Gen 5 BW2 Specs Dnite Rain

[WaywardAlchemist]

Poképaste: https://pokepast.es/da10c1a28d44c0c5



THE TEAM:
Politoed @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Perish Song

Obligatory rain setter. Scarf provides a bit more speed control for the otherwise somewhat slow team, outpacing much of the unboosted metagame. Perish Song is run over additional coverage to force out threats that Politoed would be otherwise unable to revenge kill, such as Ferrothorn or Keldeo.

Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Flash Cannon
- Thunder

Magnezone serves to trap Steels (namely Skarmory and Scizor) that would otherwise trouble this team, as well as providing momentum with Volt Switch. Hidden Power Ice is preferred to Hidden Power Fire because Thunder does more damage to all of its targets in the rain save for Ferrothorn, but leech protect Ferrothorn 1v1s Magnezone with ease in the rain. Hidden Power Ice is situational, but if I suspect a fast U-Turn from a Scizor or the opponent's Skarmory holding a Shed Shell, I can hit their Lando, Gliscor, or Garchomp hard on the switch.

Mamoswine @ Life Orb
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Mamoswine is a critical Pokémon on this team, as it sets up Stealth Rocks as well as functioning as a tremendously powerful wallbreaker capable of coming in on Ice type attacks and checking the Dragon types that trouble my Dragonite. It is also a valuable asset against Sand teams, as its Ground/Ice STAB coverage and powerful priority can handle almost every important staple of Sand teams.

Dragonite @ Choice Specs
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hurricane
- Thunder
- Surf
- Draco Meteor

Here it is, the reason I made the team in the first place. I already know you're typing a comment telling me to replace it with Specs Latios. I'm not dumb, I know Specs Latios would probably be better. But I wanted to experiment with Specs Dragonite because STAB Hurricane alongside its incredible bulk with Multiscale were very intriguing traits to me. I decided to go with Modest over Timid because its natural bulk allows it to eat almost any hit in the metagame (outside of a few Ice type attacks, I'm sure) and retaliate with a powerful Special attack. Additionally, I can bluff a Banded or setup set by bringing it in against a Special wall and get a sizeable hit off against an unsuspecting physically defensive Pokémon.

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin

Another old standby of rain teams, Starmie is able to apply incredible offensive pressure with rain boosted life orb Hydro Pump. It discourages switches with Analytic, and has an astounding speed tier. It also helps to check irritating threats to my team such as Gyarados, Keldeo, and Terrakion by virtue of its speed, coverage, and power. Naturally, it also carries rapid spin, which it can use to great effect due to the amount of switches it can force.

Toxicroak @ Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 28 HP / 252 Atk / 228 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Drain Punch
- Sucker Punch
- Ice Punch

The final member of my team is Toxicroak. I chose this Pokémon due to its ability to both abuse rain itself and switch in on irritating Pokémon that can abuse the rain my team provides, such as Keldeo and Ferrothorn. With its power and priority, it will be able to frequently clean up the holes punched by the other heavy hitters on my team like Mamoswine and Dragonite, or it can itself help to break teams by the amount of free hits it can get off after switching in on the aforementioned threats.

 

[phosphor]

OK, quite a bit of stuff here. Dragonite in Rain has actually been a trend lately (see: dice vs M Dragon BW Cup finals, Conflict v Heist WCoP) and given that powerful Specs users are a great way to break balances that rely too much on resistances now, this idea has merit. I like how your team has a lot of power which preempts a lot of potential threats. However, I feel like there are some places for optimization here.

I actually imported this into my teambuilder, and the first thing that structurally struck me was that your only Steel-type is Magnezone. Rain builds have existed where there's one Steel-type, dual hazards Ferro works because he can get both hazards up before getting executed, and Jirachi is difficult to trap, and either can be paired with Tentacruel to further resist the ability to be bombarded by Meteors. But not only is Magnezone useless in this regard, because it can't take those boosted Dragon-type attacks, but his current build is kind of counterproductive with the rain you have. Normally Magnezone uses Sunny Day on Ferrothorns in Rain (you can't do this on a Rain team), or gets behind a Sub and starts boosting. All five of your current members aside from Magnezone don't really mind Skarmory that much, and other Steels like Ferrothorn and Scizor get run over anyway, so maybe he can be switched out?

I then decided to look at the members individually and see what common Rain problems aren't covered. Some common Rain weaknesses like Reuniclus can be covered by the great deal of power you brought, and you have a lot of stops to Keldeo with three mons that resist both of its STABs, but there are glaring weaknesses I can see. First and foremost, if Gyarados gets up a Substitute on you, you pretty much lose. And with guys like Croak and Mamo around, opportunities are not hard to find. Second, Rotom-W can harass every member of your team and you have no real way of punishing it. Sure, Rotom-W gets worn down over time, but before that it stops most of your team cold or gets in really dangerous stuff like either Latios (who as I mentioned, claims one every time it comes in) or Breloom (who actually takes a big hit from most of the guys here, but if he gets a free turn he's basically gotten a free kill on you). Substitute or Agility Thundurus-T also poses a problem, but that's part and parcel of a lot of rain. Opposing Toxicroak aren't that nice.

My solution is to try to make everything more efficient. Find those little ways where you can inch your way past all of these guys. Encore on Politoed allows it to switch in on a boosting Gyarados (which it outspeeds if Politoed is Adamant) and either lock it to Substitute or Dragon Dance. Either provides an opportunity for Dragonite to come in and click Thunder. Alternatively, you can just kill it with HP Electric, but this isn't recommended with most variants of my next suggestion.

As I said, Magnezone isn't doing much. Why not replace it with Dual Hazards Ferrothorn? You get both hazards up, check Latios, and depending on how much you want to Power Whip Tentacruel you can run Knock Off/ Gyro Ball to harass other Ferrothorns/ Skarmory, Power Whip/ Gyro Ball so you don't need to take drastic measures against Gyarados, or Power Whip/ Knock Off to harass Steels and Gyarados but you'd have to rely on every one else's Ice moves to check Dragon-types (which you have a lot of so you might choose this). Plus, both hazards on the same guy frees up Mamoswine to have Substitute, which is another great way for you to keep up the offensive pressure and harass Rotom-W. Ferrothorn gives you a Garchomp/ Scarf Lando-T switch, too (Lando kind of U-turns on everyone as it is now). It's those little things.

Maybe there's room for Sleep Talk on Dragonite? That way switch-ins on Breloom aren't awkward and you turn every time he hits the field into an advantage. Hurricane/ Surf/ Thunder/ Sleep Talk can work, but there's room depending on how much you want to brick Amoonguss. 56 HP / 248 SpA / 204 Spe EVs with a Modest nature give you a reservoir of bulk while allowing you to outpace most Specially Defensive Jirachi and Calm Heatran.

Maybe something on Toed that stops Jolly Toxicroak from claiming everyone? I can't think of much beyond that. Reuni isn't a problem until it gets two CMs up. Then it wins, but it probably doesn't get there. Can't think of much beyond that. Hope I helped.

 

[peng]

Hey man, this is a really cool rain offense team. You're mostly good to go but there's a couple of things that look like they could be annoying for you:

One of the biggest offensive threats looks like Scarf Excadrill, particularly on sand. With the exception of Dragonite, you're getting mauled by choice-locked Earthquake alone. Dragonite's Stealth Rock weakness really comes to bite you here - if you don't play Starmie perfectly then you're immediately on a timer - you have to kill Excadrill within 4 Dragonite switch-ins or else you probably never will. A combination of just SR Tyranitar + Excadrill alone looks pretty tough to deal with here. You can bluff Air Balloon with Magnezone for a while but as soon as you show you don't have it, things look to get tough.

What I think would really help you here is one of the following, ranked in order of preference:
1) Something that can tank EQs
2) Something that really takes advantage of Choice-locked Earthquake
3) Something that baits and weakens Drill
4) (as a last resort) Something faster than Scarf Exca so you can at least revenge it - this lets you play the sac game

Its not the perfect fix at all, but if you're comitted to the idea of Magnezone then use the Air Balloon set. If you can keep the balloon intact then you can hard punish Choice locked Excadrill. Whilst most good players will probably expect Air Balloon from team preview regardless, you can put your opponent in really really tough positions by setting up Toxicroak in the early- to mid-game - a lot of teams rely hard on Scarf Excadrill or Lando-T to as their main out against it, and Toxicroak + Balloon Magnezone can be a nightmare.

A more consistent option would be to go down the route that firelit nights recommends. Although the Ferrothorn set he recommends will often lose 1v1 vs Excadrill, it can indirectly mess with a Scarf Excadrill game plan. Firstly, Spikes will encourage Excadrill to come in early/mid-game, take gradual chip damage, and lock into Rapid Spin. With good play you can put it in range of Toxicroak Sucker Punch or Mamo Ice Shard before Dragonite gets worn down by SR. Secondly, Knock Off Ferrothorn will cripple Scarf Excadrill before it eventually loses to it - without a Scarf, Excadrill is absolutely no problem for you at all.

I'd probably disagree with going dual hazard Ferrothorn though. I'd personally keep SR on Mamoswine and focus on making Ferrothorn as self-sufficient as you can. I'd probably go with Protect or Leech Seed in the final slot, otherwise it'll get worn down too quickly by combinations of Latios + Drill / Latios + Zam / Latios + Thund-T.

Without Magnezone you get opened up a bit against Skarm + Jelli/Gastro balance teams, so just keep an eye out for that. Certainly not unlosable, but Starmie becomes incredibly important for both hazard control and wallbreaking. More of a paper weakness than anything.

Ended up rambling but hope this helps!

 

[phosphor]

Maybe he should swap out Toxicroak for Gyarados to solve the Scarf Exca problem? It ends up a bit slow, but not much slower than it was in the first place.