Hello, I am looking mainly for EV help, since I suck at those, and helping me come to a final decision over some things as well as any additional team help that you can offer.
Changes are in bold.
Here is a quick view of my team:
1) Anti-lead Champ
2) RestTalker Pert
3) Bulkydos
4) Sub/Toxic Tran
5) Choice Band Spiritomb
6) CM Wish Jirachi
I have based this team around 3 main pokemon, who are:
1) Heatran
2) Swampert
3) Gyarados
Together, these three cover all elements at least once. Not only that, but they each pass on their weakness to one another. Fighting, ground and water attacks aimed at Heatran are easily handled by Gyarados. Electric and rock attacks aimed at Gyarados go to Swampert. Grass attacks aimed at Swampert go to Heatran.
In addition, they all share similar counters, mainly other bulky waters. This allows all three of them to work away on each others counters and in addition with the Sub/Toxic set Heatran can work as a lure to these counters.
This point can be taken advantage of by tailoring Swamperts and Gyarados' move sets. With bulky waters hopefuly suffering from toxic, RestTalker Swampert has an easier time of boosting up since he can out stall the other side. This also allows him to act as a status absorber for the other two, mainly Gyarados who hates any and all stats.
To further aid this move set, Heatran can run Dragon Pulse in order to counter possible Latias and other dragons, who also wall this Swampert set, and who Heatran also lures.
Gyarados acts as a good lure to pokemon who Swampert can set up on usually (since he often brings in electric/rock users who are scarfed so they can catch up with him, or status users) as well as being a good counter to many OU threats (Lucario and Infernape are the first which come to mind). With bulky waters slowly losing health he also has an easier time setting up for a sweep as well.
With this in mind, the first three pokemon of my team are in place.
Gyarados @ Leftovers
Nature: Adament
EV: 156 HP / 72 Atk / 96 Def / 184 Spe
Move set
Dragon Dance
Taunt
Waterfall
Stone Edge/EQ
She is here as my late game sweeper and as a stop sign to other sweeping pokemon. I have considered making her the RestTalker version that runs DD, since it will give her a lot more bulk, but I am not sure how useful, if at all, that would be for my team. I am considering EQ as the main option for the fourth move, since I lack the coverage it gives.
Heatran @ Leftovers
Nature: Timid
EV: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Move set
Subsitute
Toxic
Fireblast
Dragon Pulse
I am a big fan of Subsitute, more so on pokemon who usually force a switch and even more on said pokemon who can also run sets to counter counters. Steal types are unlikely to switch into Heatran, so Toxic always gets its uses and it makes it harder for pokemon who can usually set up on toxic stallers (Skamory for example). FB + DP gets great coverage, only being resisted by Heatran himself.
Swampert@ Leftovers
Nature: Careful
EV: 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 SpD
Move set
Curse
Rest
Sleep Talk
Waterfall
Due to Swamperts bulk being abe to heal and clear himself of brun/posion are great boons. Boons which also benefit the rest of the team by providing a pokemon who can soak up damage etc without as much worry. I can bring him out early to do just this without giving anything away about his set, and when the time is right, usually when Gyarados is in, I can bring him out again to heal up. I have considered replacing Curse with something, and changing his moveset since I already have Gyarados as a late game poke, but I find being able to set up a defensive version is more useful.
As I have already mentioned, this is the core of my team. Whats more, since Swampert is running the RestTalk set, non of them can be hit by toxic spikes. Gyarados is the weak link when it comes to stall teams, since he is hit bu both toxic and SS but has Taunt to stop the former. However, he is the backbone when it comes to offensive teams, providing an attack drop and several useful resists. As such, I find these three pokemon work well with each other creating a strong foundation for a team.
However, only half the work is done, and there are still weakness, which are:
1) All pokemon dislike Trick a lot
2) There are no revenge killers leaving the team potentially open to being swept
3) One of the 'core pokemon' is weak to Stealth Rock, meaning if I use her to swap in and out, she isnt going to last long
4) Outside of Swampert, this team has limited healing while being on the bulky/slow side
5) Other RestTalking bulky waters give me trouble.
With this in mind, I decided I needed a few things, which were:
1) My own trick pokemon and/or a strong counter to trick pokemon (Trick being prefered since it is also a counter to RestTalkers)
2) Wish passer, to back up the teams bulkyness
3) A strong anti-lead, to help prevent SR from setting up, or a rapid spinner to remove them
4) A fast/priority using revenge killer
Looking at this list, the first pokemon which came to mind was Jirachi. He could do all of these things easily. However, he couldnt do them all at once. Because of this, I looked to what my team needed most, and IMO this was a wish passer. An anti-lead would be useful, but not as much if I can wish-heal whoever I needed to, and there were plenty of option for the revenge/tricker slot.
Therefore I looked at what pokemon could be used as a wish passer. Other than Jirachi, Vaporeon came to mind right away. However, Vaporeons uses were limited, because I already had both Swampert and Gyarados on the team. This made Jirachi very appealing as a wish user.
While I was comparing these two, I was also looking up potential trick users/revenge killers. I had already decided that the two should be combined, since was an easy thing to do. I do however have a few personal issues with trick users, mainly:
1) Being weak to Pursuit is a big No-No
2) U-turn is a major plus
3) If its not scarfed it needs a priority move
The first point on this list made my choice hard, and strongly pointed me in the direction of Jirachi, which was backed up by the two other points as well. So it seemed that not only was Jirachi best suited for my team at wishing, but also as a scarfer.
This gave me some problems, until I stumbled upon the choice band Spiritomb. This guy checked a lot of boxes for me. He had priority, was not weak to Pusuit, had Trick, and what made me like him even more likeable, had Pursuit. What this meant was that when moved into a trick user he is always going to be able to smack them hard thanks to STAB Pursuit thats going to hit a feeling enemy (since they are stuck in pursuit, they have little choice).
Whats more, he has a 120 base power priority attack which can come from a choice banded, adamant natured pokemon with 92 Atk is very nice, and he also gets a STAB 40 BP priority move in the form of Shadow Sneak. So while he does not have the scouting potential from U-turn, he is a great anti-trick poke with strong priority and the ability to mess up walls (most noteably RestTalk Suicune).
And so he became my forth member.
Spiritomb @ Choice Band
Nature: Adamant
EV: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Move set
Sucker Punch
Shadow Sneak
Pursuit
Trick
All my main reasons for choosing Spiritomb have already been stated. It should be noted that this set is weak to entery hazards, which gives me more reasons for packing an anti-lead.
Now that my revenge/trick user/absorber has been taken care of, Jirachi is free to fill the role of Wish passer. While I know I want to use Jirachi for this slot, I am unsure if I should go for the Wishing CM version, or a more focused Wish-passer who could also run Stealth Rocks for my own team, since I am lacking them. Either way, he is going onto my team.
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Nature : Bold
EV: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spe
Move set
Wish
Calm Mind
Thunderbolt
Flash Cannon
I have decided to go with the CM version, but I am really unsure. With the CM wishing version I have Swampert to abosrb the effects thrown at him (as well as being a good partner in that they boost in the opporsite attack side and are thus bulky where the other is not. Plus covering each others weakness' well). In addition, this moveset draws in pokemon who swampert can set up on (aka electric types) and pairs well with Gyarados (though that is rather a general statement).
My last slot had me thinking. Did I need a SR member on this team or an anti-lead? Since most of my pokemon are bulky, choosing to set up rather than go right for the attack, I decided getting SR wasnt needed as much as helping Gyarados was. Thus I went looking for an anti-lead.
I wanted one who was able to make SR leads think twice about setting up, and who could also come in later if needs must and still have a role. So, I decided to go for:
Machamp @ Lum Berry
Nature: Adamant
EV: 240 HP / 240 Atk / 12 Spe / 16 SpD
Move set
Bullet Punch
Dynamic Punch
Ice Punch
Payback
With the ability to threaten most leads, and take down sashed leads, Machamp was my first choice. I considered Dragonite, but his weakness to SR made me think twice since it made him harder to come in later in the game.
And with that my team was made! The original core of the team support my the remainder. However, I know it can still get better (I'm sure there are better EV's or move combo's out there) and thats why I ask you all to help me with this. Thank you in advance.
Changes are in bold.
Here is a quick view of my team:
1) Anti-lead Champ
2) RestTalker Pert
3) Bulkydos
4) Sub/Toxic Tran
5) Choice Band Spiritomb
6) CM Wish Jirachi
I have based this team around 3 main pokemon, who are:
1) Heatran
2) Swampert
3) Gyarados
Together, these three cover all elements at least once. Not only that, but they each pass on their weakness to one another. Fighting, ground and water attacks aimed at Heatran are easily handled by Gyarados. Electric and rock attacks aimed at Gyarados go to Swampert. Grass attacks aimed at Swampert go to Heatran.
In addition, they all share similar counters, mainly other bulky waters. This allows all three of them to work away on each others counters and in addition with the Sub/Toxic set Heatran can work as a lure to these counters.
This point can be taken advantage of by tailoring Swamperts and Gyarados' move sets. With bulky waters hopefuly suffering from toxic, RestTalker Swampert has an easier time of boosting up since he can out stall the other side. This also allows him to act as a status absorber for the other two, mainly Gyarados who hates any and all stats.
To further aid this move set, Heatran can run Dragon Pulse in order to counter possible Latias and other dragons, who also wall this Swampert set, and who Heatran also lures.
Gyarados acts as a good lure to pokemon who Swampert can set up on usually (since he often brings in electric/rock users who are scarfed so they can catch up with him, or status users) as well as being a good counter to many OU threats (Lucario and Infernape are the first which come to mind). With bulky waters slowly losing health he also has an easier time setting up for a sweep as well.
With this in mind, the first three pokemon of my team are in place.
Gyarados @ Leftovers
Nature: Adament
EV: 156 HP / 72 Atk / 96 Def / 184 Spe
Move set
Dragon Dance
Taunt
Waterfall
Stone Edge/EQ
She is here as my late game sweeper and as a stop sign to other sweeping pokemon. I have considered making her the RestTalker version that runs DD, since it will give her a lot more bulk, but I am not sure how useful, if at all, that would be for my team. I am considering EQ as the main option for the fourth move, since I lack the coverage it gives.
Heatran @ Leftovers
Nature: Timid
EV: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Move set
Subsitute
Toxic
Fireblast
Dragon Pulse
I am a big fan of Subsitute, more so on pokemon who usually force a switch and even more on said pokemon who can also run sets to counter counters. Steal types are unlikely to switch into Heatran, so Toxic always gets its uses and it makes it harder for pokemon who can usually set up on toxic stallers (Skamory for example). FB + DP gets great coverage, only being resisted by Heatran himself.
Swampert@ Leftovers
Nature: Careful
EV: 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 SpD
Move set
Curse
Rest
Sleep Talk
Waterfall
Due to Swamperts bulk being abe to heal and clear himself of brun/posion are great boons. Boons which also benefit the rest of the team by providing a pokemon who can soak up damage etc without as much worry. I can bring him out early to do just this without giving anything away about his set, and when the time is right, usually when Gyarados is in, I can bring him out again to heal up. I have considered replacing Curse with something, and changing his moveset since I already have Gyarados as a late game poke, but I find being able to set up a defensive version is more useful.
As I have already mentioned, this is the core of my team. Whats more, since Swampert is running the RestTalk set, non of them can be hit by toxic spikes. Gyarados is the weak link when it comes to stall teams, since he is hit bu both toxic and SS but has Taunt to stop the former. However, he is the backbone when it comes to offensive teams, providing an attack drop and several useful resists. As such, I find these three pokemon work well with each other creating a strong foundation for a team.
However, only half the work is done, and there are still weakness, which are:
1) All pokemon dislike Trick a lot
2) There are no revenge killers leaving the team potentially open to being swept
3) One of the 'core pokemon' is weak to Stealth Rock, meaning if I use her to swap in and out, she isnt going to last long
4) Outside of Swampert, this team has limited healing while being on the bulky/slow side
5) Other RestTalking bulky waters give me trouble.
With this in mind, I decided I needed a few things, which were:
1) My own trick pokemon and/or a strong counter to trick pokemon (Trick being prefered since it is also a counter to RestTalkers)
2) Wish passer, to back up the teams bulkyness
3) A strong anti-lead, to help prevent SR from setting up, or a rapid spinner to remove them
4) A fast/priority using revenge killer
Looking at this list, the first pokemon which came to mind was Jirachi. He could do all of these things easily. However, he couldnt do them all at once. Because of this, I looked to what my team needed most, and IMO this was a wish passer. An anti-lead would be useful, but not as much if I can wish-heal whoever I needed to, and there were plenty of option for the revenge/tricker slot.
Therefore I looked at what pokemon could be used as a wish passer. Other than Jirachi, Vaporeon came to mind right away. However, Vaporeons uses were limited, because I already had both Swampert and Gyarados on the team. This made Jirachi very appealing as a wish user.
While I was comparing these two, I was also looking up potential trick users/revenge killers. I had already decided that the two should be combined, since was an easy thing to do. I do however have a few personal issues with trick users, mainly:
1) Being weak to Pursuit is a big No-No
2) U-turn is a major plus
3) If its not scarfed it needs a priority move
The first point on this list made my choice hard, and strongly pointed me in the direction of Jirachi, which was backed up by the two other points as well. So it seemed that not only was Jirachi best suited for my team at wishing, but also as a scarfer.
This gave me some problems, until I stumbled upon the choice band Spiritomb. This guy checked a lot of boxes for me. He had priority, was not weak to Pusuit, had Trick, and what made me like him even more likeable, had Pursuit. What this meant was that when moved into a trick user he is always going to be able to smack them hard thanks to STAB Pursuit thats going to hit a feeling enemy (since they are stuck in pursuit, they have little choice).
Whats more, he has a 120 base power priority attack which can come from a choice banded, adamant natured pokemon with 92 Atk is very nice, and he also gets a STAB 40 BP priority move in the form of Shadow Sneak. So while he does not have the scouting potential from U-turn, he is a great anti-trick poke with strong priority and the ability to mess up walls (most noteably RestTalk Suicune).
And so he became my forth member.
Spiritomb @ Choice Band
Nature: Adamant
EV: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Move set
Sucker Punch
Shadow Sneak
Pursuit
Trick
All my main reasons for choosing Spiritomb have already been stated. It should be noted that this set is weak to entery hazards, which gives me more reasons for packing an anti-lead.
Now that my revenge/trick user/absorber has been taken care of, Jirachi is free to fill the role of Wish passer. While I know I want to use Jirachi for this slot, I am unsure if I should go for the Wishing CM version, or a more focused Wish-passer who could also run Stealth Rocks for my own team, since I am lacking them. Either way, he is going onto my team.
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Nature : Bold
EV: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spe
Move set
Wish
Calm Mind
Thunderbolt
Flash Cannon
I have decided to go with the CM version, but I am really unsure. With the CM wishing version I have Swampert to abosrb the effects thrown at him (as well as being a good partner in that they boost in the opporsite attack side and are thus bulky where the other is not. Plus covering each others weakness' well). In addition, this moveset draws in pokemon who swampert can set up on (aka electric types) and pairs well with Gyarados (though that is rather a general statement).
My last slot had me thinking. Did I need a SR member on this team or an anti-lead? Since most of my pokemon are bulky, choosing to set up rather than go right for the attack, I decided getting SR wasnt needed as much as helping Gyarados was. Thus I went looking for an anti-lead.
I wanted one who was able to make SR leads think twice about setting up, and who could also come in later if needs must and still have a role. So, I decided to go for:
Machamp @ Lum Berry
Nature: Adamant
EV: 240 HP / 240 Atk / 12 Spe / 16 SpD
Move set
Bullet Punch
Dynamic Punch
Ice Punch
Payback
With the ability to threaten most leads, and take down sashed leads, Machamp was my first choice. I considered Dragonite, but his weakness to SR made me think twice since it made him harder to come in later in the game.
And with that my team was made! The original core of the team support my the remainder. However, I know it can still get better (I'm sure there are better EV's or move combo's out there) and thats why I ask you all to help me with this. Thank you in advance.
