Misplaced Stratagem (a full-on Sand-Stall Team)

[Game Freak201]

This team is an attempt by me in order to try out stall since it's a team archetype I typically do not use. Of course, it has to be during the early stages of BW2 metagame with all the offensive pressures that came with it. I do get some wins with it, but some inherent problems with the team that I'm not sure of how to solve still cost me quite the number of matches.

Misplaced Strategem

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Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 64 SAtk / 192 SDef
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Dragon Tail
- Ice Beam
- Fire Blast​

He brings up the sand and rocks, the vital residual damage I need to even hope to stand a chance at winning. I went with the special defensive set since the only other specially defensive Pokemon I have on this team are Jellicent and Jirachi. In addition, he can also act as a lure for the likes of Gliscor and Skarmory, OHKOing the grounded bat and 2HKOing the steel bird; thus, making Gliscor's life much easier. Dragon Tail, on the other hand, helps prevents bad match-ups from occuring, deals with none sub-based boosters, and helps rack on hazard damage. The sandstorm helps Tyranitar tank special hits, especially the fire-typed moves which get directed toward Skarmory and Jirachi, and disrupts opposing teams who are too dependent on their weather.

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spd
Impish Nature
- Substitute
- Roost
- Toxic
- Earthquake​

Behold everyone's favorite stall and offense breaker. SubRoost Gliscor can be very annoying to the physical Pokemon who don't have a way around this thing, namel having access to an ice move or being a Banded Scizor using BP. He's my switch-in to fighting and ground type moves. And if those resisted moves are choiced, I get a free turn to harass my opponent whether it's by setting up a Sub or by poisoning the switch-in. Being a status absorber, especially to Breloom's spre, doesn't hurt his utility either.

Jellicent @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Def / 220 SDef
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Shadow Ball​

By being the bulky water and spin blocker, the Pringles man has quite the role to take on this team. He sponges the fire attacks which Jirachi can't handle and serves as the front-line to Pokemon attempting to remove my hard-earned hazards. The likes of Forretress and Tentacruel have no chance in getting past this moist ghost. Meanwhile, Starmie hates Shadow Ball just as much as Jellicent hates Thunder or Thunderbolt. The only thing is that Jellicents tend to be bulkier than their starfish relatives. Scald and Toxic are there to help spread status while Recovery is to help its longevity.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Body Slam
- Iron Head
- U-turn​

If you don't like Gliscor, then you may like this star. This little hunk of steel serves to be useful since it can sponge the Grass attacks which neither Tyranitar nor Jellicent would ever want to handle as well as shrugging off even the likes of Draco Meteors coming from the Lati twins. Once Jirachi comes in, he can proceed to get his hax on by attempting to paralzye a switch-in or just scout with U-turn. Iron Head is there for Paraflinching or if I use Jirachi to get a Choice Scarf Tricked onto it. Wish is also worth noting in that it can breath a second life onto whoever can switch in after the pixie from beyond the stars entreats with the heavens.

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spd
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Spikes
- Whirlwind
- Brave Bird​

If Jirachi was there to tank special Dragon-type moves, then Skarmory is there to take on their more physical bretheren. Spikes is there to help my stalling endeavors while Whirlwind is for PHazing. Meanwhile, Brave Bird is there to decimate opposing fighting types as well as Pokemon within KO range without investing in attack.

Latios @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Dragon Pulse
- Surf
- Calm Mind
- Recover​

And here is the cleaner for this team. Dragon Pulse and Surf gives good coverage while Calm Mind bolster the power to more desired levels. Leftovers is a must if I don't want Latios dieing too soon to the raging sand storm while Recover is there to bolster the Eon dragon's longevity even further should he find something he can set-up on.

When it comes to the Pokemon being the weakest link, it tends to be Latios since he can't really take much hits. So he has to either come after one of my Pokemon faints or I have to pass him a wish using Jirachi. It made me think of using some other kind of sweeper which can take hits better such as a defensive version of Latias or CM Reinculus. The lack of Rapid Spin also hurts some of my Pokemon in potentially game-deciding ways, but I don't really have room for it unless I replace Latios with Starmie which would make me too Electric weak while Forretress just doesn't do the role that Skarmory does for me.

Good, constructive rates will be greatly appreciated.

 

[Episode36]

I like the idea of sand-stall, but I'm unsure how this team handles sun teams? Many sun teams carry Dugtrio, who basically owns Tyranitar either on the switch or double switch. Even if they don't, something as common as Victreebel kills your whole team, especially if the sun is up and your Tyranitar is down. Winning the weather war is vital to this team, yet I don't see many Pokemon/moves/strategies to help you do that. I'm just curious how you see yourself winning against sun teams when two of your Pokemon are weak to grass, two are weak to ice, and two are weak to fire, all three move types being staples on drought-based teams, let alone among other less weather dependent teams. I'm not great at suggestions, but you might consider Chansey or something over Jirachi, to reduce your weakness to sun teams. If you want Chansey to fulfill the same role, you can use a moveset of Wish/Protect/Thunder Wave/whatever you want (seismic toss?). Also consider Blissey, as Blissey is generally better on sand based teams due to leftovers recovery.

I also see problems with other stall based teams, particularly rain stall. First, you have no spinner. You might consider replacing Skarmory with Forretress or something to help remedy that. Forretress fulfills basically the same role as well as giving you a much needed rapid spinner. While Stealth Rock and Spikes aren't too debilitating to your team due to wish support and recovery moves, something as easy as even one layer of Toxic Spikes really ruins your chance to use Jellicent, and also hinders Tyranitar in winning that crucial weather war that weather based stall teams really really want to win.

Hopefully someone can come in with some better suggestions, because I do like sand stall, I just don't know enough about it to offer truly great changes. You are pretty weak to sun teams and opposing stall teams, though.

 

[Shining_Latios]

Hello there and nice team you have here.

As you stated, Latios does seem to be the weak link of the team. I suggest changing him to a Choice Band Terrakion.

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Terrakion @ Choice Band
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Attack / 252 Speed
Jolly Nature
Moves:
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- X-Scissor
- Quick Attack

Terrakion is a great cleaner and addition to your team. Terrakion resists Stealth Rock and is immune to Sandstorm, while also hitting opponent's hard. Nothing appreciates a Choice Banded Close Combat or Stone Edge on the switch, making Terrakion one of the best Choice Banders in the game. X-Scissor nails psychic-type switchins such as Latias and Slowbro. Quick Attack, although weak, adds some form of priority to your team, and helps pick off faster, but weakened, Pokemon. Terrakion does add another Water weakness to your team, though, which is a issue as rain teams can capitalize on that. For this reason, I suggest changing your Skarmory into Ferrothorn.

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Ferrothorn @ Shed Shell
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Defense /168 Special Defense
Relaxed Nature
Moves:
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Protect

In my opinion, Ferrothorn helps your team out a lot. Ferrothorn has the same capability of putting Spikes up like Skarmory, while still being able to take physical Dragon-type attacks very well. The resistance to Water helps your team out a bunch as a water resistance and a threat to rain teams. Shed Shell over Leech Seed so Magnezone's don't trap and KO you. That's where Leech Seed is used, as a recovery move for Ferrothorn. Protect is mainly for Leech Seed recover, but can also help you in scouting your opponent's moveset. Power Whip is a STAB that helps hits opposing water-types super effectively. Thunder Wave isn't needed because your going to be grabbing paralysis all over the place with Jirachi's Body Slam. Also, Ferrothorn and Jellicent are great teammates for a defensive core, resisting every attacking type in the game together, bar Flying and Ground.

Hope I helped.

 

[Superpowerdude]

Damn it I hade a beutiful full rate for this and the my fucking web browser stopped working :( I am so annoyed! I will rate this team later when i get the time

Edit: there is really no point giving this team the rate i was going to give it seeing as the team has changed significantly but the new versio seems solid anyway and covers the weaknesses i was going to poit out luvdisced

 

[Bryce]

Nice Sand stall team.Like you stated Latios is the weakest link since it can't take hits well.Therefore,I suggest you change it to a similar but more bulky sweeper of CM Latias.Latias as well as being a cleaner can act as a valuable member in your Defensive core being able to sponge attacks from the likes of Thundurus-T and a few more.I think Sub CM is the best Latias set.Here it is.

Latias @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 HP / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Dragon Pulse
- Substitute/Roar
- Calm Mind
- Recover

Stall teams rely on switching and their defensive core so it is very important to have an answer to hazards.For that reason I suggest you change skarmory into Forretress.With Jiachi's wish the lack of roost shouldn't be a problem.Here is the set.

Forretress @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Sp Def
Relaxed Nature(0 speed IVs)
- Rapid spin
- Spikes
- Volt Switch
- Gyro Ball

In addition I would like to say some things.Firstly,if you go with Forretress you lose a phazing move.So if you think you need to phazers use Roar over Substitute on Latias.

Also,I suggest you change U-Turn to Protect on Jirachi as it will give Rachi's recovery more reliability.Furthermore,It will also help against Choiced pokemons such as CB Terrakion who is a big threat team to your team since it can OHKO or 2HKO all the pokemons in your team(almost all the pokemons in the tier in fact).In that case Protect will be useful preventing it from getting free kills with good prediction if it comes on Rachi.It also helps against all choiced user in general.

Another thing,Like someone already said that sun teams with Dugtrio will cause you problems.Although Latias should be able to take on Sun fairly well,it is important that you keep your weather up especially on stall.Thus although gimmicky you can try out Shed Shell on Tyranitar,since you have wish support.If you don't want some thing so situational that's fine too.

 

[bluewooper]

Yo Game Freak201, how are you doing? This team really intrigued my interest becuase of your awesome Gliscor picture, so I decided to help you make it better (not the Gliscor picture, the team). Here goes:

The Problem:

In order for a stall team to really perform well in this metagame, you really must be able to have many good checks against weather teams. Considering that Politoed is #1 on July's usage statistics, you will definitely consider having several pokemon that can handle Rain teams. You do have a Jellicent, who happens to be one of two the greatest anti-Rain pokemon. However, there are some very prominent rain threats that you should know that Jellicent cannot check by himself. Pokemon like Starmie are going to give Jellicent and the rest of your team a bit of trouble. Starmie especially has the potential to really wreck your team, should Jirachi become heavily weakened. For this reason, I would like to suggest that you replace Skarmory, a spiker that is fairly weak to all things Drizzle, with Ferrothorn, a spiker who happens to be the second of the greatest anti-Rain pokemon.

My Suggestion:

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Relaxed: 252Hp/88Def//168Sp.Def
~Spikes
~Leech Seed
~Gyro Ball
~Power Whip

Benefits:

Ferrothorn alongside Jellicent helps your team shut down many of the most prominent rain threats in the metagame. Ferrothorn mainly helps in the checking of Starmie in rain, as he can quite easily avoid 2HKOed by LO Starmie Hydro Pump in rain, allowing him to shoo the bratty sea star away. Ferrothorn gives your team another really good switchin to Lati@s. Skarmory always had to worry about moves like Surf and (I guess) Thunderbolt that they could carry. The Spike support that Ferrothorn supplies helps your team wear down some difficult Physical threats, such as CB Scizor and Terrakion, that you could have some difficulty eliminating. One final bonus that Ferrothorn brings to the table is a really physically bulky Rock resist. In the past, Jirachi would be consistently tanking Draco Meteors and various special hits. This could conceivably open up a whole for a CB Terrakion's Stone Edge late game. Ferrothorn helps prevent this.

Downsides:

There are only a few things that I can think of that you would lose with the addition of Ferrothorn. You will lose a 100% safe switchin to Mamoswine, which could become somewhat of a problem for this team. However, I do plan to suggest a change which will minimize this weakness. Additionally, You will lose a ground immunity, meaning that you will become slightly weaker to Spikes. Finally you will lose a phaser, meaning that you will depend on Tyranitar as your sole phaser.

Other Small Changes:

I like the idea of the late game closer that you are running with Latios. However, Latios is meant to do one of two things, either equip a choice Specs, or Fire off Draco Meteors (preferrably both). However, since we know this about Latios, we can supplement his best friend for him, who can run quite a similar set as his, but produce much greater results. Introducing, Latias over brother Latios. I would recomend that you use this set and EVs (Which I will explain in some depth):

Latias @ Leftovers
Calm: 252Hp/140SpA/116Spe
~Dragon Pulse
~Surf
~Calm Mind
~Recover

This set does quite a lot of stuff. The Speed EVs are intended to outpace Jolly Mamoswine, which had previously been a small worry to your team. HP was maxed, leaving the remainder to fall into special attack, to guarantee that you KO Mamoswine with Surf after switching into SR twice and 1 life Orb recoil. This set also allows Latias to come in as a check to many of Sun's threats (besides Volc.), which is why a Calm nature has been added. You will definitely find that this Latias set is much more capable of tanking hits than your previous Latios had been. This sort of job, depending on bulk and survivability, is better done by Latias.

 

[Myzozoa]

I see a nitpick to start on Gliscor: even though roost is very good, Protect allows you to PP stall behind a sub without it getting broken and is an effective strategy for handling Outrages if your Skarmory should die. Your team can be torn apart quite easily by Magnezones which is why I note this.

The first change I would make is a complete removal of Latios, there is no reason for it to be on the team: it doesn't contribute to your stall strategy in anyway, Latias does the CM set better, and lastly you don't have the proper support (toxic spikes) anyway.

Removing Latios for Starmie is my recommendation, as currently you are missing a Rapid Spinner which is completely unacceptable for your type of protracted stall strategy. If an opponent sets up entry hazards you will be ripped apart by Tornadus (you will lose the weather war first of all) and Latios:

Starmie@Leftovers
Timid
252 Speed, 252 hp, 4 Special Attack
Scald/Surf/Hydro Pumo
Rapid Spin
Recover
Ice Beam/Psyshock


The second thing I would do is change TTar to:

TTar @ Choice Scarf
Jolly
Max Attack and Speed
Stone edge
Pursuit
Crunch
Superpower

This will allow you to pursuit the ghost pokemon that would block your Rapid Spin, while also providing a Terrakion and Thundurus-T check. Because of this change you would lose Stealth Rocks, but this can be remedied by including them on Jirachi instead of U-turn (it is not necessary imo, you might consider adding it to Skarm at the expense of Brave Bird but I do not recommend it).

Be advised that last pokemon set-up sweepers like Sub Roost Dnite are a nightmare for you. Perish Song Celebi may be of interest over Jirachi. It can also learn Stealth Rocks:

Celebi @Leftovers:
252 hp, 36 speed, 220 defense
Bold
Perish Song
Recover/Rest
Grass Knot/Giga Drain
Stealth Rocks

 

[Game Freak201]

Thanks for the rates so far guys, I really appreciate how much you guys helped me so far.

I just some changes to my team, and it seems to be doing well; though, I did not do enough battles to say it for certain.

Here's an exportable of the team I'm currently using.

Tyrant King (Tyranitar) (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Crunch
- Superpower
Saviour (Gliscor) (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Substitute
- Roost
- Toxic
- Earthquake
Poseidon (Jellicent) (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Def / 220 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Shadow Ball
Multi-Star (Starmie) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin
- Recover
Paradox (Celebi) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- Perish Song
- Stealth Rock
Crutch (Ferrothorn) (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Protect

I'll make the changes to the OP whenever I have the chance.