[OU RMT] Trying to improve a team based on Toxic Spikes

Hi Smogon. It's been a really long time since I've posted a team, so forgive me if I'm a little rusty at this! Here is a team I helped a friend build a few weeks ago. I think it looks brilliant on paper, but it never seems to come out on top as often as I like. For one, it has a lot of problems with weather, and teams that have very powerful special attackers... but I'll get to that eventually. If you have a moment, please read over it and give me a suggestion or two. Thanks! :heart:

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Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Volt Switch
- Spikes
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin

This Forretress is the pokemon I try to lead with most often, for obvious reasons. He can set up some preliminary hazards and spin away the ones that are set up on me. More than one of Forry's teammates has a shuffling move, so having at least one level of spikes and stealth rock on the field early on is great for racking up passive damage. Volt Switch is my attacking move of choice, as it allows Forry to switch out to a teammate and keep the momentum up.

The nature and EVs provide maximum protection from attacks on both sides of the spectrum, but especially special ice and dragon. In addition to the fact that he provides Rapid Spin support, this makes Forry a great partner for my Salamence who I feel really steals the show here.

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Salamence (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 18 SAtk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Flamethrower
- Dragon Tail
- Wish
- Protect

I absolutely LOVE this set, and it is the main reason I've stuck with the team. Flamethrower and Dragon Tail provide great coverage, one move to kill pesky steels who give my poison types trouble, and one move to shuffle the opponents team and do a lot of damage in the process. It also has Wish and Protect, in order to heal itself and it teammates (mostly Forry and Drapion).

It is an absolute beast, you have to admit. With maxed out defense EVs and Intimidate, he synergizes really well with Forry and the rest of the team. Takes A TON of pressure off of my other pokemon when it comes to taking hits. He can easily switch into any physical attacker without STABed Ice or Rock attacks (and sometimes even then) to force them out.

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Drapion (M) @ Black Sludge
Trait: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Toxic Spikes
- Whirlwind

Rounding out the defensive core, we have a bit of an oddball. Sometimes he goes down in flames, while other times he really shines. Special tank Drapion is my primary Toxic Spiker. I chose him because thanks to his Dark typing, he can absorb psychic attacks aimed at Tenta and Gengar. Crunch trolls the hell out of Magic Bounce Espion looking to reflect my entry hazards, and provides a decent STAB against other psychics like Reuniclus. Earthquake is mostly filler (trying to kill off those steels) and whirlwind is a secondary shuffling move ensuring he doesn't get set up on and to rack up passive damage. Like Forry he has no way to recover outside of his lefties, but it isn't a big deal thanks to Mence's wish. Salamence is also immune to his only weakness (ground).

Overall, he usually gets his job done, but he just can't take that many hits, even on the special side. Might be the shakiest member of the team, so I'm open to suggestions for replacements.

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Gengar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hex
- Disable
- Focus Blast
- Substitute

Next are the pokemon I have which abuse the Toxic Spikes, Gengar and Tentacruel. Substitute + Disable Gengar is standard, but mine has the added benefit of Hex and the fact that the opponent will (hopefully) be toxic'd. Stalling with substitute and disable shuts down a fair amount of pokemon that I wouldn't have an answer to otherwise. Hex it outrageously strong end game when everything is poisoned. Focus Blast provides good coverage alongside Hex and to hopefully wear down steels and bliss/chansey.

Gengar is also here because of his typing. Not only does he synergize well with drapion, he also blocks rapid spin ensuring that my hazards stay down. The Timid nature and offensive EVs are to ensure he is as fast as possible while still hitting nice and hard. Lefties over LO for longevity, especially in Sandstorm.

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Tentacruel (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Toxic Spikes
- Venoshock

The second member of my offensive duo, Tentacruel. There are a couple reasons I chose this guy. For starters, he's surprisingly fast! With max EVs and a Timid nature, this squid outspeeds every non-scarfed Glicor out there, making him a great lure and surprise killer for one of the biggest counters to this team and my end game sweeper Metagross. Secondly, he serves as a back-up Toxic Spiker. Even with Gengar on the field, my T-spikes are often absorbed by a random poison type. With T-spikes on both of these guys, I can ensure T-spikes are up MOST of the time. Finally, he an abuse the ridiculously powerful dual STABs of Hydro Pump and Venoshock.

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Metagross @ Air Balloon
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Agility
- Meteor Mash
- Hammer Arm
- Zen Headbutt

Finally, my end game sweeper is an agili-gross. After the opponent's team is worn down by all my entry hazards, I should be able to come in and clean up with this guy. He synergizes really well with the rest of the team, especially Salamence. Meteor Mash and Zen Headbutt and my two STAB moves, and Hammer Arm is added for a sure-fire answer to Bliss/Chansey.
I have Air Balloon over Life Orb again, to ensure that he doesn't wear himself out too quickly and can switch into ground type attacks with a bit of temporary immunity. It's won me games a few times!

Anyway, that's the team. To summarize:
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Specially defensive Forretress
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Special Tank / T-spiker / Phazer Drapion
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Offensive Tentacruel
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Sub/Disable Gengar
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Physical wish-passer Salamence
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Agiligross with air balloon

The biggest problems with the team are:

- Trouble with Rain Dance teams, especially those with bulky waters that can't be poisoned, or very strong special attackers. Drapion can't handle 'em.
- I've had particular trouble with defensive Zapdos, and other pokemon that won't get poisoned and can't be dealt with by my other pokemon...

Thank you for taking the time to help! :)
 
The concept looks pretty good. I'm no expert on stall, so I'll leave it up to those with that experience to suggest improvements there.

You mentioned rain teams, and I can see that being an issue, too. Especially if it's a rain team that also uses entry hazards, and features Skarmory. He won't be able to be poisoned, can set up hazards and phaze you back, and has his fire weakness nullified in the rain. And if he's on a stall team like I said, you won't just be able to wear him down. He'll roost off the damage.

Other than that, Landorus/Gliscor/Terrakion seem like they could all cause this team some trouble. Landorus and Gliscor are weak to water, but your offensive water pokemon is also weak to ground. And with all the variants of Landorus out there, there's a good chance you'll be outsped and OHKO'd. Gliscor is just bulky, hard to wear down, and considering his ability is poison heal, your stall will fail to be as successful against him.

That's what I see. Hopefully some stall experts can weigh in.
 
Scarf rotom-W,scizor,gliscor(Ice fang+earthquake),politoed and it's water friends,and some sun pokes like volcarona,are everywhere,and metagross with those moves can't do much to them even if he was made for late game.

I was going to suggest Terrakion or Lucario,but if you have problems with waters and gliscor/landorus,Virizion could be a good try to replace metagross.An odd one,I don't have much experience with it,but helps against most things you mentioned.Offensive Cm or a set with work up like the one in "other options" in the Pokedex could work.
 
This is a cool team(totally stealing that Salamence set haha) but unfortunately as it stands its not too viable in todays metagame. You definitely need better checks to weather teams and a few other key threats. But I want to try and change as little as I can :)

So first off your team is very weak to Drizzle Teams. Neither of your water resists are able take many Surfs/Hydro Pumps, and Offensive Rain Starmie in particular runs through your team. So the first thing I would like to suggest is Running Ferrothorn over Forretress. Ferrothorn is a great Rain counter and can still Set-up those hazards your team loves. The set I would suggest is the Standard wall:

Ferrothorn (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SDef
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Power Whip
- Thunder Wave

I believe this set will be much more effective than your Forretress atm because of how much easier you will be able to take those Rain boosted hits. You don't really lose too much from this switch, besides Rapid Spin, but we will get to that later.

While your team is based on Toxic Spikes, I promise you do not need them on more than one poke', and Drapion isn't very good in OU; so I would suggest dropping him and Running Calm Mind Latias. This would help your team deal with such threats as Sun teams, SubCM Jirachi, and Reuniclus. The Latias Set I recommend is:

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Recover
- Roar

With Latias' strong natural bulk, resistances and reliable recovery, it can stomach a lot of the hits Sun teams tend to throw around. It also beats SubCM Jirachi and Reuniclus by resisting their common moves, Calm Minding up with them, and then Roaring them away. Now I realize this change might make you a little weaker to both Tyranitar and Scizor, but it's actually not as bad as it seems. Gengar still beats most Ttar 1on1 by abusing Sub/Disable and a Scizor or Tyranitar locked into Pursuit provides Metagross a wonderful opportunity to set-up. Also, as a plus, this Latias should be able to handle any Offensive Zapdos.

My final suggestion is to run Rapid Spin over Ice Beam on Tentacruel. This is because you lost your spinner from changing out Forre and because Ice Beam's not really needed on that set. I really like how it lures out Gliscor but Hydro Pump should be enough to take it out.

Hope you try these changes out, and Good Luck!
 
Due to being in OU , where Magnezones thrive I would suggest that you use shed shell on forry, and as for tentacruel I would say change it's ability to Rain Dish to stall out RAin teams which are really common
 
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