A thought out team I want you to rate!

A thought out team I want you to rate! [TEAM UPDATED]

Team Focus:
This is a team revolving around the most broken OU Pokemon ever: Garchomp. Garchomp's counters are few, as he is quite bulky, and has the ability to double his attack within one turn. The rest of the team's job is to counter everything that can possibly wall Garchomp, help him set up, and cover the team's weaknesses.

16/04/08: Huge team update. Hariyama, Cresselia and Celebi have been added.

Team at a Glance:
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On to the team:

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Weavile @ Choice Band
Jolly : Pressure
40 HP, 252 AT, 216 SP
- Ice Punch
- Night Slash
- Pursuit
- Brick Break

The first Pokemon supporting Garchomp. With his excellent typing and the move Pursuit, he can switch in on the likes of Cresselia, Slowbro and Starmie quite easily, and hit them hard if they switch out. Also kills common leads Gengar and Azelf in one hit wether they switch or not.

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Magnezone @ Leftovers
Modest : Magnet Pull
172 HP, 252 SA, 84 SP
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Magnet Rise
- Substitute

This Pokemon takes care of all Steel types attempting to wall Weavile or Garchomp. Most notably: Skarmory, Bronzong, Forretress and Jirachi (may have U-Turn). Building the team I realized it centered just as much around Weavile as it does around Garchomp, giving me two huge threats that can win me the game.

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Garchomp @ Yache Berry / Leftovers / Life Orb
Jolly : Sand Veil
4 HP, 252 AT, 252 SP
- Swords Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquacke
- Dragon Claw / Substitute

Garchomp himself. With Stealth Rock support, the most common physical walls are OHKO'd by Swords Dance Outrage. I save him for late game, when his counters are hopefully elimated. A timely Swords Dance often ends up winning me. I'm still in doubt about the last move. Fire Fang is obviously not needed because Magnezone eliminates Garchomp's Steel counters, so Dragon Claw or Substitute might be a good idea. Substitute helps against the likes of Weezing trying to status me, and also allows me to Sand Veil stall when there's a sand storm up. However, I'm leaning towards Dragon Claw as it gives me the opportunity to hit more Pokemon early in the game without being stuck on Outrage. The item is hard to decide, too. Yache Berry ensures survival from any Ice Beam / Ice Shard user in OU, but Leftovers help recovering damage and works great with Substitute. Even Life Orb is a possibility, as Garchomp equipped with that absolutely destroys everything after a Swords Dance.

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Hariyama @ Leftovers
Impish : Thick Fat
76 HP, 180 AT, 252 DF
- Force Palm
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch
- Whirlwind

Now that I'm done supporting Garchomp, I need to think about my defenses. Hariyama is one of the best Weavile and Tyranitar counters in the game. He is also a very solid switch in to Blissey, something my team lacks. Knock off really helps against Leftovers recovery of some walls, but can also be vital by knocking off a Choice Item. Force Palm provides a steady chance of Paralysis, which is very welcome. Ice Punch OHKOs all dragons, and helps against Gliscor. Hariyama also does a very good job at phazing with Whirlwind, being bulky enough to shrugg off a Swords Dance Garchomp Earthquacke.

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Cresselia @ Leftovers
Bold : Levitate
252 HP, 108 DF, 148 SD
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

I love Cresselia, and I love this set. It covers alot of my teams weaknesses, and spreads Paralysis everywhere. It also gives me a solid status taker and supreme Breloom counter. Rest and Sleep Talk provides solid recovery in the sand. Ice Beam is really the only attacking move Cresselia needs. All other sweepers not hit by Ice Beam get ruined by Thunder Wave (Weavile, Infernape, Lucario, Gyarados, Gengar, etc).

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Celebi @ Leftovers
Bold : Natural Cure
252 HP, 224 DF, 32 SP
- Stealth Rock
- Recover
- Grass Knot
- Leech Seed / Hidden Power [Fire]

Another defensive Pokemon. Celebi sets up Stealth Rock, and cripples my opponent's Pokemon with Leech Seed. This team's main answer to Gyarados and Electivire, and also Swampert. Tanks away while wittling away the opponent's health. I might replace Leech Seed with Hidden Power [Fire], for better type coverage.

Jirachi may take this spot though. He also sets up Stealth Rock, but is a little less bulky. However, Jirachi's big plus is Wish, which helps some of my team mates immensely. At the moment, the number one choice is Celebi


Threat List:
Tyranitar: Hariyama does a great job at walling every set.
Gyarados: Celebi doesn't take much damage from any of its attacks, and does large amounts of damage back with Grass Knot. Cresselia can cripple it with Thunder Wave.
Infernape: Cresselia walls it, and renders it useless with Thunder Wave.
Azelf: Most Azelf are leads, and Weavile can kill them with Pursuit wether they switch or not. Scarfed Azelf will surprise me once, but will be beaten by Cresselia easily.
Electivire: Celebi does great walling him, and Cresselia can slowly kill it with Ice Beam.
Heracross: This takes prediction, as I don't have Gliscor or Weezing on my team. Hariyama can take Megahorns, and Celebi and Cresselia can take Close Combat. If Hariyama manages to Knock Off its item, he will be much easier to handle.
Salamence: Cresselia walls all versions, OHKO'ing with Ice Beam and not taking too much damage when it switches in.
Togekiss: Cresselia makes it useless with Thunder Wave, and can 3HKO with Ice Beam.
Gengar: Weavile kills it with Pursuit wether it switches or not.
Garchomp: Cresselia walls all sets. Hariyama can take a couple of hits and OHKO with Ice Punch. Celebi can come in and stall him with Leech Seed and Recover.
Lucario: Cresselia can Thunder Wave it, but that's about it. Hariyama should be able to scare him away too.
Starmie: Weavile kills it with Pursuit wether it switches or not. Cresselia can Thunder Wave.
Weavile: Hariyama totally walls it.
Dugtrio: It will trap my Magnezone. And it will suck.
Porygon-Z: Cresselia can Paralyse and proceed to kill. Magnezone resists all its common attacks and can deal huge amounts of damage to it.
Machamp: Cresselia and Celebi wall it to death.
Snorlax: Hariyama can switch in without taking too much damage and can 2HKO with Force Palm or Knock Off its Leftovers.
Zapdos: Cresselia can Paralyse and kill it with Ice Beam. Magnezone resists all of its moves and hits hard with neutral Thunderbolt.
Suicune: Celebi beats this everytime. Magnezone can also scare it away.
Breloom: Cresselia walls this to infinity, as well as Celebi when Breloom can't spore.
Ninjask: Hariyama resists the common X-Scissor and can Whirlwind it away.
Metagross: Magnezone can trap the often seen Choice Band variants. Celebi can chip away its health and doesn't take too much damage if it's not Choice Banded. Cresselia can Paralyse, but that's about it. Garchomp can threaten to kill with Earthquacke. I'll certainly have to look out for attack raises from Meteor Mash.
Heatran: Hariyama can switch in without taking too much damage. Cresselia can Paralyse, making the job a lot easier.
Celebi: Weavile puts a dent in this with Pursuit, and Magnezone isn't too scared of it either.
Jirachi: Magnezone can trap, and KO it unless it has U-Turn. Garchomp can KO with Earthquacke while it can't do much back.
Dragonite: Cresselia walls all sets. Hariyama can Ice Punch it if needed.
Mamoswine: Hariyama can come in pretty easily, and do a lot of damage with Force Palm. Cresselia can probably 4HKO it with Ice beam while it can't do anything back.
Gallade: Cresselia and Celebi do a good job at walling this.
Yanmega: Magnezone resists all of its common moves, and OHKOs with Thunderbolt. Cresselia has the bulk to survive a Bug Buzz and can Paralyse this pain.
Kingdra: After Cresselia has Paralysed it, it won't be hard for Celebi to take down.
Roserade: Cresselia walls it all night long, Paralysing and hitting it with super effective Ice Beams.
Scizor: Hariyama resists its moves, can Force Palm it until it Paralyses, Knock off its Life Orb / Leftovers, and certainly outstall it. He can even Whirlwind it when it gets too many stat ups.
 
Nice team

The first problem I noticed was that opposing Weavile could kill most of your team, but I'm not completely sure who I would replace in order to fix this. Machamp over Hippowdon sounds reasonable.

Also max Weavile's speed since he'll need it more than the guaranteed survival of Azelf's flamethrower.
 
ScarfGar, Breloom, TyraniBoah, Heatran, YacheDDragonite, and SpecsMence are the main threats I see. ScarfGar can come in and pick apart your team in a similar manner to Heatran and SpecsMence. Not sure what justification the "Ice Beam TyraniBoah's are rare" comment has behind it, since they are extremely common and can cause you trouble. Breloom with Leech Seed, Substitute, Stone Edge, and Spore will really screw you up, which I've actually been encountering recently. And of course, if Dragonite gets a DD off, it can 2HKO Hippowdon with Outrage and proceeding to sweep the rest of your team.

But overall the team looks nice. These threats aren't really huge, but just things for you to look out for. Boah is the main thing that jumped out at me when I was reading the team, as it really could screw things up.
 
Thanks for the help. In my battle against itachi 109, he indeed used Tyraniboah, however Hippowdon could take two ice beams, which was nice. The most common last move for Boah is Thunderbolt though.

As this team doesn't have Blissey, (Or empoleon for that matter) it is a bit SpecsMence weak. However, when there's no Stealth Rock Zapdos can attempt to wall it. For Dragonite, I actually don't see a better counter than Hippowdon, so I should be fine. ScarfChomp won't kill Hippowdon either. Maybe putting Ice Shard on Weavile could help to counter them better.

About Breloom, I have been thinking about giving Zapdos Hidden Power [Ice], but I won't be able to do anything to Swampert. Let's just hope I won't encounter one.

This team is quite offensive, and poses an immediate threat to the opponent. It's very hard to maintain your weaknesses while keeping a team very offensive.
 
Well Cresselia is the best Dragonite counter, but thats beside the point. Also, I have never faced a TyraniBoah with Thunderbolt/Ice Beam; only one or the other. Maybe against poor opponents, but not against top notch ones. It always needs at least one STAB move.

Good luck with the team.
 
Hippowdon doesn't counter Dragonite. If it has Yache Berry, which most do, it can DD while you switch to Hippowdon. It Outrages, you Ice Fang, don't kill it, then it finishes you off.

Tyraniboah is lame, but yes, it is common and decent at picking apart teams that don't have a dark/ice resist. Hariyama could even fit on this team for that.
 
Actually with I feel gyarados should be considered. Especially with Zapdos and Magnezone and Weavile. Probably take out Zapdos or Starmie though. When Gyara sees a starmie or a genger being in CBWeavile and pursuit. I think it would benefit this team
 
@ Pulse. I ment the common last move is Thunderbolt, not Ice Beam. So that would give it Substitute/Dark Pulse/Focus Punch and either Thunderbolt or Ice Beam.

When I get Dragonite to outrage, I can just switch in Magnezone, that's not big of a deal. I think I won't replace Starmie or Zapdos, they have too important roles. Weavile, Garchomp and Magnezone almost counter everything already. What I'm missing on this team though is a solid switchin for Blissey. Garchomp does OK, but when the opponent catches on they will Ice Beam on the switch. Weavile fears being Paralysed. Any suggestions?
 
Hariyama would give you a Blissey switch in and the best Tyraniboah counter in the game. And I completely disagree with you that Thunderbolt is more common than Ice Beam, thats definitely not the way it is (against skilled players).
 
Assuming that most Boah's run TBolt instead of Ice Beam is very stupid, as Ice Beam is often used because of Gliscor and Hippowdon. Hippowdon will be 2HKO'd, and is something you need to be careful of.

You have a very big SD Weavile weakness. With 1 Swords Dance and a Life Orb, Weavile has the ability to OHKO your entire team, and it will most likely outspeed your own Weavile. I would replace your Zapdos with Zap Cannon Forretress. You keep a decent Gyarados counter, beat Weavile, and you can move Stealth Rock from Hippowdon to Forretress, or give Forretress Spikes/Toxic Spikes.
 
I need something to wall some special threats. Zapdos gives me much needed resists, and slows my foes down with Thunder Wave. I still need something to switch in on Blissey though. Maybe a very special defensive Hariyama or Machamp will do.
 
Put Thunderbolt on Starmie please. Calm Zapdos cant possibly take Gyarados + StoneEdge/IceFang after an DD.

You have nothing that can absorb sleep, maybe change Zapdos into a stalker or put Sleep Talk > Twave.

Maybe put some Spdef on Hippo, so it can take Ice beams a tad bit better, especially against Tyranitar.

AlsoScarf Gengar isn't a problem... Weavile can obviously revenge kill lol

meh, This team has somewhat of a Blissey problem. Nothing can switch into it directly, without taking a Twave or Ice beam. You can stall it out but that's kinda lame. Stalk Machamp > Hippo would be a nice alternative. Icepunch, DP, stalk with a defensive EV spread. You won't have SR but.. who cares.

Also, with magnezone I don't see a need for Fire Fang on garchomp, since Fire Fang is only needed for Bronzong and Skarmory. Why not Substitute or even Dragon Claw for that matter?
 
Put Thunderbolt on Starmie please. Calm Zapdos cant possibly take Gyarados + StoneEdge/IceFang after an DD.

You have nothing that can absorb sleep, maybe change Zapdos into a stalker or put Sleep Talk > Twave.

Maybe put some Spdef on Hippo, so it can take Ice beams a tad bit better, especially against Tyranitar.

AlsoScarf Gengar isn't a problem... Weavile can obviously revenge kill lol

meh, This team has somewhat of a Blissey problem. Nothing can switch into it directly, without taking a Twave or Ice beam. You can stall it out but that's kinda lame. Stalk Machamp > Hippo would be a nice alternative. Icepunch, DP, stalk with a defensive EV spread. You won't have SR but.. who cares.

Also, with magnezone I don't see a need for Fire Fang on garchomp, since Fire Fang is only needed for Bronzong and Skarmory. Why not Substitute or even Dragon Claw for that matter?

Thanks, you're a real big help.

Hippowdon can't possibly go because I need to have SandStorm up, although I could rely on other people's Tyranitar and Hippowdon.

For your information, I already gave Hippo a more special defensive spread. It doesn't get 2HKO'd by Boah's Ice Beam now. =D

I will put Thunderbolt on Starmie directly, because I've had severe problems with Gyarados.

You're totally right about the Blissey being a problem. I'm currently looking to replace on of my team members, probably Zapdos, with a Sleep Talk Machamp. That would also fix my Weavile weak perfectly. However, I'm left with a gaping whole of special weakness. Mostly Togekiss and Yanmega will rampage through my team. Also I will be walled to death by Swampert.

Decisions, decisions. Help would be GREATLY appreciated. It's very late now, I'll think a bit about it.
 
machamp would give you a boah counter, a weavile counter, and a status absorber

why do you need to have ss up without sub on chomp?
 
Even with your Sandstorm (Which in THEORY cripples it) Raikou is a bitch for you. It's probably taking something down with a Sub or a CM. Consider a Phazer.
 
Ok guys, I've been thinking.

The core of the team is obviously Weavile, Magnezone and Garchomp. Weavile and Magnezone have taken something away with their trapping skills in every match I played. That's how good they are.

I'm 100% sure I want a Sleep Talk Machamp is this team. That would give me those four members.

Now, final thing I need to do is counter some threats to an extent, and include Stealth Rock. Those are the main threats that need to be countered:

Gyarados:
Infernape:
Heracross:
Salamence:
Togekiss:
Garchomp:
Lucario:

Dugtrio:
Porygon-Z:
Machamp
Breloom:
Heatran:
Dragonite:
Gallade:
Kingdra:

I know, it's ALOT.

A Starmie with Thunderbolt/Ice Beam/Surf/Recover and a very bulky spread seemed a nice way to counter a heap of Pokemon. Celebi seemed made for the job, as well as having Stealth Rock as a possibility.


Keep the comments coming guys, they're so much appreciated!
 
I would keep Starmie. However, I'm thinking you should remove Ice Beam and go with Rapid Spin to save your Weavile from Stealth Rock damage. You already have a physical and special variant of an ice move, so removing Ice Beam from Starmie wouldn't be overly devastating.
 
I wouldn't try to counter those pokemon, as much as play around them. You've actually got Gyarados covered pretty well with Zapdos, even if you are running SpDef. Same with Infernape.

CB Heracross doesn't 2HKO Hippowdon, but you can always bring in Zapdos on a Close Combat or Megahorn, or Starmie on a Close Combat if needed.

Salamence is tough, because there are so many sets, I have no advice here.

Zapdos is one of the best Togekiss counters in the game, you shouldn't be having trouble with it, especially with a SpDef oriented Zapdos.

Garchomp gives everyone trouble, this thing is tough to play around, but it is managable. Hippowdon + Weavile should be able to beat it. Weavile can only come in after Garchomp KO's one of your pokemon, or get in on a Swords Dance though.

Lucario has to be beaten by either Hippowdon, Garchomp or Zapdos, depending on the set. SD Extremespeed won't OHKO Garchomp, so that's a lifesaver there.

I'm not going to continue the list, but I hope you see my point. 1 change to your team isn't going to fix all of those threats, so I would recomend trying to outplay them, instead of just countering them.
 
I like the changes alot Kap, good job, seriously. You covered all the weaknesses stated above quite well! The only thing that makes me sad is no wish support, especially for Hariyama. Maybe consider Vaporeon or Jirachi > Celebi? Seems like your main use for Celebi is to smiply wall, which Jirachi and Vaporeon can do as well, but with Wish.
 
Yeah, in Celebi's description it states that I might replace for Jirachi. However, that would give me a hard time against Gyarados. Jirachi will need Stealth Rock somewhere on his set, so it would be something like:

Stealth Rock
Thunderbolt / Thunder (Paralysis chance)
Wish
Zen Headbutt

Sounds doable, but it bothers me that my whole team will be struggling against Swampert without Celebi.

I might just replace Hariyama with a Sleep Talk Machamp, but I like this particular Hariyama set so well. Suggestions?
 
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