Like a moth to the flame

Hey, Smogon, here again with my first shot at a Gen V RMT, sticking to OU as I am wont to do. I really wanted to build a team around Volcarona since it was one of the first Gen V pokes to really jump out at me way back last fall, and since I recently got a handle on RNG-ing in the new games, I wanted to make a competitive team in-game, so stuff like wishbliss is obviously out. That said, I want to see what you all think of the team, since it's far from finished. As it is now, it appears to me to be a somewhat balanced team, with half focusing on strong offense and half supporting defensively. Here we go!

Teambuilding Process: (I usually don't do these, but here goes)

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I knew I couldn't base a team around Volcarona without, y'know, Volcarona, so in it goes. I decided to use an offensive quiver dance variant so that I could hit really really hard off of just one turn of setup

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Volcarona works its best when it doesn't have to worry about Stealth Rock being up, so I decided to use Tyranitar and Excadrill in tandem to help prevent rocks being up and go with the offensive nature of the team. Additionally, they have some decent type synergy with Volcarona, as it can switch in on both of the Fighting type moves the pair attracts.

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I noticed that the team was getting really water-weak, and Volcarona desperately needed some good support to help combat the detrimental effects of Tyranitar's Sandstream ability, so I decided to add Ferrothorn and Vaporeon, as the former covers Volcarona's Rock and Water weaknesses while supporting with Leech Seed and Spikes, and the latter can pass wishes as well as covering Volcarona's Water and Fire weaknesses. Additionally, the trio of Volcarona, Ferrothorn, and Vaporeon form a nice little F/W/G core.

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At this point I noticed a terrible number of weaknesses to Fighting moves, so I really needed a good check to Fighting types. Dusclops should serve this role admirably, since, with an Eviolite, Dusclops is a really hard nut to crack for most Fighting types, as it can tank hits like a champ while immediately threatening with a burn. I was previously considering Scizor here to add another Dragon resist on top of Ferrothorn, but I felt like it would give me too many Fire weaknesses, and Dusclops can still take two consecutive Draco Meteors from Latios, which is damn impressive for a non-Steel.

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After some advisement I switched Tyranitar for Hippowdon to reduce the number of Ground and Fighting weaknesses, as well as to add a good counter to non-Air Balloon Terrakion, who otherwise is difficult for some of my other team members to deal with.

The Team Itself:

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Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Sand Stream (durr)
Impish 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Roar

Tyranitar was nice, but Hippowdon provides my team with a needed additional defensive supporter, and another way to deal with any Terrakion that aren't packing an [intact] Air Balloon. The moves allow optimal STAB, recovery, team support (in Stealth Rock), and residual damage to the opposition (Roar). Also, if I catch the opponent's best Hippowdon counter on the switch with Roar, I can phaze for a bit and just generally wear the enemy down to support a late-game sweep with either Excadrill or Volcarona. The EVs allow for maximum physical bulk, which is Hippowdon's strong suit, and allows it to take hits from Excadrill, Terrakion, and physical Lucario and Tyranitar the best, and hopefully counter with an Earthquake that hits hard even without investment in Atk.

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Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Sand Rush
Jolly 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin

Another new favorite of mine, I've been wanting to use an SD Excadrill for a while now, and though there is some type overlap between its offense and Volcarona's (Volcarona's Hidden Power is always going to be the same as one of Excadrill's main offensive moves), the two make for a terrifying pair once they've set up, and either can singlehandedly tear through teams once their checks are eliminated. In terms of support, Excadrill's blistering speed under sandstorm and access to Rapid Spin have garnered it great praise: "it's no joke to claim that Excadrill is the best Rapid Spinner that exists" (Rising Dusk, in his awesome analysis). Excadrill has some nice offensive synergy with Volcarona simply from the fact that, due to their sheer power, there is very little that can wall the both of them, so any wall that can take one is likely susceptible to the other (e.g. Chansey/Blissy fall easily to Excadrill, and Skarmory can't fly to its pokeball fast enough when it sees Volcarona).

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Volcarona @ Life Orb / Leftovers
Flame Body
Timid 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Quiver Dance
- Fiery Dance
- Bug Buzz
- HP Ground

The star of the show. I usually leaned toward physical sweepers in Gen IV, what with Blissey's ubiquitous presence in terms of special walling, but really, I couldn't resist something with 135 SpA, 100 Spe, and a move that's effectively Calm Mind with a Speed boost. Life Orb gives Volcarona bone-crushing (or searing) power, but Leftovers negates sandstorm damage, so each has its merits, and I would love advice on that. After advisement, I dropped HP Rock for HP Ground, since it (a) doesn't reduce my Speed IV and (b) doesn't leave me helpless against Terrakion, at least those without Air Balloon, who is a big threat to Volcarona. It's a shame that Volcarona won't be able to do much to flyers that resist Fire, but that's why we have Excadrill, right?

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Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Iron Barbs
Relaxed 252 HP / 48 Def / 208 SpD
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Gyro Ball
- Power Whip

I've started to notice that this team is quickly becoming a who's who of pokemon that look fun to use. Ferrothorn has likely got the most flux in its moveset, since I can't yet tell exactly what support would be best for it to give. There's no doubt that Leech Seed and Power Whip are go, since the healing is always welcome, and a strong STAB Grass move would put the hurt on the bulky waters that are so annoying. I finally decided on Spikes, since Hippowdon has rocks covered, and Gyro Ball over Thunder Wave, since my team's sweepers don't really require paralysis that much to function well, with Excadrill in sand being the fastest thing out there bar priority, and Volcarona being mighty quick after a Quiver Dance.

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Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Water Absorb
Bold 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
- Scald
- Wish
- Protect
- Ice Beam

Wish and Protect offer Vaporeon's most reliable healing outside of Hydration Rest in the rain, which obviously wouldn't make a lick of sense here. Scald is a good STAB move that also supports the team with its chance of burn. Picture it: a Dragonite or a Gyarados switches in, thinking it's going to get a free shot to set up, only to be met with a burn, allowing Volcarona a better shot at setting up and sweeping! Awesome! I'm not entirely sure what to put in the last slot, though. Ice Beam is a common choice for bulky waters, and for good reason, as it hits Grass types hard on the switch-in, as well as tearing through the 4x weak Dragons, as well as Gliscor and Landorus, but of whom otherwise benefit from my Hippowdon's sandstorm. Other options would be either Toxic, which doesn't seem to fit well with the more offensive nature of some of the team, and Heal Bell, which could correct any mispredictions into status moves, but might not generally be all that necessary, since, at least in terms of my sweepers, each is immune to the most common form of the statuses that affect the other the most, since Excadrill is immune to Toxic and Thunder Wave, and Volcarona is immune to burn from the likes of Will-O-Wisp.

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Dusclops @ Eviolite
Pressure
Sassy 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD
- Night Shade
- Pain Split
- Will-O-Wisp
- Disable
IVs: 0 Spe

You may be looking at that 0 Spe IV funny since this is clearly not a Trick Room team, but the general idea behind it is that I want zero chance of outspeeding any Conkeldurr, since its Guts Payback is one of the few really scary ways a Fighting type could threaten my Dusclops, and I was just too lazy to find exactly what IV would do the trick (for all I know, a 31 could work just as well, I should probably have looked into that more). Either way, the 0 Spe IV also serves as a "why not?" semi-check to TR teams, since Dusclops is just so damn slow. Generally, Dusclops is here to tank and spread burn amongst opposing physical attackers (not Conkeldurr!), as well as generally being a solid check to Fighting types that lack particularly strong Dark or Ghost moves. This guy was the last member to be added, so if there's an alternative that strikes you as particularly superior, please feel free to let me know in the comments. The last moveslot comes down to whether I want to annoy and cause switches by removing a single move (Disable), annoy and cause switches via potential self-damage (Confuse Ray), or stall (Toxic). I'm leaning away from Toxic for the same reasons as mentioned in Vaporeon's section, but I can't decide whether I like Disable or Confuse Ray more, though I'm leaning towards Confuse Ray for its possibility of whittling the opponent down better.


I hope this team is at least worth your time to look over, and hopefully you can all think of a thing or two I could do to improve it. I know a lot of the movesets and EVs are standard (read: all of them) but at the moment I'm still trying to get the feel for the new Gen V OU metagame, since the last time I played competitively was in Gen IV. Let me know what you think, and happy summer!
 
Obvious Problems:
- "Dude! Half your team is Fighting weak!"
Ugh I know. Volcarona resists and Dusclops is immune, but I'd like to take away at least one weakness. For that reason, Hippowdon is looking good to set up sandstorm and stealth rocks over tyranitar. Though Mixtar is great, its 4x Fighting weakness could be a problem.

- "Scrafty and Conkeldurr will eff you up."
You are correct, sir, to an extent. If I run Disable on Dusclops, I can burn, Disable SE moves (or Rest on Scrafty) and whittle them down with Night Shade and Pain Split. If I choose Confuse Ray, like I think I will, they could hit themselves for big damage off their more than ample Atk stats. That said, a more solid counter, such as a strong Flying type, wouldn't go amiss. Also, Cofagrigus could be notable for its ability to easily shut down both Scrafty and Conkeldurr by nullifying their abilities and then burning them.

- For that matter, Water types are a similar story, with half my team weak to it. An immunity and a resistance help, but as of right now there's not really much in the way of a hard counter, especially to something like Starmie that, from what I can tell, are often running HP Fire these days, which would take care of Ferrothorn. Maybe just revenge kill with Excadrill?

- Let me know of any others in the comments!
 
hey man, it looks a really nice team and Volcarona certainly looks dangerous. Clearly you have some slight trouble with those nasty Fighting types that are everywhere this gen. The main problems are something like BU Scrafty which can happily stall you out I guess especially with Shed Skin to get rid of Burn. I also don't like that you are slightly weak to Specially defensive Heatran with Toxic. Tyranitar cannot touch it. Excadrill cannot really switch in, and Toxic hurts Volcarona, Vaporeon and Dusclops pretty bad.

Unfortunately the only real solution I can see is if you run Hippowdon over Tyrantiar. You still keep Stealth Rock but you also have a much easier time against opposing physical sweepers such as BU Scrafty. I would also consider HP Ground on Volcarona as you better check Terrakion I guess (as well as Heatran) while the Dragons should be handled by a combination of Hippowdon, Dusclops and Vaporeon.

You don't look that water weak although HP Fire Rotom W or HP Fire Starmie could cause slight problems. They are pretty rare though (at least in my experience) although you could try out a Rotom W of your own over Vaporeon if you were really worried. Latias also works to an extent too I guess.

Quick Changes
-Hippowdon over Tyrantiar
-HP Ground on Volcarona

Hope I helped
 
Vaporeon + Duskops = Jellicent + an extra slot on your team

I know it’s a bit naive to just lump them together and say, “now you have a Jellicent,” but looking at your team, your using those 2 for more of synergy rather then support, so I don’t see why you wouldn’t use a Jellicent over both of them, so you can get an extra slot, unless there is some other benifit I am not alluded to.
 
@ginjaninja: That's what I thought. At this point I know that 3 of Hippowdon's moves would be EQ, SR, and Slack Off, but I can't decide between Ice Fang and Roar for the last slot and I can't decide between being physically or specially bulky. Thoughts?

@scarfwynaut: At first glance I'd agree with you, and I considered Jellicent, but I consciously chose Vaporeon over it for its access to Wish, which allows me to heal Volcarona somewhat reliably, as Vape can Wish and Volcarona can switch into, say, the incoming Grass move and get a nice heal. Additionally, Jellicent's raw bulk as a Ghost is just incomparable to Dusclops', so Dusclops will be an overall more reliable wall, despite lacking the nice resistances afforded by having the Water type. However, if I were to replace the pair with Jellicent, what set might you suggest? And what might you suggest I include as the sixth team member?
 
Tyranitar, Excadrill, and Ferrothorn are all weak to ground types. I think that Tyranitar and Ferrothorn can withstand a couple of unboosted EQs from some weaker but thats still half of your team, and you have nothing that is immune to switch into them.
 
@Mode2Xplode: Actually Ferrothorn's Grass type evens out Steel's Ground weakness, but I see what you mean about Ttar and Exca, which is part of why I'm liking Hippowdon to replace Ttar.

To everyone: any thoughts on move selection in indefinite slots?
 
Right, sorry.

Ferrothorn should be running Spikes over Stealth Rock. Leech/Spikes/Gyro/Power is a pretty solid set although you could run Protect over Gyro Ball to basically be more of a bitch with Leech Seed.

Disable on Dusclops

Hippowdon should be physically defensive, the better to take on those fighters. Regarding Ice Fang or Roar on Hippowdon I would prefer Roar so you can better handle set up sweepers. However, I guess you could could drop Roar for Ice Fang and then run Roar on Vaporeon. Basically the idea here being that with you running Spikes and having a spinblocker in Dusclops, having Roar on at least one of your pokemon can really hurt your opponent with your hazards and thus help Volcarona even more.
 
The only change that I have to offer this good team is that you should be running max Sp.Def. With Sassy 252 HP, 4 Def, and 252 Sp.Def, Tyranitar can live 2 of Specs Latios's Surfs in the sand iirc.
A word of caution though: be wary of how you play with Dusclops and Vaporeon because once they are gone, your team can be swept by an Air Balloon/Scarf Terrakion as well as other Fighting-types and then anything else that can take out Volcarona. Also with Volcarona, HP Ground would be the way to go, because you can hit many threats like non-Air Balloon Terrakion, Heatran, etc. A way to change this "sweeping corner" your in with Terrakion would be to change Tyranitar's item to the Chople Berry instead of Leftovers. This is great for being able to take a hit and then use the appropriate move to take out a threat!
Again, good team!
I hope this helped!~
 
Okay, so what it's looking like to me is that I'll be running this over Tyranitar:
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Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Impish 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Roar

Though I can acknowledge that Ice Fang would be really solid in the last slot for countering Dragons as well as Gliscor and Landorus. This way Vaporeon can keep Ice Beam, however.

Also, I think I've decided on Disable on Dusclops and this moveset on Ferrothorn:
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Gyro Ball
- Power Whip
It's pretty basic, and not as defensive as a lot of other sets, i.e. ones that run Protect, but it helps keep offensive momentum to an extent, and really helps combat faster threats that don't resist Steel (i.e. Archeops, Aerodactyl, boosted Dragonite lacking Fire Blast, though it's rare). On a personal preference level, I'm also just a bit excited to use a really bulky Grass type, since I haven't tended to use may Grasses in the past, usually just Breloom and Shaymin.
 
Bump. I've updated the team with the suggested Hippowdon, and would love to see what the community thinks of the updated team model.
 
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