Gen 4 Offensive SD-Lucario Sweep (Peak 1607)

[Quuton]

Hi everyone,

I've been playing Gen4 (HeartGold and Platinum) on my 3DS. It is my favourite Gen and I've been trying to make a Team thats both as successful as possible and also contains many of my favourite Mons. Here is my current version of the Team. I've peaked at 1607 Rating on the ladder.
Proof:

Without further ado, here's the team with explanations, playstyle and how much I like that Pokemon (The less I like a Pokemon, the more fine I am with it being switched out for another and vice verse). I'll add some past members of the team - Mons that I like, but had to switch out to make the team better.

Lead:

Metagross @ Lum Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 224 Atk / 32 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Explosion

Explanation:
My main goal is to get rocks up. Previous members in that slot were Aerodactyl and Azelf. They are more consistent at getting rocks up, but often thats the only thing they do. I rarely switch out Metagross. Just get rocks and then deal some damage with Mash oder Boom and not lose momentum by switching and risking another member being taken out and taking heavy damage. I do switch into Vaporeon or Starmie vs Infernape/Heatran leads but thats about it. Sometimes I get surprise-OHKO'ed by Azelf/Dragonite's FireBlast, but thats rare. Metagross usually wins vs many common leads like Azelf, Machamp, Aero etc.
I'm not 100% satisfied with this lead, because I don't always get rocks up and Metagross isnt really one of my favourite Mons. I'd give it a 6/10 rating, but unfortunately I cant think of better alternatives. Suggestions would make me very happy :)


Bulky Pivot:

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Surf
- Wish
- Protect
- Roar

Explanation:
Probably the most important member of the squad. This guy solo-wins so many games. It's not a common OU Pokemon nowadays and theres quite a few teams that just cant faint it. Generally I use Vape as a momentum spounge. Something to switch into Specs-Latias Dracos after Metagross is dead. It's my Fire Switch-in and it doesnt die to predicted Coverage moves like Starmie. Funnily enough I sometimes even sac Vape to just spam Roars for scouting and residual rocks damage. End-Goal: Opponents Pokemons need to be inside Lucario ExtremeSpeed Range. Especially the opponent has Gyara/Dragonite and other Mons that just need a little chip to die to +2 ESpeed Lucario.. Such as Flygon or Latias. I often prefer the momentum of letting Vape die and getting some scout over preserving it. It's also my switch-in for DD Gyara and CM Suicune.. Just Roar them out. If Gyara carries Taunt, I'll try to get Gyara low with Sandstorm Damage (opponents often have TTar), Rocks and Surfs. Once Inside Flygon QuickAttack or Luke's ESpeed range, I'm good. Breloom is the biggest threat here. I dont really have an answer for that.
Vape's rating: 10/10. Dont wanna switch that one out. Its one of my favourites and so strong on this team.

Stallbreaker:

Infernape @ Expert Belt
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 220 Atk / 92 SpA / 196 Spe
Naive Nature
- Overheat
- Close Combat
- Mach Punch
- U-turn

Explanation:
The Overheat takes care of Breloom, Jirachi, Bronzong, Skarmory and so on. Close Combat is self-explanatory and Mach Punch because... I love priorty. Its my SD-Lucario check and good to finish off weakened targets. With ExpertBelt I am faking a choice-variant. Adds to the confusion. This guy has won many games as a laate-game sweeper. After Luke came in on choice-Latios Draco or choice-TTars Pursuit/Crunch and SD'ed... it may not end the game on its own, but it leaves a heavy dent. And often Infernape cleans up for real. I do struggle with Starmie and Latias here. They come in and outspeed... So I dont have time to U-Turn out once they got in. Not really a fan of Infernape. I'd give it a 5/10. Could switch it out, but it beats Skarm/Bliss so nicely and hard Stall-Teams are one of the biggest threats to my team overall. Hate to having to address stall with Infernape tho.

Mid-Game Presence:

Flygon @ Choice Band
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Quick Attack

Explanation:
Surprise people with ChoiceBand. Most Flygons nowadays are Scarf or LifeOrb. People usually expect Scarf and switch out faster Starmies and what not. The power of banded-Outrages gets many surprise kills and leaves dents... to be later exploited by Lucario. Even into resisted targeted or after Intimidate CB-Outrage still hurts.
EQ and U-Turn are self-explanatory. Using QuickAttack for priority... I just like priority but I never use that move. I wonder if something else would be better.. Like ThunderPunch? I used to run TPunch but never used it either.. Does that last slot even matter? Whats a useful move here?
Flygon is nice, I'd give it a 8.5/10.

Surpriseeee:

Starmie @ Choice Specs
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Trick
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Explanation:
SpecsStarmie is rare and packs a surprisingly strong punch. Noone ever expects it when Specs Hydro jsut OHKOs the Ttar or Rotom switch-in. Trick is a way to kill Stall later in the game.. As mentioned earlier.. I hate playing vs Stall.. and losing! :D
Tbolt for other Starmies mainly. I always go for the speed-tie. Especially since I really dont have a good Starmie-Switch-in myself :D
It threatens Suicune, Vape and Gyara too, but somehow I never really need to use Starmie to deal with those. Icebeam mainly for Latias, also rarely used tho.
Just come in, click Hydro, see things die. Switch out maybe and Trick something later. It has late-game sweep-potential due to its 115 Base-Speed but Hydros 80% accuracy really lets it down sometimes.. Maybe be crazy and switch out IceBeam for Surf?
What I like most here is that it lures Rotom switch-ins which Lucario just cant deal with. My team isnt really rocks-weak so I'd never care to use RapidSpin :)
Starmies rating: 8/10, I like it, but could be replaced :)

The Star:

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Extreme Speed
- Bullet Punch

Explanation:
Very standard SD-Adamant Lucario. I try to never reveal this Pokemon until its time to win the game. I only show it prematurely if its ESpeed is necessary to revenge-kill a sweeping threat or if I noticed that the opponent isnt weak to Lucario at all. Then I try to come in on Ttar or Latias and just go nuts. Biggest threat is defintiely Rotom. I cant kill it at all. Jirachi can outspeed, but not all sets do. And if CC wasnt used yet, Luke can tank a hit.
Everything is centered around this boy. The corner stone of this team and has reverse-swept and saved me from dire situations on more occasions than I can count.
One of my favourites too. Clear 10/10.


Biggest threats to my team:
Definitely Bulky Rotom versions. With Rest, PainSplit, Leftovers, WoWs and what not. Ugh, I just dance aorund it and hope that I can get it low while preserving momentum so it doesnt have time to heal up. But its a pain... Breloom is also rough. Often comes in on my Vape and I just cry. Jirachi is a threat too, but usually Vape can handle rachis. Bulky or LifeOrb Starmie can be a threat, especially if it wins the speed-tie vs my Starmie and doesnt believe my Flygon being Scarf-Bluff. (Dont think long when switching in Flygon. Do it instantly with confidence. Make the opponent believe, that your Flygon can deal with Starmie).
In general Stall is a problem. I can deal with rocks easily but once Spikes go up too and the opponent has a well synthesized defensive core, I get stalled out and lose. I try to scout with Roar and find a win-condition somewhere - not revealing I got Luke.. often thats removing the opponent's Rotom.. but It's hard.

Previous members:

Gengar - 10/10
I've tried LifeOrb/PainSplit. WideLens-Hypnosis-WoW. Even Boom.
However, currently my Team is ItemClause-abiding and optimally I'll keep it that way.
Switched it out for Starmie for more versatile Special-attacking Prowess. Gengar dies quickly.. but it deals with Rotom! (If its not scarf).
If I can somehow add Gengar back in, that would be great... But I was more successful with Starmie.

Scizor - 9/10
ChoiceBanded ofc. QuickAttack over Pursuit as a Gyara/Infernape low-health check. Pursuit on a choiced-mon is just setup-fodder.
I love U-turning into Flygons U-turn. Rack up rocks and U-turn damage. Scouting. Identifying which mons need to be how much weakened for Luke to clean and then go to town. But noticed that Stall kills me so Internape went in. Too bad.


As mentioned earlier: Currently using Item-Clause. Im willing to open-up here, but if possible I can avoid.


How can I improve this team?
Especially Metagross and Infernape arent exactly my favourite Mons... I noticed surprise sets win most games. Specs Starmie and Roar-Vape are so good :)

Thank you all for your input in advance :)

PokePaste to try it out yourself: https://pokepast.es/c37d810a9e766268

 

[mackie]

Two Pokemon I was thinking of adding were:

1.

2.

over your Flygon and Infernape. You do say that bulky Rotoms are an issue, however shouldn't Specs Hydro Pump KO or nearly KO most bulky Rotoms? (Actually I just noticed you are running Timid which has less firepower than the Modest Specs Starmie I had been using). Anyway I think Scarf Rotoms are more deadly to the team since they outspeed everyone and can hit most of your team hard. The two Pokemon I have offered here should help with the Rotom issue, as well as offer other overall benefits to the team.

For Tyranitar I was thinking Band could work. It lets you easily Pursuit-trap Scarf'd Rotoms. and offers the same breaking potential as Flygon with Stone Edge. Also he is bulky enough to most of the time come out on top versus Starmies that you mentioned can be an issue. It is also so physically strong that it can naturally scare out Blissey and Clefable. Scarf Tyranitar could also probably work here as well. You should probably test both and see which one plays better. Update - I think the Scarf Tyranitar is the better choice here after playing with both on the ladder.

For Gengar I was thinking a utility set with SB + FB + WoW + Taunt/Trick. Mainly because it can still outspeed and heavily damage bulky Rotoms, but also offers the ability to burn Jirachi's or Taunt/Trick them a Black Sludge. Taunt is useful in general for stopping status or set-up sweepers, but Tricking a Black Sludge onto certain Mons is also generally useful. You could even run Sub over FB which may help ease prediction. I was thinking an LO PainSplit set would also work but it doesn't really cover WishTect Jirachi's that well which your team would struggle with if Gengar replaces Infernape. Lastly Gengar is Pursuit-bait which opens the door for Lucario to set-up.

With these additions you do lose an Electric immunity but Tyranitar is so specially bulky that it should be able to absorb Thunderbolts pretty easily.

Lastly I would recommend Modest Starmie over Timid, just because it has more raw power which is appreciated versus Pokemon like Bronzong, Skarmory, Machamp, Metagross, etc. Also I realized that Starmie has a lot of synergy with Tyranitar as well. For example, Latias may switch in on a predicted Hydro Pump, in this case you can switch to Tyranitar and Pursuit-trap it which will open the door for Starmie later-on in the game.

Might be worth a test!

Update - I like the Tyranitar addition the most since he takes out key Pokemon that give your Lucario and Starmie issues, but I think you can keep using Infernape over Gengar. Also Infernape's U-turn has a lot of good synergy with Tyranitar.

 

[Jeong]

Hi,
Zapdos does not give you any problems? Or even DD Taunt Gyarados / DD nite. Maybe it's too offensive a team. Still, I congratulate you. The ladder is never easy.

It reminds me of a previous team of yours, with some minor differences.

Well, for my part I will not be able to contribute much, but if you have in mind to add ttar, as togaquest told you, EBelt nape with Uturn is a fantastic partner, especially in vs Latias or Starmie and threaten with Pursuit.

And speaking of Starmie, I think you urgently need RSpin. Being such an offensive and somewhat fragile team, SR + Spikes/TSpikes can be quite annoying. The most balanced thing you have is Vaporeon's support.

Back to the beginning, if you really have problems with DD Gyarados (especially with Taunt) / DD nite, Scarf Flygon with TPunch and Outrage/DClaw > CB Jolly Nature can be a solution, although you lose offensive power.

On the other hand, if you want to add a spinblock, and something for those possible threats, Scarf Rotom (TBolt and HP Ice) can fit well.

That would be all. Sorry for not being of much more help.

 

[mackie]

And speaking of Starmie, I think you urgently need RSpin. Being such an offensive and somewhat fragile team, SR + Spikes/TSpikes can be quite annoying. The most balanced thing you have is Vaporeon's support.

I think we can fit Rapid Spin over one of Starmie's moves. I think the Specs Starmie that I used to use had these moves:
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin
- Trick

Even though he was choiced, every now and then there would be opportunities where he could get a spin off. Especially if Tar can trap a Ghost this would open the door for spinning more for Starmie. You also could even drop Trick for Psychic or Surf here (or Ice Beam).

Well actually Ice Beam is less useful since Tyranitar may trap Latias which removes the need for Ice Beam.