SM OU New OU Team

[Brembo]

Hey guys

Long story short, I abandoned my old OU team, and tried to create something a little different.

As with every team I tend to build, I am using pokemon that I legitimately have on the cartridge format of this game, however don't let that interfere with any advice you can give.

I have peaked at 1599 on Showdown, still can't break into the 1600's much to my annoyance.

Any help would be appreciated.

Team can be previewed here: https://pokepast.es/09cea91dec6055b0

Advice/help is much appreciated

Anyway, the team is as follows:

Venusaur-Mega (M) @ Venusaurite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 60 Def / 200 SpD
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Leech Seed
- Synthesis

Venusaur is my main wall, It has solid defences (326 in each stat) and pressures many things in the game such as Keldeo, Tapu Bulu, Magnearna and Tapu Fini as well as annoys a number of other threats. This provides a number of safe switch ins for my team.

Giga Drain is used to hit things like Landorus and Zygarde solidly (Prevents Zygarde from making substitutes and setting up) Sludge Bomb deals with Tapu Bulu and Tapu Koko, as well as does solid damage to common switchins like hawlucha. Leech Seed is used to annoy and recover HP, and synthesis is used to keep Venusaur healthy.

Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Magma Storm
- Earth Power
- Toxic
- Taunt

Heatran is used as it provides some defensive use thanks to its large number of resistances, but it is mainly used to trap or scare away pokemon such as magnearna. It is even able to somewhat deal with Toxapex thanks to taunt.

Magma Storm is used to trap as well as to hit with solid damage. (This 2HKO's Landorus, allowing you to kill defensive spread varients that switch in to you). Earth Power is used for coverage and against other Heatrans and also Toxapex. Toxic is used to status when possible, and Taunt is run over substitute because this stops Clefable from setting up on me and wiping my team out, otherwise Substitute would be used instead. I changed the EV's slightly from the standard spread, as I didn't feel i needed the extra defence, and as far as I can tell, 44 defensive ev's main use is to reduce Mega Sableye's ability to break your substitute to 10%.

Greninja (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Dark Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Water Shuriken

Ninja is used to pressure and dent teams mid to late game. It has solid coverage and access to priority which allow me to pick off weakened threats that are speed boosted for example.

Hydro Pump does solid damage to a lot of things, Dark pulse hits tapu lele decently while allowing you to keep your immunity to scarf lele who usually comes in against Venusaur to psychic or psyshock. Ice Beam hits Zygarde, Dragonite, Tapu Bulu for really high damage and puts a dent in a lot of others. Water Shuriken is used for priority mostly, and on rare occasions to remove my dark typing against faster/speed boosted threats.

Hawlucha (M) @ Electric Seed
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 104 HP / 252 Atk / 152 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- High Jump Kick
- Acrobatics
- Drain Punch

Late game sweeper. Standard set. Comes in during Electric Surge on someting it can set up on, consumes its Electric Seed and Swords Dances or attacks.

Swords Dance used, because this thing is terrifying at +2, however have considered bulk up as an option as well. High Jump kick does massive damage, as does acrobatics after consuming electric seed. Drain punch is used to recover HP as well as safeguard against protect users I would otherwise use HJK on.

Landorus-Therian @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Fly
- Stealth Rock

Landorus is used because if provides a Fighting resistance, and a ground immunity to my team, as well as having solid bulk and hitting physical pokemon with intimidate. It is also a very reliable user of stealth rock.

Flynium Z is used to OHKO Mega Venusaur, and also opposing Hawlucha should these thrown in. Stealth rock is used to wear opposing teams down, earthquake for a powerful stab move, U-Turn is used to gather momentum.

Tapu Koko @ Choice Specs
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Volt Switch
- U-turn

Tapu Koko is used for a number of reasons. It is vital for Hawlucha, and on top of that it is a very hard hitting fast pokemon that is extremely difficult to switch in against, especially when ground type pokemon have been removed.

Thunder bolt is used for huge damage against anything that doesn't resist it. Dazzling Gleam to hit Zygarde, and also 2HKO and Landorus who try to switch in to it. Volt switch keeps up momentum and also hits very hard, and U-Turn is used over HP Ice and Grass Knot (My cartridge version does not have HP Ice anyway) to safely keep up momentum when the opposition still has Ground types on their team.

Overall, this team has been a lot of fun to use, however it is far from perfect, here are a few of the glaring issues I have:

No Hazard Control, Rocks is not of a huge concern to this team, so I went without a defogger or spinner. However, sticky web is a huge problem for this team, and nobody wants to switch into the combination of spikes and stealth rocks, however it is extremely rare anybody has managed to get up more than 1 layer of spikes on top of stealth rock against me.

Clefable with cosmic power caused nightmares to this team, which is why I put taunt on Heatran.

Mega Alakazam messes this team up, however it is fairly uncommon.

Mega Medichan and Tapu Lele can cause this team problems when it comes in to revenge kill.

 

[Indigo Plateau]

Hey Brembo! This is a neat Mega Venusaur balance team, which are usually very solid overall as they do a good job at blanket checking a vast majority of the metagame while not being completely passive. I like the fact that you included a threat list in the end, as it helps the rater think about what threatens your team and ways to improve it. Without further ado, let's get right into it!

Overview

Before we get into the threats / suggestions, I wanted to talk a little about your team as a whole, its synergy, and the individual members. First, Venusaur's spread is a bit sub-optimal, unless you're using it for a specific reason (which you should state). You support Venusaur well by having Heatran, since the two have pretty good type synergy. Greninja provides offensive presence and forms a basic FWG core, although Greninja is in a weird scenario. If you want to run that movepool on it, you're better off going with Ash-Ninja, since you're losing out on Protean's main draw of free stab on every move. Lando-T is a good glue and an electric + ground immunity for your team, but the spread is contradictory - a Fly-Z defensive one. Koko + Hawlucha rounds out the team for more overall offensive presence. There are several changes that can be done here, but keep in mind that I'm not sure what pokemon you have in your cartridge game, so I'm just making the best changes possible.


Threats

Hazards
Like you mentioned, you have no hazard removal, which is crucial when it comes down to these types of balance teams. This meta is ruled by hazards, and having no way to remove them means that Venusaur and Heatran aren't lasting as long as they should, and your offensive presence is limited because Greninja and Koko are taking damage every time they come in. You mentioned that Webs are more of an issue than Rocks, but I disagree - Webs aren't all that common atm, whereas Rocks are very easy to fit on a team and all of your pokemon are taking neutral damage vs them. This is going to involve replacing at least one pokemon for Defog / Rapid Spin support.

Tapu Lele + Mega Zam are indeed annoying for your team, as everything on your team either straight up dies to their stab or, in Heatran's case, takes a ton from Focus Blast. Mega Zam outspeeds everything on your team bar Hawlucha, but you have to watch out for Lele interrupting Koko's terrain and preventing Hawlucha from getting a speed boost. If that happens, then Zam proceeds to kill every member on your team, especially since it can trace Heatran's Flash Fire.

Without hazard removal, you're going to struggle to keep Venusaur healthy. This is really problematic if your opponent has a SG Magearna, as when Venusaur is gone, nothing is stopping it from using Z Fight on Heatran and disposing of everything else on your team. Hawlucha can outspeed at +2, but if it gets two SG's and nabs a KO under any circumstance, it's game over.

Mega Venusaur balance builds are usually a happy time for Kyurem-B, as it gets to come in and pick up some very easy kills. Your team is no different. Tapu Koko scares out Greninja, Heatran, and Hawlucha, gets a free U-Turn as you switch into Lando or Venusaur, and then Kyu-B is almost always going to kill something for free.

Although usually rain wouldn't trouble these types of builds too much (you see Toxapex on them a lot of the times), yours only has Venusaur as a true water resist. Venusaur is very easy to overload, as you're not recovering a lot under Rain, you're constantly switching into Kingdra + Swampert, and Ferrothorn gets to set up two free layers of spikes. It'd only be a matter of time until Swampert or Kingdra come in, outspeed everything, and clean up (not to mention the high chance of opposing Hawlucha too).

Zygarde has taken a hit from its previous glory days, but that's not to say that you don't see it around anymore. A Sub + Boost set (primarily Coil) can be a pain for your team to break under the right circumstance. If your Koko happens to be choice locked into an electric move, Zyg can set up a Sub and then boost up with Coil. Your own Lando does a bad job at handling it, since you don't have HP Ice and it's defensive, so it can be used as setup bait. After a few boosts, this can easily click 1k Arrows and/or ESpeed (depending on the set) to clean up or deal massive damage vs your team.


Suggestions

I'll be suggesting two different versions of the team. In one, I'll keep the offensive core of Koko + Hawlucha, and in the other, I'll remove it. For both, however, I'll account for the weaknesses I pointed out before and try to make them as solid as possible while retaining your initial team structure.

For both versions:

Standard Spread > Current Spread
I'm not sure why you're running the spread you are, and unless it's to reach a certain benchmark, you should stick to the spread given in the Smogon dex. I copied the set below, but you can always look it up for reference. Taken straight from the dex: "It avoids the 2HKO from pre-transformation Battle Bond Greninja's Choice Specs-boosted Dark Pulse after damage from Stealth Rock and one layer of Spikes while also avoiding the 2HKO from Choice Specs-boosted Extrasensory with no entry hazards up."

Set

Venusaur @ Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 248 HP / 88 Def / 156 SpD / 16 Spe
Calm Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Synthesis
- Hidden Power Fire

Offensive Spread > Defensive Spread
Your Lando-T spread is contradictory, since you're running an offensive set with defensive EV's. I recommend that you opt for an offensive Lando-T. This ensures that you can get up Rocks on opposing Lando-T's, and also win any potential speed ties against other offensive ones. I opted for Swords Dance as it lets you break past fatter teams easier, but if the likes of Celesteela are too annoying, then you can always swap it out with Gravity.

Set

Landorus-Therian @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Fly
- Swords Dance
- Stealth Rock

>

This change isn't as straightforward as the two above, but I think it'll benefit you in the long run. Venusaur + Celesteela are a very potent defensive core and you basically always see these two together due to their flawless type synergy. Celesteela still scares out Clef (plus you have a Venusaur) and also provides an extra Ground immunity to relieve some pressure off of Lando. Celesteela also makes your team harder to break due to Leech Seed while making you less weak to the likes of Psychic spam and rain.

Celesteela

Celesteela @ Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 248 HP / 104 Def / 156 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Heavy Slam
- Flamethrower

Version #1:

>

You're still missing hazard control, and the easiest way to fix that is by opting for Mantine > Greninja. Not only does this make your team more balanced overall, it also gives a valuable water immunity so that Venusaur doesn't get too worn down constantly switching into Ash-Ninja, Pert, etc. LO Gren with the current moveset on your build doesn't really add much to the team unless you make it Scarf to revenge kill, but with Hawlucha in the back, I think you can afford to run Mantine as your Defogger. This also gives you a good defensive backbone in Venusaur + SWG, while Koko and Hawlucha serve as threats to more offensive teams. You can opt to run Haze over Toxic if set up sweepers like Volc or Clef scare you, but I don't think that's a complete necessity on this build.

Mantine

Mantine @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 136 Def / 124 SpD
Calm Nature
- Roost
- Scald
- Toxic
- Defog

Version #2:

>

This isn't a mon by mon replacement, so it might be a bit harder to explain. Clefable can be used as your Rocker over Lando, allowing you to run a full out offensive set on it. It also forms the infamous VenuClefSteela core, which is incredibly hard to break if you don't prep for it correctly. CM Clef adds as a solid wincon to your team while beating SP Clef, although I haven't really seen any of those lately. If you don't want to opt for Mantine as your defogger, I think you should run Latios here. It has good type synergy with the rest of your team and is good for role compression on your team. I chose Soul Dew since it lets you hit relatively hard without losing damage while also increasing your bulk. Like I mentioned in the beginning, these changes are more about the type synergy on your team and it's something you'd have to test out to understand.

Clefable

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Calm Mind

Latios

Latios @ Soul Dew
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Recover
- Defog

Now that you gave up Hawlucha as a cleaner, you need speed control on your team. Scarf Greninja does just that, outspeeding the entire unboosted meta. The movepool below is the best, as it lets you pressure key threats to your team: U-Turn is for switch initiative as well as the likes of Psychic spam, Rock Slide helps you revenge Volc and Kyu-B, Ice Beam is an excellent stab option that will always hit and eliminates grounds like Zygarde and Lando, and Hydro Pump is the last move since it'll hit the hardest and is your best option vs SG Magearna. This movepool, along with a Scarf, benefits your team much more than your current one, as it takes advantage of Greninja's versatility to make your balance defensive core able to take more hits by pressuring out the mons that scare it.

Set

Greninja @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Protean
EVs: 176 Atk / 80 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Rock Slide
- U-turn
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump

Final Team #1:

Final Team #2:

Conclusion

Overall, you have two options depending on what type of team you want to run. Version #1 is a balanced team that relies on walling and wearing down threats until Koko + Hawlucha can clean up, while Version #2 is a more defensive than the first. I think they're most solid than your initial build, but they still have their respective threats. Tapu Koko + Kyu-B scare the hell out of both, but it's hard to build against those two when you choose Mega Venusaur balance. Stall is incredibly hard to break, but thankfully that's not as common you basically auto-lose). Pinsir is a huge threat to #2 when Celesteela is weakened, as it cleans up at +2, but it's also fallen off the radar quite a bit. If you run into Koko + Hawlucha with #1, you need to make sure you play around it carefully and keep your own Koko/Celesteela healthy for their Hawlucha. Try both teams out, and if you have any questions, I'll be more than happy to answer them. Gl, and hope this helped!

 

[Brembo]

Hi there

First of all let me say thank you for taking the time to respond to this.

First of all, in relation to a couple of your points, just in case your curious.

The spread of Venusaur was used because it balances his defences giving him 326 in each stat.

Flyinium Z was used on my defensive landorus because it takes out several Pokemon that are otherwise troublesome such as Mega Venusaur and Tangrowth. I used a defensive spread to add some solidarity to my team

As far as your suggestions go, I am about to go test Suggestion 1. Plenty of useful points there, much appreciated.

 

[Flame from Heaven]

Hi there

First of all let me say thank you for taking the time to respond to this.

First of all, in relation to a couple of your points, just in case your curious.

The spread of Venusaur was used because it balances his defences giving him 326 in each stat.

Flyinium Z was used on my defensive landorus because it takes out several Pokemon that are otherwise troublesome such as Mega Venusaur and Tangrowth. I used a defensive spread to add some solidarity to my team

As far as your suggestions go, I am about to go test Suggestion 1. Plenty of useful points there, much appreciated.

Generally competitive battling has proven that splitting Evs is a bad idea unless you want to a survive a certain benchmark. For an example, putting 156 Evs on celesteelas spdef is a good idea because it lets it survive 2 choice specs lele psychics. Unless if you can justify what 60 defense Evs does that the standard doesn’t, I would change the venu set.