Resource NFE Old Gens Hub

[Le Don]

Sets I used or considered during the season :

Murkrow @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Insomnia
EVs: 248 Atk / 8 SpA / 252 Spe or 208 Spe
Hasty / Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit
- Dark Pulse / Drill Peck

Not being forced to do 50/50 vs Kadabra is absolutly wonderful; it is very fast ( faster than Golbat ), hits hard, can bait many Scarfers like Monferno and with Insomnia can still trap Roselia. Dark Pulse is mainly here for WoW Missy.

Misdreavus @ Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Trick
- Nasty Plot / Other ?

Specs Missy is criminally underused esp since it's able to 2HKO the majority of the tier and it's good vs both offensive teams and bulky teams. The only things that are immu to SBall are Clefairy and Vigoroth ( they both dislike getting tricked + 1st one isn't common + TSpikes solves the second one ). Nasty Plot is imo the most consistent filler cause once you tricked your Specs vs a bulky team, you can just click Nasty Plot and start being horribly annoying; it is even better if you got Leftovers from Trick so vs Hail you are a monster. You don't want Psychic since with Rocks up Roselia cannot come on you + it gives a free trap to Murkrow so xdd. Btw Roselia is never running a full SpD spread so it is even more frailer vs it. A great Monferno / bulky Missy punisher.
CONSIDER THE FACT THAT YOU CAN GET A SPD DROP TOO

252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Metang: 178-210 (55.1 - 65%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Metang: 123-145 (37.9 - 44.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Murkrow: 144-170 (55.1 - 65.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Roselia: 123-145 (40.4 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Roselia: 153-181 (50.3 - 59.5%) -- 80.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Piloswine: 222-262 (54.9 - 64.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Golbat: 186-220 (52.6 - 62.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Gligar: 210-247 (62.8 - 73.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Seadra: 273-322 (108.7 - 128.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Bronzor: 168-198 (52.8 - 62.2%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzor: 117-138 (36.7 - 43.3%) -- 99.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Misdreavus @ Whatever you need
Ability: Levitate
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Taunt / Whatever you need ( WoW / DBond / TWave etc )
- Memento / Whatever you need

In this tier we have a lot setups available but sometimes it hard to get agood opportunity esp since this tier contains a lot offensive teams that won't let you do that. But don't worry, I found a solution ! Utility Missy is really hard to wear down in one hit that's why it's good vs offense. With the combination of Taunt + Memento, it's very easy to create a setup opportunity while still doing Missy things. Ofc don't do it on Metang lol.

Piloswine @ Leftovers
Ability: Oblivious
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Toxic
- Protect

Piloswine only needs EQ + Shard to be efficient. Toxic covers non-RT Missy, Wart, Sealeo and Vigoroth while Protect gives you longevity, scouting opportunities and is ofc very good with Toxic. If you can cover the Bronzor MU, it gets even better ( Magnemite is one of the solutions ).

Grovyle @ Leftovers
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Ice]

The Shing special. Very good at shutting down offense thx to its insane speed. As long as you have enough pressure on Roselia / Clefairy and stuff like that, it will become a menace. A good pairing with Scarf Murkrow btw.

Tangela @ Choice Specs
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Leaf Storm
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Sleep Powder

A particular pokemon. A grass type that cannot try to wall Seadra cause its SpD is terrible while having a very high defense making it good into Croc, Metang, Gligar and Pilo ( Utility Golbat cannot kill you from full with BB btw ). Pair it with Scarf Monf to insta punish bulky Water types, you will see how nasty it can be. Leaf Storm does a ton of damage to w/e comes in that is not Roselia / Golbat ( you have HP Ice for this ! ), Giga Drain can be useful in some situations and Sleep Powder is a great midground. I love Modest cause the power but let's be honest, Timid is prob now the way to go esp with all these fast Roselia and 220 Missy.

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Hidden Power Ice vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Golbat: 266-314 (91.4 - 107.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Golbat: 266-314 (75.1 - 88.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Metang: 189-222 (58.5 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Misdreavus: 357-420 (110.5 - 130%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefairy: 295-348 (85.7 - 101.1%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Monferno: 262-309 (97.3 - 114.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 172+ SpD Snover: 169-200 (52.3 - 61.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Bronzor: 178-210 (55.9 - 66%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzor: 124-147 (38.9 - 46.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tangela Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Roselia: 174-206 (57.2 - 67.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Clefairy @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Soft-Boiled

OU Concept ... Tbh, if it's on the right team it's a machine at cleaning games. I think it needs to be Max SpD so you are better into NP Missy / Rain and just overall Special attackers; Bold can prob be good to have an easier time vs Gligar or Defensive Metang for ex. Be sure to use it with hazards since it is ofc passive as f.

Quilava @ Choice Specs
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe ( can be slower since it is the no man's land between 240 and 287 )
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA
- Eruption
- Hidden Power Grass
- Fire move
- Whatever you need

The perfect Roselia / Metang / Pilo punisher. Unless you face SpD Wart / Sealeo / Marshtomp, this nuke will ALWAYS claim one kill. HP Grass can be useful esp if you face max SpD Waters or just to OHKO a Croc that wants to setup on your face. SD Croc is the perfect partner since Quilava pressures physically defensive Waters. Golbat is appreciated since it forces in Metang and sometimes Pilo while being happy of Quilava damages on max Def Waters so it can spam Brave Bird easily. Rest of the moveset is flexible but I think you need at least another Fire move and on the last slot I like Sleep Talk in case you face Sleep Power Rose. The biggest problem is ofc Stealth Rock so be sure to play very aggressive with it or to use a spinner ( Foresight Wart >>> ).

Diglett @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Arena Trap
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Pursuit

Scarf Diglett purpose is to hard punish Scarf Monferno, opposite Diglett ( that are mostly CB if I understood well ) and Kadabra while being still able to, after some chip, trap effectively Tentacool, Lairon, non-IBeam Clefairy and Metang. But over this, it has an incredible Speed stat making it faster than Murkrow or Lombre under Rain. Ofc it's frail don't rely too much on it to tank every move of this planet. Speed is customizable, depends on what Scarfers are you ignoring but being faster than Scarf Monf is ofc, mandatory.
Overall, I think that Diglett is a good pokemon but it is defined by the rest of the team : Scarf Monf weak + you don't need to trap Metang to win ? Scarf is the best choice. You are using CB Golbat and Flaaffy / Metang are annoying ? CB is the way to go etc etc etc

252 Atk Diglett Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tentacool: 242-288 (85.2 - 101.4%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Diglett switching boosted Pursuit (80 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Misdreavus: 156-184 (59.7 - 70.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Diglett Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Roselia: 178-210 (58.5 - 69%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Diglett Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Metang: 192-228 (59.2 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Diglett Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Clefairy: 171-202 (49.7 - 58.7%) -- 71.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Diglett Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kadabra: 234-276 (105.8 - 124.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO


Fire in the kitchen :

Lileep @ Leftovers
Ability: Suction Cups
+ SpD Nature

As I explained in my previous post, with Sand it tanks everything. I still don't know what is the best moveset, I believe something like Tox Reco filler filler is the best. But yeah thingy has the 4 moves syndrome : no Tox ? Missy hard walls you; no EPower ? Metang gives you trouble; no Rock move ? Say hello to Golbat ! Another big problem is of course Roselia who switch on it freely that's why I paired it with a Murkrow. It's an ok glue that needs heavy support but can be unkillable in the right conditions making Special attackers useless vs your team ( CM Missy doesn't beat it ).
Some calcs with the irrelevant specific spread I made so you have an idea :

252 SpA 30 IVs Life Orb Seadra Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 176+ SpD Lileep in Sand: 122-144 (36.4 - 42.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Misdreavus Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 176+ SpD Lileep in Sand: 57-67 (17 - 20%) -- possible 5HKO
252 SpA 30 IVs Life Orb Kadabra Psychic vs. 248 HP / 176+ SpD Lileep in Sand: 102-121 (30.4 - 36.1%) -- 48.8% chance to 3HKO
252+ SpA Prinplup Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 176+ SpD Lileep in Sand: 94-112 (28 - 33.4%) -- 0.1% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Yanma Bug Buzz vs. 248 HP / 176+ SpD Lileep in Sand: 116-140 (34.6 - 41.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Golbat Brave Bird vs. 248 HP / 76 Def Lileep: 240-283 (71.6 - 84.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 SpA Lileep Energy Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Misdreavus: 67-79 (25.6 - 30.2%) -- 78% chance to 3HKO after sandstorm damage
0 SpA Lileep Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Monferno: 146-172 (54.2 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage

+

Yanma @ Focus Sash
Ability: Compound Eyes
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hypnosis
- U-turn

I don't understand why people aren't using more Yanma + Diglett. Fast Sleep inducer with very high accuracy and has U-Turn to get momentum and a free trap. What else do you want ? Rest of the moveset should be classic but you can do Bug Buzz + Quick Attack with a Hasty / Naive Nature to 1v1 Murkrow who has Insomnia and Sucker Punch ( good chances to get the kill even if it's not LO Murkrow ). Pretty sure you can do 216+ Spe to do 40 in bulk or in Atk if you run QA ( unless you are scared of a mirror lead MU ). LO Diglett is a great pairing ( Sash is good too but lacks of power and CB gives too much momentum ) and Murkrow aswell since Yanma doesn't really do something to Missy.

Drifloon @ Petaya Berry / Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt


Idk if it's good but hey if you manage to lure Murkrow and find a good setup opportunity ( it remembers me a certain Missy set ... ) it can prob be decent. It is fast, has good coverage and item is flexible ( mostly Petaya / Sitrus ). Max Speed to outspeed Scarf Diglett but I suppose you can do slower; same reasoning as Scarf Diglett. It's pretty good at setuping on Roselia, Clefairy, CC locked Monf and Gligar. Frail though ...
I have it in a double Ghost Roselia lead HO

+2 252+ SpA Drifloon Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Golbat: 350-414 (99.1 - 117.2%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Drifloon Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Roselia: 183-216 (60.1 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ SpA Drifloon Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Misdreavus: 300-354 (92.8 - 109.5%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Drifloon Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Wartortle: 334-394 (103.7 - 122.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Drifloon Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 88 SpD Metang: 189-223 (58.5 - 69%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Houndour @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
Hasty Nature
- Fire Blast
- Dark Pulse
- Pursuit
- Sucker Punch / Punishment

Houndour has some potential cause being a WoW absorber that can trap Missy is a big YES. It also learns punishment that can be useful vs CMers. But the big problem is its Speed making it not good at revenge killing setups like Agility Metang. And since you have no good physical Fire STAB, you are pretty much forced to run a Mixed set which makes you worse into Kadabra cause Houndour Atk stat isn't that high compared to Murkrow so you don't OHKO with an unboosted Suit.

Grotle @ Leftovers
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 HP / 92 Atk / Def ? SpD ? Some Speed ?
- Stealth Rock / Swords Dance
- Double-Edge
- Seed Bomb
- Synthesis

Hey I know what you're going to say " tf is this bro ? " and I agree with you. But ... I mean ... Grotle has so much Defense stat, I can't sleep on it. It must have a niche somewhere no ? Good mixed bulk, very good Atk stat, has Rocks, SD and Synthesis. But yeah it's not Roselia alas. It surely wants CB Diglett ( Atk EVs are prob useless if you do pair it with CB Dig to trap Rose cause this : 92 Atk Double Edge 2HKOs max HP Roselia ).



Other concepts that needs to be explored :

- Psy spam ( Kababra + Abra )
- Specs Tangela + Scarf Diglett ( + Flaaffy ? )
- Curse Marshtomp
- SD Lickitung
- Sub Ponyta
- Swagger cause the move is disgusting but still allowed somehow
- SD Grovyle
- Agility Combusken
- SD Gligar
- Nasty Plot Golbat + CB Dig so you can run SBall / SBomb / Other ( I could have loaded that in semis )

Udaï Khan out, peace.​

 

[eeriespell]

my time in nfe olympiad is probably over, so here's everything i used in the tour. built pretty much every team myself in like ten minutes, the less you think about the game in this tier the better you will do. thank you Celeste a fairy for drafting me and trusting me in the slot even though i was smoking crack and losing for a bit. thank you Tack Apagogie for telling me i'm an idiot for trying to make stall work.

- OTR Duosion Offense

- Z SD Torracat BO

- Marill Webs

- Machoke Spikestack

- Gothorita + Z Krow Screens

- Z Klang + Scarf Rufflet Offense

ban monferno, ban servine, ciao <3

 

[Apagogie]

Okay I'm done with NFE Olympiads with a final score in ORAS of five-one which I'm satisfied with. I got inspired by the posts made above so I will give my thoughts of ORAS NFE.

I will not post any team as they have been honestly a mix of the Pokémon that I valued as being the best in the metagame. I did not try to innovate at all. I just play the most broken Pokémon together in a way that it makes some sense to patch the weaknesses of the team. I've played Golbat in every single team I used, I alternate with Servine or Roselia for the Grass types, I always had some kind of mons to put pressure on the opposite team like Magmar, Misdreavus or Pawniard. I've played Electabuzz in most of my teams for speed control, Golbat check, pivot and late game finisher. Finally, I patched the weaknesses with Gurdurr and with Ground types. I do not think I've played Clefairy and Tangela this session but they both look very good to me. I feel a bunch of lower ranked mons look underexplored but I was too undecisive to try to seriously play one of them.

Overall, I think the metagame is competitive and fun to play, even though it might be a bias from my results. The tier has interesting sequencing, several midground plays are usually possible per turns, the pool of mons is varied and you usually have several answers for the same threat. The creativity in terms of sets or Pokémon does not look that rewarding (perhaps it's due to underexploration), but it also makes the influence of matchups feel less important. I felt, though, that there was no great variability in terms of sets, though maybe players were lazy to build. Lack of variability and creativity do not bother me, on the contrary, I usually prefer that so I had a good experience in the tier.

There is one element that I feel is completely broken in ORAS, even though I do not believe it should be reasonably suspected. Spreading paralysis is an extremely punitive and rewarding way to play the game. I do not know how to formulate this as eloquently as I could but paralyzing a Pokémon in ORAS is a near-guarantee that this Pokémon will be dead at the end of the game. Since there are only six Pokémon in the opposite team, that's a big advantage. If you look at many of my games, I've used and abused paralysis and I got rewarded in every single game that I've played. It is not that I got especially lucky because I've played for it and in a very long and bulky metagame like ORAS, paralysis will anyway tend to happen. It feels very cheap to lead a Pokémon with Glare or Thunder Wave and knowing that the yellow magic will favour you through the remainder of the game.

This is also why I think Electabuzz and Roselia are fantastic Pokémon in this metagame as you cannot really paralyse them.


I think Pawniard shouldn't have risen to S from my limited experience in this tier. It is a good and of course threatening Pokémon but it does not bring enough valuable synergy in a team outside of hazard stack, suffers from limited switch-in opportunities through the game due to coverage moves of the Pokémon of the tier and poor special bulk (I've played teams where Pawniard is comfortable to switch on zero Pokémon) and you have decent powerful checks like Gurdurr, Golbat or physically invested mons. Sure, if you think that hazard stack or simply rocks is broken I can see why you think Pawniard is S rank in the tier but I do not currently share this opinion, even if I reckon that hazard stack is one of the best archetypes.


I'm mixed bag about Electabuzz. On one hand, the four attacks or three attacks plus Toxic sets seem tbf underwhelming in most matchups due to most teams having a Ground type, bulky Grass, SpD Duosion and their own Electabuzz. Despite the useful role compression of speed and Golbat checks, the Pokémon sometimes just feels very bad at making meaningful progress in a tier as bulky as ORAS. On the other hand, RestTalk sets are very effective win conditions, especially once paralysis has been spread on the bulky Pokémon. It is very hard to kill a RestTalk Electabuzz in endgame.


Servine is an S tier Pokémon whenever Roselia isn't on the opposite screens and it is due to Glare. Leaf Storm snowballing forces opponent to play actively versus Servine and enables yellow magic to be spread consistently. Servine is also extremely splashable as a bulky Grass and so an Electabuzz check. Servine is the sole reason why I think mons like Bronzor or Dusclops feel underexplored in ORAS, as they look decent answers to it. I was too scared to innovate though.


Magmar makes the tier playable as it is the best breaker of the tier. It punishes passive Grass types especially. SR weakness is what prevents the mon from being broken. Interestingly, I think the mon is more threatening when used by good players because there is a lot of HP management you need to do to prevent Magmar getting in a specific range (SR notably). I feel like most of my games with Magmar were based on careful damage consideration and positioning so honestly, the mon is a blast to play. I think Monferno (Band or Specs) can accomplish the same role, but I haven't tested it. A Fire resist is mandatory if you're not mu fishing.

All Ground types (bar Vibrava kiiinda) feel bad but you need to run them to block Electabuzz and also often as Fire resists. I wish the tier had better Ground types to click Rocks but it is what it is. Vibrava is oke but running Vibrava means you do not run Golbat Defog which is the superior Defogger. Ig it means you can run stallbreaker Golbat though so ig there are pros and cons.


Clefairy and Duosion are weird because they spread paralysis but are also often trading paralysis themselves. Still, good utility for both. Clefairy is the best rocker in the tier even if it's so awkward to use though as it's not a Ground type. For Duosion, Future Sight paired with Knock Off (or better, Gurdurr or Monferno) picks up kill left and right.

That's it for my little rambling, thank you to everyone who has made this NFE Olympiad possible :3