First Competitive Team, Mostly Gen 1&2 Pokes

[amplifierworship]

So, let me start by saying that up until I got Pokemon Y for Christmas, the last Pokemon game I played was Gold version back when I was 11 years old, and now, after a 10 year hiatus, I'm back into Pokemon hard! This is significant for 2 reasons;

1. I knew I wanted to make a team comprised largely of first- and second-gen Pokemon. I love the old-school Pokes, and plenty of them are powerful enough to make for a competitive OU tier team, so why the hell not?

2. I have absolutely no experience with the metagame that has built up over the generations and as such, I expect my team to reflect that. I've playtested this team on Pokemon Showdown for a week or so, making adjustments here and there, but I've been hovering around the 1200 ELO mark and haven't really been able to make any headway for the past few days (to be fair, I don't play for very long sessions).

Without further ado, here's the team:

Blissey @ Chople Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
Impish Nature
- Soft-Boiled
- Toxic
- Seismic Toss
- Stealth Rock

My special wall. The Chople Berry is there because strong Fighting moves wreck this Poke and halving the damage done (if only once) can be significant in keeping me alive and Soft-Boiled renders Leftovers redundent for the most part. I usually open with Blissey (or Ferrothorn) just to be safe and set up hazards, unless I see an obvious weakness in my opponents team that I can exploit by opening offensively.​

Charizard-Mega-Y (M) @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Drought
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Air Slash
- Fire Blast
- Dragon Pulse
- Solar Beam

One of my main special attackers. Huge offensive presence, great speed, great coverage, this guy is my champion. Drought is amazing because pretty much anything that doesn't resist Fire or have a stacked SpDef stat gets OHKO'd. Solar Beam is also great because no one ever sees it coming and I nail Water or Rock types who try to switch in on me. I chose Dragon Dance because it helps against Dragon types who resist my other moves, and Air Slash because it's STAB, but these moves are largely situational and I'm not convinced that there aren't better alternatives. Any suggestions here?​

Scizor (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Superpower

My main revenge killer and physical attacker. I chose Life Orb over Scarf because I found myself being forced to switch out and lose momentum when I was confined to one move. U-Turn is good, but I feel like maybe I need Volt Switch on my team to make the most of things? Not much else to tell, pretty standard set apart from that. I chose Superpower over Brick Break for the extra power, not sure if that was a smart move or not. Any thoughts?
​

Gengar (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Sludge Bomb
- Dazzling Gleam
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt

My other main special attacker and my favourite Pokemon. I tried running Substitute in a previous set but it seemed kind of pointless. Maybe I wasn't implementing the strategy properly. In any case, this guy is something of a gambit. If I'm faster than the opposing Poke (which I usually am) I can nuke just about anything. However, this guy's pretty fragile and I find myself dying to almost anything in one hit. Maybe I should run Destiny Bond instead of Dazzling Gleam?​

Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Spikes
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball
- Rest

My physical wall (also the only Pokemon on my team not from Gen 1 or 2). I usually open with either him or Blissey, set up hazards, tank hits... pretty standard stuff. I think maybe he would benefit from a status move like T-Wave or something, but I'm not sure if it's worth giving up dual STAB moves or Rest? I'm not sure, I haven't playtested this guy as much as the others, and might swap him out.​

​

Starmie @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Psychic
- Rapid Spin

My rapid spinner. Usually serves as cleanup duty, whether that be handling Pokemon my other attackers can't deal with readily, getting rid of hazards or revenge killing weakened Pokes (although without a priority move I have to rely on pure speed which is risky, and also why I Scarf'd it). I really like Ice Beam for the Grass/Dragon coverage.​

Having met all the members of my team, let me give you a disclaimer: I've kept the core Megazard Y/Gengar/Scizor/Blissey since this team's inception, but I've kind of struggled to find Pokemon which properly compliment that core. I tried running Breloom and Cloyster in previous versions of this team instead of Ferrothorn and Starmie, but Cloyster's weak defensive typing was constantly a liability in a metagame filled with powerful Fighting types. Bulky Pokemon which have access to fighting type moves have been my bane, specifically Conkeldurr and Mawile. Mega Alakazam is also faster than both of my sweepers and has access to Shadow Ball which really sucks against my glass-cannon Gengar.

So far, I think my team is okay, but it's something of a 'jack of all trades, master of none' type deal. I can be hyper offensive when I need to and also stall/set up hazards when I need to, but I get dummied by more finely-tuned teams who specialize in one or the other. A lot of the time, I feel like the hazards I set up aren't worth the offensive momentum I lose (probably because I don't have any boosting moves), or that my offense, while powerful, loses out to nuke teams which set up more effectively than I can. I'm also aware that my team lacks a huge physical offense. Scizor is great, but he can only do so much. Also, none of my Pokemon make use of Taunt or Roar or any other pace-dictating status moves, nor do I have any screens on my team. Maybe I'm trying to do too many things at once?

Basically my team is decent and covers a lot of bases, but it's not as strong or fast or durable as I would like it to be. I was thinking some kind of Baton Pass thing to boost up my Zard/Gengar might be useful, but I have no idea how I would properly implement something like that. Any help or suggestions with this team are greatly appreciated. Also, if you have any tips about competitive play for someone who is new to the Pokemon metagame, that would also be great!

 

[Rafael J. Feliciano]

First off Welcome back to Pokémon amplifier!

Next off, pretty nice team you got there.

Just a few minor alterations:

Blissey: I would take out Stealth Rock < Aromatherapy/Heal Bell and make Blissey my cleric so dumb stuff like Will-o-Wisp won't cripple Scizor and or paralysis or Toxic will ruin your sweep with Charizard-Y. Also, change Chople Berry < Leftovers as Lefties is just better overall.

Ferrothorn: Replace Spikes < Stealth Rock & Rest < Thunder Wave. With SR off of Blissey, Ferrothorn becomes your Hazard layer supreme and T-Wave screws up Pokémon who try to set up on you with SD or DD.

Gengar: Since you have Ferrothorn, Scizor, Starmie and Charizard Y all haveing either type advantage or coverage moves for dragon types, I think its safe to drop Dazzling Gleam < Destiny Bond. Unfortunately, yes Gengar is a Glass Cannon and D-Bond can at least take someone down with you.

Scizor: Replace Life Orb < Choice Band. Scizor is your revenge killer and CB gives you a 1.5 boost rather than a 1.3 boost. Significantly more power. Also, change nature to from Jolly < Adamant. And yes, Superpower is ungodly against opposing Steel-Types with the exception of Aegislash. Aegi is just to good. If you use Choice Scarf then Jolly is fine as your outspeeding Alakazam, Lati@s and opposing Starmie. However, since you have Gengar, I doubt these guys are giving you any problems.

Starmie: Replace Scald < Surf as you are potentially missing out on some OHKOs (too lazy to list the calcs) but I know from experience that the added power is a blessing. I personally like Life Orb > Choice Scarf on Starmie to so that we can Spin & Attack without having to switch.

Hope this has been informative. Hopefully some of these changes will help you in climbing the ladder. Good Luck to you.

 

[amplifierworship]

Thanks for the feedback, man! :)

I've implemented the changes to Gengar, Ferrothorn and Blissey, although are you sure Leftovers is better than the Chople Berry? Isn't it redundent with Soft-Boiled?

As for Scizor and Starmie, I have my doubts. First of all, I was running a Choice Scarf on my Scizor but I hated being restricted to one move because it forced me to switch out a lot. Do I want the extra power or do I need the speed? Second, I switched Scald for Surf, but I put an Assault Vest on my Starmie instead of a Life Orb, changed my ability from Natural Cure to Analytic and dropped all of my Speed EVs and invested them into HP instead. The idea is that since Blissey is running Aromatherapy, Natural Cure becomes Redundent and if I switch my EVs from Speed to HP, I gain some durability and the extra damage from Analytic should make up for the lack of Speed.

Also, I'm contemplating swapping either Dragon Pulse or Air Slash with Earthquake on my Zard, but I'm not sure.

What do you think?

 

[Rafael J. Feliciano]

Thanks for the feedback, man! :)

I've implemented the changes to Gengar, Ferrothorn and Blissey, although are you sure Leftovers is better than the Chople Berry? Isn't it redundent with Soft-Boiled?

As for Scizor and Starmie, I have my doubts. First of all, I was running a Choice Scarf on my Scizor but I hated being restricted to one move because it forced me to switch out a lot. Do I want the extra power or do I need the speed? Second, I switched Scald for Surf, but I put an Assault Vest on my Starmie instead of a Life Orb, changed my ability from Natural Cure to Analytic and dropped all of my Speed EVs and invested them into HP instead. The idea is that since Blissey is running Aromatherapy, Natural Cure becomes Redundent and if I switch my EVs from Speed to HP, I gain some durability and the extra damage from Analytic should make up for the lack of Speed.

Also, I'm contemplating swapping either Dragon Pulse or Air Slash with Earthquake on my Zard, but I'm not sure.

What do you think?

The Starmie set is very interesting and I like it.. maybe I'll give it a look sometime.

As for Zard, EQ is a no-no. Charizard-Y is what it is... a SpA WallBreaking Beast. If your contemplated Earthquake, then your telling me that Rock, Steel, Poison, Electric & Fire give you pause. But out of all that your telling me that Calm Heatran ruins your day. Swap out Dragon Pulse < Focus Miss Blast to nail Heatran in the face. I would keep Air Slash for opposing Conkeldurr, even though AV helps that guy ALOT.

Scizor was one of the most used Pokémon in Gen V for a reason. Even with the nerf of steel to Ghost and Dark Attacks, Scizor still puts in work. Its just a matter of what type of work. With the vanquishing of Genesect to Ubers, the original OU Bug/Steel Type can now assume the role of Revenge Killer. Thus, CB Scizor is the best bet for your team. CB Superpower destroys guys like Ttar, Ferrothorn, and even does somewhere close to 79% to Keldeo, so yea... absolute strength is necessary, especially with 3 Special Attackers in Starmie, Charizard-Y and Gengar.

As much as you hate being locked into moves, your running one of the most brolic pokés in the game in Blissey and have Ferrothorn. Which by the way, switching in and using Soft-Boiled afterwards with Lefties recovery is why you keep Soft-Boiled. 1/16 of max HP might not seem like alot but when your Max HP ranges from 650-740 then those extra 40-70 HP per turn really adds up. Especially if you can cripple a sweeper with Toxic.

Tell me what you think.

 

[bluegrass]

As much as you hate being locked into moves, your running one of the most brolic pokés in the game in Blissey and have Ferrothorn. Which by the way, switching in and using Soft-Boiled afterwards with Lefties recovery is why you keep Soft-Boiled. 1/16 of max HP might not seem like alot but when your Max HP ranges from 650-740 then those extra 40-70 HP per turn really adds up. Especially if you can cripple a sweeper with Toxic.

I would definitely run Choice Band on Scizor, with both Blissey and Ferro you don't have to worry about switching. Leftovers is a must on Blissey, as it's the only reason to run it over Eviolite Chansey in the first place.

As for Charizard Y, Focus Blast is superior to EQ and Dragon Pulse (Even though it misses half the time) and I would replace Air Slash with Roost. Air Slash is extremely pointless, as Fire Blast hits everything harder.

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Conkeldurr in Sun: 297-351 (71.7 - 84.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Air Slash vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Conkeldurr: 270-320 (65.2 - 77.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

It also hits MegaVenu harder too. Roost provides him with better surviveability and can let you switch into Stealth Rocks more than once if Starmie goes down.

Your team has a huge Charizard X weakness, after one Dragon Dance nothing on you team can stop him. I'm too tired to try to fix it now, so hopefully someone else will, or tomorrow I'll try.

 

[amplifierworship]

Point taken.

As for Charizard X, well, I was thinking about it, and I think he might actually function on my team better than Zard Y. I bulk up Atk instead of SpAtk and that takes some of the responsibility off of Scizor's shoulder's as the only physical attacker. Also, a DD/Outrage set might give me that little extra boost of power that I was looking for.

However, I'm worried the Dragon typing and moveset might throw off my team's balance somewhat, which is why I'm also considering Talonflame. Another powerful priority physical attack would (again) compliment Scizor enormously and help lighten the load on his shoulders as sole pivot/physical attacker, and having the same typing as Zard Y doesn't upset the balance of my team.

The only downside is the lack of Drought/Solar Beam, which was not only exceptional at killing Rock/Water types who switched in on my Zard, but also gave me a super powerful Grass move which gives me great coverage. If I remove Zard Y, my only Grass type attack is Power Whip on Ferrothorn, which I don't know is enough against the plethora of powerful Water types out there.

Again, thanks for the help here guys, I really appreciate your imput. :)

 

[Rafael J. Feliciano]

Point taken.

As for Charizard X, well, I was thinking about it, and I think he might actually function on my team better than Zard Y. I bulk up Atk instead of SpAtk and that takes some of the responsibility off of Scizor's shoulder's as the only physical attacker. Also, a DD/Outrage set might give me that little extra boost of power that I was looking for.

However, I'm worried the Dragon typing and moveset might throw off my team's balance somewhat, which is why I'm also considering Talonflame. Another powerful priority physical attack would (again) compliment Scizor enormously and help lighten the load on his shoulders as sole pivot/physical attacker, and having the same typing as Zard Y doesn't upset the balance of my team.

The only downside is the lack of Drought/Solar Beam, which was not only exceptional at killing Rock/Water types who switched in on my Zard, but also gave me a super powerful Grass move which gives me great coverage. If I remove Zard Y, my only Grass type attack is Power Whip on Ferrothorn, which I don't know is enough against the plethora of powerful Water types out there.

Again, thanks for the help here guys, I really appreciate your imput. :)

If your willing to switch from Y < X on Charizard that would actually balance your team even further. Even with the removal of Solarbeam from your team, you can also go from Thunderbolt < Giga Drain on Gengar, which gives some replenishment of health from the Life Orb recoil.

As per typing, your trading in a 50% HP hit when switching into SR for a 25% loss (after Mega) and a guy in X-Zard who after one DD will sweep 9 times out of 10. Factor in Roost for longevity and now we got a scary looking team. :-)

 

[bluegrass]

I mentioned that you have a Charizard X weakness, not that you needed him on your team, but if want to switch go ahead. In my opinon CharX is better than CharY (even though they have different roles).

To shore up your CharX weakness I would replace Ferrothorn with Hippowdon. He is one of premier physical walls in OU and having Blissey takes pressure of him having to absorb special hits.

Hippowdon Leftovers
252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk
Impish Nature
Sand Stream
-Stealth Rock
-Whirlwind
-Earthquake
-Slack Off

Slack Off lets him recover HP, Earthquake is a strong STAB move, Whirlwind gives you a much needed phazing move and makes sure he isn't setup bait. Since Rocks are on Hippowdon now, replace them on Blissey with Heal Bell. This move makes sure you don't have to worry about status moves (to an extent). Wish is also an option, but since Hippo and CharY can heal themselves I would run Heal Bell.

 

[amplifierworship]

Been playtesting Hippowdon and Zard X all night. Hippowdon is working great, Zard is somewhat of a double-edged sword. I have Flare Blitz and Outrage on him and the recoil and confusion is less than favorable. His damage output is enormous, especially with Dragon Dance, I'm just wondering if there's maybe a more favorable moveset?

But yeah, I've only lost a single game tonight out of about 5 or 6, the new team is working better already, thanks guys! :D