VGC First time teambuilding! I have a million doubts and ideas lol

[Exalt]

Hi everyone, I wanted to post about the first team I've really put thought into building for VGC, and have a lot of questions about what to do with it.

Team 1: we do a little sanding
Tyranitar @ Covert Cloak
Ability: Sand Stream
Level: 50
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 220 HP / 252 Atk / 36 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Helping Hand
- Rock Slide
- Knock Off
- Tera Blast

• Tyranitar is of course the sand setter of the team, and the moveset was aped from a Reg G team I found on the VGCPastes repository. I've ended up really liking Helping Hand, as it can really bolster Excadrill's damage output since it isn't carrying Life Orb or Choice Band. The EV spread is meant to let it hit hard, soak up a couple of hits, and though I'm not too familiar with where that specific Speed investment puts it, it has helped it move right after excadrill in a lot of games I've played so far. I was juggling several potential items for Tyranitar at one point in time, starting with the Clear Amulet it came with from the Reg G team, opting to move that over to Excadrill instead and trying to decide whether or not I should get rid of Helping Hand in order to run AV, at one point using Leftovers as a placeholder and eventually settling on Covert Cloak to get around Fake Out pressure. The Tera Type gives the team a ready-made answer to Grass types that could give it trouble, as well as the dreaded Fighting-type that could cause headaches for both Ttar and Excadrill.

Excadrill @ Clear Amulet
Ability: Sand Rush
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- High Horsepower
- Protect

• Excadrill is meant to be the star of the show on this team, built to deal as much damage as possible and hopefully take care of opposingn threats quickly. I prefered Adamant over Jolly nature for this reason, but I still find that there's some problems taking out other threats before they take out Excadrill, given its clear frailty. I prefered High Horsepower over Earthquake because my team isn't necessarily built with Earthquake in mind, only Tera-Tyranitar and Murkrow can reasonably be on the field with Excadrill running it. The Tera-Stellar is meant to give amplified damage all-around without committing to an item that could potentially be made moot by an Intimidate. Clear Amulet allows it to attack unhindered by Intimidate, Parting Shots, and other Attack-lowering problems, as well as letting keep its full Sand Rush boost after Icy Wind or other Speed-lowering attacks. I have been wavering on keeping Excadrill, considering a version of this team where Garchomp features as the main attacker, with much the same investment, same item, but a Jolly nature instead since it is reasonably tankier than Excadrill and can reliably 2HKO most of the field if OHKO is not on the table.

Primarina @ Throat Spray
Ability: Liquid Voice
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 108 SpA / 4 SpD / 60 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Protect
- Haze
- Hyper Voice
- Moonblast

• Primarina becomes the primary special attacker on the team, being able to take a hit and deal damage in return in many cases, invested for bulk and solid Special Attack that can then be boosted by Throat Spray. The Speed investment allows it to move first in some situations and really helps it become a faster threat under Tailwind. There was a version of Primarina on this team that ran specifically as a Dozogiri counter in particular, running max Special Attack investment, 92 HP EVs, 164 Defense EVs, and Choice Specs with Icy Wind, Energy Ball, Hyper Voice, and Moonblast. I decided to move away from this particular set so I could comfortably bring it into more situations where it can reliably deal damage, though I question still bringing Haze instead of Icy Wind in order to have some extra Speed control, especially since I am usually bringing it alongside Murkrow who also has Haze.

Incineroar @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 156 Def / 60 SpD / 36 Spe
Impish Nature
- Fake Out
- Parting Shot
- Knock Off
- Flare Blitz

• Incineroar, for lack of a better word, is Incineroar. I figured it would be wise to bring it because it just provides a ton of supportive power to the team and is tough to get rid of. It is running a standard moveset but the EV spread is something I will gladly accept changes to, I grabbed it from another Reg G team I was using and am not sure if it is the best allocation in the current meta. The goggles are also somewhat bog standard for Incin against threats like Amoonguss, but it also provides it the double utility of not taking damage from the sandstorm.

Amoonguss @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 244 HP / 156 Def / 108 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rage Powder
- Spore
- Clear Smog
- Giga Drain

• Amoonguss is a famous source of bulk and staying power which I figured would be good to have, which also has the power to remove stat boosts from some potentially dangerous setup pokemon, while redirecting hits and sleeping opponents. I gave it Rocky Helmet as a way to have more utility when redirecting attacks should the attack be a contact move. I also ran Giga Drain over Pollen Puff because I wanted a source of STAB for Amoonguss as well as supereffective damage against Water types and did not find myself getting much out of Pollen Puff when I would run it on this team. The EV investment is one I had seen was pretty standard for Amoonguss and figured best to run as is.

Murkrow @ Eviolite
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tailwind
- Taunt
- Foul Play
- Haze

• Murkrow is the Tailwind setter I chose for this team, as I wanted a Prankster user to be able to set up faster and get Taunts off with priority as well. I brought Taunt to be able to block other Tailwind users as well as TR setters (except Farigiraf who blocks Prankster Taunt with Armor Tail). Haze is there to level things off in case of a problematic setup (Dozogiri), and Foul Play lets Murkrow take advantage of opposing pokemon. I chose to run Eviolite on this Murkrow with defensive EV investments since I figured with Prankster it would be able to forgo speed investment and still fare well into most teams when setting up, and tank hits as well. I have seen some Murkrows that max speed and run Focus Sash instead though, so I'm wondering if my thinkning was misguided. I mirrored the spread of a Clefairy I had on a Reg G team.

I've run a spate of games on the Reg H ladder, but I am a pretty low elo player still, so I don't know if my experience piloting the team is worth all that much, but I will say I've had problems against Ursaluna and Trick Room teams. I do wonder if this is because I default to Ttar/Exca leads most of the time, and would appreciate any and all advice both for the team's composition and how to get the most out of it. This is my first post to Smogon, so apologies for not having any of the little sprites or that nice stuff, I'm unfamiliar with how to work all that. Thanks in advance!

I wanted to build around a sand core because of my affinity for Excadrill and Tyranitar, and built the rest of the team ostensibly around them, with Incin being the all around supportive monster it is, murkrow being able to provide speed control and counter some trick room setters (notably not farigiraf though), and amoonguss for additional support. Primarina came to mind as the primary special attacker in situations where running ttar/excadrill seemed less than ideal. At one point I had it running choice specs with max special attack investment and tera grass + energy ball specifically to be able to hit dondozo for big damage, especially with murkrow alongside it to haze away stat boosts from dozogiri, but have since moved away from it in favor of a more traditional primarina set that can still resist dozo and hit hard, but isn't specifically tuned to that matchup in order to give myself some more flexibility. The garchomp over excadrill version came about because in the games I've played on ladder I've seen just how exploitable excadrill's fragile defensive stats and weaknesses are, though this could also be due to my own carelessness in using it and defaulting to ttar/excadrill lead in most situations.

In the games I've played so far I've noticed a little trouble dealing with Ursaluna and some water types, but I've fared alright against rain teams. I'm also having trouble dealing with corviknight teams. Of course, I'm pretty low elo in these matches so perhaps that should all be taken with a grain of salt. Mostly I wanted to hear thoughts on each team, especially running excadrill vs running garchomp, potentially replacing Murkrow or Incineroar in favor of Salamence, who seems to be more popular on sand teams, as well as how you all would answer the threats you see on this team. I apologize for the clunkiness of the post, I'm not familar with how to embed all the little sprites like I see on the metagame discussion threads, and I appreciate any help y'all can give.

 

[Pengu]

Heyo Exalt, welcome to Smogon! I can’t rate this because you need three lines of explanation for each pokemon, and you can only post 1 team per week.
Here are some thoughts for 3 lines:
What do the moves do?
What does the item do?
What does the Tera do?
What do the EVs do?
What does the Pokemon provide to the team/How does the Pokemon work with the team?

 

[TheDuckChris]

Unlocked and ready for a rate!

 

[Omastar68]

I don't know if haze is good on prim, but it CAN'T be goo din conjunction w/ throat spray.

 

[Jeong]

Who knows, although it doesn't seem to make much sense, maybe it will work. Anyway, Mystic Water also seems like a good option to me. I guess you'd have to change both the ability and a water move.

Clear Amulet is interesting in Excadrill. It is like the Clear Body ability. This is just a separate option, you can try it if you want. I was contemplating the LO option. I'm not sure if it will be as useful as Clear Amulet, since it only focuses on hitting hard. Does the Tera Type Stellar really work for you? I would use Ground, Dragon or Ghost. I think they are the best.

Now comes a more delicate change. It is the only thing where I would change your team, but only a little bit.

Sinistcha-Masterpiece @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Hospitality
Level: 50
Tera Type: Fairy / Dark / Water
EVs: 244 HP / 68 Def / 196 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Matcha Gotcha
- Trick Room / Life Dew
- Strength Sap
- Rage Powder
Sinistcha > Amoonguss. Why? For starters, you said that Ursaluna gives you problems or TR teams. Rocky Helmet seems to me to be the best item. I imagine that in VGC there is a lot of contact attack. Nothing more to add. It doesn't change much from Amoonguss.
Well, I think Sinistcha covers that better, plus he also has good synergy with sand teams. I also find it superior in its unique ability as is Hospitality. I find it a very useful ability to support your allies. In fact, every time Sinistcha enters, your ally will recover 25% HP. You have to take into account if you also carry Leftovers, which will increase even more. I have put several options in the Tera Type, but I think Fairy may be the best defensively speaking. They can only take you down with something steel/poison type. And there doesn't seem to be many threats either, or at least that it's cover. Its signature move Matcha Gotcha seems very interesting to me as well. Aside from being able to burn, depending on the damage, you can recover a few HP (10%, 20%). I find it a pretty complete pokemon, I don't know. As for EV's... this is the best I could find. Honestly, I don't know if they are specific to anything in particular. But well, it will be a matter of testing. Ah, I almost forgot. I don't think you'll get much TR in Sinistcha, since your team is not designed for that. That's why I added the Life Dew option. Another quite useful and recovery move. You can recover up to 25%. Note that you can also heal allies that use Protect or are under Substitute.

By the way, welcome to Smogon. And truth be told, it's a good team. Although I for one don't have a great knowledge about VGC, it is appreciated that it is a great team. So little to add. Anyway, I hope I helped you, even a little bit.

 

[Pengu]

Heyo! Here for the rate, and this team is actually really good. One thing it is missing is a Dragon-type, which a lot of sand teams have, resisting all the FWG types, as well as Electro Shot. Resisting Water and Grass is really important because of Tyranitar's and Excadrill's weaknesses to those typing (well drill isn't weak to grass but yknow). Anyways, here are the weaknesses to the team I found:

Weaknesses

There aren't many because this is already a good team but I'll try my best here!

• - Yeah, Primarina does really well here. Butnother than that, your matchup is pretty weak, with Excadrill, Tyranitar, and Incineroar all being terrified of it. Tyranitar can Terastilize, and yeah that should work too. Murkrow doesn't do anything in the MU, and Amoonguss gets redirected by the likely opposing Maushold.
• - Primarina yet again, with Amoonguss on the side. But aside from that, you get cooked by this Pokemon, especially if it has Tera Grass AND is under TR. And if you Tera Tyranitar, then Blood Moon just nukes, especially if they are Tera Normal instead, which is more common.

Pokemon Changes

-->
I did some foreshadowing before, but this is the Dragon-type I was talking about. Being a very powerful Pokemon, you just hit hard. Dragon Darts with a potential Tera Dragon destroys/decently chunks Annihilape, while not being disturbed by Maushold. I'd say go Tera Ghost, because that provides a reliable Ghost-type STAB thanks to Tera Ghost. You can then end it off with U-turn for pivot potential.

Other Changes


-->
Helping Hand --> Low Kick / High Horsepower
New EVs (offensive): 68 HP / 252 Atk+ / 188 Spe

Covert Cloak Tyranitar just isn't good right now. Assault Vest provides the wanted bulk, especially into MUs with Rain. Since AV was added, Helping Hand can go for Low Kick, or even High Horsepower for a more niche option. The only edit I made here is outspeeding Ursaluna-BM when they are max speed Modest, but you can keep the same EV spread if you go for High Horsepower.


Giga Drain --> Pollen Puff
Clear Smog --> Protect
New EVs: 252 HP / 156+ Def / rest in SpDef

Amoonguss isn't made to do damage and Regenerator already heals you, so Giga Drain isn't necessary. Since you have Haze Primarina, Clear Smog feels just like a unnecessary slot. The EVs are just what's standard right now, surviving Blood Moon.

That's it! Here is the paste: we do a bit of sanding

As always, happy battling!

I'd also like to address some things said here:

Who knows, although it doesn't seem to make much sense, maybe it will work. Anyway, Mystic Water also seems like a good option to me. I guess you'd have to change both the ability and a water move.

Even with Mystic Water, Liquid Voice Hyper Voice is preferred due to its spread move capabilities and STAB bonus still activating.

Clear Amulet is interesting in Excadrill. It is like the Clear Body ability. This is just a separate option, you can try it if you want. I was contemplating the LO option. I'm not sure if it will be as useful as Clear Amulet, since it only focuses on hitting hard. Does the Tera Type Stellar really work for you? I would use Ground, Dragon or Ghost. I think they are the best.

Clear Amulet is standard. Lorb is certainly good though. Ground Tera focuses around one type and one type only. Tera Dragon is just too defensive for a rather offensive and frail Pokemon. Tera Ghost does work though, as it doesn't allow Fake Out to slow down its momentum. Tera Stellar is fine though.

Sinistcha-Masterpiece @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Hospitality
Level: 50
Tera Type: Fairy / Dark / Water
EVs: 244 HP / 68 Def / 196 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Matcha Gotcha
- Trick Room / Life Dew
- Strength Sap
- Rage Powder
Sinistcha > Amoonguss. Why? For starters, you said that Ursaluna gives you problems or TR teams. Rocky Helmet seems to me to be the best item. I imagine that in VGC there is a lot of contact attack. Nothing more to add. It doesn't change much from Amoonguss.
Well, I think Sinistcha covers that better, plus he also has good synergy with sand teams. I also find it superior in its unique ability as is Hospitality. I find it a very useful ability to support your allies. In fact, every time Sinistcha enters, your ally will recover 25% HP. You have to take into account if you also carry Leftovers, which will increase even more. I have put several options in the Tera Type, but I think Fairy may be the best defensively speaking. They can only take you down with something steel/poison type. And there doesn't seem to be many threats either, or at least that it's cover. Its signature move Matcha Gotcha seems very interesting to me as well. Aside from being able to burn, depending on the damage, you can recover a few HP (10%, 20%). I find it a pretty complete pokemon, I don't know. As for EV's... this is the best I could find. Honestly, I don't know if they are specific to anything in particular. But well, it will be a matter of testing. Ah, I almost forgot. I don't think you'll get much TR in Sinistcha, since your team is not designed for that. That's why I added the Life Dew option. Another quite useful and recovery move. You can recover up to 25%. Note that you can also heal allies that use Protect or are under Substitute.

There are quite a few things wrong here (and sorry for being nitpicky): You just took information out of the dex, while not really giving a explanation of why, but how they work. The meta is also more specially suited, which means there are more special attackers. Trick Room is only a option for opposing Trick Room. I'd just stick with Amoonguss, as Pollen Puff gives healing, while Spore provides overall more utility.

That's all for now

 

[Exalt]

Hi, I appreciate all the feedback given so far, I feel like I've learned a lot from the analysis given! I wanted to follow up on some given suggestions and present a threat I forgot to include I was struggling against in the original post that I believe I'm just failing to see how to address with my team, and would like some pointers on.

Pokemon Changes

-->
I did some foreshadowing before, but this is the Dragon-type I was talking about. Being a very powerful Pokemon, you just hit hard. Dragon Darts with a potential Tera Dragon destroys/decently chunks Annihilape, while not being disturbed by Maushold. I'd say go Tera Ghost, because that provides a reliable Ghost-type STAB thanks to Tera Ghost. You can then end it off with U-turn for pivot potential.

So moving toward having an outright attacker would be the better move then? I do worry about not being able to set Tailwind in certain circumstances, as well as losing out on Taunt support. Would the set be like the one on the dex, with band, jolly and max offense?

Giga Drain --> Pollen Puff
Clear Smog --> Protect
New EVs: 252 HP / 156+ Def / rest in SpDef

Amoonguss isn't made to do damage and Regenerator already heals you, so Giga Drain isn't necessary. Since you have Haze Primarina, Clear Smog feels just like a unnecessary slot. The EVs are just what's standard right now, surviving Blood Moon.

I see, thanks for the clarification. I had actually taken Jeong's advice and run Sinistcha in its place for some games earlier today, though I realize that the frequent switch-in and more positioning mindful play I was doing with it is probably how I should have been playing Amoonguss, especially now that I'll run Pollen Puff on it.

Lastly, I edited my original post to mention it, but I want to highlight a weakness I had been encountering on the ladder and muse a bit on if it's coming from something I'm blind to or if the team simply does not have an outright counter to it in its current build.


This bird has been causing me issues just about every time I matchup against it, bolstering defenses like Archaludon but without being able to be called out on a Ground type weakness, taking neutral damage from Rock Slide spams, and mirror armoring Incin making its Flare Blitzes weaker and thus making it even more annyoing to remove. I feel like I have to let it set up in my face sometimes, and I really wanna know if this is just me being supremely stupid with the tools I have or me not being able to account for it with the current attackers.

Again, thank you so much to everyone that's replied! You've all given me a lot to think about and I am vibrating with excitement to try out your suggestions and keep getting better at VGC. Hope you're all having a nice day/evening!

 

[Pengu]

Hi, I appreciate all the feedback given so far, I feel like I've learned a lot from the analysis given! I wanted to follow up on some given suggestions and present a threat I forgot to include I was struggling against in the original post that I believe I'm just failing to see how to address with my team, and would like some pointers on.


So moving toward having an outright attacker would be the better move then? I do worry about not being able to set Tailwind in certain circumstances, as well as losing out on Taunt support. Would the set be like the one on the dex, with band, jolly and max offense?

I see, thanks for the clarification. I had actually taken Jeong's advice and run Sinistcha in its place for some games earlier today, though I realize that the frequent switch-in and more positioning mindful play I was doing with it is probably how I should have been playing Amoonguss, especially now that I'll run Pollen Puff on it.

Lastly, I edited my original post to mention it, but I want to highlight a weakness I had been encountering on the ladder and muse a bit on if it's coming from something I'm blind to or if the team simply does not have an outright counter to it in its current build.


This bird has been causing me issues just about every time I matchup against it, bolstering defenses like Archaludon but without being able to be called out on a Ground type weakness, taking neutral damage from Rock Slide spams, and mirror armoring Incin making its Flare Blitzes weaker and thus making it even more annyoing to remove. I feel like I have to let it set up in my face sometimes, and I really wanna know if this is just me being supremely stupid with the tools I have or me not being able to account for it with the current attackers.

Again, thank you so much to everyone that's replied! You've all given me a lot to think about and I am vibrating with excitement to try out your suggestions and keep getting better at VGC. Hope you're all having a nice day/evening!

I actually have the Dragapult set in the pokepaste, which is linked near the bottom.

Corviknight does look like a issue, but with pressure from Tyranitar, Excadrill, and Incineroar, you can probably handle it (knocking off potential safety goggles then sporing it would be nice too)

About the Tailwind, you don’t really need it. Excadrill has Sand, and Dragapult is already super fast, while the rest don’t need Tailwind.

 

[Exalt]

I actually have the Dragapult set in the pokepaste, which is linked near the bottom.

Corviknight does look like a issue, but with pressure from Tyranitar, Excadrill, and Incineroar, you can probably handle it (knocking off potential safety goggles then sporing it would be nice too)

About the Tailwind, you don’t really need it. Excadrill has Sand, and Dragapult is already super fast, while the rest don’t need Tailwind.

totally forgot to click the paste lol
thanks!