Kick the can! OU RMT

[iShedinja]

Hello everyone! This is just a little OU RMT that I built. I hope I didn't write to little.. Or made it look like crap >.>

About the team..
I wanted to build a team around Magnezone and Gengar. This is because after seeing the top Offensive threat list, I wanted something to take care of Scizor. To make use of having Scizor out of play, I wanted to add the most destructive Dragon dancer, which was Salamence. Salamence, when there is no Scizor in play, can completely dominate. It just takes one Dragon dance for it to own. As for the other three choices, I wanted a Lead that does a good job setting up rocks, and spreading some sort of hax in the process. I originally had Azelf there, but I found Jirachi to do more than azelf could (Para hax, scout, set up rocks, flinch). The last two slots where based on Synergy and power. I decided that I needed a Late-game sweeper and some sort of revenge killer, so I went for the Laticaro combo.

At the glance

In dept...

Cat got me (Jirachi) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 80 HP/252 Atk/176 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Iron Head
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Thunder Wave
---
Does the evs look familier? Well if so, then you can probably see that they're the standard lead Jirachi's evs. In my experience of using jirachi, 9/10 people predict a trick coming. So they'd probably switch into some scarfed pokemon such as Rotom-H and Latias. If I can predict that switch, I'll use Thunder Wave on them, which renders their choice scarf. After that, I set up rocks and use either Iron Head or U-turn, depending on the situation. This set acts like a mock Para-Flinch Togekiss, as it abuses serene grace with a flinch move, and uses thunder wave. I went through a crapload of leads before I came to this one, and I felt as if this Jirachi set is both un-predictable and effective.

A summery..

1. Azelf - Standard sash leads are flinched to death, I normally predict the Taunt the first turn. U-turn does about 50% to them after I'm done flinching :P
2.Metagross - After I set up rocks, Thunder Wave, Flinch it a little, and U-turn to Gengar or something.
3. Swampert - I normally just get rocks up, and U-turn out to Latias to take the earthquake. They normally predict a trick though, and switch out.
4.Aerodactel - Iron head it to death, if I can still survive the earthquake, then I'll set up rocks. I don't see these guys much often though, as most of the other leads handle this pretty well.
5.Jirachi - Switch to Latias. Though the opponent will probably think I'm scarfed as well, so I thunder wave it, and set up rocks.
6.Infernape - Oi! As my Jewish friend says (I'm not trying to be racist) These things are a pain. I would just switch to Latias to kill it with surf. If these are sashed, like they traditionally are, then I'll just surf again since fire blast has a 15% chance of missing. Close combat will just do laughable damage.
7.Roserade - Thunder wave, and iron head. If it sleeps me, I go to Latias and Surf, or something.
8.Heatran - I switch to Latias, and surf.
9.Smeargle - I switch to probably gengar to take the spore, switch back to jirachi and flinch/t-wave to break baton pass chain/set up rocks. It really just depends on the set he is running.
10.Hippowdon - Well.. They normally switch here predicting a Trick, so I t-wave from time to time. If they chose to stay in, I get rocks up and die. Sending in Latias, I kill this guy with surf/draco meteor

Child Molester (Gengar) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Protect
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Fire]
---
The ultimate Scizor bait, ever. EVER!!! Scizor loves to switch on this guy, When it does... I protect to scout out what type of Scizor it is, normally it is the Choice Banded variant. After the protect, I either switch to Magnezone, or stay in. Depending on the attack he used when I used protect. (Assuming he is choice banded). Gengar not only is amazing at luring out Scizor, he also is a fantastic Special Sweeper! With the given attacks, Gengar isn't stopped by Heatran, or Tyranitar. Things like Metagross don't like it when Hidden Power hits them. Gengar is an amazing Pokemon a long side Magnezone, and I have no intention in taking him out.

Eheheh.. Sorry about the image size, as it is the only human/pokemon is thing i can find... >_>;
Skillet (Magnezone) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 172 HP/84 Spd/252 SAtk
Modest nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Substitute
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Magnet Rise
---
Magnezone<3! I love this guy :D. He is the guy who just completely owns all steels. He kills other steel pokemon LIKE A BOSS. Using him is pretty simple. After Gengar lures out a Scizor, and protects to scout him out, I switch to Skillet to kill. Scizor doesn't stand a chance against a STAB thunder bolt, coming from a base 130. Magnezone is also makes a great switch in to some electric/dark/ ice attacks, as he has some good defensive stats. Substitute and Magnet Rise allow this guy to sweep. Thunder Bolt is for the great STAB, and HP ice is to give Magnezone a pseudo boltbeam combo. I also have no intention on changing him.

Kickthecan (Salamence) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 234 Atk/252 Spd/24 SAtk
Naughty nature (+Atk, -SDef)
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast / Crunch
---
Salamence is amazing, it is so freaking awesome that people call it Uber (I know, I know, It's staying in OU). The Standard Dragon Dance set works wonders. After 1 Dragon dance, My attack stat reaches 600, now isn't that cool? Outrage and Earthquake are the obvious main attacks. I never send this guy out until Scizor / Priority user is gone. So basically, I'm counting on Magnezone and Gengar to get rid of those threats. Scizor HAS to be gone, as a choice banded bullet punch will do about 60% to this guy. Crunch is an alternative option since Rotom-H and Dusknoir tend to switch on this guy.

CaptainFalco(Lucario) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Extremespeed
- Crunch
- Swords Dance
---
Lucario, Lucario...Lucario... It is the 2nd biggest offensive threat for good reason. It is incredibally fun to sweep late-game with this guy. After Salamence took care of most of the stuff, I switch into something like.. well I don't know.. I just switch into something, and either Swords Dance, Extreme speed, or close combat. This guy saved my butt a bunch of times, and it is extremely effective. Sometimes, I can get a swords dance up early, and sweep the opponents entire team :D. Swords dance is pretty standard, as well as Extreme speed, and Close combat. Crunch is just for coverage, and to get those rotom appliances.. and stuff..

Latiass(Latias) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Draco Meteor
- Trick
- Thunderbolt
- Surf
---
Jirachi's Left.. err Right hand man... err.. dragon lady? Anyways, this is my only check for Gyarados, Kingdra ( if rain isn't present) and some of OUs biggest threats. Trick is to cripple those Blissy that just make me RAGE. Draco Meteor is for STAB, and to dent anything that switches in. Thunder bolt takes care of Suicune, Starmie, Gyarados, Tentacruel (sometimes) and many other waters. Surf takes care of Heatran (I think draco meteor will do more) as well as Infernape. Latias backs up Lucario when things get rough (pun intended) and helps a hole lot, when it comes to make switches.







Conclusion / Team issues

In all honesty, the descriptions got shorter as I got more sleepy. Sorry about that~! >_<
I made this team today, hoping to improve my CRE (which is currently in the 1250s). Thanks, and remember to give good rates! Constructive criticism will be appreciated.

I can't really make a safe switch into a thunder wave, so I was considering adding some sort of status absorber, or something. Also, Phazers can cause trouble since I lack a taunter. Heatran isn't that much of a threat to this team since Latias handles both Scarf and Torment Variants pretty well.


Sorry about no threat list, as I'm lazy/tired..

 

[george182]

Hi, you have magnezone support and Earthquake, so I suggest changing your salamence set slightly. into a DD-fake mix mence salamence. Bassically by swapping fireblast for Dracco meteor you can make more use of magnezone, and have a more effective DD mence, which can beat many of its previous counters, while fooling the foe into thinking its a mix mence, making dragon dancing much easier late game. This set can also help lucario out, by drawing in the lucario counters with dragon dance, then taking them out with dracco meteor.

Chainy Chompy Mency (in need of a nickname)(M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 232 Atk/176 Spd/100 SAtk
Naughty nature (+Atk, -SDef)
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage

Now the set the ev's, may seem odd to you, but the basic idea is that mixmence counters arnt very good DD-mence counters, and DD-mence counters are not very good mixmence counters. Also most people will switch a DD-mence counter in first, only to get nailed by a dracco meteor off his base 110 sp.atk.

If you havnt understood the set, the idea is to Dracco meteor first turn, early in the game dealing some massive damdage and trickking the oponent into thinking im a mix mence. This means they won't switch there skarmory/hippowdon in late game fearing strong sp.atks, allowing you to DD up, take them by surprise and sweep with outrage. Earthquake is mearly there for type coverage and steel types like metagross and aggron, it also can help not locking yourself into outrage.

While dracco meteor is mainly there for a bluff, it can also take out/cripple many DD-mence counters without the need to DD up. So here's a list of them with standard ev's:
- Hippowdon
- Porygon 2
- Swampert
- Cresselia (bold 252 defence, after 1 dracco, she will be koed by a DD-outrage late game)
- Gyrados
- Gliscor
- Rhyperior (no sand)
- Suicune
- Donphan
- Weezing
This leaves only bronzong and skarmory, who will fear a mix mence fireblast after seeing dracco meteor (but just incase you have magnezone)

These are all pokes who with an ice/status move would otheriwse ruin a dd-mence sweep as they can take a DD outrage/EQ/fire blast and yes the ultimate mence counter porygon2 is on there, as even he cannot switch in to this amazing mix dd-mence.

While Dracco meteor will draw in these pokemon the second time round, and DD mence can turn them into set fodder and then let oppoent watch in horror as they realise they hav fallen for the bluff and get destroyed:
- Blissey (can take 1 outrage/brick break and counter/ice beam back at a mix mence, but cannot survive a DD max attack outrage)
- Zapdos (after stealth rocks, I think DD-outrage OHKO's, but normal zapdos cant OHKO nyway)
- Cradilly (Owned by a DD outrage, cant OHKO with rock slide)
- Cress (difficult but after a previous dracco meteor, she can be finished off with a DD outrage)
- Tentacruel (OHKOed by a DD earthquake)
- Revenge killers e.g. starmie, gengar, latias - all non scarfed, and scarf magnezone (Dragon dance allows me to outspeed them)

The ev's I bassically squeezed all the ev's I dared to out of atk and speed to get 100 ev's for his sp.atk and the result is suprisingly good, there is little needed the extra speed as he outspeeds the same things, and has no fewer attack ev's than a normal DD-mence.

Bassically, this is like a chain chomp or a nastly plot infernape, except the goal is not to break walls, but to sweep throught them and continue to sweep through the oponent's team. It is a great late game sweeper and also a decent wall breaker. Dracco meteor can also be useful for not locking yourself into outrage, e.g. against an oposing mence/latias or a Hippowdon etc.

I hope you like the fake mix mence set. I think it is perfect for this team as you have magnezone support for skarmory, bronzong and scizor. You have latias to draw in his counters, scout them and help Mence predictions. It will also help draw in and take out physical walls who stop lucario, such as hippowdon, while lucario can draw in and take out porygon2 and cresselia, as then can with some sp.def ev's and a recovery move take this mence down, if you let them stay on full health.

I would also suggest specs magnezone as it can OHKO forrtress and scizor with thunderbolt and is more effective against non steel types, OHKOing celebi with signal beam, swampert with hp grass and tyranitar and dragon friends with flash cannon.

 

[iShedinja]

Hi, you have magnezone support and Earthquake, so I suggest changing your salamence set slightly. into a DD-fake mix mence salamence. Bassically by swapping fireblast for Dracco meteor you can make more use of magnezone, and have a more effective DD mence, which can beat many of its previous counters, while fooling the foe into thinking its a mix mence, making dragon dancing much easier late game. This set can also help lucario out, by drawing in the lucario counters with dragon dance, then taking them out with dracco meteor.

Chainy Chompy Mency (in need of a nickname)(M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 232 Atk/176 Spd/100 SAtk
Naughty nature (+Atk, -SDef)
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage

Now the set the ev's, may seem odd to you, but the basic idea is that mixmence counters arnt very good DD-mence counters, and DD-mence counters are not very good mixmence counters. Also most people will switch a DD-mence counter in first, only to get nailed by a dracco meteor off his base 110 sp.atk.

If you havnt understood the set, the idea is to Dracco meteor first turn, early in the game dealing some massive damdage and trickking the oponent into thinking im a mix mence. This means they won't switch there skarmory/hippowdon in late game fearing strong sp.atks, allowing you to DD up, take them by surprise and sweep with outrage. Earthquake is mearly there for type coverage and steel types like metagross and aggron, it also can help not locking yourself into outrage.

While dracco meteor is mainly there for a bluff, it can also take out/cripple many DD-mence counters without the need to DD up. So here's a list of them with standard ev's:
- Hippowdon
- Porygon 2
- Swampert
- Cresselia (bold 252 defence, after 1 dracco, she will be koed by a DD-outrage late game)
- Gyrados
- Gliscor
- Rhyperior (no sand)
- Suicune
- Donphan
- Weezing
This leaves only bronzong and skarmory, who will fear a mix mence fireblast after seeing dracco meteor (but just incase you have magnezone)

These are all pokes who with an ice/status move would otheriwse ruin a dd-mence sweep as they can take a DD outrage/EQ/fire blast and yes the ultimate mence counter porygon2 is on there, as even he cannot switch in to this amazing mix dd-mence.

While Dracco meteor will draw in these pokemon the second time round, and DD mence can turn them into set fodder and then let oppoent watch in horror as they realise they hav fallen for the bluff and get destroyed:
- Blissey (can take 1 outrage/brick break and counter/ice beam back at a mix mence, but cannot survive a DD max attack outrage)
- Zapdos (after stealth rocks, I think DD-outrage OHKO's, but normal zapdos cant OHKO nyway)
- Cradilly (Owned by a DD outrage, cant OHKO with rock slide)
- Cress (difficult but after a previous dracco meteor, she can be finished off with a DD outrage)
- Tentacruel (OHKOed by a DD earthquake)
- Revenge killers e.g. starmie, gengar, latias - all non scarfed, and scarf magnezone (Dragon dance allows me to outspeed them)

The ev's I bassically squeezed all the ev's I dared to out of atk and speed to get 100 ev's for his sp.atk and the result is suprisingly good, there is little needed the extra speed as he outspeeds the same things, and has no fewer attack ev's than a normal DD-mence.

Bassically, this is like a chain chomp or a nastly plot infernape, except the goal is not to break walls, but to sweep throught them and continue to sweep through the oponent's team. It is a great late game sweeper and also a decent wall breaker. Dracco meteor can also be useful for not locking yourself into outrage, e.g. against an oposing mence/latias or a Hippowdon etc.

I hope you like the fake mix mence set. I think it is perfect for this team as you have magnezone support for skarmory, bronzong and scizor. You have latias to draw in his counters, scout them and help Mence predictions. It will also help draw in and take out physical walls who stop lucario, such as hippowdon, while lucario can draw in and take out porygon2 and cresselia, as then can with some sp.def ev's and a recovery move take this mence down, if you let them stay on full health.

I would also suggest specs magnezone as it can OHKO forrtress and scizor with thunderbolt and is more effective against non steel types, OHKOing celebi with signal beam, swampert with hp grass and tyranitar and dragon friends with flash cannon.

I don't quite understand your evs that much. Is 100 that necessary? And if your taking away from the speed, why not give it a naive nature? It looks interesting. I'll see what the other raters have to say before I come to my conclusion. Also, Magnezone might be dead by the time I send out Salamence, and the point of it is to finish the game with a sweep. With the attacks it already has, practically nothing can defeat it. Skarmory might have a chance of surviving a draco meteor, as does Forretress.

-iShedinja

EDIT: why the hell are you posting this in EVERY SINGLE RMT THREAD? Also, I realized that this set is pointless. Fire blast is a far superior option. Also, 100 sp.atk Evs are pointless if you're only carrying one special attack that LOWERS THE SP.ATK STAT.

 

[george182]

Um did you see the list of pokes that i made, I will bold some of the important advanatges of Dracco meteor:
- Hippowdon
- Porygon 2
- Swampert
- Cresselia (bold 252 defence, after 1 dracco, she will be koed by a DD-outrage late game)
- Gyrados
- Gliscor
- Rhyperior (no sand)
- Suicune
- Donphan
- Weezing

These pokes are all capable of taking on a standard Outrage DD-mence, thats not a few pokemon, thats quite alot of pokemon and they all carry moves to kill/cripple a salmence in one turn, do some damage calculatios if you want, but they can all take a DD life orb max attack Outrage. But with Dracco meteor early game, you are capable of beating them with a DD outrage late game or another dracco meteor late game.

Dracco meteor also scares off pokemon that like to lock you into outrage, such as other dragons, and physical walls like hippowdon and can even take them out, so you don't have to lock yourself into outrage.

You metioned skarm and bronzong, after seeing Dracco meteor they will probably fear fire blast, but you could always change EQ to fire blast and increase the sp.atk ev's if you felt it was nessecery.

the 100 isnt just a random number, its what i could squeeze out of speed and attack, while 2hkoing a gyrados switch in, which can intimidate and take a DD outrage.


Yea Naive could be used, I looked into it, but its the same power vs speed argument as with a normal mence. You don't loose much by dropping the ev's as most scarfed base 100's run a + speed nature, which also outspeeds a naive mence and any slower scarfer will fear that you are faster as most DD-mence are. But if scarfed base 95's are a problem then go naive. You could also use a sp.atk boosting nature i supose and use fire blast, but Earthquake with a DD boost will normally be the superior option. DD Rayquaza in ubers seems happy without all that much speed. But the extra attack isnt needed that much with dracco meteor back up, except for cresselia and cradilly.

But you don't have to use it if you don't want to, i was just argueing that its not just a useless gimmick, fire blast has its advantages over dracco meteor, it allows you to beat an extra 2 pokemon bronzong and skarm (scizor is OHKOed by EQ after a DD and SR), but dracco meteor can help you beat 10 extra pokemon with an early and late game stratergy. Add the fact that magnezone can trap and kill Skarm and bronzong, while none of your member can trap the 10 physical walls, some of whom have reliable reocvery

Dracco meteor also gives you a decent stall breaker and has the advantage of being able to bluff a mixmence set, so the oponent will alow there scarfers to die as they don't see the DD-mence threat and they will be keeping there useless mixmence counters alive.

Well ive done my best to put a good argument forwards, you also seemed confused as to the point of this set so I tried to explain that, but ill not say anymore and its your choice in the end.

 

[iShedinja]

Do you have proof? Damage calculations please. Also, That looks a lot like the Mixed Dancer Smogon set, just with worse EVs.

 

[Smith]

On Lucario, I would go with Ice Punch instead of Crunch. You're ability to hit Gliscor is enhanced and you still hit Gengar and such for good damage.

On Gengar, if you can handle the meddling accuracy of Focus Blast, then by all means go ahead- but I find its poor accuracy crippling. As a replacement, I'd recommend Thunderbolt.

That's it, really. Great team.

 

[george182]

Oh, i didn't see the mix dancer on smogon, well I would got with their ev's then and here are their damage calculatios:

Draco Meteor vs. max HP / min SpD Hippowdon: 82.9 - 97.4%
Draco Meteor vs. max HP / min SpD Zapdos: 75.0 - 88.5% (OHKO with Stealth Rock)
Draco Meteor vs. min HP / SpD Gyarados: 79.8 - 94.3% (OHKO with Stealth Rock)
+1 Outrage vs. 148 HP / max Def Blissey: 100%
+1 Earthquake vs. max HP / min Def Metagross: 93.4 - 100% (92.3% chance to OHKO with Stealth Rock)
+1 Earthquake vs. max HP / min Def Tyranitar: 97.0 - 100% (OHKO with Stealth Rock

I will also wack in your normal Outrage after a dragon dance against a Hippowdon I cba to do the rest of em, they all have roughtly the same defence anyway. Your ev's make 400 atk, then add stab, life orb and +1 atk salamence, vs 420 hp, 368 def (252, 252) hippowdon and it does:

- Between 275 and 323 damage
- Which is 65% - 77% , so thats a survival, can switch in on the DD, then OHKO with 260 atk ice fang/stoned egde or cripple you with roar.

It is a lightly different set and stratergy, there's is to use dracco meteor to sweep, hence they maxed out sp.atk, I was suggesting dracco meteor for a bluff and then DD up late game. But there set looks better so I'd go with theres, either way its much more effective I think in the current metagame with magnezone support. But I think its more effective than a fire blast mence on your team, and can help not lock you into outrage.

 

[iShedinja]

On Lucario, I would go with Ice Punch instead of Crunch. You're ability to hit Gliscor is enhanced and you still hit Gengar and such for good damage.

On Gengar, if you can handle the meddling accuracy of Focus Blast, then by all means go ahead- but I find its poor accuracy crippling. As a replacement, I'd recommend Thunderbolt.

That's it, really. Great team.

I wouldn't chose Thunder bolt on gengar since tyranitar is the all-so-common switch in to it. As for Ice punch on lucario, I don't recommend it either. This is because Latias, and Salamence to an extent, counter Gliscor.(Surf from latias will do a shit load) Thanks for the rate though :)

(I love narwhals)

Oh, i didn't see the mix dancer on smogon, well I would got with ther ev's then and here are there damage calculatios:

Draco Meteor vs. max HP / min SpD Hippowdon: 82.9 - 97.4%
Draco Meteor vs. max HP / min SpD Zapdos: 75.0 - 88.5% (OHKO with Stealth Rock)
Draco Meteor vs. min HP / SpD Gyarados: 79.8 - 94.3% (OHKO with Stealth Rock)
+1 Outrage vs. 148 HP / max Def Blissey: 100%
+1 Earthquake vs. max HP / min Def Metagross: 93.4 - 100% (92.3% chance to OHKO with Stealth Rock)
+1 Earthquake vs. max HP / min Def Tyranitar: 97.0 - 100% (OHKO with Stealth Rock

It is a lightly different set and stratergy, there's is to use dracco meteor to sweep, hence they maxed out sp.atk, I was suggesting dracco meteor for a bluff and then DD up late game. But there set looks better so I'd go with theres, either way its much more effective I think in the current metagame with magnezone support.

Thanks for the calcs. I would just rather stay with my current set, if I may ask.. Why not post a C&C?

 

[DJXO9]

Oh, i didn't see the mix dancer on smogon, well I would got with ther ev's then and here are there damage calculatios:

Draco Meteor vs. max HP / min SpD Hippowdon: 82.9 - 97.4%
Draco Meteor vs. max HP / min SpD Zapdos: 75.0 - 88.5% (OHKO with Stealth Rock)
Draco Meteor vs. min HP / SpD Gyarados: 79.8 - 94.3% (OHKO with Stealth Rock)
+1 Outrage vs. 148 HP / max Def Blissey: 100%
+1 Earthquake vs. max HP / min Def Metagross: 93.4 - 100% (92.3% chance to OHKO with Stealth Rock)
+1 Earthquake vs. max HP / min Def Tyranitar: 97.0 - 100% (OHKO with Stealth Rock

It is a lightly different set and stratergy, there's is to use dracco meteor to sweep, hence they maxed out sp.atk, I was suggesting dracco meteor for a bluff and then DD up late game. But there set looks better so I'd go with theres, either way its much more effective I think in the current metagame with magnezone support.

It doesn't really matter. You can use Draco Meteor to bluff either way and use it to sweep. While the concept of the set is good, I think you're going way overboard on how broken this set is.

 

[joshe]

Put Trick over Thunder Wave on Jirachi. With Trick, you'll be able to get rid of your Scarf (I really don't see the point of getting stuck in a Thunder Wave at all), and hopefully ruin a Pokemon on the opposing team. With something stuck on a move like Waterfall or Earthquake or any move that Lucario and Salamence resist, you'll be able to switch in either of those two easily and proceed to set up or get off a good Earthquake, or Close Combat early game. Skarmory is a common switch-in to Jirachi also, so if you can trick it when it switches in, it's gonna be gone thanks to Magnezone.

I really want you to use a Sub Magnezone with Thunderbolt, HP-Grass, and Explosion. This is much better than your current one in terms of overall preventing things from setting up on Magnezone, and being overall a greater offensive threat. Magnezone can get rid of Swampert now for Salamence, meaning not much will be able to stop it when it sets up. Also change your evs to 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe with a Naive nature, which always allows you to outpace Adamant Scizor (and Skarmory, no speed Metagross, etc...), trap them, and set up or attack accordingly. If something you really want gone like Latias comes in, you'll be able to Explode on them for the ohko, meaning nothing can revenge your Salamence if you play right with Magnezone.

With Magnezone being fully able to trap and get rid of steels (with Jirachi and Latias tricking stuff, even Shed Shell Skarm's and Forry's won't be able to escape), I want you to try Roost and Adamant with the EVs of 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe on Salamence. Again, Magnezone will most likely be able to get rid of Skarmory and Bronzong who are the only two Pokemon that resist Outrage and Earthquake. Scizor is also handled by Magnezone and even Gengar sometimes, and your team is able to get rid of Gliscor and Hippowdon through Latias, Gengar and Magnezone (HP-Grass), meaning Fire Blast is definately not needed. Having Roost gives you a lot of survivability, and a form of recovery which can really pay off if you can get an extra Dragon Dance.

The rest of the team looks solid, just don't let anything like Heatran or Machamp get a sub up. Good Luck.

EDIT: lol sorry, just ignore the first para then, or even change it to scarfrachi if you feel like it :3

 

[iShedinja]

Put Trick over Thunder Wave on Jirachi. With Trick, you'll be able to get rid of your Scarf (I really don't see the point of getting stuck in a Thunder Wave at all), and hopefully ruin a Pokemon on the opposing team. With something stuck on a move like Waterfall or Earthquake or any move that Lucario and Salamence resist, you'll be able to switch in either of those two easily and proceed to set up or get off a good Earthquake, or Close Combat early game. Skarmory is a common switch-in to Jirachi also, so if you can trick it when it switches in, it's gonna be gone thanks to Magnezone.

I really want you to use a Sub Magnezone with Thunderbolt, HP-Grass, and Explosion. This is much better than your current one in terms of overall preventing things from setting up on Magnezone, and being overall a greater offensive threat. Magnezone can get rid of Swampert now for Salamence, meaning not much will be able to stop it when it sets up. Also change your evs to 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe with a Naive nature, which always allows you to outpace Adamant Scizor (and Skarmory, no speed Metagross, etc...), trap them, and set up or attack accordingly. If something you really want gone like Latias comes in, you'll be able to Explode on them for the ohko, meaning nothing can revenge your Salamence if you play right with Magnezone.

With Magnezone being fully able to trap and get rid of steels (with Jirachi and Latias tricking stuff, even Shed Shell Skarm's and Forry's won't be able to escape), I want you to try Roost and Adamant with the EVs of 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe on Salamence. Again, Magnezone will most likely be able to get rid of Skarmory and Bronzong who are the only two Pokemon that resist Outrage and Earthquake. Scizor is also handled by Magnezone and even Gengar sometimes, and your team is able to get rid of Gliscor and Hippowdon through Latias, Gengar and Magnezone (HP-Grass), meaning Fire Blast is definately not needed. Having Roost gives you a lot of survivability, and a form of recovery which can really pay off if you can get an extra Dragon Dance.

The rest of the team looks solid, just don't let anything like Heatran or Machamp get a sub up. Good Luck.

Thank you for the rate! On jirachi, I think you misread.. The item on it is a leftovers. I will be considering changing Magnezone and Salamence. Tbh, I never had a need to use fire blast, and Swampert do Fck me over 80% of the time.

Again, Thanks for the magnificent RMT :)

 

[Flashstorm1]

Hello. I think I've seen you around in #stark, so I figured: Hey, why not come around and give this guy's team a rate?

From what I can see of your team, you seem to have all you bases covered relatively well. I don't see anything that will be giving your team major problems. However, I do spot a weakness to Heatran here, as your only reliable check to it at the moment in Latias. In any normal circumstance, Latias would be a great counter to Heatran, but I'm worried about its lack of recovery and weakness to Pursuit that prevents it from fulfilling that task.

In order to fix your weakness to Heatran, I think that you should replace Choice Scarf Latias with Suicune. I find that Suicune's higher durability, as well as its access to Leftovers and great coverage, will greatly benefit your team. Before, moving on I should probably give you the set: Leftovers, Timid Nature, 172 HP / 120 SpA / 216 Spe, with a moveset of Calm Mind / Surf / Ice Beam / Hidden Power Electric. Anyways, the premise of this set is quite simple. Once you weaken your opponent's team sufficiently, you can set up with this and attempt a sweep. Additionally, Suicune also does a good job of luring out a lot of Lucario's counters, such as Zapdos and Rotom, both of which you can beat after one or two boosts.

In order to maximize Suicune's potential on the team, I think that you should replace Magnet Rise for Explosion on Magnezone. Magnezone does an excellent job of luring out Blissey, so it is definitely worth it to take it out whenever you get the chance to do so, especially if it means that Suicune is likely to sweep the rest of the (stall) team. Suicune itself can beat Steel-types like Magnezone and Bronzong reliably that Magnezone can't without Magnet Rise. Also, definitely go with the EV spread Joshe mentioned. He pretty much nailed it as far as I am concerned.

Another quick nitpick: On Jirachi you state that you switch out of Smeargle to avoid the Spore. However, Jirachi outspeeds it with your current spread, so there is no reason to switch. Just thought I should point that out.

Anyways, good luck with the team, and don't be afraid to look for me on IRC if you have any questions.

 

[animenagai]

You're really heatran weak. Scarfed latias is a poke that gets pursuit killed very easily and with CB scizor and T-tar being so popular, I think it would be quite a common occurrence. Scarfed heatran than proceeds to OHKO eveything you have with fire blast, bar salamence, which is 2HKO'd after SR anyways.

A simple fix would be to use swampert over jirachi. I think this would be a good fit since it would not only take away a fire weak but add a fire resist too. Jira wan't countering much anyways and pert gives you an even better rock resist. You could also think about changing latias in a jolly scarfer with t-punch. It pretty much does the same stuff only it's not pursuit bait. You would have to play around ape a bit more, but you do have the tools to deal with it (flygon and gengar with a bit of prediction).

 

[Megan_Fox]

I agree with Joshe's changes on Magnezone. Thunderbolt, Hp Grass and Explosion are much more effective when when using Magnezone

As for Salamence, i also agree with employing roost but i think Salamence should be Jolly > Adamant. With jolly nature, you are able to speed tie with scarf flygon and scarf jirachi (2 of dd mences biggest checks).

Since most unscarfed rotoms sit at 280 speed in order to outspeed Adamant Lucario, you can also try Stone edge > Crunch. Stone edge enables you to OHKO a Defensive Zapdos and non Rest-talk variants of gyrados after a SD.

Overall nice team, GJ Mori :)

 

[george182]

Ill give your team a proper rate this time, instead of going on about dd-mence:

I would suggest occu berry on lead Jirachi, you do have some major fire weaknesses and occu berry can allow you to get the t-wave off against infernapes and heatrans, so you can then u-turn out while breaking the focus sash. You could also use bodyslam as it breaks a sash, but im not sure if its worth the 60% chance tbh.

Scarf Jirachi and scarf flygon are always jolly, loosing power just to speed tie with them is stupid, as a 50% chance is not worth and you should just switch out. 2nd they are not very good dd-mence checks, Jirachi (without ice punch) rellies on 60% flinch hax and 2 50% speed tie wins and stealth rocks (10% chance, thats not reliable and definately not one of the best DD mence checks). Flygon rellies on a 50% speed tie win and then is locked into outrage after. Scarf latias, scarf gengar, scarf starmie, most physical walls and bronzong are all better mence counters. You can go jolly, but if the reason is to force a speed tie with Jirachi and Flygon then its really not worth it. Jolly lets you beat modest scarf gengar and modest scarf latias, but they are rare anyway.

Now for latias, I would suggest changing it to porygon 2, this gives the team a bit more bulky and can check the same threats that latias is, heatran, salamence, gyrados, jolteon, vaporeon etc. As well as spreading paralysis and providing some bulk and a decent counter to heatran. With that I would change lucario to a more bulky sweeper e.g. curse sp.def swampert or calm mind suicune. This can help your team out against stall teams and provide your team some more bulky, but ive neaver been a fan for all out offence. It also give your team a status absorber.


Yea thats all, oh, how could I forgot, salamence needs dracco meteor over fire blast aswell :)

Joke lol, if lucario does go then there is no need for mence to bait and OHKO hippowdon and gliscor.

 

[iShedinja]

Hello. I think I've seen you around in #stark, so I figured: Hey, why not come around and give this guy's team a rate?

From what I can see of your team, you seem to have all you bases covered relatively well. I don't see anything that will be giving your team major problems. However, I do spot a weakness to Heatran here, as your only reliable check to it at the moment in Latias. In any normal circumstance, Latias would be a great counter to Heatran, but I'm worried about its lack of recovery and weakness to Pursuit that prevents it from fulfilling that task.

In order to fix your weakness to Heatran, I think that you should replace Choice Scarf Latias with Suicune. I find that Suicune's higher durability, as well as its access to Leftovers and great coverage, will greatly benefit your team. Before, moving on I should probably give you the set: Leftovers, Timid Nature, 172 HP / 120 SpA / 216 Spe, with a moveset of Calm Mind / Surf / Ice Beam / Hidden Power Electric. Anyways, the premise of this set is quite simple. Once you weaken your opponent's team sufficiently, you can set up with this and attempt a sweep. Additionally, Suicune also does a good job of luring out a lot of Lucario's counters, such as Zapdos and Rotom, both of which you can beat after one or two boosts.

In order to maximize Suicune's potential on the team, I think that you should replace Magnet Rise for Explosion on Magnezone. Magnezone does an excellent job of luring out Blissey, so it is definitely worth it to take it out whenever you get the chance to do so, especially if it means that Suicune is likely to sweep the rest of the (stall) team. Suicune itself can beat Steel-types like Magnezone and Bronzong reliably that Magnezone can't without Magnet Rise. Also, definitely go with the EV spread Joshe mentioned. He pretty much nailed it as far as I am concerned.

Another quick nitpick: On Jirachi you state that you switch out of Smeargle to avoid the Spore. However, Jirachi outspeeds it with your current spread, so there is no reason to switch. Just thought I should point that out.

Anyways, good luck with the team, and don't be afraid to look for me on IRC if you have any questions.

Thanks for the rate. I have chosen Explosion > Magnet rise already. I do appreciate the Suicune recommendation, and I'll look into that. Thanks for the rate!

You're really heatran weak. Scarfed latias is a poke that gets pursuit killed very easily and with CB scizor and T-tar being so popular, I think it would be quite a common occurrence. Scarfed heatran than proceeds to OHKO eveything you have with fire blast, bar salamence, which is 2HKO'd after SR anyways.

A simple fix would be to use swampert over jirachi. I think this would be a good fit since it would not only take away a fire weak but add a fire resist too. Jira wan't countering much anyways and pert gives you an even better rock resist. You could also think about changing latias in a jolly scarfer with t-punch. It pretty much does the same stuff only it's not pursuit bait. You would have to play around ape a bit more, but you do have the tools to deal with it (flygon and gengar with a bit of prediction).

I have taken note on the heatran weakness, and I will try to fix that. I will test out the Swampert lead, though I'm a bit skeptical using it. I think I'll go with Suicune over Latias, as I don't think Flygon is that necessary.

I agree with Joshe's changes on Magnezone. Thunderbolt, Hp Grass and Explosion are much more effective when when using Magnezone

As for Salamence, i also agree with employing roost but i think Salamence should be Jolly > Adamant. With jolly nature, you are able to speed tie with scarf flygon and scarf jirachi (2 of dd mences biggest checks).

Since most unscarfed rotoms sit at 280 speed in order to outspeed Adamant Lucario, you can also try Stone edge > Crunch. Stone edge enables you to OHKO a Defensive Zapdos and non Rest-talk variants of gyrados after a SD.

Overall nice team, GJ Mori :)

Danke' Near. I'll look into making it a Jolly nature, as it might work. The thing about flygon, is that I can counter it easily with Latias. (Or suicune since that is what I'm changing it to). So I'm not to worried about that. Scarfed Jirachi isn't the most common thing out there and as I said above, Suicune should be able to handle it.

Ill give your team a proper rate this time, instead of going on about dd-mence:

I would suggest occu berry on lead Jirachi, you do have some major fire weaknesses and occu berry can allow you to get the t-wave off against infernapes and heatrans, so you can then u-turn out while breaking the focus sash. You could also use bodyslam as it breaks a sash, but im not sure if its worth the 60% chance tbh.

Scarf Jirachi and scarf flygon are always jolly, loosing power just to speed tie with them is stupid, as a 50% chance is not worth and you should just switch out. 2nd they are not very good dd-mence checks, Jirachi (without ice punch) rellies on 60% flinch hax and 2 50% speed tie wins and stealth rocks (10% chance, thats not reliable and definately not one of the best DD mence checks). Flygon rellies on a 50% speed tie win and then is locked into outrage after. Scarf latias, scarf gengar, scarf starmie, most physical walls and bronzong are all better mence counters. You can go jolly, but if the reason is to force a speed tie with Jirachi and Flygon then its really not worth it. Jolly lets you beat modest scarf gengar and modest scarf latias, but they are rare anyway.

Now for latias, I would suggest changing it to porygon 2, this gives the team a bit more bulky and can check the same threats that latias is, heatran, salamence, gyrados, jolteon, vaporeon etc. As well as spreading paralysis and providing some bulk and a decent counter to heatran. With that I would change lucario to a more bulky sweeper e.g. curse sp.def swampert or calm mind suicune. This can help your team out against stall teams and provide your team some more bulky, but ive neaver been a fan for all out offence. It also give your team a status absorber.


Yea thats all, oh, how could I forgot, salamence needs dracco meteor over fire blast aswell :)

Joke lol, if lucario does go then there is no need for mence to bait and OHKO hippowdon and gliscor.

The thing in bold, just made me LOL. Anyways, if I wanted a bulkier offensive team, I would probably already have swampert in :P. I don't think Porygon 2 isn't neccisarry as it is two slow. Also, I don't think I need it to counter Gyarados since Magnezone can take care of it(Waterfall does about 65% to it, after a dragon dance assuming he is running the standard set). About lucario.. It's job is to sweep late game, and to provide a Priority move to somewhat revenge kill. So if I did add swampert, I'll love the advantage of sweeping.

Thanks for the rate though




Some other problems

-Status users such as Cresselia, and Porygon2 are a pain in the ass. I really have nothing that can switch in on a thunder wave. I was considering a cleric, or something with natural cure. I'd appreciate it if someone can give me suggestions on fixing this :)
-Sub torment heatran is an ass..

 

[FAHKMAN]

As far as status users go, you have a couple options, but I don't know if they'll fit in with the synergy of your team.

The first one would be a RestTalk Machamp instead of lucario, who could also give you a nice way of perhaps dealing with Heatran, as it removes a fire weak. However, Lucario is the 2nd most dangerous Poke for a reason, so I dunno if you'd want to chuck him.

Another option would be to throw Psycho Shift or Refresh on Latias, but the problem there is you cannot really Choice Scarf her then (or can you? That would be an interesting way to disable a status user as well, tricking it and then psycho shifting status onto the scizor/Ttar that comes in. Won't help vs. Paralysis, though.) Anyways, it would require quite the shake-up.