No Foursome ;-; (OU RMT)

Wilechase

So I decided I really needed a new team for no reason at all, I just wanted one. I also wanted to make something without the usual combo I use (infernape/jirachi/salamence/rotom-a). So I said I would try to not use more than one of those, and make a team that works. This is what came out of it. Also, after testing this team more, I was able to LB for the first time ever. I peaked at like 1520, then started playing like shit. Still, not increadibly bad. Changes are in bold.





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Mamoswine (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Protect/Superpower
This was more or less a random choice for my team. I picked out everyone else, and I just needed a lead. I looked through leads, and I saw mamoswine. I haven't used one for awhile, and looking at the metagame, it seemed like it would help. It has been doing well so far. So lay up rocks, EQ for STAB, Ice Shard for STAB. Protect helps me scout for moves, such as a scarfer move, beating infernape leads, and the such. Testing out Superpower in the last slot over protect. Haven't used it much, so no conclusion. Changed nature to jolly as to help outspeed lead heatrans. The only significant thing I lose is the ability to have a chance to kill metagross with the combo of EQ + Ice Shard, which isn't huge.



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Infernape (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk/192 Spd/64 SAtk
Naive nature (+Spd, -SDef)
- Close Combat
- Overheat
- Mach Punch/U-Turn
- Hidden Power [Ice]
Now when I added this, I already had the 4 guys listed below. I didn't have much of a clue at first. Then I decided I needed a good special sweeper, and a way to kill blissey more efficiently. Ape seemed like a good fit. CC for strong STAB, Overheat for STAB and hits harder than fire blast, Mach Punch for TTar and Lucario revenge kills. I have also been told to exchange the Mach Punch slot with U-Turn, as it is usually the butter of the set. I have done testing, and its more like half the time I need U-Turn, half Mach Punch, so dunno. HP ice may seem like a pretty big outlier on a physical mixape, and normally u-turn would go there. Some of my friends said I would have some trouble with salamence, so thats half the reason I added mamo. So someone suggested I run an ape with HP ice after I decided to run physical mix. With it, I can lure in mence, gliscor, and dragonite, and kill them all. It has worked pretty well so far.



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Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Iron Head
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch
- U-Turn
So after taking some advice from snorlaxe, I took the spot that was once held by my scarf tyranitar, and put jirachi in its place. With it, I have a bit more solid of a check to dragons, and be able to take on tyranitar a bit better. The only problem is that now rotom has a bit easier time getting around my team, but it can probably be handled by celebi since I am usually faster, and can take it out, since scarf rotom is barely used anymore. Anyways, this is basically standard scarf jirachi. Iron Head for STAB and flinching, Fire Punch checks scizor and lucario, and hurts other steels, Ice Punch for dragons, and U-Turn for scouting. To be honest though, it seems like jirachi and tyranitar might be interchangeable, depending on how I use them.



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Celebi @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 232 HP/36 Spd/240 SAtk
Modest nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Thunder Wave
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Recover
Part one of the defensive core I wanted. I have never had anything successful with a tinkerbell celebi, and really wanted something, because I knew it had the potential. So this was the first basis for the team. I knew that this would provide me with a way to speed my opponent down, and bring potential to hit them better. T-Wave cripples, Leaf Storm for STAB, and OHKOs tyranitar because of the life orb damage. HP fire hits steels not named heatran, and other grass types, and recover to keep this thing living. I also took 4 sp atk evs and put them into speed so I could still outspeed tyranitars that aren't scarfed.



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Vaporeon (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 188 HP/252 Def/68 Spd
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Surf
- Hidden Power [Electric]
Now that I had celebi, I wanted a good supporter. Fire types were one of my concerns, and I knew the perfect check/counter to them, vaporeon. I also knew with it, I could provide nice wish support. So Wish for healing and support, protect to get wish healing, or to scout a move and goto the proper check, Surf hits for STAB, HP electric provides a more solid gyarados check than celebi, and hits opposing water types.



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Gyarados (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
Now that I had my defensive core, I needed a sweeper. I looked through both vaporeons and celebis analysis', and looked for a sweeper that would be covered by both. I also looked at what they took down, and with what they could do, gyarados seemed a sound option. So I opted for life orb over leftovers to gain more power, and I also have wish support being ran, so prior damage + SS won't be the biggest concern. Waterfall for STAB, Stone Edge provides great coverage by hitting fliers, EQ hits steels that may be a nuisince. I opted for it over bounce, as the rest of my team can deal with what bounce would want to hit, same with ice fang. Trying out jolly. Helps me deal with heatrans that want to explode on me, and also beat jolteons. Kinda missing the power, but not sure.





So thats my team, hope you like it. Leave any rates, all appreciated.
 
A bulky water-type with a STAB Surf and Thunderbolt could present a huge problem for this team, seeing as only Celebi can counter, and the possibility of the Opponent having Icebeam is high. Interesting Infernape, I won't comment on it because it seems situational so if it works for you great. But you may want to consider covering up that hole left by any Bulky Water type.
 
So basically you are refering to a starmie being able to do a number. Well, considering starmie cannot OHKO my vaporeon, and Ice Beam most likely won't OHKO celebi, thats a safe bet. I also have tyranitar for starmie, so its not much of a threat.
 
A Quick Rate:

Give T-Tar Superpower and a CB preferably over Stone Edge/Choice Scarf, as it will help the cause in the war against Blissey and open up a free spot (Infernapes no good if T-Tar has Superpower) for another Pokemon.

In Infernapes slot should go Heatran, as it makes a great Revenge Killer, and can add a lot of extra damage to the opponents Pokemon. As a bonus, sandstorm doesn't affect it and Gyara can come in on Ground Attacks aimed at it and set up.
 
Getting rid of the scarf on tyranitar would mean I lose a way to check important threats to my team. Do you know the merits of running scarf tyranitar? And getting rid of stone edge, what, just no.

And is there any real merit for switching ape out for heatran, you didn't really state any.
 
Very quick rate.

Try using U-turn over Mach Punch on ape and with that EV spread use Fire Blast, i can see why you have Mach Punch but in my experience in the OU metagame it is almost always dire to let latias have a free switch in. With U-turn you instead gain a tempo out of this scenario as you can either go to Mamo and Ice Shard, or to TTar and pursuit. This team cannot handle a Draco Meteor to save its life and it will highly compromise your defensive core once it hits home. U-turn should prevent this from happening. Now i realise this opens you up in particular to DD TTar and SD Lucario to some extent, but overall you will not get so destroyed by Latias whilst you will still be able to handle these Pokemon to some extent through Scarf Tar and Gyarados for Lucario as insurance, Celebi will probably lure in TTar regardless so it shouldnt be too much of an issue. As added insurance, i suggest Superpower over EQ, to ensure that you get that KO on opposing TTar, and of course for the superior type coverage in general the move grants.

Mamoswine should definitely run Jolly to outspeed and OHKO Heatran leads and CM Wish Jirachi, I can't stress this enough. Other than that the team has a serious weakness to CM Wish Jirachi, and depending on its popularity EQ on TTar as your only solution may be necessary.

Sorry for that, at times convoluted advice, but i hope i helped open your eyes to some alternative options.
 
hey wile solid team,

after looking at it, i see that your extremely dd Mence weak. While its sorta overshadowed by mixmence in this metagame, its a huge threat that could really rip your team without problem.
i would replace mamo lead with swampert who has a better chance of being at living late game to retaliate to dd mence. personally i still dont think thats enough since i like to ensure that sweeping will be hard but imo its better than what u currently have. swampert also beats most the stuff mamo does anyways

also tho im not 100% sure on this but i think a bulky gyra would be better for this team than the LO set. anyways vaporeon isnt the best wishpasser to gyrados considering they both share an electric weakness meaning gyrados may not be able to safely receive the wish

hope i helped
 
I understand U-Turn, I used to use standard physical mixape, and U-Turn is potent. I will try it, I have been debating over it, but its just I like mach punch, I will see if it provides me with more. Superpower, dunno. Its debateable I guess.

Jolly also makes sense. But iirc, most trans carry a shuca berry, and cant die unless I run LO. Also, adamant mamoswine outspeeds standard wish CM rachi, as they only carry 245 speed iirc. Adamant would serve better for killing rachi, but jolly would work for tran.

Megan, half the reason I ran mamo and HP ice ape was for mence. If pert doesnt live past leading, or takes too much, then that is not a secure live either.

Well since I already have a bulky water megan, whats the real point. I guess for its own well being, but otherwise w/e.
 
Sorry, not really thinking about Synergy right now. Changing Scarftar to Bandtar would be horrible for your Team as Rotom/Latias would become a Weakness.

Maybe Jirachi in place of Infernape? Jirachi Resists Salamence's Outrages and counters back with Ice Punch. Maybe a Physical Mix set like this:

Jirachi@Expert Belt
Naive Nature
252 Atk/4 SpA/252 Spe
~Iron Head~
~Fire Punch~
~Ice Punch~
~Grass Knot~

Basically, It works as like a Defensive Infernape that can take Salamence to a degree.
 
Wilechase said:
Jolly also makes sense. But iirc, most trans carry a shuca berry, and cant die unless I run LO. Also, adamant mamoswine outspeeds standard wish CM rachi, as they only carry 245 speed iirc. Adamant would serve better for killing rachi, but jolly would work for tran.
Click to expand...

Jolly Mamo with a focus sash does 96.3% - 113.6% to a Shuca Tran so its pretty reliable.
 
Alright, I wasnt sure. Thanks for the calc. I will switch to jolly then. I don't lose any important 2HKO's or OHKOs iirc, so sounds good.
 
You say you want a special sweeper for Infernape's slot, so why don't you run specially based Mixnape instead of physical? You lose Mach Punch, but gain Grass Knot (goodbye Swampert and Hippodown) and more powerful Overheats (you probably want Flamethrower more though, being able to spam your STAB special has its benefits). CC has a high enough base power that you really don't need to boost attack, as it's just gonna be killing Pokemon weak to it anyways. The analysis set has served me well indeed, but if you really need that priority, keep using your set.
 
Swampert and hippo are both dealt with by celebi, and hippo is killed by vaporeon. I know I said I needed a special sweeper, but its position as physical mix has served a better purpose.
 
Hi Wilechase!

Cool team. The first thing that I notice about your team is that it lacks a resistance to Rock-type moves. This means that switching in on Choice Band Tyranitar is going to be tricky, and an opposing ScarfTar will basically sweep your team as nothing can switch in on it; in fact, anything with Stone Edge is going to be problematic for your team to take on. Now this means that we're going to need to replace a Pokemon. I don't want to get rid of Celebi as she provides a nice backbone to your team. Vappy's Wishes help your team out as well, and your team supports Gyarados so well that removing him would be stupid. So I think that the best way to add a Rock resistance to your team is to replace ScarfTar with Choice Scarf Jirachi. ScarfRachi covers much of the same threats as ScarfTar, but has a Rock resist, and has much better overall synergy with your other Pokemon as well. The only concern with Rachi is that he brings the total number of Pokes on your team weak to Fire-type attacks up to three, but this is somewhat balanced out by your three Fire resists so it isn't a big deal. Use a set of Iron Head | Ice Punch | Fire Punch | Thunderbolt, an EV spread of 252 Atk | 4 SpA | 252 Spe, and a Naive nature (this is the metro pride Jirachi with Thunderbolt in place of Thunderpunch by the way, feel free to use a Jolly nature and Thunderpunch instead if you like it better).

Yeah as other raters have pointed out, Mamoswine definitely needs to run a Jolly nature. With Jolly you can still OHKO opposing Heatran leads basically all of the time as well as always outspeed, and in my personal experience with lead Mamoswine I have always used Jolly and never found the power drop from the lack of Adamant a noticeable thing at all. If you test out Jolly and find that you miss the power, however, feel free to go back to using an Adamant nature instead. I would also look into Superpower over Protect for the quick OHKO on Blissey (at least I think it OHKOes...if not it deals heavy damage), but Protect works as well, so it's your call.

As iKitsune said, you are probably going to want to use U-turn over Mach Punch on your Infernape. U-turn actully allows Infernape to hit Latias and some other shit like Starmie which would otherwise wall it. With Mach Punch, you're basically letting a whole host of Pokemon switch in for free, especially notable/dangerous ones being Latias and Rotom. So yeah U-turn will actually let you get to a sweeper in a pinch if you need to, which is cool because Celebi can use Latias as Thunder Wave bait pretty handily.

One more small thing, I would personally try a Jolly nature on Gyarados as opposed to an Adamant. I personally do prefer Jolly on DDDos so that I can actually outspeed random Jolteon after the boost, as well as Starmie who invest heavily in Speed or whatever. After a couple of DDs the power difference is basically nonexistant, but you can still outspeed more threats, so I think you should test it out. Overall great team, hope to have helped and good luck in the future! ;)
 
Ugh, I was trying to avoid using any 2 of ape/mence/rachi/rotom, I guess I can test it out. I do lose an important rotom check however, so I would be a bit hesitant. If I did run rachi, I would use u-turn over the elec attack, as I have vaporeon for gyara.

Well as long as no power is really lost, then I will switch it. Blissey isnt that much trouble, but I can consider superpower. It is really just a preference thing I guess.

The only reason I wasn't running u-turn at first was because I was figuring latias was gonna go uber soon anyways, and that it wouldnt be important. Starmie has seen to be a pain, and if I switch to rachi, then ttar and luke are a bit easier to deal with, so it could work. I can test it I guess.

I might try jolly gyara, its more of preference. With adamant, I do outspeed starmie after a dance, and tie with HP grass jolteon. But taking the risk may not be worth it.
 
Bump, made some suggested changes to the team. Just curious to see what people think. Have tested a bit, but a few opinions on the look of the synergy and such are always nice.
 
On a team that is already quite weak to stall I'm not so keen on the prospect of Jirachi not having Trick. Without it Jirachi will be dead weight in that match up. So far I'm behind all the changes but I think in the long run this will be more helpful. IMO one U-turner should be enough to get the momentum you need. I agree the only problem would be Magnezone but that is the same for all steel types lacking shed shell.

Anyway see how it goes.
 
I have never liked using trick jirachi. I think I just prefer keeping the scarf for later use. Plus keeping U-Turn helps me beat latias, as it will hurt that hard, plus if he switches, I have that. I could replace Ice Punch, since like I could just use iron head for mence, then dragonite could be problematic if he is DD + E-Speed. Would Ttar be better against stall (doubt it), or is jirachi the better choice.
 
Wilechase said:
I have never liked using trick jirachi. I think I just prefer keeping the scarf for later use. Plus keeping U-Turn helps me beat latias, as it will hurt that hard, plus if he switches, I have that. I could replace Ice Punch, since like I could just use iron head for mence, then dragonite could be problematic if he is DD + E-Speed. Would Ttar be better against stall (doubt it), or is jirachi the better choice.
Click to expand...

TTar is better cos he can kill rotom so Gyarados can easily sweep of course it also leaves you vulnerable to Mence. Jirachi is also good against it but only with trick, as far too much on stall walls it otherwise. I guess if you don't think Trick is that good then keep U-turn, but if stall becomes a problem it will be worth considering.
 
Alright, I have done more testing, and one thing I have really noticed. Either I just suck at being able to utilize a late game sweeper, or gyara isnt doing much. I dunno what I should do with that slot, because half the time it seems like dead weight to me. I'm just not sure tbh.
 
Well well well wile. Its Fox btw.

Anywho I see a glaring Zapdos weakness, as 2 or 3 of your pokemon go down, mainly Rachi for its hax capabilities, it can come in and wall and sweep the rest. Gyarados' Stone Edge wont kill even with Stealth Rocks, and with a Zapdos and a good bit of prediction you might get swept. For this problem I recommend either a Scarf/Specs Latias, maybe over Rachi, or something like a Jolteon, to be put in a place where its needed. Nice team tho bro.

Fox
 
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