A nuzlocker is mad with power

Hello.
I've been playing pokemon since Gen II (Gold, ruby, diamond, emerald, black 2, emerald, sapphire, diamond, Y, in roughly that order.) From that list, the sapphire, the second emerald and the second diamondwere nuzlockes. Y is a challenge run of my own making; I might post about it later.

Anyway, after playing nuzlocke runs all about keeping your pokemon alive, you get pretty attached. Now when I discovered the competitive scene, I felt kind of worthless, you know?

Every single one of my pokemon I had grown close to, with all our friendships and triumphs and failures, can be outdone by a few clicks and BAM. A better pokemon. WHAT.

It's not that I didn't know that that was hapening in the competitive community, I just felt kinda "Oh. okay. Everything here is better better than all of my pokemon ever and I can make better pokemon too."

Did anyone else get this when arriving here first? Please tell me I'm not the only one. I now have no idea what to do with all this power I have. HALP
 
No, I can't say I feel these same feelings. For myself and many other players, the experience of playing Pokemon is compartmentalized into playing the in game RPG and playing the multi-player game. Playing with an in game team in a competitive environment won't get you anywhere fast and a competitive team won't be very optimal for playing in game. I enjoy both aspects of Pokemon a whole lot, but trying to enjoy them inter-spliced drains a lot of the fun from both aspects.

Also, I always do try to make any in game partners / nuzlocke veterans fathers / mothers when I'm breeding. Passing down the lineage is a fun little touch that really doesn't mean anything, but always feels neat.
 
I'm going to go into a mini-rant, but I will preface this by saying I enjoy both the casual and competitive aspects of Pokemon. I like exploring the world, I watch the anime movies every year, I read the manga, I collect, and close friends know that my bank account and Pokemon merchandise are at odds.

However, Pokemon is the only video game fandom I've seen ever where wanting to optimize performance or play competitive is looked down upon and in most cases shunned in a hostile manner by the majority of the fandom. It pisses me off because these people can't leave us alone and understand that playstyle is up to the individual. If you said "good players are ruining the game" in any other video game fandom, you will laughed at and ridiculed right out of the room. Seriously, I dare people to give SmashBoards or TeamLiquid or battle.net or any of the million LoL boards half the shit people have given Smogon. It's easy to chalk this up to "the games are made for kids" but the Junior division in VGCs and the fact that the majority of complainers who think that competitive players are ruining the game tend to be teenagers/young adults say otherwise. You say that your "friendships are worthless" but why is it the competitive community's fault? Why is wanting to play the game to its best and testing our mettle against other players affecting the way you chose to spend you time? If you enjoyed it, fantastic. But if you felt that your time in a video game having fun is worthless, then that's your own problem, not the competitive community's. That's the problem I have with the "Smogon is evil" crowd, I don't understand why people feel forced to play a certain way when no one is forcing you to do anything. You just feel hostile because that's a mentality you imposed on yourself; you want to "be the very best" but you don't want to actually put in the effort to do so. In-game, part of that has been Gamefreak's fault and I kind of agree. Before they made breeding easy mode this generation and introduced horde battles and super training for easy EVing, you had to learn how to RNG abuse to even get optimal Pokemon and it took forever to EV train....that's if you didn't hack everything. That put a bad taste in many players' mouths so they went to simulators. However, that is no fault of Smogon or competitive players, Gamefreak made questionable design decisions. That's still no reason to feel your time was worthless if you want to take the next step and play competitively.

tl;dr: The only people who are criticizing how people play in this fandom are the "casual" players, have fun your own way
 
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You know, I don't think Kethuel was blaming the competitive community itself for his issues. Your argument, Age of Kings, is probably a valid one but I don't think that was the subject at hand.

The fact is, the competitive community is there and though IVs and EVs and breeding all make the pokemon game fascinating, deep and wonderfully challenging to perfect, it can be hard on some people to know if they want to transition to the competitive side they pretty much have to throw away their old team and start from scratch and follow all these crazy rules in order to keep up.

Here's the difference between pokemon and most, if not all other RPGs: the pokemon themselves. When I am on World of Warcraft I have a main character and, say I want to become part of the competitive raiding or PvP scene... I can use the SAME character and gear up, which is completely different from taking your core pokes that got you through all your RPG and put them in a box, never to be used much again. My main character on WoW has gotten me through thick and thin, and though her armor and weaponry and even her spells are different, it's still the same old Druid I have always had with the same name. I never needed to delete her... and never will. Same goes for most player-characters in RPGs. You can improve them and make them as perfect as any other player character in the game because it's the items you give them that change your stats.

Poor pokemon, their stats are determined, for the most part, at birth through nature and IVs. And there's nothing you can really do about that and you can breed a perfect Charmander for your competitive needs but deep down, you know it's not the same ol' Charmander you used and it feels a little sad.

I hope this helps for both sides to understand a little? Yeah, it's just feelings and you can get over it, but it's still kinda lame when you nicknamed them all and you trained them and they're on your Hall of Fame record. They're special and your experiences with them make them special. And even the most perfect offspring will never have the same emotional investment as your starting team for some people.
 
The sad thing is that the IV system is intended to make individual Pokemon unique and special, but instead it makes about 95% of all Pokemon competitively inferior. Even though it may be easier to easier to get good IVs now, I think the real issue is that "good" and "bad" IVs exist in the first place. The player can at least control EVs, and Natures aren't as hard to reset for (although it would better if they were also controllable), but IVs almost always damn Pokemon from the very moment their code pops into existence. Transitioning into competitive Pokemon would be much, much easier if players didn't have to discard half their in-game teams because they weren't incredibly lucky with the RNG.

In any case, I agree with TheMantyke in that competitive Pokemon and the Pokemon games should be treated differently. The point of the former is to win, and the point of the latter is to have fun. Obviously those goals aren't mutually exclusive, but there are still going to be cases where a Pokemon that fares well competitively is not something a player will enjoy using in the games, and vice versa. And while it would be nice if we could make every Pokemon both good-looking and competitively useful, it's not so big of a deal that it takes all the fun out of the game. I think one of the most appealing things about Pokemon is that you can enjoy it in a variety of ways, casually or competitively.
 
while there are good points brought up here, i think the main reason a lot of people don't like competitive battling is because even though IVs and stuff are easier to get now, people don't like the fact that a lot of teams need perfect ivs. And im not saying like if you have 28 or so in attack you can't win, it just seems like thats the mindset. I know my buddy Chris doesnt like competitive battling for that reason. I know at first I didn't like Smogon for that reason when I first found out about it, because that's the mindset I perceived. But once I actually started battling people online, I realized that for everyone, it is different, and I competitive battle for fun. I just think more people wouldn't perceive competitive battling as some kind of no-fun nonsense if we got to the point where IVs weren't ever considered to be bad or something. IDK, i rambled on at the end lol.
 
The fact is, the competitive community is there and though IVs and EVs and breeding all make the pokemon game fascinating, deep and wonderfully challenging to perfect, it can be hard on some people to know if they want to transition to the competitive side they pretty much have to throw away their old team and start from scratch and follow all these crazy rules in order to keep up.

I do agree with you and your points. I do not disagree with you, but between the general tone of OP's text and the signature, it does come off as yet another whiny rant against the competitive community. Perhaps not to you, but I've seen a LOT of shit similar in sentiment. I've played Pokemon for over 16 years and I've experienced a lot of the community and it seems like a thinly veiled "gosh you competitive guys never have fun" garbage rant.

I don't think competitive play and emotional attachment should always be completely divorced from one another. I have my first hexflawless Pokemon in X, a female Gogoat, by my side as much as I possibly can. I started caring more about my good competitive breeds because they will ALWAYS be good and relevant. Yeah, in-game teams are nice but they become irrelevant as soon as the next game in the series comes out. I can trade my competitive breeds over and they'll still be good to use. Maybe I'm different in that aspect, idk.

I did mention that Gamefreak has made many questionable and/or bad design decisions, pretty much the phenomena that SnoopingGil describes: the majority of Pokemon are useless for battling other players. However, casual players misdirect their blame on the competitive community for "having to start over" or "making everything worthless". That's the main point I was trying to make: it's not our fault that people "pretty much have to throw away their whole team and start from scratch". OP blames Smogon specifically (or more broadly competitive players), as does many other misguided and ignorant people. The competitive player wants to make the best of the boundaries Gamefreak has placed us in, but in the end, it's not our fault that the in-game team won't do well. Instead, the frustration should be directed at the makers of the game, the people who actually make the rules. Gamefreak has done a lot to improve this generation but there are still the bitter memories of past generations where it's a) a giant timesink, b) hack, or c) go to unofficial simulators just to stand a fighting chance. Fuck, with the whole Battle Analyzer fiasco and now Pokebank's terrible hackcheck, simulators were/are the platform of choice for competitive battling because Gamefreak can't be assed to care.

Here's the difference between pokemon and most, if not all other RPGs: the pokemon themselves. When I am on World of Warcraft I have a main character and, say I want to become part of the competitive raiding or PvP scene... I can use the SAME character and gear up, which is completely different from taking your core pokes that got you through all your RPG and put them in a box, never to be used much again. My main character on WoW has gotten me through thick and thin, and though her armor and weaponry and even her spells are different, it's still the same old Druid I have always had with the same name. I never needed to delete her... and never will. Same goes for most player-characters in RPGs. You can improve them and make them as perfect as any other player character in the game because it's the items you give them that change your stats.

I actually recently unsubbed from WoW because that may not always be the case. What if you chose a server that wasn't one of the dozen or so extremely overpopulated ones (or guild that falls apart a few months after you join) and you don't want to fork over the $25 to xfer? It's unfortunately pretty difficult to do much of anything besides World of Queuecraft if you're not on one of those dozen or so "chosen" servers that crash on patch day and are full of douchebags. If you're doing high-end raiding or PvP, what if your class/spec isn't FOTM? I don't think you understand this especially as a druid where you can literally play any role and almost always have a good spec. I quit playing because a) the difficulty of finding a guild that fits my needs and is looking for melee DPS, everyone wants healers and locks, and b) being sick and tired of paying fees to play on servers that don't make me want to lose faith in humanity just to prevent myself from starting over. I agree with the rest of your points, but I wanted to present a rebuttal to your WoW example because it runs contrary to the experiences of many players, including myself.

while there are good points brought up here, i think the main reason a lot of people don't like competitive battling is because even though IVs and stuff are easier to get now, people don't like the fact that a lot of teams need perfect ivs. And im not saying like if you have 28 or so in attack you can't win, it just seems like thats the mindset. I know my buddy Chris doesnt like competitive battling for that reason. I know at first I didn't like Smogon for that reason when I first found out about it, because that's the mindset I perceived. But once I actually started battling people online, I realized that for everyone, it is different, and I competitive battle for fun. I just think more people wouldn't perceive competitive battling as some kind of no-fun nonsense if we got to the point where IVs weren't ever considered to be bad or something. IDK, i rambled on at the end lol.

People need to realize: it's not Smogon's fault, it's Gamefreak's. You know, the people who actually made the rules, specifically the IV system. Smogon did not dictate that 31 is better than 5 for instance, Gamefreak made it so. The blame is misdirected. I don't understand why it's shameful and provokes such a hostile reaction to want to play with the best that is possible under a defined set of rules.

tl;dr: I don't understand the dichotomy of the casual player blaming other players who have no say in game design decisions for said decisions in such a bitter and hostile manner.
 
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I'm not saying it is Smogon's fault. But I think part of the reason why people blame it is Smogon is probably one of the higher tier institutions for Pokemon battling. Most of the Poke fans I know consider Smogon as the definitive site and stuff. Idk, just my opinion on it.
 
I'm not saying it is Smogon's fault. But I think part of the reason why people blame it is Smogon is probably one of the higher tier institutions for Pokemon battling. Most of the Poke fans I know consider Smogon as the definitive site and stuff. Idk, just my opinion on it.

I still don't see how the widespread hostility towards the competitive community by the general fanbase is rational. /shrug
 
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