ORAS Ubers Balanced PVP team ft. my perfect Lugia

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groudon.gif
azumarill.gif
lugia.gif
aegislash.gif
serperior.gif


Hey smogon and welcome to my 2nd Ubers RMT. To cut a long story short, I have a perfect IV and nature multiscale Lugia on the way, and decided it was good enough to warrant a new ubers team that I can use in pvp and random battles, because it's highly unlikely random people will stick to OU format without prior contact. With that in mind, this team seeks to do 2 things: One) Use my Lugia correctly and find a way that it can fit onto this team, and 2) to counter common playthrough mons: these include Xerneas, Yveltal, P-Don and P-Ogre, and the 3 mega starters of ORAS, since it's extremely likely these will be in people's playthrough teams. So let's get into the team!

The team:


lucario-mega.gif


Lucario @ Lucarionite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bullet Punch
- Close Combat
- Swords Dance
- Ice Punch

Onto the first member of my team: M-Lucario. Besides being ridiculously cool looking, he does serve a massive purpose for me and that's to counter, or try to counter the fairies roaming Ubers. Besides the OU fairies, the only OU fairies to be added are Arceus-F, Mawile and Xerneas, all of which I counter with either steel or fighting, such as a guaranteed 2hko to Mawile with Close Combat, and a +2 Bullet Punch with a 92% chance to OHKO Xerneas that's HP Invested; an ohko if it's not. That makes Swords dance hugely necessary on this set, allowing it to wallbreak with a very respectable 355 speed, placing it just ahead of the OU contested speer tier and meaning I don't need to rely on speed boosting stats really. Also, just as an added bonus, it actually ohkos P-Don and P-Ogre with a +2 CC, which is ridiculous; I once went 5-0 with Mega Luc, and died when I hit Xerneas for 87% health with one Bullet Punch, so I know this guy can really put some work in. Not much to say about the EV spread or moveset for Lucario, I'm running Ice Punch just for coverage but if there's a better move somewhere else then let me know!

groudon-primal.png


Groudon @ Red Orb
Ability: Drought
EVs: 104 HP / 252 Atk / 96 SpD / 58 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Roar

I needed someone who could soak fire and fighting, and with a fire resist, huge bulk, massive attack stat and the ability to set up rocks, P-Don deserved a place in my team (but really, who needs an excuse to use this guy?) The very small amount of speed EVs on this set allow me to outrun uninvested enemy P-Dons, allowing me to reliably 2hko defensive Groundons with the accuracy from Earthquake and the ability to outspeed those checks. I lumped most of the EVs into attack, as with an adamant nature it reaches 504 attack which is just dumb, and the rest into HP and Sp.Def to take advantage of it's massive bulk, allowing it to survive certain things such as a +2 Xerneas Moonblast among other defensive benchmarks. The role of P-don on my team is to set up rocks and be a water soak, a fire resist, and serve to use it's massive attack stat boosted Earthquake to pressure fire/steel types, keeping mons such as Aegislash (using Lava Plume to avoid King's shield) and Mega Blaziken away from my team. Lava plume is there because in the sun, he has a quite high special attack stat, letting him use this without the contact of physical fire moves, and since the sun doesn't boost accuracy I'm loathe to use Fire blast. Roar is there just for phasing, but with the utility of this team's status conditions such as Toxic, this can be quite an annoying and powerful move when combined with Stealth Rock.

azumarill.gif


Azumarill @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 202 HP / 252 Atk / 50 Def
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Waterfall
- Play Rough
- Superpower

Azumarill actually serves a very important benchmark on this team and that's to counter the physical dragons of Ubers. In particular, with a small investment to Defence, he survives a Dragon Ascent (though it does kill after SR, perhaps I need more Defence investmet) and it ohkos with Play Rough. If it misses, though, I'm done for. The other reason for picking Azumarill was that I needed a really good fire soak alongside P-Don to keep my Aegislash and Lucario running at 100% efficiency. It also becomes a perfect Mega Blazekin counter, resisting both it's stabs and being double effective with mine. So actually Azu becomes quite important to this team, filling in defensive holes and actually being a reliable (as reliable as you can be with 90% accuracy) physical dragon counter, though with one D-Dance M-Salamance does kill me, and M-Ray kills me after SR, so I think this slot needs touching up or replacing: It needs to counter dragons and be a fire and preferably a ground soak too.

lugia.gif


Lugia @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Aeroblast
- Recover
- Defog
- Toxic

I was really hyped to use my Lugia, and then when I went on Smogon I was really disheartened when I read that basically it's pretty shit and only fits on stall and some balanced teams. Since this is the mon I wanted to build around I really need this guy to work, as I've put in a lot of effort to attain him. I went with the smogon recommended build of fully defensive, as with multiscale intact it still has amazing specially defensive capabilities; it even takes a 3hko off Darkrai's Dark Pulse. Well, 2hko once M-scale is broken, but it really just walls almost everything. I went with a damaging move since I didn't want it to be walked over, but the combo of a hard hitting move, recover and toxic damage should make this, unless it's a steel mon, a really hard mon to take out. I went with recover over roost because recover doesn't get rid of my flying typing. This is the mon I'm so anxious to get right, so give me a heads up on how to use him.

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Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Pursuit
- Iron Head
- King's Shield
- Night Slash

Aegislash actually fulfills a really important role in this team of countering psychic and ghost types, and a back-up check to fairies with iron head. Although it's weak to ghost, it can take the hit with the shield forme, then hit with a slow night slash, taking advantage of it's stance change to really hit hard to enemy ghost and psychic types. It also has pursuit, which is in the same boat as Night Slash as a slow attack, or gets priority when they switch out, making it an incredible Lati@s and Alakazam counter, and allowing it to do serious damage to Mew, Darkrai and the like. The big Lati@s counter is the real reason it's on the team, as well as being a back-up check to fairies such as Xerneas, wearing them down or even outright killing them to allow my team to clean-up and sweep.

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Serperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Giga Drain
- Dragon Pulse
- Glare

Serperior is there to cover the lack of water coverage in this team; Namely to P-Ogre and Mega Swampert, two of the mons I need to cover in this team. Although P-Don does go to town on Serp with an ice beam, the combo of a boosted Leaf Storm and then a +2 giga drain on the next attack means I can make short work of him. Of course, if it's +2 before Kyogre comes in then it's dead anyway. Dragon pulse is there because I really needed a way of hitting the dragons alongside my Azumarill, and I went with glare over HP Fire simply because I wanted a way of spreading paralysis and the only mons I'd be able to hit with HP Fire are steel and grass types, all of which I have covered anyway.

Conclusion:

That's the team! I haven't played Ubers much at all, I'm basically still new to it and so don't know the sort of threats I will be coming up against. Since I won't be using it on showdown much and plan to create in on my copy of Omega Ruby, I need to use mons that are attainable to me, and also since I'm mainly using this team in PVP and with friendly battles on my game, some of the mons that are in ubers threat lists won't be present in PVP. Still, please rate, tell me how shit the team is, give me ways to make it better but basically I need to team to counter or at least check the mega starters and each of the legendaries from Gen 6 and I need the team to consist of mons I can actually attain. Thanks Y'all!
 
I am not a very good rater, but I can recommend one thing: take Flamethrower>Lava Plume on P-Don. The added power is pretty big, especially in the sun, and is also has the perfect accuracy you were looking for in Lava Plume.
 
Lucario is pretty solid for this team, but there are many flaws in the other pokemon. Thunder Wave is usually preferred over roar as it allows you to slow down most of the metagame and can completely stop GeoXern (by making it slower than you, then you can click eq and kill it faster than it can kill you). Keep Lava Plume on P-Don, it has a higher burn chance at the cost of 10 BP. As for Azmuarill, if you want it to be used for eating up fire types, like kyogre, or palkia (if possible to obtain). Even Lugia would be a better choice since it has multiscale and access to good recovery, but Azumarill just does not have the bulk or recovery options to be switching in on fire types/taking hits from them. Lugia with HA cannot have Defog on it as it is a gen 4 tutor move and the only way to get its HA is for it to be obtained in gen 5. Replace Aeroblast with something like Ice Beam to allow you to hit m-mence/ray/any other dragon type that may be a threat, and replace defog with whirlwind so you can safely remove pokemon that you cannot kill otherwise/will attempt to setup on you. Aegislash should be running shadow claw over night slash since it is STAB and super-effectively hits psychics and ghosts. Have the EV spread for aegis 252 HP / 248 Atk / 8 in the preferred stat unless you need it to have SpD bulk. For Serperior, I recommend using LO over lefties for the damage boost and that you are running giga drain. Keeping glare could be useful as it allows paralysis on threats, but it is not going to live a lava plume/fire punch from pdon.
 
Hi, MaChew94 and congrats on your perfect Lugia. The three mega starter pokemon are not common at all in Ubers. The only one you will see is Blaze. As you mentioned before, Lugia fits on more bulky builds, and is a fairly common mon on stall teams. Unfortunately some of the pokemon and sets on your team are completely not-viable in the ORAS Ubers metagame. Serperior and Azumarill, while very powerful and big threats in the OU metagame, they don't quite fit with the big boys in the Ubers tier. Lucario, Groudon,Aegislash, and Lugia are all decent in the tier but there is a few things to fix up concerning these pokemon.

First off is Lugia, Aeroblast is not used because it just doesn't hit the mons lugia looks to check hard enough, also Defog is very rarely used and only fits on specific Lugia builds. I believe this Lugia set will fit your team better. Ice Beam hits dragons such as Rayquaza and Salamence, and keeping Toxic to wear down other threats such as Groudon. Whirlwind can phaze out threats such as Arceus and Xerneas. 136 speed outpaces Adamant Rayquaza.

Lugia is not very good at all on anything but bulkier stallier teams. HOgia is a joke around the community about Lugia paired with offensive mons such as your team. There have been some great Lugia builds that are featured on the Sample Team Thread. If you scroll down you will see two Lugia builds, Absolute Control(Sun Balance) by Lord Outrage and Full Stall by many people.

I am not going to focus on the members on your team as I believe the best Lugia builds have already been built, but will help out on the movesets of some of the Pokemon to give you better move-sets and further your knowledge of the Ubers tier.

Lugia @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 248 HP / 124 Def / 136 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic
- Ice Beam
- Roost
- Whirlwind

Lucario runs Iron Tail over ice punch, being able to knock out Mega-Sableye after a +2 boost.

Lucario @ Lucarionite
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Bullet Punch
- Iron Tail

Aegislash is a very interesting mon in the Ubers metagame. It can pursuit trap the lati twins, deo-a, and is a great Xerneas check. Toxic is for the free switch-ins it gives to Ho-Oh and Primal Groudon.

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- King's Shield
- Gyro Ball
- Toxic
- Pursuit

You can find the analysis and good movesets of all mons here. Also here is a list of great resources for the ORAS ubers tier. http://pastebin.com/ZbWyPHSp

Hope I helped!
 
Thanks for your replies guys! There's a lot there so I'm gonna break it down. Firstly, I'm keeping L-Plume for the 30% burn chance, that's just ridiculous. I'll trial everything you've said ih8ih8sn0w , because it all makes pretty sweet sense.

HOgia is a joke around the community about Lugia paired with offensive mons such as your team

Would this mean I should make a stall team rather than balanced? I've never really created a stall team to be honest, but would it fit better with Lugia?

Aegislash is a very interesting mon in the Ubers metagame.

Your Aegislash build beats mine :P However, it is worth running Toxic on two mons? Or should one be running WoW, since I may be putting T-Wave on my P-Don.

Serperior and Azumarill, while very powerful and big threats in the OU metagame

If I can viably build a balanced team with Lugia, I need better mons that Serp and Azu. This is just coming from my complete inexperience with the Ubers tier. What would you recommend I use to replace these? I need a fire soak, dragon counter (my original thought reason for picking Azumarill) and a bulky water (M-Swamp, since I did say I'll pvp with this team and not Showdown with it, meaning it's very likely I'll bump into a mega starter from someone's playthrough team). That said, I do need a water counter since I need a way to pick off Kyogre. What would you guys recommend I replace Serp and Azu with?

TL, DR; Should I keep it a balanced team or should I try and make a more stall oriented one to fully use Lugia. If I'm going for stall, head's up on how it works in ubers, if I'm keeping it balanced what would you replace Serp and Azu with?

Apologies for my lack of knowledge about this tier, the only reason I'm trying ubers is because of my Lugia :P Any help would be appreciated, and thanks for your help so far! :)
 
So after going away and reading through the recourse list you posted, I realised that building a semi-stall based team greatly increases it's viability and actually looks like a real fun kind of playstyle. With that in mind, I knocked up a first drat of my first ever stall based team, taking insipiration for a few mons from the "Absolute Control Sun Balance" to get this effect:

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M-Sableye lets me spread burns, bounce hazards, soak fighting and E-Speed, allowing me to counter E-speed variants of Arceus, C-band Dragonites and Lucario. Klefki gives me spike control and a way to counter dark type leads such as Darkrai, Yveltal and lets me cripple Xerneas, as long as I don't use it for set-up fodder. P-Groudon actually either becomes my sweeper, using either rock polish or SD, or a special wall, countering P-Ogre. Lugia lets me counter M-Ray, M-Salamence with ice beam, whirlwinding those who manage to set up, and T-tar is my rock setter, sand setter and pursuit trapper, giving me a back-up check to the big dark boys running in Ubers. (On a side note and one that was completely unintentional, because Unnerve sucks and I have to use sandstream, it was nice to see none of my team take sand damage, whereas they all do). Clefable just gives me a cleric, win-con with calm mind, and an answer to fairies (since it's neutral damage) and dark types alongside Klef.


Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Foul Play

Klefki (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
IVs: 0 SAtk
Careful Nature
- Toxic
- Thunder Wave
- Draining Kiss
- Spikes

Groudon @ Red Orb
Trait: Drought
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Lava Plume
- Thunder Wave
- Swords dance? Rock Polish?

Lugia @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 248 HP / 124 Def / 136 Spe
Bold Nature
- Ice Beam
- Toxic
- Roost
- Whirlwind

Tyranitar @ Smooth Rock
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 80 Def / 180 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Rock Slide
- Pursuit
- Crunch

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Heal Bell

OR

Scizor @ Leftovers
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 180 SpD / 80 Def
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- Roost
- Bullet Punch
- U-Turn/Knock Off

Since this is my first attempt, it's pretty shoddy, but the essence is I want to use 5 mons to stall and one to be a set-up late game sweeper, using rocks, sand, spikes, Toxic, T-Wave and WoW to cripple their team. I'm consdering a swords dance Scizor to sweep late game, but this compounds a nasty fire weakness; On one hand, Clef gives me fairy STAB and a cleric option, on the other hand Scizor can clean-up late and gives me amazing fairy pressure, at the cost of losing out to dark types.

EDIT: Or I run a late-game Swords Dance Aegislash that can pursuit trap, remove T-tar completely, move SR onto Groudon and run Clefable in the last slot. Choices, choices!
 
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Bump. Sorry to "revive" an old thread but I want your opinion on that stall team proposed above, and also what you guys think about this proposed change, or what you can think to adapt based on the mons proposed above.
 
Essentially you dropped the viable mons that gave this team potential to branch out and then followed a structure that combines the elements of two sample teams, but didn't cary over the Arceus. As a result, the final product is just sample stall except you're running Klefki over Arceus-Water. Some of your sets also aren't optimal such as Tyranitar and Clefable.

SD Mega Scizor and SD Aegislash aren't really worth using ever so I wouldn't be considering those. In terms of overall structure it's double Fairy, no Arceus, and no Defogger / Spinner + Lugia that stick out immediately, along with the fact that Primal Groudon doesn't have Rest meaning your only Primal Kyogre switch-in can be eliminated via repeated bombardment or residual damage. Adding an arbitrary offensive mon to this build in an effort to help the matchup against stall just doesn't really work; you need to win the stall matchup with meticulous play and / or by fitting in defensive stall breakers. Unfortunately there just isn't much to talk about because as it was already pointed out, this build is just a hybrid of two sample teams. Either you optimize to the standard or you incur heavy restructure by building around Lugia and something that allows you to justify breaking away from these standard arrangements.

Summary:
- Either optimize to standard stall with personal preferences where appropriate, or restructure around Lugia to a build that is able to justify its differences with standard defensive builds

Normally I wouldn't have rated this team as the course of action is either to optimize to a standard or basically scrap most of the team, but you really seemed to want some suggestion on where to go which is why I replied. That's pretty much everything to say, so good luck with your Lugia build.
 
Yeah I get your point. Looking st the stall team in more detail, the only mon I don't like is Arceus, because I'm sick of seeing them, just personal preference really. Saying that, what if I changed the arceus form for a defensive defogger that fits the arceus role; either a defogger latios, or replace Ho-oh with a calm mind wall breaker Latios and get a defensive giratina in instead of arceus, giving me mega gengar pressure too with shadow sneak. I like the look of the main stall team but I want my own flair on it so what do you think? Only very Minor changes but I think it can work; id still have the groudon, klef, Lugia and sableye, just a few other moms to replace the common uber mons. With a M sableye I want to limit the amount of damage ghost does to
The team, so I'm leaning towards the idea of a Latios defogger and offensive Ho oh, but I'd probably do a HP / Att set on him
 
Arceus can't really be replaced as the jobs it does for this build and how effectively it does them is better than any potential replacement. You can use Defog Latios along with Ho-Oh, but then the build is Mega Sab / Latios / Ho-Oh / Arc Water / P Don / Lugia which is still an awkward combination of two sample teams and wants to default to one of them to cover the structure issues. Gira-A is generally a pretty awful Pokemon, and I would never use it outside of a stall team that wanted to ease the stall matchup by including a crazy bulky Rest mon that has Pressure. If you meant Gira-O with max Attack and 252 Def, that can work for such a build, but you're still similar to known structures. Your build would then be Gira-O / P Don / Arc Water / Ho-Oh / Lugia / Klefki.

If you want an effective stall team with some flair, like I already said, you're going to have to start over from Lugia and a niche Pokemon that has qualities you are interested in. You can look at defensive Pokemon that are in the B - C range of the viability thread to maybe get some inspiration, but the list doesn't necessarily stop there. Don't over do it though, be sure your decisions are justified and you aren't just using weird stuff for the sake of using weird stuff. Building with some of the more esoteric things out there requires a much more familiar grasp of Ubers, because you need to be able to identify what is worthwhile and what isn't. Since this is your first Ubers team you might want to follow paragraph one instead even though it means your build isn't groundbreaking or anything. Being new to the tier you should set out to make a solid team, not an innovative one.
 
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