SV OU I saw someone running simple beam latios on ladder with trace gardevoir thought it was funny tried to build looking to refine the team

Estradiol5mg

Estradiol5mg

https://pokepast.es/880a3c55bb917531

i saw someone on ladder playing simple beam latios trace gardevoir and this team is basically ment to exploit simple beam i should probabally replace corv with tusk was thinking wheezing galar just in case i fuck up and the unaware clefable isnt enough to stop the enemy simple sweep

Latios @ Soul Dew
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flip Turn
- Draco Meteor
- Psychic Noise
- Simple Beam

flip turn for chip simple beam for simple beam sillies with gardevoir also opportunities to do intimidate spam plus accuracy minusing spam cause funny

Gardevoir @ Leftovers
Ability: Trace
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Def / 164 SpA / 92 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draining Kiss
- Stored Power
- Substitute
- Calm Mind

leftovers for survivability 92 speed to outspeed kingambit and iron hands
also defense investment cause was getting bullied by phys attackers basically just traces the simple beam and then sweeps

Corviknight @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Iron Defense
- Defog
- Body Press
- Roost

corv is the team member i am most unsure on basically needed a hazard removal will probs cut for a wheezing galar or a tusk also the pressure stall has been nice also a backup for if a fuck up into a phys attacker with a setup move sometimes probs gonna swap with wheezing galar though

Clefable @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Knock Off

is unaware cause if i fuck up the simple trace so i dont get swept sets rocks and i needed something that was specially bulky

Pecharunt @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Poison Puppeteer
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 248 HP / 232 Def / 28 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Malignant Chain
- Hex
- Parting Shot
- Recover

ngl i love this pecha set so much it outspeeds kingambit and iron hands so i can parting shot spam colbur berry cause its honestly rlly nice for the knock off also its so tanky

Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Mud-Slap
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Taunt

intimidate with pecha is actually rlly good for simple beam stat drop spam and gives room for me to fuck up with simple beam mud slap is funny cause simple beam with a accuracy lowering move is just evil also just gives chip
 
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It's unlikely to serve as an improvement but Grassy Seed on Garde with Terrain Extender Rillaboom would give a +2 Def boost if you can set everything up to switch into terrain and trace Simple. Would be funny but also obviously enables more switch-ins and a faster Stored Power ramp.
 
I tested a team with this Gardevoir set:
Gardevoir @ Kee Berry
Ability: Trace
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Draining Kiss
- Moonblast

I really do not think SpA investment is needed because the "simple" fact is after just one CM and a Kee Berry proc you are strong enough to KO almost anything unresisted. Stored Power is a given, having an absurd 140 BP after the aforementioned CM + Kee Berry combination, and being boosted even further to 220 BP if you CM a second time. Draining Kiss is very nice for the faster Pokemon that try and get some damage on you before dying to your other attacks, and can catch a lot of people by surprise. Moonblast is a stronger fairy move aimed to hit many of the Psychic-immune Dark types that may be able to shrug off your Draining Kiss. Most notably this hits Kingambit harder and allows you to get a massive hit on Ting-Lu before getting Roared out. Running double fairy moves may seem unusual, especially since it leaves you defenseless against steels, but Stored Power is such a strong move to begin with that it hardly matters.

I gave it enough speed to always outspeed adamant gambit, and though you could run a bit more to speed creep other gambit speed creepers, I do not think this matters at all. Even outspeeding Kingambit does not feel too necessary if you are Terastallised, as the +2 to defense renders Kingambit very non-threatening.

Though Tera-Water has a plethora of good matchups, being weak to Meowscarada, Rillaboom and Ogerpon-W is far from ideal. None outright OHKO you from full (if Kee Berry has procced), except max roll/adamant/damage boosting item Meowscarada. Tera-Poison is certainly worth testing, as it offers a valuable immunity to toxic, a handful of useful resistances, whilst only leaving you weak to Ground and Psychic. The main reason I did not consider this is that being weak to Headlong Rush from Great Tusk sounded unviable, but I neglected to consider that a non-terastallised Great Tusk is a Draining Kiss victim, meaning you come out with more HP from the exchange.

Now while this Gardevoir set is really strong on paper... these is one massive issue. Encore. Encore is everywhere in OU, and it completely shuts down Gardevoir as it tries to set up. I have not really had the chance to test this set extensively but for teams lacking an Encore user it often would just sweep. If you predict Iron Valiant coming in you can also nuke it with Moonblast and then come back in a second time with nothing to stop you (assuming they can force you out with anything... otherwise just CM).

As for what Latios to pair it with... I went through a few different sets for Latios. Most people actually turn their brains on when they see Latios use Simple Beam and immediately figure out what is up, so they will just switch out immediately. Fortunately, actually stopping the strategy is far easier said than done even if you know what is happening, much unlike Mummy Slaking or other mufish gimmicks. Switches happen in speed order, so Latios' natural 110 speed means that even if they try switching out to prevent Simple from being traced, you usually get to switch first. There are very few ways to reliably prevent Simple + Trace. Even fewer if you use Scarf Latios with Simple Beam, which definitely sounds unusual but means it can act as speed control for most of the game and then get off a dying Simple Beam. I think Flip Turn or the Eject Pack pivoting sets are too unreliable, they rely on the opponent not switching to try and deny Trace which very often happens. Eject Button makes a little more sense, as you can give them Simple and switch into Gardevoir in one turn, without taking any damage on Gardevoir.

Further thought: Ogerpon-W is one of the biggest Pokemon stopping Gardevoir due to its access to encore and a supereffective Power Whip after Tera-Water. Trying to lure Ogerpon-W in and then paralysing it is definitely a win path, as it makes Ogerpon-W another Stored Power victim.


Edit: if anyone has a team using any Latios set other than CM/Recover please message me the paste so I can try laddering with it, I think the best way to utilise this idea is to play a 5 Pokemon game and aim for a Latios endgame. Having hazard control or at least a poison type to soak up t-spikes would also be preferred.
 
cestu said:
I tested a team with this Gardevoir set:
Gardevoir @ Kee Berry
Ability: Trace
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Draining Kiss
- Moonblast

I really do not think SpA investment is needed because the "simple" fact is after just one CM and a Kee Berry proc you are strong enough to KO almost anything unresisted. Stored Power is a given, having an absurd 140 BP after the aforementioned CM + Kee Berry combination, and being boosted even further to 220 BP if you CM a second time. Draining Kiss is very nice for the faster Pokemon that try and get some damage on you before dying to your other attacks, and can catch a lot of people by surprise. Moonblast is a stronger fairy move aimed to hit many of the Psychic-immune Dark types that may be able to shrug off your Draining Kiss. Most notably this hits Kingambit harder and allows you to get a massive hit on Ting-Lu before getting Roared out. Running double fairy moves may seem unusual, especially since it leaves you defenseless against steels, but Stored Power is such a strong move to begin with that it hardly matters.

I gave it enough speed to always outspeed adamant gambit, and though you could run a bit more to speed creep other gambit speed creepers, I do not think this matters at all. Even outspeeding Kingambit does not feel too necessary if you are Terastallised, as the +2 to defense renders Kingambit very non-threatening.

Though Tera-Water has a plethora of good matchups, being weak to Meowscarada, Rillaboom and Ogerpon-W is far from ideal. None outright OHKO you from full (if Kee Berry has procced), except max roll/adamant/damage boosting item Meowscarada. Tera-Poison is certainly worth testing, as it offers a valuable immunity to toxic, a handful of useful resistances, whilst only leaving you weak to Ground and Psychic. The main reason I did not consider this is that being weak to Headlong Rush from Great Tusk sounded unviable, but I neglected to consider that a non-terastallised Great Tusk is a Draining Kiss victim, meaning you come out with more HP from the exchange.

Now while this Gardevoir set is really strong on paper... these is one massive issue. Encore. Encore is everywhere in OU, and it completely shuts down Gardevoir as it tries to set up. I have not really had the chance to test this set extensively but for teams lacking an Encore user it often would just sweep. If you predict Iron Valiant coming in you can also nuke it with Moonblast and then come back in a second time with nothing to stop you (assuming they can force you out with anything... otherwise just CM).

As for what Latios to pair it with... I went through a few different sets for Latios. Most people actually turn their brains on when they see Latios use Simple Beam and immediately figure out what is up, so they will just switch out immediately. Fortunately, actually stopping the strategy is far easier said than done even if you know what is happening, much unlike Mummy Slaking or other mufish gimmicks. Switches happen in speed order, so Latios' natural 110 speed means that even if they try switching out to prevent Simple from being traced, you usually get to switch first. There are very few ways to reliably prevent Simple + Trace. Even fewer if you use Scarf Latios with Simple Beam, which definitely sounds unusual but means it can act as speed control for most of the game and then get off a dying Simple Beam. I think Flip Turn or the Eject Pack pivoting sets are too unreliable, they rely on the opponent not switching to try and deny Trace which very often happens. Eject Button makes a little more sense, as you can give them Simple and switch into Gardevoir in one turn, without taking any damage on Gardevoir.

Further thought: Ogerpon-W is one of the biggest Pokemon stopping Gardevoir due to its access to encore and a supereffective Power Whip after Tera-Water. Trying to lure Ogerpon-W in and then paralysing it is definitely a win path, as it makes Ogerpon-W another Stored Power victim.


Edit: if anyone has a team using any Latios set other than CM/Recover please message me the paste so I can try laddering with it, I think the best way to utilise this idea is to play a 5 Pokemon game and aim for a Latios endgame. Having hazard control or at least a poison type to soak up t-spikes would also be preferred.
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i have been running grassy seed with rillaboom just for the regen im aware of encore but im mostly having this team just cause its funny
 
Estradiol5mg said:
i have been running grassy seed with rillaboom just for the regen im aware of encore but im mostly having this team just cause its funny
Click to expand...
Three issues
1. I do not like the idea of running another mon so easily U-Turned on, makes it hard to keep up momentum.
2. Switching in Rillaboom (suppose it is the end of turn 1), swapping for Latios (turn 2), using simple beam (turn 3), and then swapping (turn 4) means you only have one turn of leniency and leaves you very, very, predictable. Protect can leave you with even less time. Wanted to U-Turn out with Rillaboom but got protected on? Minus one turn. Wanted to use simple beam but got protected on? Minus one turn. That Pokemon in front of you that probably wants to setup on your Latios if it wanted to be passive? Please attack it or use T-Wave into it. It will waste you a turn. The simple fact is that having grassy terrain active on the field AND using simple beam AND going to Gardevoir simply rides on too much going correct. It telepgraphs your item choice and telegraphs your plans. Sure, Terrain Extender Rillaboom is a thing but this is such a waste of an item slot on 99.9% of teams. And this is not even mentioning the biggest flaw of this all: Ice Spinner. Ice Spinner Great Tusk is everywhere, absolutely everywhere. And if you get Ice Spinnered in any of those 3 turns, you are completely shut down. The two Pokemon you have to bring in before bringing in Gardevoir? They are BOTH Ice Spinner victims. With simply Kee Berry, you can get off a dying simple beam with Latios as you get KOed, CM with Gardevoir as they Headlong Rush you with Great Tusk (their calc will show a guaranteed OHKO), and then live the next Headlong Rush thanks to Kee Berry and leave the exchange with an 82% healthy Gardevoir with +2 for three stats and a dead Great Tusk. They will not even bother going to an encore user.
TL;DR grassy terrain is inconsistent to have setup on the field when you are in. Do not limit your opportunities to setup just by having another factor.
3. It gets expended immediately upon switching in. This leaves you vulnerable to whirlwind/red card dragging you out, or to being encored into a move and being forced to come back in later. Using Kee Berry often means that if they activate your berry they do not have an encore user, or not one they feel safe going right into anyway (unless it is activated on a U-Turn or Flip Turn).


Kee Berry also has the element of surprise. Unlike Grassy Seed which immediately reveals itself, Kee Berry is hidden until it is activated, and this means you actually get to bluff a whole lot--are you Weakness Policy and they should avoid using supereffective attacks? Most likely their course of action if they see a simple Gardevoir is to immediately go out into a physical attacker and get a big hit off, which will of course activate your Kee Berry very reliably.
 
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