OU RMT-Get your red hots (technically 3rd one, first here)

piman34

This is my third rmt for OU, and I like to think that I have learned a lot from my first one. It has fairly good synergy, and doesn't bypass any resistance completely, but still some work can be done. Any advice is appreciated!


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Metagross @ Occa Berry/Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
Nature: Adamant (+Atk, -SpA)
EVs: 252 HP/236 Atk/12 Def/8 Spd
- Bullet Punch
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Meteor Mash|Explosion


This is my lead and anti lead. It is really good for breaking sashes with meteor mash followed by a bullet punch. And if they switch out, then it's a free SR for me. I chose earthquake over explosion, that way he would be more viable as a tank later in the match, and can damage fellow metagross. The ev's are questionable, and I'm kinda leaning toward Rhys29's bulky metagross spread (204 HP/88 Atk/204 Def/4 SpD/8 Spd), but I'm not sure if it is still a good spread for a lead. Item choice is up in the air, as when I had Heatran/Arcanine on my team Metagross was good bait for fire users to use an attack, not KO me, then swap in my flash fire pokemon to wreck havoc, but I think that now leftovers will yield longer survivability. This lead doesn't go well (or so I have been told so far) with the team very well, so I am more than happy to swap for a better alternative.


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Porygon2 @ Leftovers
Ability: Trace
Nature: Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
EVs: 228 HP/188 Def/92 SpA
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Thunder Wave
- Thunderbolt


Salamence, Gyarados, Heatran counter, works fairly well, and also works great when I trace say a water absorb or a motor drive :] Thunder wave to spread status around which lets me get some quick recovery moves in. I get lucky with para hax a lot, so I wanna keep this over toxic since Thunderbolt covers the bulky waters that would be targetted with toxic. Boltbeam coverage is great, and has enough SpA to do decent damage, even without STAB. Recover to heal from residual damage or an outrage or waterfall or whatever I'm switching into.


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Rotom-h @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Nature: Modest nature (+SpA, -Atk)
EVs: 156 HP/228 Spd/124 SpA
- Overheat
- Shadow Ball
- Will-o-wisp
- Trick


This guy is my spin blocker and lucario/scizor/wall counter. Has 3 immunities which are greatly appreciated in this team, and a boatload of resistances too. He outspeeds adamant lucario and ohko's before he can SD crunch me for the ohko. Also, WoWing switch-ins, since they are usually physical usually works wonders and allows me to survive the pursuit. I was thinking of Spiritomb as my spin blocker, and he's also not weak to pursuit, but having another ground immunity really helps, so it's up in the air right now. Good hp number when I trick leftovers from a wall or a pokemon that I expect to set up.


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Tyranitar @ Babiri Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
Nature: Jolly (+Spd, -SpA)
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
~ Dragon Dance
~ Crunch
~ Stone Edge
~ Fire Punch/Aqua Tail


Babiri and Jolly nature make Tyranitar always defeat Scizor switch-ins to it. Jolly outspeeds Adamant Scizor before a Dragon Dance. This means that if it tries to use its Fighting/Bug move on me, I will destroy it with Fire Punch. Babiri Berry is there if uses Bullet Punch, so Tyranitar can survive that and OHKO with Fire Punch.
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Heracross @ Leftovers
Ability: Guts
EVs: 204 HP/56 Atk/180 Def/68 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Brick Break
- Megahorn


My bulky physical sweeper and second status absorber. Also my tyranitar and wall counter, which works pretty well. Guts helps a lot when they status me, and even more when I rest it off ^_^. brick break and megahorn for STABs I chose brick break over night slash for coverage, but I am thinking that since fliers (like zapdos) resist both, maybe I will keep brick break on ttar and swap it for night slash here. Not that I would keep my heracross in on a zapdos, but I'm saying for the switch in


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Latias @ Life Orb


Ability: Levitate
EVs: 80 HP/176 Spd/252 SpA
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Surf
- Recover


My special sweeper, which provides some needed resistances and on the switch I can calm mind up and then do a fair amount of damage with a STAB dragon pulse or Surf. Recover to brush off the residual damage from Life orb and sandstorm. Enough speed to outspeed base 100's with a choice scarf. I was thinking maybe going 76 HP/180 Spd/252 SpA to outspeed typical Mixape since he can ohko me as well as other latias, but so far I haven't encountered any of them. Also calm mind coupled with recovery can make for an annoying pokemon, especially if they let me get at least 2 in, then they're in for a hurting.


Anyway, that's my team and it has been doing alright on shoddy. However I would like to someday get this to wi-fi, and since rotom-h is unattainable for wi-fi, suitable replacements would be great! Indecisive on my lead, so advice about that would be appreciated as well. I need a steel pokemon for ice and dragon resistances to cover Latias, and metagross does it, but he usually dies so other options for that would be appreciated too (Bronzong was suggested, I just don't know where he would fit). Currently, I have every type covered by at least 2 pokemon, except Water, Ice, and Dragon, to which I have one. I am thinking I may need another water resistant pokemon, since latias isn't meant to take too many hits right off the bat, even though she does a fair job at it. Any advice at all would be greatly appreciated and please RMT! :)


Images thanks to Pokemonelite2000.com and Arkeis.com

changes in bold
 
having any machamp problems? it can easily take out or seriously cripple latias, t-tar and heracross. if its packing ice punch, payback and/or dynamic punch can spell real trouble for those 3 guys. also rotom could be in trouble as well if you switch it in expecting a dynamic punch and get hit with payback, but i dont know if you play against anybody that good lol :)
 
usually the only machamp i face are resttalkers with dynamic punch and stone edge, and I used to have togekiss for air slash on my team, but I needed a water resist and some support latias could give. is it possible (plausible) to give latias a psychic attack to take care of this problem? and as far as skilled people, not usually :P thanks for the advice though
 
Dont use Psychic on Latias, it just sucks.

Machamp wont be able to OHKO with Payback or Ice Punch (I think) so you can set-up a Calm Mind and then OHKO with Dragon Pulse.

I think that 2 sleep talkers is a bad idea, so why not using a DD Babiri/LO Tyranitar? It will help you with Raw Physical power i think you need on this team.
 
What is a Babiri? lol...and okay I will look into replacing (ttar or hera?) for a more physical oriented sweeper
 
piman34 said:
What is a Babiri? lol...and okay I will look into replacing (ttar or hera?) for a more physical oriented sweeper
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T-tar is a better sweeper, having DD to boost his attack and speed. Not like Hera who relys on a Scarf to outspeed things.

Babiri is a berry that makes Steel supereffective moves half of the power. That means that Scizor wont be able to revenge kill with Bullet Punch, which is one of the things that can stop DD T-tar easily.
 
Okay will look into this replacement. any suggestions on a lead, or item for lead, or replacement for rotom for wi-fi?

EDIT: what about this as a dd ttar:

Tyranitar@Leftovers/Babiri Berry
Ability: Sandstream
Nature: Adamant|Jolly
EV's: 176 HP/252 Atk/80 Spd|76 HP/252 Atk/180 Spd
- Dragon Dance
- Crunch|Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Taunt|Crunch|Stone Edge

Adamant after one dd can 2hko metagross with 204 def with earthquake(mine lol) and can outspeed Jolly ttar and other base 60s
Jolly after one dd can 2hko metagross with 204 def with earthquake (same metagross) and can outspeed base 100's like infernape and salamence
 
You have two ResTalkers already. I would agree with making Tyranitar into your physical sweeper.

Tyranitar @ Babiri Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
Nature: Jolly (+Spd, -SAtk)
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
~ Dragon Dance
~ Crunch
~ Stone Edge
~ Fire Punch/Aqua Tail

Babiri and Jolly will make your Tyranitar always defeat Scizor switch-ins. Jolly Tyranitar outspeeds Adamant Scizor (and those are the only ones that exist, seriously) before a Dragon Dance. This means that if it tries to use its Fighting/Bug move on you, you will destroy it with Fire Punch. Babiri Berry is there in case it uses Bullet Punch, so you can survive that and OHKO with Fire Punch.

Aqua Tail is an option for Gliscor and Hippowdon, but then you may as well go Adamant with Leftovers, since Jolly Stone Edge only does 49-57% (+1 Jolly does 73-86%). This is assuming the standard CB Scizor with 252 HP. Basically, if you don't want to just switch out of all Scizors, use the above set with Fire Punch.
 
okay i'll try that...but since he can't heal anymore, nor can he absorb status, should i maybe have a cleric/wish passer on my team?
 
i dont think you do since your keeping heracross as rest talker and if you can correctly predict a status move such as WoW or t-wave and so forth then you could just switch in heracross but if not and you really see your team needing a cleric/wish passer then i would suggest replacing heracross for a wish passer/cleric
 
Word, I guess I just have to work on my predicting skills lol. So any ideas on my lead? or ideas for another dragon|ice resistant pokemon that might not explode in the beginnning (Cuz I'm replacing meteor mash for explosion to counter swampert)
 
if you really dont like metagross as a lead and are worried about swampert and want to have a dragon/ice resistant pokemon, you could try bronzong out(he is immune to e-quake, resistant to avalanche and neutral to waterfall and other water moves it might have)
 
I recommend using a lum berry with hera soo you wont have to use sleep talk and take risks =] i also recommend using ttar as a ddancer
 
On Rotom-h, Thunderbolt should go over Overheat. After using Overheat, you'll be setup fodder for too many things, and bluffing Overheat is usually enough. By the time they see Rotom-h, most people will switch out their Scizor, Metagross, etc., fearing Overheat, and assume that you were predicting a Heatran switch-in when you use Thunderbolt or Shadow Ball. Electric+Ghost also has STAB and excellent type synergy, being resisted by only Magnezone in OU.
 
I don't recommend Explosion over Meteor Mash. Gross needs MM + BP to beat many common Sashers. Swampert is one lead that Metagross will always handle dubiously. Unfortunately, you don't have any good switch in to Swampert. Latias could work as it will probably avoid an Earthquake coming in (unless it goes for rocks, which is always a pain). Dragon Pulse will take care of recovery-less Pert while you can Recover off Ice Beam. The problem is that you don't want your opponent to see Latias so early in the game (you're also quite vulnerable to Pursuit trapping if you bring it out early).

But I think you would benefit from a cleric over Heracross. Unfortunately Wish + Aromatherapy/Heal Bell is illegal on Blissey. Toxic / Aromatherapy / Softboiled / Etc. could work, or for a change of pace, Dragonite with Heal Bell / Roost / Dragon Pulse / Filler.
 
i'll look into a healer/cleric for sure...why is wish +aromatherapy banned/illegal? and I was thinking the same thing about metagross, that's my normal approach to other leads, however Bullet punch can usually 2hko leads that i would get to 1 hp with meteor mash then bullet punch for the ko, like azelf and aerodactyl, common sash leads, so i'm thinking just having the insurance for swampert is kinda a good thing.

In terms of bronzong, i don't think they are good leads anymore, with platinum's effect on hypnosis, but if anyone has a good set for one, i'd be willing to try it.

about rotom, He's my lucario counter, so I think overheat is necessary, since otherwise a sd adamant luke can wreck my team really easily. with scarf, I can outspeed it, and ohko before it can ohko me with a sd crunch. also, as I don't really have a surefire scizor counter, willowisping one that switches into me (or ttar too) really helps. As far as heatran, I know i lack an appropriate counter for it too, any suggestions?

and about heracross lum berry, the point is to absorb status, so a one time use isn't gonna cut it and sleep talk is good cuz with guts +rest, his moves do a heck of alot more damage.

edit: about dd ttar, i still need a ttar counter and a scizor counter, since even though i can ohko scizor switchins, i can't switch in on one myself. I have rotom, but it can only do so much, and I'm lacking a special wall/sponge, which is making a natural cure blissey that can cleric my team seem feasible.
 
piman34 said:
In terms of bronzong, i don't think they are good leads anymore, with platinum's effect on hypnosis, but if anyone has a good set for one, i'd be willing to try it.
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Actually, I think you'll find Bronzong benefits from the accuracy drop in Hypnosis. Because of it, fewer people run Sleep Absorbers, so Sleep is really a very good way of incapacitating a member of the opposing team. You can run the standard set, except with more success, especially seeing as how most leads these days aren't equipped to deal with Bronzong, unless they're the scarf/CB tricking variant.
 
Aromatherapy/Heal Bell + Wish is illegal because Aromatherapy and Heal Bell are egg moves, and Wish is an event move. It's not possible to get the combination in game, so Shoddy doesn't allow it.

Meteor Mash + Bullet Punch ensures that faster Sashers get one turn, rather than two. Really, it's the point of using Metagross: very little has the ability to OHKO him, while he can break Sashes and finish with priority. Explosion starts you off at a disadvantage, and some Pert leads carry Protect for that very reason anyway.

Bronzong is unexpected and walls Swampert and Metagross leads. Try it. You could even try Dual Screen which doesn't rely on accuracy.

You could switch Rotom for Physically Defensive Zapdos. Only 20.8% of Lucario carry Ice Punch, as opposed to 45.1% carrying Crunch. It counters Scizor also. I dunno how much it takes from neutral hits from Lucario, but hopefully enough for you to survive, OHKO it, and Roost off damage.
 
oh okay, cool I was just wondering. What do you think about a blissey to replace the ttar that I made an attacker instead of heracross? also I agree with metagross, and never thought about it like them getting one turn instead of two. Although how is it like that if I use BP twice to ko, that's me attacking first, their move, then me first again, compared to most likely them go first, then meteor mash, then me BP first. Just trying to understand.

Ill look into bronzong, and if i change out heracross screens would be more of an option, but I'll look into hypnosis as well.

The thing is I like the fighting immunity since it wrecks my team and while zapdos resists it, it doesn't have a reliable way to ko sweepers like machamp. And while dropping the dark weakness is good, i'm not sure a zapdos could ohko with heatwave while being resistant to extremespeed for example, especially after a SD on the switch in. maybe spiritomb since it drops the dark weakness, and makes a good rest talker too, but then I lose a ground immunity. any ideas?
 
Zapdos doesn't resist Extremespeed, it's normal-type. And Lucario has piss defenses and steel typing, so Heat Wave definitely OHKOs. It's up to you. I'd suggest either Zapdos or Rotom-H though as they both fill similar purposes for you.

I don't know if you want Dual Screens, actually. You've got Tar (possibly) and Latias a set-up sweepers. Latias will get walled by Blissey, Screens or not, if it carries Seismic Toss. Tyranitar would actually be really nice to set up if you can manage it. If Screens let you get 2 or 3 Dragon Dances without using your Babiri, you're pretty much set for a sweep. You could try it.

Bullet Punch isn't really good for 2HKOing stuff, since the first hit won't really be enough (Meteor Mash has 3 times the BP).
 
Well I was referring to your statement about zapdos vs luke neutral hits, but I guess I was kinda thinking that if I switched zapdos into a luke, assuming sd variety, it sd's on the switch, then extremespeeds, will I be able to heatwave/roost, also assuming steath rock...for that scenario it seems that rotom would be better, but again they both have their own strengths and weaknesses. I'll stick with rotom, but if i make this team on wifi I'll try out zapdos. what do you think of:

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Bold nature
252 HP/ 216 Def/ 40 Spd
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power Ice
- Heat Wave
- Roost

The Ev's reach optimal Leftovers recovery, the highest jump point in Def and the speed outruns Tyranitar and other Zapdos and Celebi.

Also noted about bullet punch, it was just my thinking in the best situations instead of the worst lol. I'll try bronzong too just to see if it suits my team as a lead too, screens and without, but i'll leave it as metagross for now, thanks :]
 
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