Kecleon suggestions?

Ryouu

Hi I've just registered to join the Smogon community, but I've been a frequent visiter and lurker to this site.

I would have posted on the ADV gen board, but I thought I'd try here as well since more people are probably here as they wait for D/P. I'm sorry if this isn't directly D/P related since I'm asking for help for an ADV Kecleon.

Kecleon is my absolute favorite ADV gen Pokemon and I've been trying to create a useful one ever since Ru/Sa's release...

I've tried the whole Skillswap/shadow ball thing and the physical attacker, but they haven't been too effective. I kinda want to try a trickbander that can get a Special attacker/sweeper to change his type (since a lot of special types resist themselves and he has good Sp.Def) to maybe buy some time for focus punching or something if they decide to switch or stay in for some reason.

kecleon.png

Kecleon@ChoiceBand
Adamant/Careful
-Trick
-Substitute
-Focus Punch
-Shadowball/Shadow Claw

Maybe even use CB Focus Punch if I get the chance? (who would switch out from Kecleon? lol) I always wanted to try Thunderwave or counter, but they probably wouldn't fit here. It' so frustrating since he learns so many awsome moves, but can't fit them all. =(

So, I would like some suggestions on the EV spread, nature, and maybe moves for the little guy. This is more for ADV, but I'm open to ideas for future Kecleon strategies for D/P (if they even exist). Feel free to show your own Kecleon move sets here or past experiences with it lol.
 
Shadow Ball is special now so you're better off with Shadow Claw.

Can't really comment on EVs and Nature however (although Adamant off the bat seems the way to go).
 
D&P set:
Kecleon@Adherence Scarf
252 HP, 252 ATK, 6 Def, Adamant
Trick
Disable
Focus Punch
Ambush

Trick the AS over and pray you survive that hit. If you catch them in a stat up move use FP, if you catch them in an attack move use Ambush. Disable to make them struggle to death. He needs some kind of recovery move, but that is stupid to say.
Obviously this is far from perfect but it can screw over a lot of things.
 
Kecleon doesn't really get anything interesting or new... I'd just go with the Advance standards, really obviously with Shadow Claw over Shadow Ball).
 
Shadow Ball is special now so you're better off with Shadow Claw.

Can't really comment on EVs and Nature however (although Adamant off the bat seems the way to go).

Yea I realized that it changed to special for D/P, but as I already apologized, this set was more towards ADV. So switch out shadow ball for shadow claw if this was for D/P.

Kecleon doesn't really get anything interesting or new... I'd just go with the Advance standards, really obviously with Shadow Claw over Shadow Ball).

May I ask what the ADV standard for Kecleon was? Are the Smogondex sets considered the standards for each pokemon? Yea and I agree that he doesn't gain anything too useful. However I noticed that he gets trick room that could be potentially useful in a TR team, and Stealth Rock which is cool in an odd novelty kinda way.
 
Ryouu said:
Yea I realized that it changed to special for D/P, but as I already apologized, this set was more towards ADV. So switch out shadow ball for shadow claw if this was for D/P.
Click to expand...
My bad, kind of skimmed the thread, only really took notice of the moveset posted and the request for EVs.
 
I guess the poor guy is not too popular?

Well anyway he's probably going to end up on my D/P gen team someway or another and since he gets Steath Rock I thought he could fill that role for me.

Kecleon@Leftovers
Adamant/Careful
-Stealth Rock
-Thunder Wave
-Ice Punch/Focus Punch/Seismic Toss?
-Counter

EVs: MAX HP/ Rest split between ATK and SpDef. I wish I was better at creating EV spreads...=/ Anyway he'd either switch into a AG something that is using a self resist type and hope they switch or come in after after death and use Stealth Rock. If they switch to some physical counter Paralyze or Punch on the switch and then counter or run away.

Does either of my movesets work at least in theory? And how do you think they would do over Wi-fi or against humans (ie not NET Battle)? And lastly, could someone who has had experience with Kecleon or competitive battling in general help me decide on the nature and EVs? I can't decide how much of each stat (HP/ATK/SpDef) and if I should even give him some Defense.
 
Kecleon @ Choice Band
- Return
- Focus Punch
- Ambush
- Trick

Kecleon has a pretty workable attack score, and can certainly dent stuff hard with CB. He actually switches in on most special based pokes (120 base SD + Color Change) pretty easily as well. With Ambush, it can actually get the jump on things now. And Trick can just mess something up if you need to.

Kecleon is fantastic with some well developed mindgames.
 
YesIDoPwn said:
Is Kecleon actually worth using on wifi? I never saw him as too great a pokemon.
Click to expand...

I don't really know how he'll do, but he's just too awsome to not be somewhere. Element of surprise? Haha.

aeroshadow said:
Kecleon @ Choice Band
- Return
- Focus Punch
- Ambush
- Trick

Kecleon has a pretty workable attack score, and can certainly dent stuff hard with CB. He actually switches in on most special based pokes (120 base SD + Color Change) pretty easily as well. With Ambush, it can actually get the jump on things now. And Trick can just mess something up if you need to.

Kecleon is fantastic with some well developed mindgames.
Click to expand...

I agree. Ambush sounds like a nice attack for him and can replace shadow ball/claw on my other moveset.

However, I still wish someone could help me with possible EV spreads and the nature because that is currently the primary thing stopping me from raising some Kecleons.
 
EV spread depends partly on which moveset you want.

EVs: 236 HP / 100 Atk / 172 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)

Give hims 320 HP, 350 SDef and 241 Atk. Attack isn't great, but if you use this on a Trick/Choice Band set it gives him 361. 320 HP and 350 SDef is reasonably good for UU/NU.
 
Max HP would be more beneficial than putting some in Special Defense in my opinion unless you are trying to survive a specific Special Attack.

Kecleon is simply not a good Pokemon. He can be fun to toy around with and screw up things maniacally with Trick, Skill Swap, Focus Punch and whatnot. But whether that's worth using him over something that will always help like Snorlax, Blissey or even Kangaskhan...I wouldn't be sure on that.
 
Keckleon needs more evolution with:
HP: 80
Atk: 110
Def: 90
Spd: 50
SpcAtk: 70
SpcDef: 135

It's got a killer movepool, but its stats don't augment it.
Needs more Judgement Pebble also.
 
Pokemon needs move, evo and better stats-posts are really extraneous. DP evolved plenty of useless Pokemon into...quite cool concepts. I can't see why you would complain.
 
Well, Chimecho at least deserves an evo...

Kecleon can be a bitch in 2 vs 2, which is where you would have the most success using it in. Try it in combo with Guard Swap or something to get its defenses even higher.
 
Phuquoph said:
EV spread depends partly on which moveset you want.

EVs: 236 HP / 100 Atk / 172 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)

Give hims 320 HP, 350 SDef and 241 Atk. Attack isn't great, but if you use this on a Trick/Choice Band set it gives him 361. 320 HP and 350 SDef is reasonably good for UU/NU.
Click to expand...

Hmm so I guess I shouldn't put attack as a priority for him.

Mekkah said:
Max HP would be more beneficial than putting some in Special Defense in my opinion unless you are trying to survive a specific Special Attack.

Kecleon is simply not a good Pokemon. He can be fun to toy around with and screw up things maniacally with Trick, Skill Swap, Focus Punch and whatnot. But whether that's worth using him over something that will always help like Snorlax, Blissey or even Kangaskhan...I wouldn't be sure on that.
Click to expand...

I agree with the fact that he's not too great overall and easily screwed over, but I guess I'm just one of those people who are stuck on using their favorites and trying to make the best out of them. And Kecleon seems to at least have a chance to do something unlike some other pokes.

I guess I'm going for the Careful one then and focusing more on survival rather than boosting his usable ATK. Thanks for the replies. I hope other people experiment with this cool looking pokemon.
 
CPU V2.0 said:
Keckleon needs more evolution with:
HP: 80
Atk: 110
Def: 90
Spd: 50
SpcAtk: 70
SpcDef: 135

It's got a killer movepool, but its stats don't augment it.
Needs more Judgement Pebble also.
Click to expand...

I'm actually against a Kecleon evolution even though it could greatly help him. Maybe I'm just Kecleon biased, but I usually prefer just the addition of new poke families rather than continuing previous ones. A pre-evo would be meh, but if it gives Kecleon some helpful move then I'd be up for that.
 
Bump

I know this thread is kinda old now, but I guess I want to see if anyone thought about this Poke lately and came up with any new ideas. Also, are either of my movesets viable?
 
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