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I'm not saying it is a problem for Stall teams or the blobs and Sylveon. I am saying it isn't competitive. I'm not calling it the Bubonic Plague, but to say it is competitive is plain wrong. And that is what I am "arguing". That is what Smogon is all about if I'm not mistaken.

Not too many people here are saying they are "unbeatable". I've been trying to explain how this is Noncompetitive, yet, you constantly bring up your Chansey calc like that some how explains it being so. . .

Yes, we get it, Chansey stops it. . . As long as it doesn't hit itself. It also can't do anything to Klefki outside of Seismic Toss. But if I don't carry a Chansey what relevancy does that serve?

I play mostly Stall actually. So, I'm not sure if that makes a difference or not, but I do in fact play stall and am still for giving this the boot.

I did not say Chansey was the only stop to this. But when I go into a battle, unsuspecting of someone using this "strategy" and I don't have something that can take it on 1v1, then I can potentially hand this person a free win. You're right, Kelfki can't OHKO it but you're not taking the fact I...

I used the wrong quote. Oops, shame on me. Regardless, as NoahStar stated, Dragon/dark/fire gives it perfect neutral coverage to everything bar Azumarill, which it can't beat anyways. Yes, Heatran is 2HKO'd by an Earth Power. And yes, Dark Pulse 3HKOs but, there's nothing Heatran can do in...

So, you're telling me I MUST bring a Chansey or counter? You realize that's typically why most bans happen. When something pretty much REQUIRES you to bring something that counters it. Or, what can and I believe should happen, the strategy it gets the boot as a whole. SwagPlay is not...

If that wasn't the most evasive argument brought to the table I don't know what is. Although this was not directed at me, I feel I should answer with a clear, quick, concise answer. Making the game luck based, is not Competitive, which, Smogon strives to maintain.

There's a huge difference in Luck in which you can't help (Missing, crits, burns, poisons ETC.), and forcing someone to have to bank on luck to win. . .

Although I would never call this "creative" to use the fact you have knowledge in Statistics doesn't exactly justify this as a "Strategy". Luck based, clearly is not competitive, in the slightest, and that's what this is about. Not Luck based Statistics. This is essentially Evasion with the...

There is a reason, since now, Dark isn't resisted by as many as it used to be it's a lot more "Spammable". You're using Azumarill as an example that Dark Pulse is a bad move choice, but there's two things wrong with that. . . 1. Even after you Charge beam, which isn't an OHKO that Azumarill can...

^See that's what makes me think this needs to go more and more everyday. The fact that you really have to bring a check or counter for not just one, but at least 3+ 'mons that don't all have the same problems setting it up. Although, yes it can be stopped, it's entirely luck based, and I think...

It's not right. Lopunny doesn't get the boost. So, neither does Golurk. Lopunny is better in my opinion for leads. How's that (semi)useless Ferrothorn/Smeargle?

Payback only means it's meant to take hits. Which, if it didn't drop the targets attack or doesn't resist said attacks, her bulk isn't as great as one might think. Iron head is just plain better. It hits harder and it takes fairies out.

Why have a lum berry on a restalk pokemon? That nullifies its purpose. And, i can near guarantee you you'll die before you get the chance to pop one of those off successfully.

Dugtrio doesn't have Perish song that guarantees Kills. Nor does it have Destiny Bond, which does the same thing. mGengar also has a far better movepool. mGengar can tailor his move pool to whatever he needs to so that the rest of his team can do their job as safe as possible. Dugtrio has...

I ask you this one, simple question. . . What good does this check do if it isn't already switched into mGengar? Yes, there ARE checks to mGengar, no one here is saying there isn't. There aren't counters however. THAT is what I am saying. Anyway, if the check isn't already in on mGengar, it...

. . . It's not JUST the trapping that makes him broken. . . Have you read ANYTHING any of us have said. . ? The trapping just helps him in doing his job perfectly. What do you not get about IT HAS TO ALREADY BE IN PLACE. If said Pivot isn't already in on mGengar, what good does it do? If...

You have ONE chance to switch in a "counter". After that one chance is gone, you can no longer counter it. After that one chance, the ONLY way you can "switch in" this apparently amazing counter is if something dies first. THAT IS mGENGARS JOB! To kill things with little to no effort. . . It...

There's a HUGE difference between Arena Trap and Shadow Tag. . . Arena Trap doesn't stop flying types, nor levitaters. Dugtrio also doesn't have Destiny Bond, or Perish Song. . . You can't even compare the two. . . There are things that scare Gengar out. Naturally. BUT, they have to already be...