Research Champions Battle Mechanics Research

jgb said:
Thought I'd post this here. First time using the forums ftr, unsure if Twitter embeds properly work here and thought it'd still be preferable to have a single screenshot over 3 tweets anyway. Do lmk if you want me to link the tweets instead and I'll change it.

IMG_2223.png
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This is post-patch, so worthy to note.
 
Hydrametr0nice said:
Same with Fur Coat.
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Actually, Fur Coat should double Def since it also interacts with Psyshock and moves like that.
252 SpA Alakazam Expanding Force vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Furfrou: 147-174 (50.5 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Alakazam Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 240 Def Fur Coat Furfrou: 75-88 (25.7 - 30.2%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
So does that mean Fur Coat no longer interacts with Psyshock?
 
Cuddly said:
Actually, Fur Coat should double Def since it also interacts with Psyshock and moves like that.
252 SpA Alakazam Expanding Force vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Furfrou: 147-174 (50.5 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Alakazam Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 240 Def Fur Coat Furfrou: 75-88 (25.7 - 30.2%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
So does that mean Fur Coat no longer interacts with Psyshock?
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Currently, Fur Coat doubles defense. So maybe, even with the new Huge Power/Pure Power descriptions, it still doubles the Pokemon's attack.
 
ralts_boy said:
Found this on reddit. Looks like they manually check?
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Confirms my suspicious. Probably the move is still either internally considered powder server side and it lacking the flag is a bug, or has hardcoded checks for same things.

Either ways glad to see it's still the same, would have had major implications otherwise
 
The move classifications aren't flags anymore like in previous games. Basically, each move can have 2 classifications. Think of them as cosmetic labels that could be used for filters. The labels have no obligation to match the battle behaviour on the server. If in doubt, testing should be done, not just blindly trusting the display.

Here's a line for the classifications in the data so you can see how the displayed labels are determined:
https://github.com/projectpokemon/c...9f6b0b2ca023/masterdata/MdWazaParam.json#L320

As I said yesterday:
Anubis said:
I would not be surprised if a move was classified as something and did not have the effect, or vice versa.
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Stallion said:
Apologies if I've missed this already being mentioned in the thread, but whenever I use Rapid Spin against a Rough Skin Garchomp, even when my Pokemon ends up fainting it still removes hazards.

Can't recall the interaction ever being like this even in SV.
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Same interaction happened with Knock Off. Possibly affects all these moves:
  • Knock Off, Thief and Covet
  • Rapid Spin and Mortal Spin
  • Ceaseless Edge and Stone Axe
 
Hi. Good to be here.

I've heard multiple rumors about Knock Off ignoring Focus Sash and possibly Colbur Berry by removing them first. Thanks to the online bots being practically unable to play the game, I've tested the interaction with my Azumarill + Gengar in doubles and confirmed this is false. At least as of patch 1.0.2, it works as it did in previous games with the items applying and reducing/capping damage. Here's the Focus Sash video and the Colbur Berry video, along with a short clip that shows Knock Off still revealing/removing the item when it faints a Pokemon, since I think I heard something about that too. Hope this helps.
 
Hydrametr0nice said:
Strikethrough questions or parts of questions referred to elements that are not present in Champions. I'll update the questions with the answers.
Answered:
  1. What is Rapid Spin's PP? Are there any moves with more than 20 PP?
    • All moves are clipped to 20 BP (Dhelmise)
  2. Does Mega Sol have an activation message for two-turn moves? What about for other moves like Synthesis or Weather Ball?
    • It does only for two-turn moves.
  3. Does Mega Sol announce if the weather is Sun?
    • No.
  4. Does Mega Sol activate in other weathers?
    • Yes.
  5. Is item clause or teampreview enforced in private battles?
    • Yes.
  6. When you are Encore'd, does your move commit when you select the Fight button or can you still see your moves? When you select the Encored move, can you see the target selection menu?
  7. Is x4 and x1/4 effectiveness notified?
  8. Are all claw moves boosted by Sharpness? Crush Claw, Dire Claw, Dragon Claw, Metal Claw and Shadow Claw?
    • Yes to all of them.
Unanswered:
  1. How much PP and Max PP does a transformed Pokémon or a mimicked move slot have?
  2. Can Galarian Slowbro or Battle Bond Greninja mega-evolve?
  3. Does Tri Attack still have a 20% chance of status? What about Effect Spore?
  4. When Encored, and your move priority is recalculated, does it take into account Prankster, Gale Wings or Triage?
  5. How is the HP percentage rounded? If a Pokémon is exactly at 50% HP, is the bar yellow or green? If a Pokémon is exactly at 20% HP, is the bar yellow or red?
  6. Do status immunities from abilities trigger an immunity message like Spicy Spray? Do inaccurate defensive abilities, e.g., Static? Do offensive abilities, e.g., Poison Touch? Do damaging moves, e.g., Poison Jab? The last one can be tested by using Inferno into a Fire-type Pokémon.
  7. Like Knock Off, do Rapid Spin, Mortal Spin, Ceaseless Edge, or Stone Axe activate even if the Pokémon faints from Rocky Helmet? I would also test Thief separately since the item destination faints.
    • Rapid Spin also activates if the source faints. I would still test Thief and Ceaseless Edge/Stone Axe.
  8. If a Pokémon is hit by Quash and then Encore, is Quash's negative priority negated?
  9. What about Quick Claw and Prankster Encore—is the Quick Claw wasted?
  10. Given the Parting Shot + White Herb desync glitch, which activates first if a Pokémon targets its ally?
  11. Are Grass-type and Overcoat Pokémon still immune to Rage Powder?
  12. Are draining moves still blocked by Psychic Noise and affected by Triage?
  13. Do Huge Power and Pure Power double the power of the attack instead of the attack stat? This can be tested by using Foul Play against a Pokémon with one of these abilities.
  14. Does Dragon Cheer affect an ally with Soundproof?
Unanswerable:
  1. Are Ditto and Utility Umbrella in the game? If so, we can test Skill Swap with Mega Sol onto Ditto holding a Utility Umbrella to see which effect takes priority.
  2. It seems like Megas don't revert after fainting. If you use Revival Blessing, does your Pokémon stay in its Mega forme?
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14 does not work and Pokémon are immune to dragon cheer.
 
DooDMan said:
14 does not work and Pokémon are immune to dragon cheer.
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Does Dragon Cheer bypass an ally's Substitute? While the obvious answer would seemingly be yes, Howl *does* respect ally Substitute for some reason, hence the question. Speaking of which, does Howl still respect an ally's Substitute?
 
Can any of the folks who can root around in the code discern any rules for how the initial sets are generated on new pulls? The "rental sets" if you will. We're working on building a random format that simulates those sets, but we need a few questions answered first:

-Under what conditions can Pokemon generate mixed sets?
-What enables things like max attack Glimmora or max special attack Scizor to exist, when otherwise it seems to mostly make sense for most Pokemon which attacking stat is preferred?
-Are the moves that can generate the same on all Pokemon? Is there a list of "included" and "discluded" moves that is globally applicable in most cases?
-Normally a strong STAB move is forced. If that's true, what's up with Toxapex? Why can it get Infestation as its only attack? Is that hard-coded?

The team we have working on this would need hundreds more sets worth of data to deduce the answers to these without being able to dig into the code. Any help would be appreciated!
 
A Cake Wearing A Hat said:
-What enables things like max attack Glimmora or max special attack Scizor to exist, when otherwise it seems to mostly make sense for most Pokemon which attacking stat is preferred?
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We know from an interview (fan translation here) that these are randomized as Pokemon are meant to be living creatures, seemingly like a toned down version of the reason behind IVs.

1775854658697.png


The further semantics are left in the air, but from what I've seen every single spread in the recruiting pool is just 2 maxed out stats and the 2 spare Stat Points invested in a single other stat, so that should be a good base on this regard, case in point I bothered rolling 2 pools of 10 Pokemon with this consistent pattern and I've yet to see one that deviates from this.

https://imgur.com/nuKCr8n

https://imgur.com/PViI09q
 
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A Cake Wearing A Hat said:
Can any of the folks who can root around in the code discern any rules for how the initial sets are generated on new pulls? The "rental sets" if you will. We're working on building a random format that simulates those sets, but we need a few questions answered first:

-Under what conditions can Pokemon generate mixed sets?
-What enables things like max attack Glimmora or max special attack Scizor to exist, when otherwise it seems to mostly make sense for most Pokemon which attacking stat is preferred?
-Are the moves that can generate the same on all Pokemon? Is there a list of "included" and "discluded" moves that is globally applicable in most cases?
-Normally a strong STAB move is forced. If that's true, what's up with Toxapex? Why can it get Infestation as its only attack? Is that hard-coded?

The team we have working on this would need hundreds more sets worth of data to deduce the answers to these without being able to dig into the code. Any help would be appreciated!
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As far as I can tell, the random recruit Pokémon are generated server-side too. All we get is a list of possible species and their recruit cost with no other data. I imagine this information is used to display the cost to you without having to talk to the server each time.

I tried looking for the code handling this to see if I could get information on shiny/title rates, but couldn't find anything.

Essentially you have to think of this as a mobile game masquerading as a Switch game.
 
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FIQ said:
Does Dragon Cheer bypass an ally's Substitute? While the obvious answer would seemingly be yes, Howl *does* respect ally Substitute for some reason, hence the question. Speaking of which, does Howl still respect an ally's Substitute?
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Yes it bypasses. It works similair to other sound moves. Howl is an outlier for some reason
 
Karxrida said:
How does Mega Sol interact with Cloud Nine? Altaria is legal so we should be able to check.
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Also still wondering if Mega Sol ignores Sand/Snow or still gets its damage reduced.
Only lead I’v found is someone claiming they OHKO’s a Tyranitar, which is only normally possible if Tyranitar has no bulk investment and Meganium is Modest.
252+ SpA Meganium-Mega Petal Dance vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 308-366 (90.3 - 107.3%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
If Meganium was Timid or Tyranitar had some bulk, then it’d confirm that that Mega Sol ignores Sand.
 
A friend tested some Mega Sol things:

* Mega Sol is still able to status foes with Leaf Guard (this means it does NOT work like Mold Breaker, which lasts for the entire move sequence).
* Mega Sol still instacharges Solarbeam if Cloud Nine is up.
* Mega Sol bypasses defensive boosts from Sandstorm/Snow.
 
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Cuddly said:
Also still wondering if Mega Sol ignores Sand/Snow or still gets its damage reduced.
Only lead I’v found is someone claiming they OHKO’s a Tyranitar, which is only normally possible if Tyranitar has no bulk investment and Meganium is Modest.
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From what I gather, no bulk investment is currently very common of Tyranitar and the most popular Meganium spread uses Modest. Fairly realistic.

FIQ said:
* Mega Sol still instacharges Solarbeam if Cloud Nine is up.
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Was this in Singles or Doubles? Targeting into the Cloud Nine user or not might matter.
 
Karxrida said:
From what I gather, no bulk investment is currently very common of Tyranitar and the most popular Meganium spread uses Modest. Fairly realistic.


Was this in Singles or Doubles? Targeting into the Cloud Nine user or not might matter.
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The test was conducted in a Double battle, but did not target the Cloud Nine mon, but rather its Tyranitar ally.
 
dhelmise said:
https://gist.github.com/KrisXV/f32889936ea1737cce367f8152f60b8f

i parsed the learnsets and filtered out dexited moves yay
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Looking at this list I noticed a few discrepancies: Your list doesn't have Bide or Psywave on it when those are definitely moves with a "0" in "available" in the dump. I haven't parsed the whole list yet but those two stood out.

EDIT: After parsing the full list, also add: Return, Present, Frustration, Magnitude, Natural Gift, Trump Card, Wring Out, Me First, Punishment, Crush Grip, Guardian of Alola, Nature's Madness, Pika Papow, Veevee Volley and Ruination, as well as the following missing from the table entirely: Revival Blessing, Double Shock

EDIT2: Wow I only noticed later that I quoted the wrong post, meant to quote the dexited moves list.

SmoltenMoltenMoltres said:
Yes it bypasses. It works similair to other sound moves. Howl is an outlier for some reason
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I am positive this is because it changed targeting from self to self/ally and they never bothered to fix it.
 
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