Heatran-Tank with support

Instinctive

Heatran @ Leftovers
Flash Fire
Modest (+SAtk, -Atk)
252 HP/100 SDef/ 100Def/52 SAtk
-Substitute
-Will-o-wisp
-Fire Blast
-Earth Power


This Heatran has a couple of things going for it: First off, it can take Outrage/Dragon Claw from a Choiced Chomp very well, gettign up a sub and burning the Chomp. The basic strategy with this guy is too bring him on on one of his many resistances, or a Fire atttack, Sub up while they switch, then burn or annihilate whatever comes in.

NATURE

I chose Modest because of his high SAtk, and because I think the 10% boost to his SAtk is more important than raising his defenses some more.

EVs

252 HP
This HP gives hm 386 hit points, a nice number for lefties and relatively high. If only Heatran had base 100 HP...

Def/Sdef

Thses each have 100 EVs, which gives him 273 in each defense, and allows some tanking from both ends of the spectrum. If you wish to specialize in one, you can go 252/252 and change the nature. I like this, and thank you for X-Act's defense Applet to show me that even EVs was indeed the best way to go.

SAtk

I just dropped 52 evs into SAtk for a little boost. If you wantr to go 128 in each defense, feel free.

MOVESET

Sub

This is great, because everybody expects a LO/Scarf revenge killer. You bring Tran in, and then SUb up as they switch out to somebody liek Garchomp (which actually happens often...) or another Heatran. Then you can utilize the rest of you moves to cripple or kill the counter.

Will-o-wisp

This is a very easy to use move. If you have a sub, or you just feel a switch coming, or you wish to burn the Garchomp that is outraging, use WoW. Its very easy to do.

Earth Power

This is for other Tran, fir types, and basically everything that you can't Fire Blast. Bliss without SToss is eventually screwed by SDef drops too, as a bonus.

Fire Blast

This is Tran's most powerful move. STAB, maybe FF, and 120 BP can deal out the damage. Lava Plume could go here, but you already have WoW for burns.


Ok, thats it. DISCUSS!
 
That looks quite nice on paper. I'd hate to see a Heatran sub up when I switch in my own Heatran. Burning stuff like Subless Garchomp is always a plus.

Did you try it out yet?
 
You need to throw some damage calcs up here. We need to know if it...

Can its survive a EQ from Garchomp if it is burned?
Can it take on a Surf from Milotic/Slowbro or some other popular surf users.
How does it handle pokes that are a serious issue to this poke on the threat list like Gyaradose and Machamp?

You should consider using moves like Taunt or Swagger, to maximize its annoying-ness behind a sub.

Need to to a better job on the evs, but with some work, the set could have potential....maybe. Also, dump fire blast for flamethrower or Magma Storm.

Trapping shit in there with Magma Storm while you confuse it, toxic it, and just watch it die would be sick.
 
I ran a quick calc whether Heatran would survive a burned Garchomp after subbing, and it won't. Garchomp was already killing Heatran about half the time before I entered EVs/nature.
 
Hmm... Not Bad. Looks good on paper. Have you tested it at all? Lava Plume might be better than fire blast because it has a high burn rate + better PP.
 
I prefer Rest, Sleep Talk, Earth Power, Lava Plume for my Tank Heatran. Lava Plume has a cool 30% chance to burn.
 
Yes, I have tested it. And, I have tested Lava Plume. Generally, it seems that the extra firepower is more useful than the 30% burn because, as noted, it has WoW.

If a Heatran comes in, and when you switch to your Gyara it Subs, are you really gonna taunt it? Do you automatically think Oh Tran, WoW is coming, or do you DD up/Waterfall it?

The problem I have with ReSTalk is that you don't get to choose the move. And since Tran has so many bulky water counters, using a Fire move/weaker Earth power just doesn't cut it. And so you switch out to be stuck with sleep. If you really need a status absorber, go with something like SpecsShaymin or Specsmie or a better ReSTalker that can take status.
 
I find Heatran doing alright sleep absorbing, but the only times he really lives to make use of both Rest and Sleep Talk is when he's up against some stall machine like Cresselia or Blissey.
 
Obi said:
I prefer Rest, Sleep Talk, Earth Power, Lava Plume for my Tank Heatran. Lava Plume has a cool 30% chance to burn.
Click to expand...

What Obi said is true. Also, I <3 coincidentally round EV spreads.

Being able to take an Outrage isn't that unique; a lot of Steels can do that you know. Hell, Steelix is a great Garchomp counter if you predict Earthquakes. Still, have fun.
 
Chris, I think you missed the point. Tran is, I think, the only guy who can switch into any Garchomp's Outrage and then proceed to cripple it for the rest of the match with a burn.

I also say, do all the Lava Plume people recognize the redundancy and difference in power? Why is a move with high burn % needed when you have a move that burns the opponent, period.
 
Hitit4three said:
Chris, I think you missed the point. Tran is, I think, the only guy who can switch into any Garchomp's Outrage and then proceed to cripple it for the rest of the match with a burn.

I also say, do all the Lava Plume people recognize the redundancy and difference in power? Why is a move with high burn % needed when you have a move that burns the opponent, period.
Click to expand...

Because you've essentially combined the fire move and the burn move into a single move thus freeing up a slot? It's also funny when the "tank tran" runs out of fire blast PP when stalling.
 
I suppose that is a point, but Tank and Wall (for stalling) are very different. Don't stall stuff, that base 130 SAtk should be put to use while you cripple opposing attackers.
 
Hitit4three said:
I suppose that is a point, but Tank and Wall (for stalling) are very different. Don't stall stuff, that base 130 SAtk should be put to use while you cripple opposing attackers.
Click to expand...

You just contradicted yourself here. You say Heatran is the only outrage switchin that can burn Garchomp (thus that's why Will-o-wisp is there), but you also say you DON'T want to stall with him since you'd be wasting 130 Satk. Think about it. Will-o-wisp... is a stall move. It makes Garchomp do less damage. You have 130 Satk. If you're scared of Garchomp, you shouldn't be BURNING it, you should be KILLING it under your "not stall" logic. If you say that you don't want to give up Will-o-wisp, that's what Lava Plume is for.

So now with the whole "only steel that can set Garchomp on fire" thing out of the way, wouldn't you rather switch in a Steelix, who isn't entirely screwed over if he mispredicts an Earthquake and has Ice Fang? Sure, he can't attack as hard as Heatran, but if you want an attacker, run the attacking set.
 
Hitit4three said:
If you really need a status absorber, go with something like SpecsShaymin or Specsmie or a better ReSTalker that can take status.
Click to expand...

Natural Cure Pokemon are the absolute worst thing to switch into sleep moves. If you switch in a Natural Cure Pokemon, they get a free turn to do whatever as you switch, then they can still put something to sleep again later, buying yet another free turn. At least when you take sleep with a regular Pokemon, that's it, and they can't put something to sleep again.



Also when you factor in Will-O-Wisp's 75% accuracy, Lava Plume looks even better. Another cool thing is that you damage and have a shot at the burn. If they are using Substitute, I'd rather use a move that will pretty much be guaranteed to break their Substitute (Heatran is strong enough to do that) if they use it, and has a chance to burn if they don't, so I don't have to get into a prediction / guessing match (depending on what point in the game it is). Lava Plume also has the advantage of hitting through Taunt.
 
you may opt for 244 HP/ 136 Speed/ 100 Defense/ 30 Special Attack as the EVs, as it will have max leftovers recovery, as well as being able to outrun bulky Gyarados. I agree on the arguement of using Lava Plume over Will O Wisp, and Taunt in the last slot to stop CM Roar Suicune whos opts to not run Surf (although (BAN ME PLEASE) can take the Surf) and Cresselia, as it will have no way to hurt Heatran unless its the Timid Hidden Power Fighting set in the analysis
 
I kind of agree with everything else that has been said so far, except for Chris is Me. There is a distinction between Wall and Tank, WoW is not a "stall-move", it is a crippling move meant to make life easier for the rest of your team. Again, the point is come in on outrage---its your fault if you mispredict, just don't suck at predicting... The point is that once you have burned something, even something that switches in as you were going to burn something else, you can then switch out.

I.E: earlier today, I was able to get a Gyara on a switch in, which I subsequently used to bring in Togekiss to NP and then BP to my Timid Gengar (he switched to Forry and started spiking...) at which point Forry blew itself up for nothing (I BP'ed on the turn he exploded lol) and Gar swept his team. All because Gyara was neutralized...


Anyhow, the point is to burn where you can, and then utilize sweeping capabilities elsewhere. Its nice to be in a situation for an obvious fire move and Sub when they bring in a Tran that only dies to Earth Power...hehe
 
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