M&M Mix and Mega

Greetings, my fellow citizens. Today is the day we show our gratitude to our moms, those who have nurtured and loved us since we were born unconditionally. Sometimes You just take what you have for granted, perhaps I can change your mind about that. And thus, allow me to tell You a story... An imaginary (probably) story about a family that will highlight just how important Your mom can be.

Your mom (Snorlax) (F) @ Aggronite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Curse
- Rest
- Body Slam
- Darkest Lariat

At first glance, Your mom doesn't seem useful. All Your mom does all day is cursing, and you do wonder whom those curses are for. When she finally stops cursing, Your mom goes back to sleep. As of now, you probably are very frustrated because in your eyes she doesn't seem to do anything productive. However, You will soon realize everything is not as it seems. Your mom is willing to take hits from the mean bullies for You, and when the time comes, she will also repel all those who dares threaten your family's happiness. At this point, it hits you that Your mom saves all those curses to unleash all her power to them, and she utilizes those power with her insane WWE moves. Yes, you don't even know when and how she learned those, but does it even matter when they do the job? Your mom also buys a lot of gems for your family because that seems like the trend in this environment. And she is willing to take the worst, unfashionable one for everyone else to shine.

You (Dugtrio) @ Diancite
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Reversal / Stealth Rock / Sucker Punch
- Substitute / Memento

Coming from a wealthy upbringing, You are sadly just a frail kid, but that doesn't stop you from contributing to your family, or at least that's what Your mom says. Your mom is not the almighty god, some walls are just too high for her to climb, and this is where your ability comes in handy. Your sneaky contraptions that gave many other students headache countless times (Also Your mom when she was summoned by your teacher, but let's ignore that for now) handles threats to your family, which I will mention later. Since your trap is planted in the ground, birds and all those pesky hovering gems don't really care about it, and sometimes your trap isn't effective enough, so You shall prey on the weaklings that fear it. You can occasionally throw stones in frustration against those birds, however remember it's not your main priority. You can even pull out your secret trick by making those poor bullies chase after your decoy before falling into their demise and seeing the role reversal. Since that requires careful maneuver though, You can instead make a trap for other meanies when they enter your playground. When all else fails, a good old play dead trick will surely make them shed a tear, which makes them show empathy and become more vulnerable. The gem given to You by Your mom makes you even more agile and tricky, and even though it consumes your stamina a lot you don't have much in the first place.

Your dad (Hippowdon) (M) @ Altarianite
Ability: Sand Force
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
IVs: 25 Spe
- Body Slam
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Your dad is quite literally a giant in more ways than one. His durability, his strength are all top notch. Drowning in office work in a long time though has made his speed on the field a bit sluggish. If You have been observing him, You will realize there's striking resemblance between You and Your dad. Looking at the way he utilizes the ground and makes traps for the invaders, You know where You got all those habits from. Obviously he also needs rest time because work wears him down a fair share, he prefers relaxing while staying awake instead. A closer look also reveals Your dad has been Your mom's WWE partner all this time, and both their favorite moves seem to be Choke Slam or something of the kind. His piece of jewelry is his favorite way to deliver his unique spin on the move, which definitely surprises your bullies.

Your brother (Slowbro) (M) @ Sablenite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Slack Off
- Teleport

Your slow brother inherits not only the sluggish speed trait but also his preference for slacking off from Your dad. Unlike You, he doesn't like to lay his hands directly. Instead, his trusty water gun is his favorite choice when it comes to dealing with stress. Have I told you he doesn't just use ordinary water? Sometimes he loads hot water, which causes burn to those unfortunate enough to piss him off. Other times he just decides to load water so cold, it might as well be ice. After being done, he sometimes displays a magic trick where he just disappears in front of you to recharge energy (probably go buy milk or something). Since Your brother has spent a long time near you, he knows all the dirty tricks and can take advantage of his gemstone to detect and repel all the attempts to poison his food or set trap like You often try to do.

Your pet bird (Ho-Oh) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 SpD
Impish Nature
- Defog
- Brave Bird
- Sacred Fire
- Roost

Your pet bird has always been a reliable partner that You need to prevent retaliation. Its sharp eyesight allows your family to avoid the pesky traps others mimicked from You. Apparently someone taught it to spit fire (Most likely your brother judging from his love for hot stuffs), so now on top of rushing into your bullies, Your pet bird can also give them a second-degree burn. Constantly spreading its wings is tiring though, so it does spend lots of time roosting on its favorite tree. Giving it a gem to flex seems like an appealing option, however the damn local law bans it as a way to combat income inequality, which means you have to either abide or go to an anarchy land where anything goes (It's a scary place though because some families' wealth there overflows beyond your imagination).

Your bodyguard (Ditto) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Transform

Coming from a rich family does give You some perks, and one of those is having a bodyguard. Your bodyguard usually won't interfere with trivial matters, but when push comes to shove, he will give your bullies a taste of their own medicine. Especially when they get buffed up with all their energy drink and weapons, Your bodyguard is willing to do the same since he knows his speed advantage will give him an edge to scare them away. In fact, just a sight of Your bodyguard makes them think twice before they decide to do so.

Just like everything you have to encounter in life, there are some obstacles that threaten Your family, especially Your mom. Dealing with these swiftly will guarantee prosperity and allows Your mom to keep cursing and sleeping!

This annoying bird from your neighbor keeps disrupting Your mom's peaceful time, and no matter how much curses are thrown at it Your mom just can't keep up with it. It's up to Your dad to slam this to the ground, which should be unforeseen and devastate it. Your bodyguard also keeps this avian at bay if work exhausts Your dad a bit much.

Completely unphazed by Your mom's curses, this creature of unknown origins is a tough one to crack. You should step in and ensure Your mom can have a good time. Be careful though, as dealing with this is like playing with fire and you can get burned.

Seems like Your mom is allergic to some aquatic creatures. This one in particular can slither through for a long time before Your family can catch it, but if the stars align, after hitting it hard enough it will be paralyzed and neutralizing it becomes less of an issue.

Full of drip and thinking he's the coolest guy when he takes your lunch money, the time for your payback is here. With your newfound power from the gem, it's going to be great to look at his face when he falls into your pit trap.

:ss/Tapu Koko:
This band rocker's loud music just won't allow Your mom to sleep in peace, even if he's rarely seen in this neighborhood. Just like the guy above though, You can break his guitar and returns the silence to your home.

I see you are still skeptical about Your mom. Fear not, to further convince you, I have prepared footage from when the family competed in the local family competition to outsmart other families.

TLDR: You should treasure Your mom more, she is very valuable and can help You get out of tight situations, as well as increase the strength of your family as a whole.
I've been doing some testing with Swampertite Dracovish with rain to make Rend always move first but had limited success. From my findings I've noticed a few key things:
1) fishious rend lol still strong af, now add 40 atk with the mega stone
2)Adament Dracovish in rain outspeeds Zeraora with Diancite, so you're outspeeding almost the whole tier
3)The loss of strong jaw is negated by rain in the case of fishious rend, but obviously Crunch and PFangs are slightly weakened
4) In order to have rain, you need to sacrifice a mega spot just for Pelipper, which is rather trash to be honest
5) In addition to this ^ it's very easy to have Pelipper get worn down or just straight up wrecked, and once the 7 turns of rain is up Dracovish's success is vastly limited

To be honest it's just an idea I had to have a threat use Swampertite successfully for the first time (in my knowledge) in the history of this tier. Maybe it's a fruitless endeavor, but I'd appreciate some different ideas to make a powerful rain sweeper. Thank you!
Since Fairy is the most viable type in this meta here I am with an innocent looking E-cleaner which can prolly save you from other cleaners too XD

Newbies hate me (Dragonite) @ Altarianite
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Scale Shot
- Earthquake

This set is as simple as it looks like. Only thing to keep in mind is you don't mega evolve it as soon as it enters the field to benefit from Multiscale and get a free DD boost (ofc there shouldn't be any hazards lol).After a successful DD boost just mega evolve and spam Espeed until a bulky steel type comes in. Scale shot is for getting some more speed buff when you encounter slow mons. Eq is for coverage against those pesky steel types which resist the other two moves.

So far I've been having a lot of fun with this beast and sometimes it sweeps an entire team single handedly. I will update this post later with replays and viable teammates for countering threats.


Forgiven and Hanged
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
The Story Of Sw/Sh MnM

Was originally gonna do this after omwc but given that top 10 titans of mnm is soon , i thought it would be better to do post this before that. Gen8 MnM was the first meta that got me involved with competitive tours in general and even though i found myself less and less involved for the past year with it due to my personal dislike of how it progressed , i still want to have a proper send off post in the thread.
This is merely a post showcasing the stuff gen8 meta overall went through and is somewhat inspired from M Dragon's post about adv throughout the ages. There's still one teamtour left but i doubt there's gonna be some drastic changes * (atleast i hope for the sake of the meta itself lol). Anyway here we go

(*Zap G suspect was announced as i was writing this post and its ban could certainly change the meta in a big way but i can just hope people realize that not every fighting type that can pivot needs to be banned in mnm)


  • Gen 8 Mix and Mega had a lot of new toys to work around with. Stuff like Dragapult , Boomburst Kommo-o , Toxtricity and Dracozolt were relatively hyped up as mons that would have a strong influence on the meta. It also started with a very small banlist including only zac-c as the banned mon alongside the obvious stones. A lot was happening , however it became pretty clear that stuff like Zacian-H and STAG were not ok which resulted in zac and Gothitelle and Gothorita getting the boot just days after the meta was live.

  • The meta did settle a bit after these bans and we saw some early trends. Im just gonna give a brief account of such trends and the teams we saw
    • :corviknight: + :toxapex: This was basically everywhere as it became the main defensive core of the meta. Banetite pex helped beat stuff like Arcanine and Altarianite Kommo-o while Corvi was a good slow pivot and hazard remover checking stuff like Etern and Dragapult.

    • :gastrodon: Another Mon that saw usage. Gastro saw usage primaly due to checking Eternatus and Arcanine in 1 slot. It was also sometimes used instead of the dominant corvipex core to remove weakness to electric types like NP rotom and Dracozolt. Soft checking Altarianite toxtricity was also a decent bonus

    • :Arcanine: Arcanine was as familiar to a mnm team as CorviPex at that point. It offered good utility along with speed control and Howl Pinsirite sets with enough chip could go past through pex and Jellicent.

    • Defensive options : :Jellicent: :Mandibuzz: :Rhyperior: :Corsola-Galar: :Clefable:
      All these mons were the main defensive walls when one moved away from corvi pex. Banettite Jellicent with WoW + Strength Sap was a solid stop to physical attackers , Same with Mandibuzz as a removal and soft check to Gengar. Ampharosite Clef was a very common hazard setter however lacked access to soft boiled so wasnt omni present as u would read in the later stages of meta. Corsola-G wasnt as big but was in a few teams that went on to dominate ladder in the early stages. Rhyperior had the added bonus of checking etern and also provided for a decent wall breaker

    • Offensive options : :Dracozolt: :Toxtricity: :Gengar: :Dragapult: :Noivern: :Excadrill: :Lucario:
      These were the go-to mons to break the traditional cores. Lucario generally was seen less due to dominance of Arcanine but was still terrifying to face unprepared. Stuff Like NP rotom were also used but were only seen in teams of few individuals so i didnt include them.

    • :Dugtrio: and :Ditto: : Both of these mons though sound gimmicky actually were quite viable and widely used. With how the nature of meta was , Ditto provided excellent revenge killing opportunites while dugtrio allowed breakers like Dracozolt and Toxtricity to shine.

    • :Eternatus: Eternatus simply put, was the best mon in the meta. Metronome 3 attacks recover was the main set - being able to make progress vs almost everything but Cosmic power also saw some usage on the ladder.

Stresh's post here basically provides a much in depth analysis of the meta and is a good read to follow the above points better.
  • Playstyle and Teams : Overall Early Pre-Home meta was a bit Offense Oriented. There were few decent stall options available but they still had to be wary of Eternatus and Gengar. Some of the teams that were seen frequently on ladder at that time with replays (click on the sprites) to give u an idea :-

    Standard balances :
    :jellicent: :corviknight: :ditto: :eternatus: :rhyperior: :gengar:
    :corsola-galar: :corviknight: :toxapex: :dragapult: :arcanine: :Hydreigon:
    :hydreigon: :corviknight: :jellicent: :dragapult: :arcanine: :clefable:

    :kommo-o: :corviknight: :eternatus: :arcanine: :wobbuffet: :mamoswine:

    Stall :
    :Shedinja: :ditto: :corviknight: :toxapex: :hippowdon: :wobbuffet:
    :shedinja: :mandibuzz: :gastrodon: :eternatus: :toxapex: :tsareena:

    Teams Featuring Dugtrio:
    :Eternatus: :Jellicent: :Corviknight: :Rhyperior: :rotom-heat: :dugtrio:
    :dugtrio: :ditto: :corviknight: :arcanine: :gengar: :eternatus:

  • Eternatus Ban and 1st MnM Open:
    The 1st team made by stresh was p instrumental in displaying etern's brokenness in the meta at that time. Soon , Etern was voted to be banned in a very one sided suspect test. Gengar and Blastoisinite Hydreigon were greatly benefited from this and became the tier's premier special wall-breakers. It was also the time arcanine started preferring to run howl pinsirite sets to serve better as a cleaner.​
  • MnM open soon rolled over and while there weren't some crazy shifts , it still had some interesting development
  • This meta soon came to an end after Home released shortly mid round 3 of the open. Idt i missed any important details altho there is 1 team in particular of this meta that i wanna talk about which not only dominated the ladder but won almost every game it was used in the open and it was made by none other than the stall lord himself, pigeons.


    While i wont go in detail about the team itself (cuz i honestly dont remember that much), This team deviated from the previous attempts by making use of gyaradosite Ttar as a special wall and having a cleric in the form of aromatisse. Techs like clear smog on Gastrodon and Taunt on Ttar was also very impactful in this teams success. The fact that this team made people run stuff like giga drain gengar and sub dracozolt or hydreigon is enough for me to consider how big it was

    [Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: stresh vs. uhuhuhu7 - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com)
    Replays - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com)
    [Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: LaBalladeDesCieux vs. Andyb0y - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com)


  • Early Home Meta and New Troubles
    • Home fixed a lot of things with MnM - Introduction of a strong electric type in zeraora , Clefable finally wasn't forced to waste 2 slots for recovery and Mew could now run defensive sets. While obvious broken mons like kyu-b were quickly added to the banlist , Terrakion and Melmetal were given chances to see if they were a healthy addition to the met. The latter , however quickly proved to be the most broken thing MnM had seen so far as even stuff like cameruptite sets were becoming viable. With the ability to run toxic or twave as its 4th move , Melm often was able to break against traditional defensive cores long term. Thankfully Melmetal was banned before the next round of Open (alongside STAG).

      Some trends that shaped after Melm got banned were

    • :clefable: : Home meta was the beginning of Clef's domination in Gen8 MnM at that time. With Ampharosite , Clef quickly became the premier hazard setter while also checking stuff like Hydreigon / electric types and Dragapult. Clef was also part of the standard defensive core alongside mew and corvi in most teams.

    • :zeraora: / :zekrom: : Pre-Home meta was in desperate need of good electric types to keep Corvi-Pex in check. Thanks to Gen8 , Zekrom getting access to dragon dance , it and zera were widely used in teams. Lopunnite and Pinsirite were the two main sets of Zera , allowing it to function as a powerful physical attacker and speed control Metagrossite sets would later see usage after the meta progressed further. (Zekrom however faded away as the meta progressed , owing to Clef and Hippo and to some extent Arcanine being the dominant forces in the meta)

    • :Terrakion: : Thought to be overpowered and bannable , Terrak soon proved to be not as dominating. It still ended up as a very powerful offensive SR setter and a wall breaker with Lucarionite but the threat of Zeraora/ Dragapult/Mew affected its presence in teams a lot.

    • :Gengar: / :Lunala: : Its safe to say Ghosts were the dominant forces in MnM in early home meta. Lunala quickly became a staple , being used in various roles - Defog HDB , Leftovers / Helmet WOW , CM set up sweeper. Specs was experimented with later on , after multi brought it in open finals and quickly also became a powerful threat. Lucarionite NP Gengar continued its rampage from pre-home , with clef builds actually giving it more of a stronger match up against typical standard builds but also sometimes ran WoW + hex sets to get around pex.

    • :Toxapex: : Toxapex went through a major change in this meta , as gyaradosite quickly became its main set. While This was mostly as a response to Lunala / Gengar , Moldy toxic allowed it to annoy defensive mons like Clef/ Mew and Mandibuzz.

    • :kyurem: : While initial kyurem sets ran stuff like heracronite and cameruptite , its true potential was soon discovered with its lucarionite set. The calcs that this mon got (can be seen in this post ) was enough to make this mon broken in the eye of many people at that time. Kyurem soon became an important figure from teambuilding perspective and was a major reason for corviknight running venusaurite sets.

    • :Arcanine: / :Lucario: : Nothing really changed for Arcanine as it still was equally viable and popular , Lucario on the other hand started being seen more thanks to sd + mega kick breaking defensive mons like mew / gyara pex.

    • Defensive Options : :Corviknight: :Mandibuzz: :Mew: :Hippowdon: :Tyranitar:
      Corviknight picked up from where it left as it was still the premier defogger , however mandibuzz itself got a buff and was very common thanks to ghosts being dominant. Manec Mew was the main physical defensive wall and was almost universal in every team. Curse Hippo also started gaining usage to counter Zeraora and Terakkion as the meta progressed. Tyranitar had very fringe usage , mostly to tackle gengar.

    • Offensive Options : :Excadrill: :Noivern: :Dragapult: :hydreigon: :Mewtwo:
      Excadrill with its metagrossite / Latiosite sets became a powerful utility mon taking advantage of clef builds. Dragapult and Noivern both used the same set they used to run pre home whuile hydreigon shifted to diancite sets after blastoisinite became too slow for the meta. Mewtwo with its np sets would see decent usage but was very rarely used as the meta progressed.
  • Playstyle and Teams : Most of the teams were balance or bulky offense with heavy focus on pivoting. Stall was barely present and was successful in the early stages when the meta was fresh and sets were still being discovered. HO werent consistent at all but did win some of the games in open. Since this meta dropped in middle of the open , there werent any notable teams on ladder but i'll just paste the teams i remember being pretty good / were spot on representation of the meta. (Once again click on sprites for replays)

    Standard Balance :
    :Mew: :Mandibuzz: :Lunala: :Arcanine: :Clefable: :Zeraora:
    :Gengar: :Lunala: :Terrakion: :Clefable: :Gastrodon: :Corviknight:
    :Zeraora: :Mew: :Arcanine: :Terrakion: :Excadrill: :Mandibuzz:
    :Excadrill: :Zeraora: :Mew: :Mandibuzz: :Arcanine: :Gengar:

    Stall :
    :Zekrom: :Mandibuzz: :Toxapex: :Mew: :Clefable: :Ditto:
    :Clefable: :Toxapex: :Corviknight: :Hippowdon: :Mew: :Ditto:
  • With Ompl closer , Gengar was seen as the biggest threat in the meta. It was soon suspect tested and banned and i consider this to be the end of early home meta as most of the development after this came via ompl games and as u would see , the meta in ompl saw a lot of varience.​
  • Gengar Ban resulted in the meta being revolved around three mons - Clefable , Zeraora and Lunala. Zera and Lun were incredible offensive mons and clef was a universal utility mon without which building team was incredibly difficult. Necrozma Dusk-Mane also gained some viability and would often run offensive dd / sd sets.
  • Nothing much happened trend wise before the start of ompl. Once Ompl began ,
    • We saw Lydia inventing Lucarionite Chandelure and subsequently bringing it against fardin in w1 of ompl. Lucarionite Chandelure would go on to become gengar 2.0 in the meta and would see a lot of usage as the tour progressed.

    • Lunala and Zeraora Continued to dominate and this resulted in a lot of cries to ban them. Brokenness of lunala could be seen in w1 replay of multi vs andy as well as this (infamous) w2 game. Zeraora too was seen over-restricting on the builder , with all three of its sets requiring different checks. This was also the time when players started to voice out their disappointment of the meta as a whole owing to centralization and restriction in the builder. (Andy's post here basically was the opinion of most people in the community and does a good job expressing it)

    • Altarianite Dugtrio (a set created by Catalystic) , saw use in w3 to eliminate clef. This would later on become a mainstay as clef was a mon u would almost see in every team and getting rid of it was huge. This was also the week where lunala finally got the boot from the meta as it was unanimously quick banned by the council.

    • Week 4 of the tour was super big in terms of meta development.We saw two sets being discovered that would be very influential in rest of the home meta. First , Jordy would bring the first cp mew in oms (later known as demon mew). This set pushed mew to be the most important mon to be considered in the teambuilder thanks to this and its cm set, both requiring different checks. Second, Andy's altarianite Toxtricity set also brought back the mon from the shadow realms and it soon proved out to be a powerful offensive breaker in the later stages of the tour.
      This was also the week , specs NDW saw usage in the tour after skysolo brought it. Specs NDW was something multi experimented in "double lunala structure" to some success but with Lunala gone , Specs NDW was seen as an ok alternative. While being inferior in ability and speed , specs NDW was able to 2hko max spd corviknight , the meta's premier spd wall. This resulted in some people running gyaradosite clef (as gyara pex basically became extinct)

    • Zeraora finally got the boot at the end of week 5. It was also this time that we saw rise of hydreigon sets with either gardevoirite or glalilitite (with blastoisinite still seeing some usage) to counter clef +mew teams. (was created by multi / cata) Another new mon that would surge in usage, thanks to lydia , would be Golisopod which was directly influenced by the rise of sablenite mew sets. Goli was able to break traditional cores and was also an excellent spikes setter.

    • Zeraora being banned also affected clef's viability a little bit and clef started running spd in some teams after hydreigon became prominent. Excadrill too became a top threat in the meta and Pins Lucario also started seeing some surge in usage. This would be the final development in meta , as DLC 1 dropped in the middle of finals of the tour and Home meta came to an end.
  • Playstyle and Teams: Most of the development in this meta came from ompl , and there was a heavy focus in clef balances. The winning team of ompl, infact had a 100% clef usage throughout the regular season. HO teams ranged from whack stuff like screens to standard suicide lead mew and was prominant in later stages of the tour. Stall had a horrid run , going 2-3 and with 1 dub coming in an extremely cursed game.

    Standard Balances:-
    :clefable: :zeraora: :chandelure: :toxapex: :mew: :corviknight:
    :zeraora: :mew: :hydreigon: :corviknight: :arcanine: :clefable:
    :dugtrio: :mew: :terrakion: :chandelure: :corviknight: :toxapex:
    :golisopod: :mew: :clefable: :excadrill: :umbreon: :zeraora:

    Hyper Offensive:-
    :golisopod: :arcanine: :mew: :hydreigon: :excadrill: :necrozma-dawn wings:
    :mewtwo: :excadrill: :mew: :lucario: :dragapult: :necrozma-dawn wings:
    :mew: :gyarados: :lucario: :excadrill: :arcanine: :necrozma-dawn wings:

    :corviknight: :hippowdon: :mantine: :mew: :gastrodon: :ditto:
    :ditto: :mandibuzz: :necrozma-dusk mane: :corviknight: :toxapex: :clefable:

  • Similar to pre-home recap, i would like to highlight a team from this meta. While it wasnt as influential and widely used as the stall (as it was made towards the very end of the meta) , it was extremely creative and was the first successful iteration of a weather team in mnm and was made by the the TL himself (now former).

There were some attempts to make a rain team before like when skysolo brought vish + peli vs andy in ompl but it wasnt successful. This team tho completely turned that around, substitute + iron head dracovish made sure clef was never a counter and altarianite jolteon was another big abuser as it became a near unstoppable pivot with weather ball. Surf manec mew was another tech that was a highlight. Ultimately, this team ended up going undefeated in relevant battles in home meta

[Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: stresh vs. jrdn - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com) [Ompl VIII finals tiebreak]
[Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: Andyb0y vs. Redflix - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com) [Ssnl top 4]


  • DLC 1 MnM brought up quite a familiar faces back from gen7 including titans like Magearna, Slowbro and Blissey. The addition of the latter two was welcomed a ton especially since they were a powerful def and spd walls respectively. In addition , we also got introduced to the two new fighting type shifu forms. The MnM council also made a major decision by freeing zamazenta and zacian-h (still retricted from holding stones). The trends in mon that was seen in dlc 1 were:-
    • :Urshifu: : The two forms quickly became the top offensive powerhouses in the meta. While early sets consisted of the mons consisted of metagrossite only , Urshifu single strike would later branch out to abuse Lucarionite as well. Similarly , Rapid strike started preferring aerodactylite as the meta progressed. The combination of U-turn + respective crit move was very deadly and this resulted in a lot of users to dig a bit deeper to find solid answers to these mons. While Magearna, Clefable , Arcanine , Altarianite Hippowdon and Toxapex were the main defensive answers to urshifu (depending on the form) ,stuff with slowbronite like corvi or skarm and even togekiss also began seeing usage.

    • :Zacian: : Another Mon that was an excellent wallbreaker , Zacian mostly used LO 4 attacks or SD + 3 attacks as its main set. While CB saw some usage in the early stages of meta, presence of Necrozma - DM , Arcanine and Magearna quickly made that set subpar.

    • :Noivern: : Isle of armour brought noivern back from being mediocre to a top threat. With its amazing speed which allowed it to outspeed both the threats mentioned above and the combination of boomburst + super fang which allowed it to cripple steel types , Noivern was a perfect fast pivot. It also served as a soft check to urshifu rapid strike (as ice punch was less common)

    • :Blissey: : After the best spd wall finally returned , MnM special wall-breakers had a rough patch in the meta. Mons like Necrozma-DW basically became irrelevant while Chandelure and Hydreigon also saw less usage. A lot of special breakers would later in the meta adjust themselves to beat blissey thus giving rise to new sets. Blissey formed a very potent core with Arcanine which was utilized in plenty of the teams. While Sablenite was the main set, It also ran Ampharosite , making it an excellent hazard setter.

    • :Toxtricity: : After falling in usage in early meta development thanks to the blobb, Toxtricity once again returned to relevancy as a sweeper after it started running mixed glalitite set (popularized by andy). Shiftgear + Drainpunch allowed it to bypass blissey while psuedo-stab boomburst + tbolt was enough to break a lot of cores. This game is a good example that shows its prowess in the meta. Altarianite sets would also see usage later in the meta.

    • :magnezone: : DLC 1 meta also introduced us to Magnezone , which with Lucarionite became a very annoying mon to face as it easily trapped magearna and corviknight in addition to already threatening meta staples like slowbro and pex, thus making it an ideal partner in a lot of teams. While zone's presence lead to a corviknight often running different sets which could not be trapped ,it still never really reached a point where it was very common / popular as the meta in general was unfavourable for it.

    • :volcarona: : While Initial Volcarona sets ran Charizardite-Y , Manectite , Cameruptite or even Lucarionite, as the meta progressed the two main sets eventually that i remember being successful were defensive sablenite and absolite. Absolite patched its weakness to confide blissey sets and was a pretty decent late game cleaner with psychic and Sablenite Volc was one of the best answers to zacian and a stall utlizing that set also managed to go 50-0 on ladder during that time.

    • :Corviknight: : Sablenite Corviknight saw a huge drop in this meta as it faced stiff competition for the stone by blissey , slowbro and mew. Venu max def sets were still very popular with slowbronite seeing some usage as well but a lot of times Corvi had to switch to metagrossite or even salamencite sets to avoid being trapped by zone.

    • :Magearna: : Magearna made a big impact on its arrival and quickly became the best mon in the meta. Manectite was a good pivot and an amaing blanket check to 90% of the meta. However , Mag also ran thousand other sets and each set was equally viable- CM cameruptite , Latiasite , Pivot Sablenite etc. The most broken was without a doubt CM split pinsirite mag with tri attack which either ran agility or substitute last. This set was a pain to face and had an amazing matchup vs the traditional builds in the meta being able to beat blissey , excadrill while also being able to decimate stall. To counter this , Encore became the main set on pivot mag sets (popularized by stresh) while some players resorted to run eerie impulse on manectite/sable mag (set used by lydia). My favourite check which imo had a pretty decent mu vs every mag set and which I used in plenty of successful teams was this set. This replay is a good example as the resh forces mag out everytime and denies it any possibility to set up.

    • Defensive Options: :Slowbro: :Hippowdon: :Toxapex: :Mew: :Necrozma-Dusk Mane: :Clefable:
      Slowbro with Sablenite / Manectite was meta's premier physical wall. This was also the time where Fs slowbro sets started to become popular and it + one of urshifu forms was a great core. Hippowdon with Altarianite was the best answer to Urshifu-SS and was also a decent option to force mons out with body slam while Toxapex was the best answer for the other form , mainly using banettite. (Slowbronite / Latiasite sets also saw some usage) Slowbronite / Manectite Mew alongside Demon Mew kept seeing usage time to time. Clefable wasnt as dominating as in the previous meta , as it not only faced competition from Excadrill , Terrakion and Blissey for a hazard setter but popularity of Zacian / Urshifu-SS / Exca and Mag made it exploitable. Nevertheless , it was a solid Urshifu-RS answer and and Moldy Toxic was always a good selling point. Necrozma-DM was an excellent Zacian answer and at the end of the meta , also had surprise CM sets working for it.

    • Offensive Options: :Arcanine: :Excadrill: :Lucario: :Terrakion: :Chandelure:
      DLC 1 was the peak of Arcanine. Not only it continued to be the meta's premier -ate speed mon , it offered a lot of utility with altarianite + Morning Sun as an Offensive Check to Zacian/ Urshifu-SS. Pinsirite sets also started to run Double-Edge to get past a weakened slowbro / Toxapex in this meta. Excadrill also continued its upward trend from Home meta as it too was one of the best mons in general - Offering a great utility as a Spinner / Hazard Setter or both with Glalitite / Latiasite but also could function as a good late game cleaner with Lucarionite / Metagrossite SD sets. Terakion and Lucario also enjoyed having success in Isle of Armour as both could get past stuff like Blissey / Corvi and Magearna (with a bit of chip) and also threatened Urshifu out. Terrak could also get pass Slowbro / Mew with the help of Megahorn , a tech which occasionally did see some use. Chandelure with Sub CM set also popped up in teams from time to time but its success was nowhere near the previous meta.

  • Playstyle and Teams: Teams in general were momentum-heavy in this meta with Mag / Bro being omnipresent. HO's were seen very less and barely had any development while there were variety of ladder stalls present.

    Standard Balances:-
    :Chandelure: :Arcanine: :Terrakion: :Magearna: :Slowbro: :Excadrill:
    :Noivern: :Toxapex: :Magearna: :Excadrill: :Terrakion: :Volcarona:
    :Arcanine: :Skarmory: :Excadrill: :Noivern: :Zacian: :Blissey:
    :Toxtricity: :Urshifu: :Excadrill: :Toxapex: :Corviknight: :Slowbro:
    :Magnezone: :Urshifu: :Arcanine: :Corviknight: :Hippowdon: :Mew:

    :Blissey: :Mantine: :Toxapex: :Hippowdon: :Corviknight: :Ditto:
    :Ditto: :Blissey: :Corviknight: :Zekrom: :Hippowdon: :Slowbro-Galar:
  • DLC 1 only lasted for around 2-3 months and as only 1 tour (ssnl) was going on , u could say it was a bit under developed. Unfortunately, There werent really any notable team built in this and the meta ended quitely even before ssnl ended as crown tundra released in october.​


  • Crown Tundra releasing brought back a huge chunk of legends and old mons , along with two new calyrex forms. MnM council decided that it was a good time for a redo and thus , the banlist was reduced to just dynamax and the broken stones. Solgaleo was also unrestricted from holding stones as there were plenty of arguments that the mon was healthy for the meta.
  • Steel types like Melmetal and Zacian-Crowned showed no signs of being healthy as they continued to do what they did in the earlier metas i.e, wrecking teams without having much switch-ins. Kyogre too , proved to be a very difficult mon to handle as one had to guess between specs or scarf which often resulted it in getting atleast 2/3 kills in a game. Lastly, Despite freeing two ghosts that were broken in previous meta in the form of Gengar and Lunala, Calyrex-Shadow proved that it was even more broken , as it routinely did stuff like this to teams that werent running max spd sablenite mandibuzz.
  • This lead to the council setting up a vote for the 4 mons in the 1st week of the meta which resulted in all 4 being banned. The bans did lead to some breathing space for meta to settle down and show some early trends which were :-
    • :Eternatus: : Quickly rising to the top ranks , Eternatus's function didnt change much from what it did when it was legal back in pre-home meta. Having well rounded stats and the ability to annoy most , if not all defensive cores along with the fact that it was an amazing offensive check to plenty of the new mons made it a favourite while building.

    • :Zygarde: : Prob the other "titan" of the developing meta, Zygarde enjoyed the luxury of running its gen7 sets to similar success. Thousand arrows + -ate speed was a successful combo that annoyed plenty of defensive cores while substitute lucarionite sets also had deadly sweeping capabilties.

    • :Gengar: : Calyrex-Shadow Ban allowed Gengar to become a strong breaker and despite addition of blissey , there werent many signs of this mon being healthy. Sludge Bomb poisons would often result in blissey or mandibuzz losing its longevity, allowing gengar to break past them later with focus blast. Substitute sets were equally amazing as well , taking advantage of mono-seismic toss blissey builds.

    • :Urshifu: : Urshifu Single Strike continued its upward trend , as it soon became the meta's premier physical breaker being able to take advantage of most defensive mons in the meta. Downward trend of usage of alt-hippo in the developing meta def contributed to this. Rapid Strike on the other hand had a poor showing as it not only competed with its counterpart but rise of Eternatus, Dragonite and Defensive Lunala meant its breaking power was compromised against well-built teams.

    • :Ho-oh: / :Zapdos: : Crown Tundra blessed mnm with plenty of viable hazard removal. HDB Ho-oh was a much needed mon as it was a strong special tank and a good answer to pinsirite mag , something the meta lacked in isle of armour. Zapdos mainly resorted to phy def Slowbronite sets to check Urshifu, kart and Lando-T better.

    • :Naganadel: : Naganadel was another terrifying wall breaker making use of NP + Sludge bomb to break past walls (which can be seen in this replay). With either diancite or lucarionite even stuff like Venusaurite corvi werent a safe check and its speed tier ensured it wasnt revenge killed easily.

    • :entei: / :Dragonite: / :Regieleki: : DLC2 also brought the death of arcanine's dominance as both Dragonite and Entei proved to be better options. While Entei had an advantage with a stronger attack stat and a better fire stab , Dragonite could run variety of sets ranging from dd + 3 attacks to roost cleric or bulky defog. As the meta progressed and developed further, Dragonite soon revealed to be the altarianite user and gradually became the best mon in the meta. Regieleki was another espeed mon that was introduced, however was generally seen inferior. Funnily enough tho , Regieleki was ladder's favourite tool to use at that time and would often see more usage than either of entei / dnite.

    • Defensive Options: : :Lunala: :Slowbro: :Toxapex: :Magearna: :Blissey: :Landorus-Therian: :Corviknight:
      Slowbro and Magearna continued to be the premier physical wall of the meta. Lunala was an excellent defensive cm sweeper or could run hdb/helmet utility sets with defog. Blissey started running ampharosite more than sablenite as there werent much hazard setters. Toxapex was also decently common thanks to it checking entei and etern and even sometimes ran slowbronite sets. Lando-T quickly established itself as one of the top ground types. While it also ran offensive sets such as SD + explosion with either altarianite or salamencite , the main set was generally defensive/utility salamencite as either a defogger or a rocker. Corvi did Corvi things , being a slow pivot and a hazard remover alongside checking kartana / eternatus / Lando -T.

    • Offensive Options: :Zeraora: :kartana: :Solgaleo: :Tapu Lele:
      Zeraora mostly preferred pinsirite sets with bulk up + facade / mega kick as Lando-t and Alt dnite being common prevented lopunnite or metagrossite sets from being viable. Kart was a very average mon to pick as the meta was extremely against it and while Solg was a better option with metagrossite , it was never a reliable breaker. Tapu Lele saw some usage , thanks to psychic surge blocking -ate speed but got left in the land of irrelevancy as the meta progressed on.

    • :Pheromosa: :Zacian: :Xerneas: :-
      Clubbing these 3 mons as all were expected to have good usage but ended up being subpar at that time. Xern ended up being the best of the bunch and saw some usage while Zacian on the other hand completely disappeared. This was mostly due to it being seen as an inferior option as an offensive pokemon as LO sets suffered from less longevity and presence of mag / solg / lando didnt help either. Phero had to compete with Shifu and was in its few showings in the early meta didnt impress as much owing to pex / ho-oh being common.
  • Further Bans and Major Tournaments:-
    Soon , council conducted another vote . this time for naganadel and gengar as both special breakers were seen considerably unhealthy and sharing this sentiment, they were banned. This was also the time MnM was having quite a few tournaments - Livetours , Circuit Playoffs and soon to start Wcoom which further developed the meta.
    • Spectrier , a mon which was completely under the radar , started gaining some usage after these bans and proved to be surprisingly good . While it struggled with having no real outs vs shadow ball blissey , sets like Sub Lucarionite started popping off to beat toxic varients. Gyaradosite with wisp + hex would also see usage later in the meta

    • Wcoom soon rolled over and Landorus-T and Urshifu continued their upward trend in the meta. Dragonite as well , continued to dominate altho it saw more usage in circuit playoffs and live tours than omwc and Eternatus while pretty common in all three tours, it did not enjoy as much success in winning as the previous 3. Zygarde and Entei too was fairly common in teams while Regieleki was seen only occasionally and performed poorly. On the defensive front , Slowbro , Magearna and Corvi established themselves as the top options and Ho-oh and Lunala also enjoyed their popularity.

    • An interesting development occurred in week 1 game of zesty vs stresh and w3 game of cata where both brought altarianite slowbro with body slam , as a tech to catch urshifu. This set would end up becoming one of its main options further showing the lengths one had to go to check urshifu. Another new discovery was in w2 when stresh brought swampert vs me . This was pert's first showing in competitive mnm , and it showed its niche as a good slow volt blocker / entei check which could pivot and set up rocks. Pert would later dominate a different meta further down the lane.

    • Taunt Urshifu used in this week 3 game also showed techs the mon could run to beat its established checks. Wcoom ended with Urshifu being the most used mon and also the best mon with a large portion of the community voicing their concern with regards to its brokenness. On the other hand , the meta's other fighting type pivot, phero continued its poor showing in the meta in both this tour and circuit playoffs.

    • Livetour Playoffs , which were happening at the same time also lead to a discovery of a new viable mon in the meta in the form of calyrex-ice with jrdn bringing it in the finals. This lead to plenty of people experimenting with the mon and while it did enjoy some success , it never truly became a meta defining threat.

  • Playstyle and teams: Balance continued to dominate while Stall despite gaining some victories in tours was largely a mu fish and often folded to shifu + fs structures. HO also did see some use , particularly in wcoom , to average success.

    :Zygarde: :Entei: :Landorus-Therian: :Corviknight: :Urshifu: :Zapdos:
    :Urshifu: :Zygarde: :Toxapex: :Corviknight: :Lunala: :kartana:
    :blissey: :Zygarde: :Ho-oh: :Magearna: :Urshifu: :Swampert:
    :Zygarde: :Toxapex: :Ho-oh: :Slowbro: :excadrill: :Dragonite:

    :Corviknight: :Starmie: :Ditto: :Buzzwole: :Blissey: :Toxapex:
    :Toxapex: :Corviknight: :Buzzwole: :Mew: :Ho-oh: :Blissey:

    :Shuckle: :Spectrier: :Tapu Lele: :Landorus-Therian: :Magnezone: :Genesect:
    :Mew: :Entei: :Landorus-Therian: :Genesect: :Metagross: :Urshifu:

  • Urshifu Ban and MnM Open
    After Wcoom concluded the council decided to vote on the two major mons that had complains of being broken - Urshifu and Eternatus. Eternatus was unanimously voted "no-ban" while shifu , in a close one ,got the boot.
    • Terakkion quickly rose to the occasion as the fighting replacement. However instead of Lucarionite , its main set became Tyranitarite (popularized by lydia), as it could also function as an eternatus soft-check.

    • Around this time , Pigeons was also experimenting with Ampharosite Heatran, it being able to check etern and entei pre mega and being able to trap stuff like pex after evolving. Similarly , another Eternatus check , Rhyperior with ttarite started seeing usage in bulky builds. While heatran didnt get as much attention as rhyp at that time , it would later on become one of the top mons in Ompl IX and the further metas.

    • Once Mnm Open rolled out , further development of post - shifu meta took place
      • Solgaleo began to see an upward trend with metagrossite sets , mostly thanks to its ability to switch up against most of eternatus attacks while forcing it out with psychic fangs.
      • Spectrier and Zygarde continued to enjoy good usage with Zygarde preferring Lucarionite sets more. Glowking, a mon who had no prior usage in tours , also showed up in a team with slowbro as a chek to etern as well as having breaking capabilities thanks to NP. This core was dubbed as "slowtwins" by the creator lydia. Glowking would later become a top mon in the meta for a while thanks to an additional set.
      • A meta-changing game was lydia vs pichus g1 as it introduced Zacian back in the meta but with a different set , Choice Band. CB would push zacian to be a terrific wall-breaker and the mon, which was in the shadow realm ever since dlc 2 got released, suddenly would become a top threat.
      • Rise of Regieleki: Another Major Development in the meta during this tour was Regieleki's rose to relevancy. While originally thought to be sub-par at best , Eleki's access to rapid spin and volt switch made it a popular choice in offense teams as it was able to generate momentum vs everthing and -ate explosion made sure it could trade it off in unfavourable situations. A bit of this rise also came from gman making his very successful team public, which plenty of users used in the tour.
      • Perhaps directly related to Eleki's rise during that time , MnM Open also saw a rise in use of offensive teams over the traditional BO/ Balance , ranging from lydia's ttar offense to webs used by jordy and stresh.
  • While glowking mainly used sablenite and Cameruptite after slowtwins became a staple core , the meta was introduced to a different set in a team brought during OMGS playoffs. This team def deserves a highlight as the set would quickly take the meta by surprise , establishing it as one of the top options for balance.

This Spikes Bulky Balance team made by stresh not only introduced to aggronite glowking - a mon that could check Zacian v well while also function as an Regieleki switch in and a cm breaker but also brought Zygarde-Complete into relevancy. The rest of the defensive core of the team is also extremely solid with HDB blissey as hazard removal, blissey functioning as a pivot and Ampharosite Skarmory as a moldy hazard setter with toxic. CB Zacian as the sole breaker might seen doubtful but with spikes support, it does its job well.

[Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: xavgb vs. Chazm - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com)

Zacian Ban and Ompl IX
  • Soon Zacian was Suspect Tested and was Banned. During the Suspect , Stresh built a team with Scizorite Weavile , which surprisingly did well against the traditional cores being used in the meta as magearna was generally in a downward trend. Another set that started to gain popularity right before ompl, created by lydia was 4a aerodactlylite Solgaleo. Boasting the power that metagrossite sets lacked , with flare blitz + Wild charge/ Crunch Solg was able to get past through Ho-oh and Sablenite Bro.

  • This was also the time lydia started advocating for LO offensive and Power Herb Eternatus . While not immediately accepted as the main set , LO slowly did start to replace metronome even in defensive sets.

  • Ompl soon started and there was a lot of change in the meta:-
    • Regieleki and Ho-oH continued to dominate. Magearna finally returned to the top ranks of the meta, being a good blanket check in most balance/ offense teams.

    • :Groudon: / :Swampert: : Ground-types which were considered basically a necessity to stop regieleki branched out as Lando-T soon wasn't the only viable one. Groudon , a mon qways spammed a lot in ladder , was brought in his w1 game (funnily enough , cata brought it as well). Groudon was an excellent rocker , being able to perform both defensive and offensive roles with its access to SD. Pert on the other hand continued it niche , being a good enabler in offensive teams.

    • Week 2 saw the first use of CM defensive solg. While it had a very disappointing result , this set would become a major force later in the meta (altho with mystical fire / flamethrower over fire spin).

    • Week 3 was a big one as stall finally was re-introduced in the meta with both fardin bringing it and tect using it vs andy . Before this point Stall was considered p average and mu fishy but both of these teams were strong and did well vs most of the standard teams. Fardin's team in particular would see reuse in later weeks and even after ompl ended. Lydia would also bring stall the next week and claim another W for the archetype. In the same game vs tect , Andy also created a new varient of Cosmic Power Eternatus. Catalystic also brought the same set vs lydia , showing its prowess as it would've clinched the win if not for the crit.

    • :Urshifu-Rapid strike: :While Urshifu Rapid Strike did see some faint usage after zac ban and even in week 2 game of tect vs qways , qways structure of future sight + Urshifu-RS vs fardin brought back the mon as a top threat. Later fardin would display more of shifu's prowess in his playoff game against lydia's stall.

    • :Genesect: / :Lunala: : Another mon that notoriously became a top threat was Cameruptite Genesect. Created by lydia , it was used in plenty of teams to high success as Shift gear + Leech life and bolt beam coverage ended up being too good for the meta's then defensive core. Since there were a lot of hyper offensive teams used in the tour (esp in the later half),Power Herb Lunala also enjoyed some success in those structures often accompanying gene.

    • :Magnezone: : Magnezone also made an appearance this ompl with its Lucarionite sets , taking advantage of the corviknight and Mag running around while also enjoying the fact that ground types like groudon coudn't easily switch in vs it. Qt's week 6 game shows its viability. Zone would enjoy even more success in a later tour.

    • :Pheromosa: / :Dragonite: : Pheromosa finally started popping off in the later half of the meta , with sets like aerodactylite and lopunnite making appearances with Toxic as its 4th move to annoy Ho-oh. Finally , a major development would be the downfall of dragonite as the mon crashed from being the top mon in the meta to being extremely mid. Dragonite faced stiff competition from Entei as an -ate speeder and regieleki's rise in usage also didnt help its cause..........
...However , Dragonite was part of a very strong team made in this tour which was definitely one of the best rendition of HO in the meta and this team was once again made by the former-TL.

This screens HO team utlizes Eleki's reliability as a screen setter and Pert's ability as pivot to position its abusers to sweep through rest of the team. Both the espeeders in the team run inner focus, to beat manectite mons. Cameruptie Gene can set up against variety of defensive mons while Xern takes advantage of slow pivots like corviknight , pert , mew , bro under screens to get a sub up and potentially sweep. This team has withstood the test of time as it enjoyed success in a later tour as well and imo , is still equally viable.

[Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: Quantum Tesseract vs. fardin ❤ - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com) [Ompl IX finals]
[Gen 8] Mix and Mega replay: Tectonicdestroyer vs. Dragonillis - Pokémon Showdown (pokemonshowdown.com) [Wcoom pools phase]
  • Post OMPL development and WCooM IV :-
    Apart from rise in Xerneas and Urshifu-R and Eternatus being the dominant force, the meta didnt see much development after ompl ended. Just before the start of WcooM though​
    • Lydia introduced some new threats in the metagame in the form of Magnezone and Kyurem. While Lucarionite Magnezone wasn't something unhead of , lydia's set ran steel beam , thus allowing magnezone to delete grounds like hippowdon , groudon and Landorus-T. This made zone a potent threat, altho it also lead to rise in pert usage. Kyurem with heracronite and substitute was once thought to be unviable thanks to magearna and solgaleo but it soon became apparent that kyurem could easily stall mag out and set up with dragon dance and sweep in addition to already being able to set up vs slowbro.
    • Wcoom soon started and this "Kyu-zone balance" did see some success as seen in Lydia vs fakee. Kyu-Zone balance would be seen in another game , with both players bringing it.
    • Another major development was the rise of milotic after lydia's game vs tect. While Milotic was used before this , especially by qways on ladder and even in ompl and by stresh as well , it saw a quick surge after users recognized its capability to beat common set up sets like cameruptite genesect with haze and its ability to pivot vs eternatus. Speaking of Eternatus , Stuff like Tran also saw surge in usage as it was able to check etern and entei well pre-mega while being a solid hazard setter.
    • This was also the time Magearna and Entei started having some changes in its set. Magearna would often run Grass Knot as its 4th move , a set created by shing , to catch pert off guard or run dazzling gleam over fleur canon to win vs kyurem. Entei on the other hand , deviated from its howl sets and started preferring double edge more.
    • Pheromosa and Urshifu also continued to dominate which lead to a lot of speculation on one / both being too unhealthy for the meta. Double Fighting structures utilizing both the mons also picked up at the end of the tour and even saw success in circuit finals game.​


Phero and Urshifu -S , owing to increased cry amongst the community , were restricted by the council via a unanimous vote. MnM open soon started a week after and some early trends after restriction of the meta's premier fighting types seen in the tour were:-

  • :Eternatus: / :Heatran: : Eternatus Continued its rampage , easily being the most important mon in the meta. In response, Heatran usage surged even more , making it meta's premier spd wall alongside milo.​
  • :Zapdos-Galar: / :Zeraora: : Both of these mons rose to the forefront as the fighting types in the meta. While Zapdos-G either ran Metagrossite or Aerodactylite and abused the combination of tkick + uturn , Lopunnite Zeraora offered more speed and the ability to threaten milo mag rhyp cores.​
  • :Landorus-Therian: : A direct result of the bans , Lando-T enjoyed Urshifu going and surge in Zeraora usage , as it was a hard wall to its lopunnite set. It also could force trade off vs milotic while also checking Groudon and Regieleki.​
  • :Zapdos: : A set discovered by lydia , Cameruptite zap soon became a monster threat in the meta. Blissey's usage was at all time low thanks to etern and Zapdos could take advantage of the eternatus checks like Heatran and Milotic. This wallbreaking capability can be seen in this game
  • :Solgaleo: : Venusaurite / Manectite Bulky CM Solgaleo sets also made an appearance in the open , mostly in fat balance used by jordy and created by lydia. A solid check to eternatus while also functioning as wincons , these Solg sets would further rise in usage in Ompl.​
  • :Lunala: / :Hydreigon: : After being a bit out of action due to the fighting mania previously caused by shifu and Phero , Lunala enjoyed decent usage in the MnM open , especially with its Power herb Meteor Beam set , which allowed it to get pass through mandi as well as blissey. My finals g3 vs jordy and fardin's game is a good example of this. Absolite Hydreigon made an appearance in my finals g2 game vs qt having a niche as to be faster than etern and meta solg. This set would later surge in usage in ompl meta.​

Eternatus was finally banned after the Open via a one sided suspect test. This leads to our current metagame. Ompl X should be fresh in most people's mind but the key points from the tour was:-
  • :Blissey: : Eternatus Ban meant Blissey could finally roam free and wasted no time to get at the top of the meta. Both Ampharosite and Sablenite sets were seen almost equally in usage. Blissey's rise affected a lot of mons viability like Zapdos, Cameruptite Gene and even Heatran , which faced competition for the ampharosite slot.

  • :Entei: / :Zapdos-Galar: : Both lost one of their best offensive check , making them the top offensive mon in the meta. Both Entei and Zapdos-G enjoyed success in Ompl and generally can get past their checks with small effort thus making few member of the community worried about their healthiness in the tier

  • :Barraskewda: / :Buzzwole: : The meta got introduced to two new viable fighting types in the form of lopunnite barraskewda and buzzwole. Barraskewda started seeing use after spindas brought it week 5 , as it was able to take advantage of milo builds and was faster than majority of the meta. Buzz proved to be more sturdier option , having a good match up vs traditional defensive cores involving bro and Lando-T.

  • :Solgaleo: : The biggest meta devlopment was Solg's shift from metagrossite to Bulky CM set. Initially running Manectitie / Venusaurite , Cameruptite sets with thunder saw use at the end of the tour , being able to get past Ho-oh and Milotic , two of its hard answers. These sets were also seen being successful in OMFL.

And that brings us to the present. I dont think the ongoing ssnl is gonna affect the meta much as i generally expect team tours to set different trends but who knows. Anyway , Gen8 MnM was cool and i can only hope it goes out in style in the upcoming omwc.

This post took me wayyyy too long to write but im glad im done with it . S/o Gman for the stag replays cuz i couldnt them find them anywhere and to Osake for finally retiring , Enjoy the time off brother.
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Hasta Siempre
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That’s cool and all bro but

who asked?

(Dont delete pls it’s been 2 weeks that he’s complaining of his post all the time and I’m such a good supporting friend all of this to have a « thanks for finally retiring » smh ihu flix)
Want a glass cannon that takes both of those to the max? Then have I got the mon for you:

Azelf @ Diancite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- U-turn
- Psychic
- Flamethrower
- Dazzling Gleam

This thing has paper defenses but its sky high special attack can just blast through some otherwise decently bulky mons especially if it can catch them on a switch. Dies to any sort of priority and the occasional outspeed which mostly just means the occasional ditto, but outside of that you can customize the moveset to your liking. You can even go with a -spdef or -def nature(-spdef is maybe better since most of the strong priority is physical but those usually more than oneshot so it might not matter much) so you can run explosion or just for the stronger U-Turn. Don't expect it to sweep but if you have a bulky pivot you can easily get a lot of chip onto the opponent's team

And in a similar vein:

Dracozolt @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bolt Beak
- Dragon Claw
- High Horsepower
- Fire Fang

Admittedly struggles to get an opportunity to shine but when it can(usually against slow walls) it can tear them up. Dracovish is probably better but I didn't realize it could run a mega until after I made this set so :)
The mix and Mega council is now considering action on Solgaleo. Long a staple on offensive teams as a powerful physical attacker and speed control, it's recently gained traction with additional sets like bulky calm mind or special wallbreaker seeing more usage, which might push it over the edge. If you have thoughts on Solgaleo and its place in our metagame, or on whether or not it should be suspect tested, please feel free to share them here or on discord, both for us on council and the userbase at large.

Given the timing, if implemented this would likely be the last tiering action for gen 8 Mix and Mega while it remains the primary generation.


One small yeet for man, one giant yeet for mankind
I was shocked to learn Solg was ever allowed, I don't have anything to add beyond whats obvious (strength, bulk, speed, -ate resist, etc.)..

I did just want to add that I've also been getting great value with a bulky Future Sight Teleport set (I use latiasite, but Venu and Sabe are also viable). It's really effective to slow pivot to a physical sweeper like SG Mag who can then set up on common switches (Blissey) and will appreciate potential walls being chipped by FSight. I believe it's actually a relatively common & viable strategy in AG, and it's just improved in MnM with the stats boost and ability options like Levitate. Set also completely walls things like Lando-T, and can switch into Dragonite and Regi and many others
Solgaleo @ Latiasite
Ability: Full Metal Body
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
- Sunsteel Strike
- Future Sight
- Morning Sun
- Teleport
The mix and Mega council has voted to suspect Solgaleo

Gonna be honest here I think Cam CM Solg is a bit too much for most teams to deal with, it's far too bulky to really remove easily, and its power is at the very least intimidating. Pair this with the other CM sets that are practically impossible to kill and only really have counterplay via boosting alongside it or phasing, and things get really tough to deal with. It's also worth mentioning that there's a bit of an annoying coverage game with physical Solgaleo - whilst this isn't exactly what I think makes Solgaleo busted, it is further evidence to suggest it is suspect worthy. There are several different annoying coverage options (Flare Blitz, Wild Charge, Crunch, etc.) that make certain checks just not work (see Manectite Magearna, certain Ground types if Aero vs Meta) and therefore, consistent counterplay ends up being pretty limited. Though if it weren't for the CM stuff I'd say Solg would be fine tbh.

I'm in favor of a solg test mostly just because I think that the amount of set variety is just pretty unmanageable atm. It's usually kinda hard to determine the stone of Solg at preview (I have made teams with all 6 mons the same and easily swapped stones around w/ Solg) and guessing wrong switching into it can be awful. Like if you switch into Hooh expecting like, meta and it ends up being Aero Wild Charge or Camel Thunder/Tbolt you're really fucked, and if it ends up being Venu then your whole game plan has to change. Overall I think it's just on thin ice atm and while I am not necessarily in favor of a ban bc I think Solg is important to the tier, it would be a good idea to suspect it.

Or going lando on unrevealed solg and it ends up being lati, like that's just… each set has largely different counterplay and it's just so aggravating.

venu - https://pokepast.es/7d3a46dd6d3cde03
lati - https://pokepast.es/b11eacac611158c3
camel - https://pokepast.es/4ddfa34272d0e814
aero - https://pokepast.es/757fbed585da12ff

The top 2 comps are pretty identical while the third and fourth are a bit different, but on preview solg fats can basically be like anything. Which is the main issue imo, just hard to account for in-game and in the builder due to the set diversity.

I am currently unsure on a solg suspect. I think I would currently vote dnb, but it's at least close to the level of a suspect being warranted. Generally i feel the CM sets are a threat on par with lunala a few months back, very threatening to some kinds of teams and with good bulk + splashability that makes it relatively painless to fit on a team, but fundementally not actually broken even before the metagame adapted to it. What makes me nervous is yes that Solg is, if less immediately threatening, significantly more versatile than Lunala was and correspondingly difficult to answer unrevealed. It's physical sets are a significantly net positive impact on the metagame in my eyes in isolation, but they do put extra pressure on special solg checks and place more emphasis on determining which one you are facing from team preview, which while skill based is not the dynamic we want to be relying on. There is definitely no specific set that is, in isolation, broken, but each of its variant sets are good enough that most of the opportunity cost of running niche sets to bypass counterplay is gone.

Overall, if I think there's one thing that puts me up to the threshhold it is the rise of cam solg, which is generally worse than lati or venu imo but good enough and fundementally different enough from the two that it adds noticably more pressure on counterplay.

Be sure to post your requirements in the Thread by October 30th!


is a Tiering Contributor
hello mix and mega


this funny little HO team got me to 1400 for like a fleeting moment but i was wondering how i could change it to not get bodied by solgaleo and pult and zera and eleki
nice start to a team but the biggest issues i see are a lack of role diversity and synergy as a whole. ive gone ahead and reworked the team to make it work a bit better while still having some of the same elements (skewda, xurk)
paste: https://pokepast.es/1ad498f846c0791a
i first removed terrakion, dragonite, and shuckle because theyre either worse than other options or just dont fit in well together. i then made skewda lopunnite to pair better with its stabs while being a much more effective pivot and diancite xurkitree to properly abuse its stats while revenge killing up to 147s like gzap, victini, adamant skewda, and more. lele is now lucarionite to break better while still being able to slam non-defensive solgaleo with shadow ball on the switch (somewhat, its still incredibly bulky). most special attackers are also setup fodder for lele like magearna and slowbro, so dont be afraid to set up one late game for them.

lando-t, milotic and heatran were all added to give the team a defensive backbone. lando-t acts as a bulky breaker and defogger. the given spread hits a jump point for attack, lives a sablenite slowbro ice beam always, and outspeeds adamant entei. milotic is standard spread and acts as a slow pivot, a dragapult answer, a backup entei and cm solg check for when heatran is too risky, and a general setup remover. heatran serves as the primary entei and solgaleo answer, but also can set stealth rock reliably, toxic sablenite walls like blissey, and trap other threats like thunderbolt tapu koko and (when heatran isnt mega'd) non-scald slowking-galar
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