Gastrodon (QC 0/3)

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noobcubed

noobcubed

[Overview]

- Fits remarkably well onto any team archetype, unbothered by the team's preferred weather or speed control methods.
- Sweet resistances/immunities to no fewer than seven spread moves, while being weak to none, backed up by natural bulk.
- Storm Drain is a really nice ability; as well as providing the team with protection against rain, it actually does sweet damage after a boost.
- Many rain Pokemon more-or-less countered by this thing - Politoed, Kabutops, Toxicroak, Rotom-W (stalemate), Gyarados (stalemate too). However, the likes of Ludicolo, and, to a lesser extent, Kingdra, can force their way through, and Manaphy can boost past it.
- Rock Slide resist and Water-type STAB and Ground STABs means it checks sand okay too. for example, Earth Power is a guaranteed OHKO on Excadrill.
- 39 base speed makes it a good Trick Room check.
- Basically checks everything.

[SET]

name: Tank
move 1: Muddy Water
move 2: Earth Power
move 3: Ice Beam / Recover
move 4: Protect / Recover
item: Rindo Berry / Sitrus Berry / Water Gem
ability: Storm Drain
evs: 248 HP / 160 SpA / 100 SpD
nature: Modest

[Set Comments]

- Muddy Water is a great spread move - the lack of accuracy in comparison to Surf is more than counterbalanced by not hitting your teammate.
- Earth Power has somewhat redundant coverage with Muddy Water, but notably hits Steel-types like Heatran and Bisharp harder.
- Ice Beam has great coverage, one-shotting Landorus formes, Skymin and various Dragons.
- Due to some key resistances, Gastrodon can viably run Recover, which is rare enough in Doubles.
- Protect for those pesky Grass-types.

[Additional Comments]

- The Special Defense EVS survive Timid Latios's Dragon Gem Draco Meteor.
- Rindo Berry helps Gastrodon survive some Grass-type STABs. However it is powerless against Breloom's Bullet Seed and Skymin's Seed Flare. Sitrus Berry for general longevity. Water Gem if you are taking a more offensive route, typically on Trick Room teams.
- You could also run 0 Speed IVs and Quiet for Trick Room.
- If you are running Gastrodon on a sun team (more sensible than you might think) you should lose Muddy Water and run EP / IB / Recover / Protect.
- Likewise, you can run Blizzard over Ice Beam on Hail or Gravity teams.
- Stuff that takes care of Grass-types. Volcarona, Heatran, Tornadus are prime examples.
- Rain teams - Politoed. But it is advised not to run them side-by-side as Storm Drain deflects Scald & Hydro Pump. Surf spamming with partners to deliberately activate Storm Drain is a mainstay of the lower ladder, but not recommended due to its inflexibility.
- Other weather-setters for other weather teams. Sun and Hail naturally cover Grass-types, Gastrodon's Achilles' heel.
- Trick Room setters. Chandelure and Victini do this and take care of Grass-types while Gastrodon covers their Water-type weakness.
- Just generally other things that get rid of Grass-types, eg Bug-types like Scizor, Genesect and Heracross, can switch into and kill/force out Grass-types.
- All the common FMRP users (Jirachi, Amoonguss, Volcarona, Togekiss) absorb Grass-type attacks with ease. In the case of Volcarona, Gastodon reciprocates by automatically absorbing Water-type moves.
- Intimidate users cover Gastrodon's weaker Defense stat.

[Other Options]

- Not much to say here
- Icy Wind, but Gastrodon is so slow that one often won't be enough.
- Scald is nice to fish for burns, and doesn't miss like Muddy Water
- Stockpile
- Substitute (seriously, in every OO ever)
- Toxic (so it can actually hurt Rotom-W and co, rather than just cockblocking them) Notably useless against Ferrothorn, Amoonguss and Manaphy (Hydration)
- HP Electric if you REALLY want to hit Gyarados
- Counter-coat
- Just stick to the moves in previous sections.

[Checks & Counters]

- Grass-types. Breloom, Skymin, Ludicolo, Ferrothorn, Abomasnow, Amoonguss, Chlorophyll users. Frailer mons must beware Ice Beam. Amoonguss and Ferrothorn additionally outslow it in Trick Room.
- Various powerful neutral attacks will 2HKO.
- Sun weakens Muddy Water. Wide Guard blocks it altogether.
- Gastrodon is somewhat easier to wall than it is to kill. Cresselia, Gyarados, Rotom-W, Jellicent, Suicune and other Gastrodon take little from it but can't do much back (unless they carry HP Grass).
- Dragons that aren't OHKOed by Ice Beam, such as Latios or Hydreigon, win 1v1. Additionally, they can switch in for free on a predicted Earth Power. Kyurem formes are neutral to IB and so win even in Trick Room.
- If you find your team is weak to Gastrodon, sticking a Grass-type move on one of your Pokemon is often the solution.
 
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ok a few things here:
  • remove clear smog in OO, not a very good option even for oo (only thing of note you'd clear is volc really and you can just muddy water)
  • you're overhypin gastrodon, rain is in no way hardwalled by it (unless you're runnin a really bad rain team) so i'd tone that down a bit, altho gastrodon is a great rain answer. on the more notable end saying that gastro is a good check to sand is just false really, only thing it checks on sand is ttar since it doesn't like taking earthquakes (gets 2hkoed by most if not all of em) and only other notable mon w/ stab rock slide is terrakion who can just use cc.
  • add counter, mirror coat, bulldoze, substitute to oo
  • cut the part about rain surfs, it's overly gimmicky and just isnt to threatening to a decent team
  • add jellicent to c&c where you say mons that wall it
  • also add mention of jellicent when you talk about toxic in oo
  • remove mention of venusaur in grass types, its not notable in doubles and isnt a good mon in general
  • add dragons to c&c. kyurem formes don't care at all about any of its attacks and latios + latias + hydreigon have no problem takin a muddy water, are immune to ep because of levitate, and can take an ice beam.
  • add hp grass to oo to hit opposin gastros and other bulky waters
  • add gastro to c&c since gastro really can't hit other gastro w/o toxic or hp grass
  • steel types like scizor meta genesect etc make for good partners to gastro since they can switch into and eliminate grass types that gastrodon attracts, so mention that in ac
 
Made all changes except the following:

- Toned down the whole Surf/Storm Drain self-interaction but didn't remove it. Pokemon like Politoed may well be running Surf anyway, so you may as well, if you have a team with Politoed and Gastrodon, make use of it, at least in my eyes. I made a point of saying it's a bad thing to have a team of six Water Absorb users on a team, all spamming Surf.
- Added Icy Wind instead of Bulldoze. I think this one is obvious.
- Changed "Venusaur" to "Chlorophyll users", which is the point I was trying to make.
 
actually if you've read politoed's analysis surf is mentioned only as an ac mention on the specs set, which shows that it really isn't a good move or strategy (most politoed are running hydro pump or scald). not sure what other qc members have to say about this though. also i still say get rid of any mention of chlorophyllers because they're not good enough to be worth noting specifically. since you're already saying grass types in general can check it so you don't need to go and list every possible grass-type, just the most threatening ones. change to icy wind is cool tho, didnt see it when i was lookin through moves for some reason
 
Yeah okay on reflection I see what you mean about Surf, that it isn't great on Toed because it doesn't have the raw power to compensate for hitting your partner. However, it's not like Politoed can usefully use Scald or Hydro Pump either when next to Gastrodon because it won't actually hit the opponent. The only Pokemon that are recommended to use Surf in other analyses are Ludicolo and Manaphy, neither of which are massively common.

Come to think of it, I'm not sure I've actually used Gastrodon on rain teams very much, certainly not to massive success. Maybe I should emphasise its ability to work on other weathers or weatherless teams, against rain?

Also can you comment on Toxicroak? (Which, by the way, has been sitting at QC 2/3 for about a month.) I made similar comments about Surf/Dry Skin there, but feel a bit more justified there because Toxicroak synergises well with Ludicolo and Manaphy in other ways (eg, Fake Out helps Manaphy set up Tail Glow safely, Cross Chop takes out ultimate rain wall Ferrothorn, etc etc).
 
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Gastrodon should have 2 sets - offensive and defensive. You have an offensive set already listed. AC mention Ground Gem to OHKO max HP Metagross and a high chance to 2HKO max HP Tyranitar with Earth Power.

Defensive Gastrodon can make use of Stockpile, Toxic, Icy Wind, and / or Scald (and even Counter / Mirror Coat, too, although i've never seen use of either moves). A lot of OO mentions can be moved into Defensive Gastrodon. Here is the main spread: 252 HP / 156 Def / 100 SpD, Calm / Bold Nature. With a Calm Nature, Gastrodon survives 2 hits from LO Jolly Garchomp's Earthquake, Adamant Metagross's Zen Headbutt, Adamant Tyranitar's Crunch, and Adamant Scizor's Bug Bite. It can also tank a +1 Close Combat from Terrakion on the physical side. On the special side it can tank one Dragon Gem Draco Meteor from Modest Kyurem. With a Rindo Berry, Gastrodon can even survive an unboosted Seed Flare from Timid Shaymin-S!

With a Bold Nature, it can now survive 2 hits from LO Adamant Mamoswine's Earthquake, LO Jolly Garchomp's Dragon Claw, LO Timid Keldeo's Secret Sword, unboosted Adamant Kyurem-B's Dragon Claw, and LO Adamant Victini's V-create while still tanking a Dragon Gem Draco Meteor from Timid Latios from the special side. This spread is far more susceptible to Modest Draco Meteor, though. Pick one spread and mention the other in the AC.

Here's also another cool resource from nuggetbridge that you may want to read: Gastrodon for Dummies. It's written for VGC format, but there's a lot of detail that you may find helpful when drafting your analysis.
 
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