Format Discussion BD/SP Random Battles Set Discussion


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BD/SP random battles are now live. Set generation is still very much a work in progress; if you get bad sets, feel free to post them here so that they can be fixed. Please remain civil in this thread. Thanks!

What should be posted here?
- Accurate reports or screenshots of objectively bad movesets, ability synergy, items, et cetera.
- Suggestions on moves or items to add to (or remove from) Pokemon, backed by good reasoning.

Please do not post:
- One-liners. This includes suggestions without any backup reasoning.
- Requests to add the National Dex.
- Posts complaining about unfairness, demanding certain Pokemon should be "banned" from the format, or complaining about hax.
- Screenshots of movesets that are not actually bad.
- Suggestions for other existent or potential formats

Important details about Random Battles that affect set effectiveness and generation!
- All Pokemon have 85 EVs in every stat with a neutral nature, unless 0 Atk EVs/IVs and 0 Spe EVs/IVs would be beneficial. In these cases, the rest of the EVs are still 85 and the nature is still neutral.
- The set generation is random and runs on an algorithm. Sets will not be identical from match to match, and some sets may be slightly better than others; this thread is only for reporting unviable/undesirable sets. If you want the same few sets every time, you should play Battle Factory instead!
- Unreleased Pokemon and abilities and illegal move combinations are allowed in Random Battles.

You can find all Pokemon info here:
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Blastoise should be allowed to have Shell Smash because I don’t think there’s any reason not to let it have such a strong move. Earthquake would be a useful addition alongside Shell Smash, though maybe less useful in sets without it.
Wormadam-Trash should be using Flash Cannon over Iron Head because it’s better in pretty much every way and this would allow Wormadam-Trash to also use Quiver Dance.
minor oversight presumably but it seems like Darkrai was not set to lvl 80
edit: same for Deoxys, and possibly other legendaries/mythicals as well?
View attachment 387310
Actually it seems as though all mythicals are level 100, somehow.

Other most notable things are that:
Wailord has 3 moves because Ice Beam was inputted twice.

Tropius can get a berry, but a Lum Berry; it has Harvest, so Sitrus Berry is way better. Bibarel also has Moody and is the one mon who doesn't want that, go for Simple instead since it has Curse.

Sunflora being Grassy Terrain instead of Sunny Day is also just, odd? This feels like a deliberate decision, though, since it's Sunny Day in every other gen.

Noctowl having Shadow Ball over Hyper Voice is also strange too. I don't mind it having both, but Noctowl also isn't powerful enough to be worth a 80BP non-STAB move.
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things that seem less ideal:

leftovers unown (e with hp fighting and m with hp psychic if that matters)
chestorest mantine (bulba says it still gets roost in bdsp)
fake out + sucker punch + choice band shiftry (with leaf blade/brick break if that helps)
agility + swift swim seaking (wouldnt rain dance be better here? sd/waterfall/megahorn were other moves)

imo intimidate is considerably better than shed skin on arbok unless it has rest for some reason, and i got shed skin arbok, but shed skin users being immune to poison is rare and maybe intimidate already has a higher chance, so idk

got fake out/dedge/heal bell/twave Delcatty. yes, it can twave ghosts, but if it cant directly attack them, maybe looking into Normalize could be fruitful? normal Twave is funny, Sucker Punch becomes 96 BP STAB priority (remember Normalize boosts power now), Play Rough is a no-recoil powerful STAB (but less accurate than dedge), stomping tantrum could have some gimmicky setup


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rain dance / sub / bulk up / drain punch swift swim poliwrath

choice band hitmontop with sucker (sucker / mach / stone edge / cc) seems a bit suspect. somewhat similarly, im not sure if choice band fake out kangaskhan is something intended to be possible, but i got it (with dedge/eq/crunch)

aerial ace on dugtrio seems a bit niche. maybe memento or toxic, both of which appreciate being on a fast mon? not a life threatening question though
  • :Butterfree: has Sleep Powder listed twice
  • :Fearow: is capable of learning Drill Run in DBSP and likely would get way more mileage from it than from Steel Wing
  • :Arbok: could make use of Coil in its moveset. Also works well with Shed Skin removing status
  • if :Crobat: is gonna have only one STAB available, can it have Brave Bird instead of Air Slash?
  • :Venomoth: would likely bennefit from having Sleep Powder as an option
  • :alakazam: probably would enjoy Dazzling Gleam in the options (also opens up choice set possibilities)
  • :scizor: could have X-Scissor added for a STAB option that doesn't force it out (and also makes 4 attacks choice possible)
  • Considering Grass-types, :Gyarados: would likely want Ice Fang more than Stone Edge
  • :Vaporeon: should have Wish + Protect over RestTalk since it enables Vaporeon to also heal allies if needed
  • :Leafeon: should run Double Edge over X-Scissor for neutral coverage on Fire and Flying
  • :Glaceon: more than likely wants Shadow Ball more than Roar (also allows 4 attack choice sets)
  • :Feraligatr: wants the option to run Ice Punch for Grass-types
  • I'd think :ampharos: wants to be full choice specs with Power Gem and Volt Switch more than having RestTalk. Doesn't seem like it's the kind of thing that wants longetivity anyway
  • Double Hit does more damage from :ambipom: than Facade does thanks to Technician
  • :Honchkrow: and :Mismagius: appear to be missing from the set list for some reason.
  • :Heracross: has Throat Chop that deals more damage than Night Slash
  • :Sceptile: could maybe slot Dragon Pulse to enable full attacks choice sets
  • :Gardevoir: should be using Moonblast over Dazzling Gleam
  • :Gallade: probably bennefits more from Knock Off or Shadow Sneak than it does with Poison Jab
  • :Hariyama: could bennefit from Bullet Punch as an option
  • :Wailord: has Ice Beam listed twice. Can't think of a good replacement though
  • :Milotic: would likely want Recover over RestTalk to use an extra move
  • :Froslass: likely wants to use that speed tier to set Spikes
  • :Bibarel: can get more attack from Swords Dance than it does from Curse
  • :Wormadam-trash: might have a better time with Quiver Dance + Flash Cannon over Dig and Iron Head. Could be wrong about this
  • :Skuntank: could bennefit from Nasty Plot. This would require swapping Poison Jab and Crunch for Dark Pulse and Sludge Bomb though
  • :Rotom: (all forms) might want Nasty Plot on their sets

Link to the sets for reference:
Moves for Ambipom in [Gen 8 BDSP] Random Battle:Brick Break, Facade, Fake Out, Shadow Claw, Switcheroo, U-turn

Ambipom has 2 amazing abilities in Technician or Skill link and Ambipom could use a lot of cool moves with Technician.

Here are some moves that are affected by Technician that could replace some that are are not being affected:
Thief (90 BP) > Shadow claw (70 BP)
Double hit (105 BP) > Facade (70 BP)
Revenge (90 BP) > Brick Break (75 BP)
Aerial Ace (90 BP) could also be added as it's good vs fighting types which obviously destroy Ambipom.

If Drapion is going to have Sniper and Scope Lens, it should have Cross Poison instead of Poison Jab, shouldn’t it?
It doesn't have a wide Movepool. Gust hits fighting types specially breloom. Recently Gust Shedinja was used in Smogon Charity Bowl Tournament.
Lvl 80 85 SpA Shedinja Gust vs. Lvl 80 85 HP / 85 SpD Breloom: 68-80 (29.9 - 35.2%) -- 9.7% chance to 3HKO
Lvl 80 85 SpA Shedinja Gust vs. Lvl 80 85 HP / 85 SpD Heracross: 44-56 (16.9 - 21.6%) -- 3.5% chance to 4HKO after burn damage
Also, Breloom has Rock Tomb in its pool. Not to mention that 90% of fighting types have rock or dark moves in their pool. Including Hera.
Why does Shedinja have Gust in its pool lmao
Lvl 80 85 SpA Shedinja Gust vs. Lvl 80 85 HP / 85 SpD Breloom: 68-80 (29.9 - 35.2%) -- 9.7% chance to 3HKO
Lvl 80 85 SpA Shedinja Gust vs. Lvl 80 85 HP / 85 SpD Heracross: 44-56 (16.9 - 21.6%) -- 3.5% chance to 4HKO after burn damage
Also, Breloom has Rock Tomb in its pool. Not to mention that 90% of fighting types have rock or dark moves in their pool. Including Hera.
Gust isn’t for dealing any serious damage, it’s for PP stalling. Without access to Swords Dance, it doesn’t really have a whole lot that’s better to use. False Swipe does have a little more, but that’s otherwise inferior for hopefully obvious reasons. The other main contender with just as much PP as Gust would be Metal Claw, and this might actually be preferable. It’ll hit harder in general being a physical attack, and in a PP stalling situation, the small chance to raise attack can actually come into play. The only real downside is that it’s a contact move so Garchomp can switch into it for an instant KO, but there aren’t any other Pokémon with Rough Skin, Iron Barbs, or Rocky Helmet to worry about.

I’m fine with Stone Edge as an alternative to Head Smash that lets Aggron run Sturdy, but they don’t need to be on the same set and apparently these are its only moves? It needs something else to fill out the band set, and I think that should be Avalanche. Superpower doesn’t hit much that EQ and Heavy Slam don’t already cover, but it would work too.
I did a game on random battle BDSP today and I faced a Shedinja without any move in my team able to touch him, statue him, in a way to kill him. I think it's not supposed to happen so I just let you know, here is the replay of the game : Gen8BDSPRandomBattle-2021-12-05-chewba-thewalnut27.html

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