ORAS OU Fear the fluff

[MaChew94]

What's up smogon. I've made a few teams in the past, as I love the thrill of creating strategies and counters, and get bored of teams real quick. With the help of a few of you guys, I've made good progress and a really solid OU sand team, but the more I play, the more I want to try out cool strats and mons. Namely, for this team, I really wanted to try a mega altaria, as it seems like a really cool design, and the dual-typing of dragon/fairy was too good to pass on. With this team, I hope to curb my team-building for a while and focus on playing and getting experience, using my sand team and hopefully this one to get some real good ground on the whole competitive scene, as I'm fairly new to it all. So, let's go (Zohan, Don't mess with the Zohan)

Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Spe / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Return
- Roost refresh (Thanks to Team Pokepals and oml it's too ez)
- Earthquake

Alright, so here he is. Not so sure on the sets or moveset, but I don't like the idea of sacrificing coverage for roost, though if it's the better option, a safe D-dance into roost could work. Usually, however, a counter is switched in after one D-dance so I have to switch or sweep. It's got decent bulk, and I like the idea of mega-ing against say a Lati@s and surviving because of the mega immunity. Refresh is there to hopefully take a burn on the chin, D-dance through the burn, refresh it off and sweep. It's netted some key OHKOs with Return, such as on Bisharp, strangely. I really want this guy to shine, it's what I've built the set around, so i need this guy to work. As I said, all the other mons on this team serve to counter Alt's counters while also attempting to tick off the check and counter list.

Heatran @ Leftovers/Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 188 SpDef / 68 Spe
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Rock Slide (For T-flame/Char)
- Stealth Rock

Alt needed a partner to take the first of his counter; steel. So, I thought, why not use a defensive Heatran, possibly with an air balloon to take an EQ or two, and counter steel, while also countering big threats like Lati@s, T-tar and T-flame/Char, providing a safe switch-in and serving to annoy the enemy team through the combo of toxic and stealth rock, using taunt and having 68 speed to outspeed things like Mandibuzz and uninvested Venu from setting up, and beating them to a taunt. Uninvested special attack is still high, coming in at 297, so a lava plume can really do some chunking. After battling a bit with this team (and getting bad results, sadly) I can't even survive a defensive Gliscor EQ, so air balloon might be a necessity.

The other idea here was to use a Magnezone instead, and sub out Raikou for something else, but I'm not sure what yet, and I wanted a good SR user.

Landorus-T @ Choice Scarf (As Recommended by Team Pokepals)
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 232 Spe / 20 Def
Nature: Adamant
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Rock slide

As recommended, I swapped out Conk for a Lando, because I had no resist to ground, except un-mega'd Altaria, and an E-drill could cause me havoc. With this build I get an offensive pivot, capable of scouting attacks, and serving as a lead, as even with adamant nature I'm still reaching 414 spe, outspeeding anything not choice scarfed. I went with adamant to get the OHKO on Latios with Knock off, and to give Rock slide the more damage over Stone Edge, as I hate the accuracy creep. 427 attack in total with Adamant/252 Atk, so the coverage moves are hitting like a truck, and even resisted U-turns here and there are chipping away at the team. It can also take out (despite the obvious T-tar, E-drill and T-flame) things like Scizor, dealing around 80% wit an earthquake, and shrugging off whatever it can throw at me.

Scizor @ Leftovers
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Roost Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Defog
- Knock Off/Bug Bite U-Turn

So, I needed a defogger, and the priority bullet punch was lovely to break the last counter of Altaria; fairy. It can get the jump on literally any fairy that can threaten Altaria, Azumarril excluded, though I have counters and ways for that, and it's hardly seen these days. Roost is there over swords dance to give it some longevity and allowing it to stay in or switch in to status hazards. Full HP/AtK investment because I don't need speed at all and Scizor's defences are pretty piss poor. Defog/Bug Bite for damage and utility, respectively. Although being hopelessly weak to fire, it's still a really viable mon, especially for this team, as a bullet punch/Bug Bite can really wreak havoc, and has enough bulk to (if it has to) suicide for the defog, though none of my team are hugely weak to it, fortunately.

Raikou @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 30 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Extrasensory

I realised I was fairly weak to Keldeo, and any water in general, resisting my Scizor's steel, switching into Heatran and possibly carrying ice attacks for Altaria. Enter: Raikou. Spec'd, he can OHKO Keldeo even with a Volt Switch, and survives a spec hydro pump/scald with impunity, shrugging it off (70~ % of a spec H-pump really isn't anything to sniff at). IVs are there so I can run HP ice, a staple for taking care of Gliscor/Landorus, especially the first, as it either protects, or uses EQ or Toxic and dies. Extrasensory for a tiny bit of psychic damage to get the hit on things like Venu or Conkeldurr, though I can swap this out. Alongside Heatran, this checks T-flame/Char and literally any water type you can throw at me, looking to set up on the team's water weak tendencies.

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance

Because of the fire damage incurred from Scizor, and the ability for a fire type to switch into half of my team, I needed a water type to alleviate the pressure on Scizor and to be able to resist Keldeo again (although, sacred sword still hurts). I then wondered at the possibility of adding a dark move (toyed with knock off Conkeldurr but went with poison jab instead) and stumbled upon Crawdaunt instead. Although it has piss poor defences and speed, the combo of adaptability, swords dance and aqua jet make this truly terrifying, and on the switch, can OHKO Lati@s with knock off. In fact, on the switch, it can probably OHKO anything not resisting it, and fulfills the coverage aspect the team needed. I'm open to swapping this out, however, slapping Knock off back on Conk, and using something like a Slowbro with Regenerator, but I'd love to keep a water sweeper if possible. This is the mon I'm most open to swapping out. No water legendaries like Keldeo/Manaphy pl0x, i'm making this on ORAS and don't have access to those mons. Still, op crab.

So there you have it. I'm not certain on this team, hence posting it before really testing it, and I think it needs some work doing but I can't see what needs doing so I'm turning to you guys to give me a hand. I want to keep my core intact; Raikou, Altaria and scizor. and I'd love to keep my Terrakion if possible, though if there are better suggestions I'd love to hear them. I haven't used these mons before so that could be the reason the sets are a bit funky/the team comp is a bit random. Played a few more games and edited to team so it's a little more viable, and seems to work a bit better.

TL, DR; Not performing great yet, would like to keep Raikou, Altaria, Scizor.

TL, Really DR; Help.

 

[Ryfi110]

I feel like Conk + Crawdaunt may be unneeded.

You are p weak to physical walls, as you only have one threatening sp. attacker (sorry Heatran)

I think SubCM or Scarf Keldeo almost does the job of both, while providing another special attacker.

On scizor, having Defog + SD + U-Turn is somewhat overkill. Without Roost, you will be worn down quickly, and getting off a slow U-Turn is not helping your case. Replacing U-Turn with Knock Off or Bug Bite may be a better idea, but this set I generally consider sub par.


Since this would give you another team slot, you have a few options: Serperior. This would patch up the Rotom-W weakness the first change would make.
If this is not what youre looking for, Latias may be a good choice, giving you another dragon to spam, plus giving you a more stable Defogger with recovery. This would allow you to change Defog to Roost on Scizor. Also patches Rotom-W weakness.


If none of these changes feel right, I still do not like Conkeldurr in the current meta. I find it too easy to wear down, and many physical walls... welp.... wall it.

252+ Atk Conkeldurr Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 110-130 (32.9 - 38.9%) -- 8.8% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
That's a SE hit, yet it is a counter (Assuming it has Whirlwind OR Brave Bird).

 

[TPP]

Right now you have no ground resist, meaning Lando-T (and Lando-I for the next week), and Excadrill are gonna give your team a hard time. I also agree that Conkeldurr and Crawdaunt can easily be replaced by Keldeo. So with the extra spot left, I recommend Keldeo + Lando-T > Conkeldurr + Crawdaunt. Keldeo can defeat opposing Heatran and Bisharp really easily, and it also checks Scizor for Mega Altaria. Lando-T covers your ground weakness and can check opposing Lando-T and Excadrill. Lando-T also gets Knock Off, which Crawdaunt originally had, and you'll get even more momentum with U-turn.

Roost > Refresh is an easy one because Altaria can easily get worn down by Hazards, Weather, damage from Status Conditions (it takes a turn before you can use Refresh), and recoil damage from opponents like Tank Garchomp. Mega Altaria is able to check a ton of things such as Serperior and Keldeo, so you'll need Roost to keep Altaria healthy.

Magma Storm > Lava Plume because you have the other moves necessary for trapping. You'll be able to shut down and KO Clefable, as well as the annoying Mega Venusaur (without Earthquake). I'm not sure why you're running a defensive Heatran over a special defensive Heatran, but you should give a better reason since it still gets 2HKO by Earthquake, and Talonflame can checked by special defensive Heatran too.

Since you're running the Defog set, I recommend Roost > Swords Dance. Scizor will take 12% every time it wants to remove Stealth Rocks, and Spikes can take up to 25% each time too, so Scizor needs to be healthy to maintain its role as a hazard remover. If you had kept Swords Dance, Tank Garchomp or Ferrothorn could have come in and given you an extra 29%, so that's 41% potentially lost HP and you would have no way of getting it back.

Keldeo and Lando-T

Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword

Or

Keldeo @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Justified
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Hydro Pump
- Icy Wind

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 24 Def / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Stone Edge

That's it for now. After these changes, Keldeo and Charizard-Y look to be your biggest threats. One way to handle both of them is to run a Bulky Mega Altaria, and if you're really concerned about Burn damage, you could run the 1 attack Mega Altaria set. I'll leave it below. Hope I helped ^_^

Altaria

Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Cloud Nine
EVs: 248 HP / 136 Def / 96 SpD / 28 Spe (I stole this from Smogon Dex so I think it works)
Impish Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
- Return
- Heal Bell

 

[MaChew94]

Thanks for the replies, guys! I noticed I was probably missing a few obvious things, but couldn't see what. Also, Crawdaunt was an afterthought, and Serperior was actually considered because of this team's mad speed creep. Originally, I had a levitate Gengar because of this team's weakness to ground, but that wasn't working out.

As for the keldeo you both submitted, I agree, it would solve a lot of problems, but as I said in the post, I can't have event mons as I'm looking to make this team on my 3DS (I know, apologies). Legendaries are fine, and the Lando-T looks appealing, but what are the calcs for it's knock off and U-turn and stuff? Running Lando > Crawdaunt and perhaps Serperior > Conkeldurr, though then I lose a pretty bulky mon on my side, and go with 4 sweepers, Heatran, and HP trained Scizor, which doesn't strike me as a good trade off - I have no bulk.

Still, I realise Conk isn't everyone's favourite, and Crawdaunt is a bit of a joke, so I'm happy to sub them out - with no Keldeo, however, I have no fighting stab to take out the steel mons that can threaten Altaria, and with my only fire damage as 75% accuracy if I swap Magma storm, I'm not hitting those steel types at all!

So, possibly to Lando-T as a pivot (and everyone's gonna expect the HP/Def SR build), but I need something that can threaten those steel types out, preferably fire so I can hit Scizor, and perhaps something rather bulky, at least HP trained. While this is a narrow field, I think it's the necessary last slot for my team.

Also, what do you think of the Heatran set? does it work for the team, countering steel, fire and flying. Do the EVs work? Or should I go something like HP/SpAtk to get some damage? Im going for a balanced team with this, so 3 or 4 sweepers and 2 or 3 bulks are optimal. I already have bulk in Scizor. Do I keep Heatran as it is and maybe sub in a defensive Amoongus for the last slot? Though that brings my weakness to ice and fire even more up!

EDIT: Changed the sets, looks a bit more interesting now. Now I have Lando, I don't need such investments into fire, as that's not what's going to wall me (I will just use a boosted Altaria for Sableye/Ferrothorn, as Raikou and Lando deal with Skarmory and Scizor). Instead, water types can rampage this team, especially Azumarril or an enemy Keldeo (though I have Raikou, what if it goes down? +4 aqua jet says hi). So for my 6th, I'm torn between some fire STAB for that x8 ice weakness or a bulky grass to resist the water types. Keldeo is hella popular in OU, sadly, so what do you guys think? Thanks for your suggestions so far!

 

[MaChew94]

Bump, need a good mon to replace Conk (replaced Crawdaunt with Landorus). Ideally bulky, something that really rounds the team off, while having access to fighting or flying, to replace the fighting stab on conk, or allowing me to hit Venusaur/Medicham. Any help would be appreciated, team is working OK at the moment but really need this solid 6th!

 

[kumiko]

yo,

luv altaria, it's such a good 'mon. i think your team has pretty decent frameworks, but there are a few issues.

First of all, you have zero Keldeo switchins. It comes in on half your team and a choice locked Landorus-Therian and just grabs a kill. This is definitely a huge issue, so a quick fix would be to change Crawdaunt to Latios. This gives you a solid answer to Keldeo, as well as a better defogger than Scizor, which I feel is very lackluster. Scizor does beat things Latios doesn't, this is very true, but Scizor is a very slow Pokemon, meaning it's somewhat harder to get off a Defog in certain scenarios, and Scizor gives away momentum very easily without threatening the opponent with Swords Dance or U-turn. I'd also recommend running Psychic > Psyshock on Latios, as this prevents Clefable from coming in freely and lets you 2HKO it on the switch, whereas Psyshock fails to.

After that, you don't really need Defog on Scizor, so making it a Swords Dance variant would help your team out a lot. SD Scizor provides you with more offensive presence, a secondary win condition alongside Altaria, and gives you a check to fairy types like Clefable, which don't mind anything Heatran does to you. Although Scizor still loses to Flamethower variants, it's a solid check, as the majority lack a Fire move.

Another change I'd suggest is removing you to drop Heatran in favor of Rocky Helmet Garchomp. Right now you're team has no ways to handle Bisharp outside of going to Altaria and outspeeding it, and risking your win condition, especially one of Altaria's caliber, is insanely risky and not something you should be forced to do from Team Preview. Garchomp also helps your team with Mega Metagross a lot, as your team is forced to use Scarf Lando-T as your answer, which can't safely switch in until Metagross Mega Evolves, and even then, it takes too much to be your only answer. Scizor can also switch into it, but it's not as bulky as Mega Scizor to give you the ability to set up in front of it to damage it, nor is Scizor strong enough to do it. Mega Lopunny was also a massive threat, as your only checks were Altaria and Landorus-Therian, both of which aren't vey reliable. The former isn't reliable because Return + Ice Punch KO, as well as the fact you're forced to run a near max speed spread to outpace after a DD, or you take 40-50% from Return to kill it, and then lose your primary win condition. The latter isn't reliable as it gets worn down very easily and just gets blown back by Ice Punch. Fat Chomp also checks things like Mega Scizor and Ferrothorn, which you previously used Heatran for. Garchomp can also check Talonflame, although it doesn't appreciate a Will-o-Wisp. Wisp variants, however, are handled nicely by Raikou.

Lastly, three minor changes;
1. Your Mega Altaria spread is inefficient, Adamant 252 / 252 doesn't give you a notable speed tier nor does it allow you to have as bulky as an Altaria as you could have. I'd suggest using an EV Spread of 248 HP / 84 Atk / 76 Def / 4 SpD / 96 Spe with a Jolly Nature. This gives you enough bulk to take two Psyshocks from Latios, two Returns from Lopunny, and two Fire Blats from Charizard Y while outpacing base 115s, such as Raikou and Starmie. The rest is dumped into attack.
2. Scarf Landorus-Therian 100% needs Jolly in this metagame, otherwise you get outsped by Mega Lopunny. Use Jolly.
3. As it stands, the team struggles with Clefable quite a bit, although it gets somewhat limited opportunities. Using Explosion on Landours-T gives you a last ditch effort vs Clefable, nailing it for big damage. If you use this, you have to use it when Clefable is at 80% or lower, or it can survive and then Soft-Boiled off the damage. This also helps a bit with Mega Gyarados, which is really annoying.

Changes:

->

Defog -> Swords Dance

->

EV Spread

Adamant Knock Off -> Jolly Explosion

Sets

Garchomp (M) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 76 SpD / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 HP / 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Psychic
- Recover
- Defog

Scizor (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 64 Atk / 196 SpD
Careful Nature
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off
- Roost

Altaria-Mega @ Altarianite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 84 Atk / 76 Def / 4 SpD / 96 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Return
- Roost
- Earthquake

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 24 Def / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Explosion
- U-turn

 

[MaChew94]

Hey man, thanks for the comment. I'm on my mobile so I can't quote, but I'll try my best to lay my thinking out neatly.

I agree with the EV changes to Alt, as it would be nice to have bulk before I set up, as I get damage and speed after setting up anyway, and it would have so much more longevity. I love mega Alt too, it's so fluffy!

I like the idea of using a chomp, but if I use Latias too (which, I'm agreeing with also, as I love SD scizor and Defog damage latios gives me a Keldeo check) I have a ridiculous weakness to ice, and with the few priority ice users in OU, I can't take the chance that they'd appear; altaria, landorus, Garchomp And latios all fall to a weaville ice shard. So, here's what I'm thinking: keep Heatran, as magna storm is nice, it's a reliable rocker and the typing is nice for Altaria. I'll drop crawdaunt For Latias, as the Keldeo check is quite necessary. With the EV changes to Altaria and scizor, along with the already bulky heat ran, I have enough leeway and flexibility to run the speed latios set. However, I'm really not hot on the huge ice weakness I already have, and I only used Lando-T as an EQ immunity, but latios does that too. So, if I drop Lando, I keep the speed from a set up Alt, a boosted priority Bullet Punch, and Latios to compete with the speed I was getting off Lando. I lose earthquake on the team, which is a shame, and the knock off was nice too, but I don't think Lando-T was gelling, and I certainly can't risk the ice weakness. So, that leaves me with a 6th. You mentioned I was weak to Bisharp and ferrothorn, as well as Mega Loppuni, and you're absolutely right. How about I use a speedy mon (which I still have the flexibility to use) that deals with all of that. I'm thinking of using Infernape. IIRC it has a pretty good Speer stay, nice attack, and access to Mach punch, helping me out with Lopunny, Bish and Ferro, while also denting anything that doesn't resist it, while giving me an ice RESISTANCE. Maybe it's not the answer, but I don't want to run so many Dragons; weaville will have a field day.

If that was untidy, allow me to clarify:

Scizor - swords dance, changed EV
Altaria - changed EV
Latios > Lando-T - ground immunity, Defog and keldeo check
6th mom to counter steel/normals - fast fighting mon. Perhaps Infernape.

As I said, thanks for the comment, but I think I've laid out my arguments for and against some of your reasoning, so I'd appreciate it if you could get back to me on what you think! :)

EDIT: Trialing Infernape, it's doing well! Went with HP/Att scizor still; I have Bulky Altaria and Heatran to take hits too, and I love the attack stat with a swords dance; I OHKO'd a Bisharp with Bug bite after it swords danced. 2 game and 2 forfeits!