ORAS NU Another NU Team

[ProjectShadow]

Hello everyone, Project Shadow here with my second NU team on this forum. I've made quite a number of teams in this tier, but none that I would say are good enough to write an entire page about. Before I get into the team, I'll go through my teambuilding process, which I think works fairly well for me. It's pretty basic to be honest, to start, choose a pokemon that you want to use; for me it was Musharna!

I've made a lot of teams in all the tiers, and most of them didn't do very well for one reason: No set up sweeper. Now that isn't to say that any team without a stat boosting mon is a bad one, but my teams in particular seem like they would benefit from having a mon that can deal out heavy damage without being locked into one move. The next part of the team building process; pick out other mons at semi-random, ones that work to cover the weaknesses that 'Sharna brings. The mons chosen should be dedicated to the roles that are neccessary for a good team (Wall, Choice Sweeper, etc.) and so I made this team:

The first draft. Now one thing I noticed right off the bat was that I still had a lot of weaknesses in type alone. Still, I continued with the third part of my process: Testing. Take the team into battle and search for any weak links, and any mons that threaten the team. The first problem came in the form of Weezing. Without a CM up, Psyshock does less than half against a defensive Weezing, and other than 'Sharna, I had no good way to deal with it. Lilligant was a semi-threat, if it puts Garbodor to sleep, then I have nothing to kill it before it sets up QD's. Now for the final part of teambuilding, the mons that constantly let me down, the ones that didn't do their jobs properly, or could be switched for a Pokemon that does it better were replaced.

The only mons in the original team that were kept in the final, were the first three. This is the final team, in all its glory!

Mushy (Musharna) @ Life Orb
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Psyshock
- Moonlight
- Calm Mind
- Dazzling Gleam

The star of this team, Musharna! A fairly common set I would say, other than the Psyshock. Dazzling Gleam is for Dark types that switch into Psyshock and Moonlight to recover LO damage. This is a set I wanted to try out, but I could never find a good place in any other teams that I built, so I decided to make this the centre of it all. Musharna is great for dealing a lot of damage while being able to take a few neutral attacks itself, perfect for a set-up sweeper!

Garbage (Garbodor) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 208 Def / 44 SpD
Impish Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch
- Seed Bomb
- Haze

This Garb set is kind of unorthodox. Gunk and Drain punch is pretty standard on this mon, but Seed Bomb and Haze aren't seen that often. Seed Bomb is for extra coverage, since I don't see much of a use for T-Spikes, and Haze has proven to be really useful. Gurdurr, Klinklang, Lilligant, Gorebyss, all of them are mostly used for setting up and sweeping. Haze completely ruins these Pokemon, and after the stat changes are gone, I can follow up with one of Garb's moves to deal a lot of damage. And if you're wondering why I use Haze over Clear Smog, the answer is Klinklang.

Quagmire (Quagsire) @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 188 HP / 68 Atk / 252 Def
Brave Nature
- Scald
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Recover

This is one of my favourite Quag sets. I used him a lot when he was in UU, but since moving down there have been more viable water types in that tier. I use mixed Quag because it doesn't have many good Physical Water moves, other than Waterfall but I prefer the burn chance over flinching. Most people expect Water Absorb on Quag, but I prefer Unaware to tank Pokes that have set up and take them down easily. The EV spread might seem a little strange, the reason is because with this spread and Nature, Ice Punch will always do at least 50% to Lilligant and EQuake will almost kill Klinklang and does a lot to Lanturn. And Recover for obvious reasons.

Hairymama (Hariyama) @ Choice Band
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Bullet Punch
- Facade
- Knock Off

Hariyama was originally running AV, but I changed to Choice Band for some reason (I can't remember why exactly). I also used Thick Fat in place of Guts for some extra bulk against Fire/Ice types with the AV, since HP is it's highest stat, and most Fire and Ice type attackers in NU are Special oriented. Pretty standard Hariyama set, slow but with a lot of Attack power. Facade over EQuake because it's a lot more powerful when he's statused.

Tina the Llama (Audino-Mega) @ Audinite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Heal Bell
- Wish
- Protect

I lacked a cleric on my original team. Lanturn did have heal bell, but it didn't have a reliable way of healing itself, nor the bulk to warrant giving it such an important role on the team. That's why I went with a reliable healer, who can take a few hits. Nothing special about this one either. With this mon, I prefer to Mega evolve later on incase I need to take advantage of regular Audino's Regenerator.

Pango (Sandslash) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 84 Def / 4 SpD / 168 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rapid Spin
- Knock Off
- Super Fang

Sandslash took over Prinplup's role in the team. Slash is an excellent Physical wall, that can also deal out quite a bit of damage. Assault Vest also allows it to take at least one Special attack from certain mons if the situation calls for it, and apparently Air Balloon Magmortar is a thing. Normally Fire Blast kills 100% of the with Lefties, but an AV Slash will always live Mag's FB, along with attacks from mons like Lanturn and Cryogonal.

So that's the team. I know that there are a still some flaws with the team, the most obvious being the lack of entry hazards, but there aren't many mons that are completely crippled by hazards, they're more useful in higher tiers so I don't think it'd be that useful. Plus the only mons that DO hurt from rocks aren't really threatening to my team, and if they are then I have the right counters to them. I am willing to change any Pokemon on the team other than Musharna, who I will only accept set changes. Thank you for reading!​

 

[remember16]

Hi ProjectShadow! Before I start, I must warn you this is probably feel quite long too read, so be prepared :)
Hope it helps!

Hide

The first thing that I noticed from your team is their bulk. They're all Pokemon that generally a save switch in to receive resisted attack, and after looking up their set, sure enough, this team is built with counter attack in mind.

However consider this, as all your Pokemon is slow, they will always take the hit first. Even if you switch into another Pokemon for resisting attack, they will take that hit, and then getting hit again before they can attack. That's not even considering if your opponent also switching out to resist your attack, that would make you wasting the turn to do a feeble damage. That's the problem with slow team, they would always a step behind, the other team will reach the goal line first.

The problem with the process of your team building is because you're too concerned about defensive balance. Even if in theory, individually your Pokemon can handle a hit and to find a desirable match up, they wont be able to contain a group of them. And even if they resisted, your Pokemon won't last forever right, their health would be depleted even if it's little by little. If it's a battle of switch your team would be at disadvantage. A strong team is built with this question in mindset, "How could the team I built manage to force a victory?" or "How could I impose myself to my opponent?". And I feel that this team don't have a solid idea about it.

I have experience building team like this, a team full of my bulky stars, such as Miltank, Quagsire, Noctowl, and such. The result is, almost all the battle takes too long because it's filled with switching out. Honestly, it's boring and tedious. And it's not perfect. A team of wall breaker still manage to destroy me.

I also not sure how you're gonna start the game. Who're going to be your ace lead? I know it's also depend on your opponent team, but usually you have a designated lead or two who you can trust to get the game going in your favor. And that's related to what I was saying above about understanding the team's blueprint to win. To any race, a good start is crucial.

I feel like in general, you need to think the offense aspect more because as it is, only Musharna, Hariyama, and Sandslash who are able to do reliable chunk of damage. And I have a reserved opinion about mixing defensive and offensive duty. Even a full HP full defense Quagsire easily 2OHKO from a lot of strong, boosted (Guts, Toxic Boost) neutral attacks like facade. That little attack EV investment is unlikely to worry your opponent. I know that because I have full attack Quagsire with Ice Punch and it didn't even do half against defensive Vileplume, a common switch in against Quagsire. And don't forget, as it is, in this team only unaware Quagsire can handle Malamar, that's why since you don't have a single bug type move I would recommend a fully defensive one with Toxic.

Choice Band Hariyama is interesting, however I'm not convinced about how well it work. He's slow and restricted in movement, basically it would only hinder your team which already predictable to switch in the first place, you would need to predict excellently. Choice Scarf would be better if you want to surprise people, since it's attack already beastly by nature. But in general status orbs is better because it hits hard and allow the flexibility of attack choice. If you don't like a continual damage, Expert Belt could work also. And since you didn't set a status in place, I think Retaliate or Poison Jab would be more helpful instead of Facade.

I also think you need to consider speed control. Such as Thunder Wave, Trick Room, Sticky Web or priority attacks. Because strong, fast wall breaker like Swellow or Quick Feet Ursaring can dent your team considerably. That's why I would recommend to change Garbodor into Skuntank. Both have Aftermath which is good as a guaranteed damage against physical attacker, and have access to Sucker Punch. It can also learn Haze, although I think Taunt would be better in general. And don't forget Pursuit. You could switch it against Psychic type that treathens Hariyama, and threat them back with Pursuit. It can also be a great lead who can prevent status moves with Taunt.

I agree that a team can live without entry hazards. But in this case, I think it's quite important for you to win. If you built around Musharna, then consider the common threat; U-turn and Knock Off all over the place. Pokemon like Schyter, Mesprit, Liepard, Swellow, Archeops, etc. I think Super Fang isn't really necessary on Sandslash, you could sub Stealth Rock for it. You mentioned about its survivabillity with Assault Vest. But staying in against super effective attack that almost kill it isn't wise either right, especially when you don't have any attack to counter them (except Earthquake against Lanturn, very circumstantial, not worth in in general).

And last, I feel like Audino isn't really helpful in general, much less in this team. You could change it into something that can help you against flying types. Mawile resist them, have Intimidate, can take Knock Off well, and can use Sucker Punch, another counter against faster Pokemon. As a steel type it has advantage against fairy, which Hariyama scared against. Rotom Fan could also work as resistor, a status dealer, and attacker. Both also resist grass type like Vileplume, which Quagsire and Sandslash are weak to. Or if you want something that resist fighting, Mr. Mime have double resistance to it. Although it's defense stats is low, it can use a plethora of support moves, like Light Screen, Reflect, Thunder Wave, and many others. And don't forget it is quite fast and a decent special attacker too, with Calm Mind if you want. It's weakness (ghost, poison and steel) can be countered by Skuntank, Quagsire, and Sandslash.

Whatever you pick I think would be more helpful than Audino. In case of Mawile and Mr. Mime, they can also Substitute+Baton Pass to Musharna to give it a reliable protection for setting up Calm Mind. Just need to find the right momentum since both Mawile and Musharna are slow.

In summary:
Change of set including;
-Hariyama's item into something else, not Choice Band. Expert Belt, Life Orb, status Orbs, Leftovers, Brightpowder, berries, etc. your pick. Even Master Ball would be better, just for the lulz if your opponent trying to use Trick on it.
-Facade on Hariyama not really needed, I recommend Retaliate or Poison Jab.
-Change Quagsire into max HP and defense
-Teach Quagsire Toxic instead of Ice Punch.
-Teach Stealth Rock to Sandslash. As a sub for Assault Vest, Rocky Helmet might work

Changes of team member including;
-Substitute Skuntank for Garbodor
-Substitute Audino with something else. My recommendation are Rotom Fan, Mawile, and Mr. Mime

 

[lolbro]

Hi there, nice team you have. Here are somethings id say to do, that the other rate gets wrong/misses imo.

Hariyama should remain choice banded, otherwise you lose the bulky wallbreaker you needed. And facade makes it a great status absorber. Ev spread should be 252+atk/128def/16spe/dump sdef or hp. This allows you to have a chance to live sawk's banded CC. But dont rely on this chance.

Garbodor should have 252 hp/160+ defense/96 speed. This allows is to hit neutral base 55s. Tspikes over haze and spikes of seed bomb. Those moves arent rly needed as the threats you mentioned either dont appreciate a gunk shot already or kill themselves to rocky helmet+aftermath. Which garbodor should have(the helmet)

Take the assault vest off sandslash as its not a vaible item on it. Also remove super fang, give it swords dance and a lum berry. The evs should also be shifted to 178hp/252+atk/87spe.

The standard cm musharn set w/o barrier is
240hp/252+def/16 sdef.
Give it a colbur berry because without it you have no real switchin to sawk that doesnt get hit and killed by a coverage move. Also, signal beam>dazzling gleam, as signal beam hit other psychics harder than dgleam.

The aforementioned quag changes are good but it doesn't fir your team. Instead try changing it too Assault vest magmortar with the ev spread 84hp/252satk/rest in speed. The moveset is: Fire Blast; Focus Blast; Thunderbolt; filler( hp grass/eq/flame charge). This gives you a solid check to vivillon and powerful fire types, it also synergizes well with mdinos wish support and sandlashes spin support.

Good luck with the team,

Lolbro.

tl;dr

im on mobile, cant do proper r8.

 

[HJAD]

hey bro,

Nice team you have here, it looks like a really strong core for a stall team, i like how you utilise typing synergy to make it a strong team to face overall. I would like to take the oppurtuinity to disagree with the above rate, he didn't even mention the item Hariyamas really should be running, which is assault vest. All the items he mentioned are worse than CB, which is the second most common item. I disagree with his nomination of Poison Jab and Retaliate, because a.) hariyama doesnt have the pure power to break the relevant fairy in the tier, which is granbull, not to mention granbull itself is really uncommon, therefore i waste of a coverage slot better spent elsewhere. Dont give it retaliate either, its at best a move for revenge killers, which hariyama is definately not. Agree with Max Defense on Quag, however i dont agree with Toxic. Quagsire doesnt beat the likes of Malamar with Toxic, so its not neccesary at all, especially on a stall team where you really just wanna rack up toxic damage. Agreeing with the last set change, maybe leftovers > rocky helmet for passive recovery. I disagree with Skuntank mention. He has a couple of Psychic checks namely Musharna, Audino and Quagsire depending on coverage selections and Garbodor provides the most useful support of them all which is spikes / hazards support. This means it allows his team to wear down opposing teams easier, and makes the stall team effective overall. Also, because it is clearly a stall team, i disagree with substituteing audino. WishPass on Stall is close to essential, and the suggested replacements dont wall anything you dont already. (not lolbros rate, but remember16s). On the subject of picking out peoples rates, lolbros rate isnt optimal either, since he removes your SR Setter (essential) and removed your main Klinklang Check. I would like to disagree and say Quagsire is almost a staple on stall teams, so it fits perfectly fine.

Now onto my part of the rate. A lot of the sets you are running are quite sub-optimal, so i will be replacing all the sets i feel arent pulling their weight with Standard, more effective sets, which hopefully bear better results. First Change is to run 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 SpD Bold Nature Spread on Musharna, (maximum defense for switching into fighting type pokemon and hp makes it hit a leftovers number which = more passive recovery) and change its item => Leftovers. Signal Beam > Dazzling Gleam lets you hit both Darks and Psychic types at the same time, so is therefore the superior coverage option. Change Garbodors spread => 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe Impish Nature, and its moveset to Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Gunk Shot / Drain Punch. Rocky Helmet as its item helps get huge ammounts of residual damage on physical attackers via rocky helmet and aftermath itself. Quagsire's Spread to Max HP / Max Defense with Curse > Ice Punch. Curse allows you to beat restalk boosters such as Malamar far easier than previously. It also means you can become a psuedo late game win-condition and reliable stop to gurdurrs etc, with the defense boosts and higher attack. Assault Vest on Hariyama and Thick Fat > Guts means you have a much more reliable lilligant check, Fire Check (to stuff like Pyroar) and Ice Check (For stuff like Aurorus.) Because you are running TSpikes on Garbodor, i will suggest running fake out > facade. It means you can rack up free residual damage in between poison and fake out. Also a change of spread to 252 Atk / 252 SpD / 4 Spe Adamant Nature is more optimal since hariyamas high hp stat means it enjoys spdef investment straight up rather than HP invest. Audino moveset is fine. Finally, Leftovers on Sandslash and Stealth Rock > Super Fang mean you have more hazards damage available at your finger tips and passive recovery in lefties. Finally, a change of spread to 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spe Impish Nature allows you to pull off the bulk you need to Spin reliably for your team, as well as set SR.

I think thats it. Your team itself (6 pokemon) have great synergy and wall majority of the meta, you need the above changes however for it to give even better results on ladder or elsewhere.

changes

Musharna==> 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 SpD Bold Nature Spread, Item => Leftovers. Signal Beam > Dazzling Gleam.

Garbodor==> 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe Impish Nature, Item => Rocky Helmet. Moveset to Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Gunk Shot / Drain Punch

Quagsire==> 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def Impish Nature, Curse > Ice Punch

Hariyama==> 252 Atk / 252 SpD / 4 Spe Adamant Nature, Fake Out > Facade

Sandslash==> 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spe Impish Nature, Stealth Rock > Super Fang, Leftovers > Assault Vest.

hope i helped :s
~HJAD