ORAS OU Mega Heracross Bulky Offence (Peaked 1734)

Pigeons

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Hi Smogon, I'm Yuga42 and I have a team that I'd like to get rated. A little of my background in competitive, I got into competitive playing VGC, however with 2016's rules in place I decided to branch out to other tiers (too much Smeargle/speed ties), and I decided I'd give OU a shot. I've really enjoyed it, it's a very different format compared to what I'm used to but it's very diverse and there's a lot of room for innovation.


Proof of peak
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The Team At First Glance
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kyurem-black.gif
metagross.gif
landorus-therian.gif
latios.gif
raikou.gif



Teambuilding Process
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I started with a core of Mega Heracross and Kyurem-B, the two easily dismantle bulky cores and cover each other's defensive checks quite nicely and I felt it was generally a strong pick for the metagame.

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Heracross and Kyurem were outsped and 1HKOd by Latis and both shared a weakness to fairy-types, so I added Assault Vest Metagross to cover that weakness.

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I was noticing a pretty big weakness to Charizard-X and Talonflame, I still needed a Stealth Rock setter so I added Landorus-T in the next spot to remedy that.

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I needed a hazard remover, and the team looked fairly weak to Keldeo and was generally quite slow as it was, so I added Latios next.

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To round things off, I thought electrics like Mega Manectric or Nasty Plot Thundurus would be hard to beat, and the team was still rather slow, so I added Raikou in the last spot to round out the team.

In-Depth

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Heracross-Mega @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Close Combat
- Pin Missile
- Rock Blast

Wallbreaker #1, Substitute Mega Heracross can single handedly bring down many stall teams and threatens many balanced builds as well, not to mention it still can be useful against more offence oriented teams.

Substitute renders Heracross immune to status, intimidate and takes advantage of the many switches it forces. With a Sub up, Heracross is almost impossible to stop for stall teams because many don't have enough power to break Hera's sub without being 2HKO'd in the process. Close Combat is a hard-hitting STAB that deals with Chansey and Ferrothorn in one shot and can also score a 2HKO on Skarmory after rocks. Pin Missile is a second STAB attack that has the added advantage of KOing opponents through sash, so Weavile and Bisharp aren't safe even if they're running it. It 2HKOs Mega Sableye and Quagsire on bulky teams, and against offence it can be used freely against TankChomp because it doesn't make contact. Rock Blast rounds out the set's coverage, being able to KO birds on the switch and also do a decent amount of damage to fairies like Clefable.

I've been hearing a lot of hype around a bulkier spread for MegaCross, but I always found it more useful to outspeed and KO things like Bisharp or Breloom outright instead of relying on tanking a hit first. This spread has worked fine for me and I've never really wished for more bulk during a match.​


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Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 12 Atk / 244 SpA / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Fusion Bolt
- Roost
Wallbreaker #2, Kyurem-B takes on many of the Pokemon that can stand Heracross's attacks, mainly things like Landorus-T, Hippowdon and Skarmory while being able to last throughout the match thanks to reliable recovery and good bulk.

Ice Beam is Kyurem's STAB of choice, dealing with all the bulky ground-types that would hinder a sweep by Heracross in one hit, and is also Kyurem's safest option for breaking past Skarmory (Counter can mess Kyurem up and both Ice Beam and Fusion Bolt 2HKO). Earth Power has great coverage with Ice Beam, it deals with many of the steel types that would tank an Ice Beam and also hits Rotom-Wash through Levitate thanks to Teravolt, though it doesn't quite manage a 1HKO there. Fusion Bolt breaks past bulky water types with little issue and also gets a nice hit on flying types that aren't hit by Ice Beam such as Talonflame or Gyarados. Kyurem's three attacks are all it needs for offensive coverage most of the time, so I added Roost in the last slot to help Kyurem last through the whole game and mitigate the effects of Life Orb recoil and hazards.

Max speed is run to outspeed positive natured base 80s and tie with opposing speed neutral natured Kyurems, while the 12 EVs in attack guarantee that Fusion Bolt will 1HKO Manaphy after rocks, and the rest is put into Special Attack to buff the power of Kyurem's Ice Beam.



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Metagross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Atk / 96 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Pursuit
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Zen Headbutt

Easily my favourite Lati check currently, AV Metagross switches into anything the twins can throw at it and traps them with Pursuit. Metagross is also a great check to fairies thanks to it's typing and great bulk when holding an Assault Vest.

Pursuit is the move that makes Metagross such an effective Psychic check, forcing them to stay in and take an attack or switch out and risk being KOd by Pursuit. Pursuit isn't just limited to trapping Psychics or other Pokemon weak to it, it's also useful for chipping foes that are switching out because of fear of another of Metagross's moves so that the Pokemon can be more easily revenge killed later. Meteor Mash is Metagross's primary STAB move, having good neutral coverage on most of the metagame and hitting fairly hard of Metagross's high attack. The reduced accuracy is very unfortunate at times, but the potential attack boost is very nice compensation. Bullet Punch picks off weakened Pokemon such as Gengar or Latis and sort of makes up for Metagross's poor speed stat, though the power is underwhelming in most cases. Zen Headbutt is the last move on the set, it hits Keldeo for decent damage and gets neutral coverage on things like Talonflame that resist Meteor Mash. I have been trying out Earthquake in this spot but I never seem to end up using it as much as Zen Headbutt, as it was only ever used to try and hit Heatrans on the switch.

The EV spread ensures that Metagross will live 2 Shadow Balls from Mega Alakazam after rocks, with the remaining EVs being put into attack to get as much damage as possible.


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Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 28 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock

Generally a good check to physical attackers, Landorus provides rocks for the team while preventing fast threats like Excadrill and Talonflame from sweeping through the team, not to mention its decent pivoting abilities thanks to U-turn.

Earthquake allows Landorus to be somewhat threatening to Pokemon it can't hit for supereffective damage thanks to STAB and a high base attack, and naturally is able to 1HKO all Heatran bar Shuca varients. Stone Edge compliments Earthquake well in terms of coverage and lets Landorus not be setup bait for Talonflame or Mega Pinsir. U-turn is great for grabbing momentum from switches that Landorus can force, and also is valuable to get other Pokemon in safely thanks to Landorus's relatively low speed. Stealth Rock completes the set and supports the team extremely well, many KOs this team can get depend on whether or not Stealth Rocks are up (such as the previously mentioned potential 2HKO by Heracross onto Skarmory or the 1HKO by Kyurem-B onto Manaphy). Stealth Rocks are also important for pressuring Charizard-X and the less common Volcarona, both of which put immense pressure on this team when set up, so being able to strip it of half its health whenever it switches in can save me a match.

The EV spread allows Landorus to outspeed Modest Magnezone and tank one Hidden Power Ice from Pokemon like Manectric or Raikou, with the remaining EVs being placed into defence to cover physical attackers like Excadrill or Charizard-X.


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Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Roost
- Defog

My hazard remover of choice and generally strong special attacker, Latios provides the team with much needed control over the hazard game and is a strong Pokemon regardless, being able to check threatening special attackers such as Keldeo and Charizard-Y thanks to it's typing, decent special defence and reliable recovery.

Draco Meteor is Latio's strongest STAB attack and can deter Pokemon like Bisharp and Tyranitar from switching in hastily thanks to it's insane raw power. The special attack drop however, makes Latios much more prone to being either Pursuit trapped or set up on, so it shouldn't be used excessively in the presence of dangerous setup sweepers. Psyshock is Latios's other STAB that threatens the likes of Keldeo, and Pokemon that are generally more specially bulky (Assault Vest users in particular). Roost keeps Latios healthy and is important to help Latios repeatedly check Keldeo or other threats throughout a match. Defog clears hazards away from both sides of the fields, losing my own rocks can be annoying but it's generally worth it as the team is worn down quite quickly by hazards due to lack of Pokemon resistant to Spikes and the fact that many of them lack reliable recovery.

Latios should only really be investing in speed and offence, and this set is no exception. By maximizing these stats, Latios becomes a very threatening offensive presence in addition to a valuable team supporter.


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Raikou @ Assault Vest
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Shadow Ball

The last Pokemon on the team, Assault Vest Raikou provides useful pivoting abilities thanks to Volt Switch and provides coverage against a wide variety of attackers thanks to its good speed tier, bulk thanks to Assault Vest and special attack.

Thunderbolt is a solid power electric attack, so it covers many of the water types that can be annoying to the team without forcing Raikou to switch out, but often these Pokemon switch out against Raikou and I end up using Volt Switch regardless. Thunderbolt is still a very valuable slot, the added power is key against bulkier attackers like Manaphy or Charizard-Y. Volt Switch is key to Raikou's pivoting abilities and nets a lot of momentum in most matches, though ground types being immune to it sucks. Volt Switch also does everything U-turn does in terms of getting Pokemon in safely and all that good stuff. HP Ice hits ground types that would block Volt Switch, but in reality it doesn't do much to anything that isn't 4x weak to it (Hippowdon especially). Shadow Ball was my move of choice for the last slot to hit Latios and Medicham with, the special defence drop can come in handy from time to time as well.

The EV spread didn't need to be complicated so I kept it as such, max speed to tie with opposing Starmie and outspeed things like Latis and Thundurus and max special attack to do as much damage as possible.


Threats

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Mega Medicham is probably the biggest threat to the team if it has Ice Punch, at least in my experience. Nothing can switch in at all, Metagross can endure 1 attack and can hit back with Meteor Mash, Latios and Raikou both outspeed it but neither can switch in, and Latios is extremely prone to being trapped by Bisharp, who often accompanies Medicham.

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Scizor may not be able to easily sweep large portions of the team effortlessly, but it takes minimal damage from most of the team, so if it has Roost it can freely set up with SD in many cases. Landorus can ship it with EQ+Rocky Helmet but isn't all that useful if it has Roost, Raikou can take most of its attacks quite well but can't do more than 50% with any move, Heracross can do over 50% with Close Combat but takes quite a bit of damage in the process and struggles to take Scizor's attacks after a few defence drops. I would like to fit fire coverage onto the team somehow to lure it but I'm not sure where to put it.

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This thing is always annoying no matter what I do. It outspeeds the entire team so I have to rely on tanking a hit from it then KOing. Heracross and Metagross can both do this, but can't switch in multiple times so I often am forced to sack things to get them in safely. Landorus can take a few hits if its only attacks are its STAB moves, but if it has Ice Punch (which it usually does) Landorus just loses.

Importable
Heracross-Mega @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Close Combat
- Pin Missile
- Rock Blast

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 12 Atk / 244 SpA / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Fusion Bolt
- Roost

Metagross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 160 Atk / 100 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Pursuit
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Earthquake

Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 29 Spe
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Roost
- Defog

Raikou @ Assault Vest
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Shadow Ball

Replays

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-371249113
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-371256845
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-371271473
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-371269731
(I don't tend to save many so there's not much lol)


So that's the team. I'm pretty happy with it considering it's my first build, I feel like it's pretty solid overall given I got to 1700 with it, and I feel that the fact that I haven't gotten much higher has mostly been due to misplays on my part instead of massive weaknesses in the team. Of course the team does have weaknesses, otherwise I wouldn't post it. Thank you to anyone who took the time to read this and any suggestions or criticisms are much appreciated, I'm willing to change whatever I need to make the team as good as it can be.​
 
This team looks pretty good, honestly, I don't have too many things to say. One of the main problems with it though is a weakness to Fairies, given that you have 3 Pokemon weak to it to it. yes, you do have Metagross, but you can't entirely rely on it to check fairies, especially if you also need it to trap Latis, meaning any team with both a Lati and a Fairy will inherently be pretty difficult to beat. Clefable in particular just plain wins if Metagross goes down. The best way I can think of to deal with this problem is by replacing Raikou for Talonflame. I don't think Raikou is entirely necessary for your team, you already have 3 Electric resists so you aren't exactly weak to those, and though it provides VoltTurn support, I think you would benefit more from Talonfalme's ability to handle fairies outside of Diancie (which you defenitely need to be careful about, there's no too much you can do to be less weak to it), as well as check all 3 of the threats you mentioned + other stuff like Serperior and Weavile which, even though you aren't too weak to them, can still be pretty annoying to handle.

Another option would be Heatran, its advantage being that it can check Diancie if it runs an Air Balloon (though Diamond Storm still deals a ton of damage so beware), and deal with opposing Heatran, which you seem pretty weak to. Being able to set up SR gives Landorus-T the option to run a Scarf or Dual Dance set too, which is nice. However, it doesn't help you vs Lopunny or Medicham, makes you even weaker to Keldeo, and having 4 only one fast Pokemon on an bulky offensive team strikes me as a bad idea (that being said, you can run Scarf, though it can't really beat Clefable as a result)

If you want to keep Raikou, I would highly recommend running Specs over AV : not only does this let it 2HKO Clefable, it also helps it deal with Scizor way better, deal more damage to Heatran, and just hit harder in general, which helps a lot vs the likes of Diancie and Mega Gardevoir. If you're still having trouble vs Scizor or Heatran, you could run a coverage move on Latios (HP Fire or Earthquake respectively), however I'd advise against that, since your team ends up being very weak to Keldeo as a result of not being able to switch into it consistently.

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Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Roost

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Heatran @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Magma Storm / Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Flash Cannon / Hidden Power [Ice] / Stealth Rock
- Taunt

Heatran @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Earth Power
- Flash Cannon
- Stone Edge

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Raikou @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Shadow Ball
 
Thanks for the rate! I'll definitely give your suggestions a shot, Talonflame looks pretty promising and Heatran could be decent as well. You're right about the team not being overly weak to electrics, the reason I was worried was the team initially had Starmie instead of Latios, but after I changed that the problem did go away. Mega Diancie being a problem hadn't occurred to me but you're right about it being a pain, I guess I never really ran into Mega Diancie on the ladder :/ Thanks again for the rate, I really appreciate it!
 
Yo! First off let me say I think this team looks fairly solid already. Main weaknesses I would note all have to do with how slow the team is: stuff like Serperior, Weavile, and fast megas / wallbreakers can be tough to deal with. Bulky waters are also annoying since Raikou and Kyu-B are your main ways of breaking them but don't enjoy switching in. Yeah having only 2 mons at 110 or higher is often gonna leave you pretty susceptible to stuff. I also think that Mega Scizor is a pretty big problem: it sets up on everything except Heracross to be honest. Heatran is kind of an issue too - nothing really wants to switch in.

My first proposed change is to remove Kyurem-Black. While it's a nice wallbreaker, its honestly not supporting the rest of the team all too well and seems like it's creating more weaknesses and restrictions to me. Stacking a fairy and steel weakness, not offering a lot of speed and not helping with Clefable at all either.

I agree with Albacore that a Talonflame could be extremely useful here; it alleviates a lot of your speed problems and gives you a win condition against offensive teams. I think an offensive SD + Wisp set would be very nice since it can lure some of Heracross' checks like Lando-T allowing you freer subs. It also lures Tyranitar which quite frankly is an issue for both Latios and Raikou.

Alright so I think that helps with offense a good deal but the teams still quite weak to bulky water types, and also Heatran is a big problem to switch into. First thing I think you can do is put Thunderbolt on Latios over Psyshock. You already have Heracross, Talonflame and Metagross to an extent to deal with bulky Grass/Poison types, and Tbolt helps with fat waters while still hitting Keldeo and Torn-T, and hits Heatran for neutral damage.

My next recommendation is to run either Calm Mind or Specs on Raikou. I really think AV Raikou is quite poor in this metagame and it is not really helping a ton besides taking Scald a bit better. These choices also let you wear down Heatrans better and break CM bulky waters far more reliably. I think CM Raikou probably makes a bit more sense since being choice locked could prove problematic for you. Leftovers' passive recovery help with longevity anyway even when you drop the Assault Vest.

My last suggestion is to change your Heracross spread. Don't know if you have heard but there's been an increasing popularity in bulky Mega Hera, it subs up on things more easily and you can afford to run Adamant Nature to 2HKO Clefable a good majority of the time with Rock Blast. Given that Talonflame boosts the teams speed up, cutting some out for bulk on Hera seems fine. The spread is 240 HP / 136 Atk / 132 Spe

I'll be honest these changes didn't really fix the Heatran weakness, so another thing you can try is Starmie over Latios. Defensive Starmie is wack but you can run LO Spin with Recover. This opens some other holes (Zard Y) but also checks additional things (Diancie). Not an official suggestion but I think it can't hurt to try out.

Heracross @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 240 HP / 136 Atk / 132 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Pin Missile
- Rock Blast
- Substitute

Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Will-O-Wisp / Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Roost

Raikou @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power Ice
- Volt Switch

OR

Raikou @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power Ice
- Shadow Ball

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Thunderbolt
- Recover
- Defog

OR

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Hydro Pump / Scald
- Thunderbolt
- Recover

Personally when I rate unofficially this is probably closer to the format I use. A bunch of suggestions rather than just one clear cut choice. I feel that rating is a two way street and the important part is giving a threat analysis and your thought process on how to fix things. I prefer to brainstorm multiple things as it can give more ideas. That way, even if you don't use my exact suggestions, its possible you might have some takeaways anyway. Hope this was helpful
 
Hey man, your team doesn't really capitalize on Heracross' breaking potential. With it you invite in bulky walls like Lando-T which will get worn down by the reapeted hits from Hera. You should focus on exploiting weakened walls, with a physical sweeper for example. I like the changes bludz suggested, but I'll go a slightly different route.
First of all I see that your mons are walled by bulkier grounds like Hippowdon. Although you have Latios to pivot into them, it is susceptible of getting pursuited and then your team just collapses because of Keldeo and Volcanion.
Also it's a cool idea to run pursuit trapper Metagross in combination with Heracross and Kyurem, however the team struggles to find switchins to Heatran and Talonflame, they will just burn Landorus and Raikou so both will be worn down pretty fast.
With Slowking>Metagross you will be able to improve your matchup vs Heatran, Talonflame, Tornadus-T, Keldeo and Volcanion significantly, while adding a Fighting resist. Not only you will you still have a switchin for waters if Lati gets pursuited, it can also run speed control in Twave or act as a wincon with CM. It can still switch into Diancie and Timid M-Gardevoir and can deal with Clefable if you run Psyshock doing what Metagross did. A Nasty Plot set is also an option to boost faster than cm users and pressure teams with +2 Scald or Psyshock.
With the bulk Slowking provides for the team, you should use Scarf Lando-T > def. Lando. Heracross will break physical walls which Lando can clean up later in the game. This also adds needed speed to the team.
With the loss of a steel type a Stealth Rocker and an answer to Latios is needed which can deal with Serperior, I recommend Heatran>Raikou. As I said earlier your opponents can switch into their ground type on your Raikou, inviting Lati in which leaves it vulnerable to being trapped or just worn down by burns. Doubling into Kyurem is not only dangerous but Stealth Rock weakness wil prevent you from doing that too often. Heatran in combination with Slowking can handle Talonflame well which is important for Heracross.
If you run bulky hera you should run it with 136 Evs speed so you outspeed modest Volcanion.
land (Landorus-Therian) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
- Knock Of

tr (Heatran) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power

Slowking @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 184 Def / 76 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Slack Off
- Psyshock
- Scald
- Thunder Wave/Nasty Plot/Calm Mind
 
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