VGC Not really hailroom

[Vert84]

=== [vgc2015] Hailroom ===
This is my first VGC team. Though I have done some doubles teams. Hail is super helpful for countering weather surrounded teams. Which is what I'm trying this team out for. It's uncommon to see hail so people aren't ready to counter it. Since this team doesn't revolve around weather war loss hurts me less, but Obama almost always wins.

Humble Bumble (Abomasnow) (M) @ Abomasite
Ability: Snow Warning
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Ice Shard
- Protect
This is Obama. He's the only one who uses the hail to his advantage and is the only one who needs to. I chose giga drain over wood hammer because it allows blizzard to do more damage and healing with giga helps with survivability. Can take brave bird from banded talon. Obama even takes a flash cannon from max special attack flash cannon from aegis lash. With blizzard he can take out the bulkiest hydragon. Nearly kills rotom-W and gains HP with giga drain. So now you see Barak Obama is a true threat.

Bane (Rhyperior) (M) @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Solid Rock
Level: 50
EVs: 88 HP / 168 Atk / 168 SpD
Adamant Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Rock Slide
- Drill Run
- Earthquake
- Protect
Awe man this guy is awesome. Since he has solid rock he will eat up a super effective move; then with weakness policy he destroys all who are on the opposite side of the field! Also he is a great partner with Obama since they cover each other's weaknesses. Now let's get into what he can do. He will survive a flash cannon from max aegislash and can take iron head from max mega mawile (heh three Ms) takes aqua jet from choice azumaril not waterfall. OHKOs Garchomp after weakness policy with earthquake as well.

Nifty (Scrafty) (F) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Atk / 64 Def / 68 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Taunt
Well first I needed fake out support for my trick room setters. Intimidate is also very good at stopping Physical attackers from killing my trick room setters. And taunt is amazing at stopping aegislash who is a big pain to my team. Some things it can actually do. OHKOS blade form aegislash 252 hp 40 Def. always survives choice specs timid max special Hydregon 50% if it has Modest nature. Survives a talonflame's choice band brave bird. Now you know scrafty is quite nifty.

Lumiere (Chandelure) (F) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Flash Fire
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Heat Wave
- Trick Room
- Will-O-Wisp
- Protect
Here is my first trick room setter. Since this team is about countering weather, what's better than a mon with flash fire. Usually people run this mon wth sash but I decided to try to make it bulky. It works out for me because even with no investment in defense or special defense it can still take hits. Also not too many people carry will-o-whisp and it really helps stop any form of placidly attacker from hitting my team. Survives hydro pump from calm 116 special attack rotom-W. Always Survives choice talonflame brave bird. Can take crunch from max attack tyranitar. Will take dark pulse from tyranitar as long as it isn't modest.

Double-A Jay (Zapdos) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
EVs: 220 HP / 196 Def / 36 SpA / 56 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Thunder Wave
- Roost
- Thunderbolt
- Heat Wave
I needed a Pokemon that could work inside and outside of trick room. Zapdos was a perfect answer. It also resisted my steel and fighting weaknesses. He is a great lead against rain teams. I like everything about him except his last move. I've been choosing from so many things and just recently it's been heatwave. Thunder wave may seem counter productive on a trick room team, but parahacks are useful. Takes a play rough from mawile 100% of the time. He can even live after banded chomp rockslide.

Sailor moon (Cresselia) @ Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 236 HP / 204 Def / 68 SpD Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Psychic
- Safeguard
- Helping Hand
Cresselia is actually pretty fast which is why it my fast(ish) trick room setter. Safe guard is like heaven for my team. No longer my rhyperior and scrafty have to suffer from burn. Helping hand is also great support. Helps a lot of my Pokemon which just need that little boost. This is just the smogon ev spread so not much to say about that.

DOUBTS: This is a new thing I want to try to show all my problems with my team. I love these four Pokemon as they work so greatly together, Cresselia, scrafty, Obama, rhyperior. Zadpos and chandelier are left out. The reason being whenever I bring them into battle I lose. Chan gets OHKOed and zapdos barely gets any work done. I've been trying to think of replacements but I just can't get it right. If there is anything that needs to be fixed it would be this.


Thanks for reading this; And when you do rate don't be shy I'll take any suggestion from a new Pokemon (especially if it's honchkrow) to Different EV spreads. Also I'm on mobile and I can't tell how much is three lines. If this isn't enough information please say so and I'll try to provide more for next time. Thank you again!

 

[Hobi]

Nice solid team you got here, ran a similar one a while ago. I too also had a problem in deciding what the fourth move of my Zapdos should have been. In the end, I decided to run Swagger because in conjunction with T-wave my opponent would rarely attack me. Also, when paired with Scrafty, Zapdos could Swagger Scrafty to give it a +2 and no confusion thanks to lum berry, which allowed me to KO a threat I needed off the field immediately. Just a suggestion though!

 

[Vert84]

Nice solid team you got here, ran a similar one a while ago. I too also had a problem in deciding what the fourth move of my Zapdos should have been. In the end, I decided to run Swagger because in conjunction with T-wave my opponent would rarely attack me. Also, when paired with Scrafty, Zapdos could Swagger Scrafty to give it a +2 and no confusion thanks to lum berry, which allowed me to KO a threat I needed off the field immediately. Just a suggestion though!

Thanks for the suggestion in definitely trying it out. I wouldn't have thought of swagger myself.

 

[TheHoodedGamer]

Not like this very relevant , but this calc contradicts you statement on Abomasnow:

252+ SpA Mega Abomasnow Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Hydreigon: 80-96 (40.2 - 48.2%) -- 2.7% chance to 2HKO after hail damage

Now onto the rate. This team has some standard VGC Trick Room pokes like Cresselia and Scrafty. And it's interesting you're trying to do hailroom because I've actually done it before! So I know you know I know that Rhyperior is a very unorthodox Pokemon in VGC, just because it wouldn't be used over all the other good Trick Room Pokemon. Now I'm just assuming that you don't WANT to give up any of the 4 Pokemon you stated (Abomasnow, Cresselia, Scrafty, Rhyperior) so I'll just suggest one thing (because I know you stole the EVs from Nugget Bridge, in which THAT team was HailRoom too), if you ARE going to use Rhyperior, I suggest using Earthquake, Protect, Rock Slide, and Aqua Tail, Hammer Arm, Ice Punch or Megahorn. Instead of using Drill Run AND Earthquake, which only gives you one thing (being able to hit things with Wide Guard up), using Megahorn, Aqua Tail, Ice Punch or Hammer Arm just gives you more coverage.

Next, you were saying that you weren't liking Chandulure on the team because it was being dead weight. To fix that problem, I suggest using Amoonguss with this spread:

Amoonguss @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Rage Powder
- Spore
- Giga Drain / Sludge Bomb
- Protect
Rage Powder and Spore is what Amoonguss is known for, and for good reason. With Rocky Helmet, Mega Kangaskhan takes 1/3 of its original health as damage when it attacks Amoonguss. If you feel you already have enough Grass Coverage, than Sludge Bomb can be used instead.

That's all I have for now.

 

[Serapis]

Alright, to begin with I wouldn't recommend HailRoom to newer players. It is, at best, a highly difficult style to play and takes large amounts of experience to use successfully in any competitive setting. With that said, I think I'll just drop some thoughts on the team.

(shiny Abomasnow is the only Abomasnow)
Abomasnow @ Abomasite
Ability: Snow Warning
Level: 50
EVs: 208 HP / 12 Def / 228 SpA / 60 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Blizzard
- Energy Ball
- Ice Shard
- Protect

Having used Mega-Abomasnow extensively before, I can truthfully say that it is the heart and sole of any and every HailRoom team. Consulting the Abomasnow Tag on Nugget Bridge provides a nice basis of past teams, and in particular Gilbert's 6-0 in the Snow report suits your needs pretty well. His team literally shares 5 members with what you currently have, so it's at least worth looking at. The Abomasnow spread up top under the sprite is my personal one (yes I'm aware that 4 EVs are wasted in HP, but they don't go anywhere else). The spread allows you to get all of the same KOs while surviving Jolly Low Kick from Kang and Double Edge from Adamant variants. You survive Choice Specs Hydreigon's Draco Meteor and Landorus-T's Superpower (Rock Slide is a 3HKO at best). Energy Ball is for addition power because, for the most part, Abomasnow prefers to get KOs while Trick Room is up and the 15 extra Base Power really helps that. Ice Shard is simple priority for when TR isn't up.

Besides that, I'm curious to see what you think about Gilbert's report, assuming that you haven't already seen it. Overall, I feel as though you should keep Chandelure for the moment and that if you decide to replace it another Fire type (probably with the Safety Goggles as well) should take it's place. Although Abomasnow does beat Amoonguss, running a TR team with only one way to deal with the mushroom is just asking for trouble.

 

[hexmarie]

It's difficult to find a solid Hail team, but you did a great job. This looks like a fun team to use, as it will surprise most opponents and teams aren't usually built to deal with Hail.
I just have one minor suggestion. On Zapdos, you could replace Thunder Wave or Heat Wave with Hidden Power Ice. However, the previous moves both work well on Zapdos, so it's up to you. Just something to experiment with.
(Btw love the nickname for Cress! I never thought of that haha.)

 

[Vert84]

Not like this very relevant , but this calc contradicts you statement on Abomasnow:

252+ SpA Mega Abomasnow Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Hydreigon: 80-96 (40.2 - 48.2%) -- 2.7% chance to 2HKO after hail damage

Now onto the rate. This team has some standard VGC Trick Room pokes like Cresselia and Scrafty. And it's interesting you're trying to do hailroom because I've actually done it before! So I know you know I know that Rhyperior is a very unorthodox Pokemon in VGC, just because it wouldn't be used over all the other good Trick Room Pokemon. Now I'm just assuming that you don't WANT to give up any of the 4 Pokemon you stated (Abomasnow, Cresselia, Scrafty, Rhyperior) so I'll just suggest one thing (because I know you stole the EVs from Nugget Bridge, in which THAT team was HailRoom too), if you ARE going to use Rhyperior, I suggest using Earthquake, Protect, Rock Slide, and Aqua Tail, Hammer Arm, Ice Punch or Megahorn. Instead of using Drill Run AND Earthquake, which only gives you one thing (being able to hit things with Wide Guard up), using Megahorn, Aqua Tail, Ice Punch or Hammer Arm just gives you more coverage.

Next, you were saying that you weren't liking Chandulure on the team because it was being dead weight. To fix that problem, I suggest using Amoonguss with this spread:

Amoonguss @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Rage Powder
- Spore
- Giga Drain / Sludge Bomb
- Protect
Rage Powder and Spore is what Amoonguss is known for, and for good reason. With Rocky Helmet, Mega Kangaskhan takes 1/3 of its original health as damage when it attacks Amoonguss. If you feel you already have enough Grass Coverage, than Sludge Bomb can be used instead.

That's all I have for now.

First I would gladly give up one of those four, though I love them, anything that would work better, works better. About night bridge, I make my teams from scratch and then try to find similar ones and take their IVs and make some changes. Thanks for the amoongus I'll defintally use it. Also now that I no longer have my flash fire Pokemon I wanted to replace zap dos with one of those. I've been thinking either arcanine, entei, or heatran. I'm leaning on heatran though. What do you think? Thank you for rating!

 

[Vert84]

Alright, to begin with I wouldn't recommend HailRoom to newer players. It is, at best, a highly difficult style to play and takes large amounts of experience to use successfully in any competitive setting. With that said, I think I'll just drop some thoughts on the team.

(shiny Abomasnow is the only Abomasnow)
Abomasnow @ Abomasite
Ability: Snow Warning
Level: 50
EVs: 208 HP / 12 Def / 228 SpA / 60 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Blizzard
- Energy Ball
- Ice Shard
- Protect

Having used Mega-Abomasnow extensively before, I can truthfully say that it is the heart and sole of any and every HailRoom team. Consulting the Abomasnow Tag on Nugget Bridge provides a nice basis of past teams, and in particular Gilbert's 6-0 in the Snow report suits your needs pretty well. His team literally shares 5 members with what you currently have, so it's at least worth looking at. The Abomasnow spread up top under the sprite is my personal one (yes I'm aware that 4 EVs are wasted in HP, but they don't go anywhere else). The spread allows you to get all of the same KOs while surviving Jolly Low Kick from Kang and Double Edge from Adamant variants. You survive Choice Specs Hydreigon's Draco Meteor and Landorus-T's Superpower (Rock Slide is a 3HKO at best). Energy Ball is for addition power because, for the most part, Abomasnow prefers to get KOs while Trick Room is up and the 15 extra Base Power really helps that. Ice Shard is simple priority for when TR isn't up.

Besides that, I'm curious to see what you think about Gilbert's report, assuming that you haven't already seen it. Overall, I feel as though you should keep Chandelure for the moment and that if you decide to replace it another Fire type (probably with the Safety Goggles as well) should take it's place. Although Abomasnow does beat Amoonguss, running a TR team with only one way to deal with the mushroom is just asking for trouble.

Well I'm new to VGC, but in smogon doubles I'm slightly experienced. Thanks for the Obama set I will be using it. Yes I have seen Gilbert's report and it has helped a lot. If you look at what to hooded gamer said and my response I will be replacing chandulure with Amoongus and zap dos with maybe heat ran. Thank you for rating!

 

[Vert84]

It's difficult to find a solid Hail team, but you did a great job. This looks like a fun team to use, as it will surprise most opponents and teams aren't usually built to deal with Hail.
I just have one minor suggestion. On Zapdos, you could replace Thunder Wave or Heat Wave with Hidden Power Ice. However, the previous moves both work well on Zapdos, so it's up to you. Just something to experiment with.
(Btw love the nickname for Cress! I never thought of that haha.)

Well will definitely try that if I keep zap dos. Thanks for the thought on the dress. I didn't myself either. My friend was talking about it because she is recently obsessed with anime since I introduced it to her. Thanks for rating!

 

[Hobi]

If you do replace Zapdos for a Flash Fire Pokemon, I would replace it with Arcanine so 4/6 of the team isn't weak to fighting. Arcanine also fits Zapdos' purpose of working in and out of trick room with a base 95 speed and having access to Extreme Speed.

 

[Vert84]

If you do replace Zapdos for a Flash Fire Pokemon, I would replace it with Arcanine so 4/6 of the team isn't weak to fighting. Arcanine also fits Zapdos' purpose of working in and out of trick room with a base 95 speed and having access to Extreme Speed.

Thanks for the suggestion. I didn't even look at the weaknesses. I definitely will be trying him out. Thanks so much for your help!