Ou Team with Anti-Metagame Gengar

vielIeis

Ou Team with Anti-Metagame Gengar/ Gengar is now out for Raikou

So thats my OU-Team atm. I think its balanced and can win to.
So lets begin:
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swampert.png

Swampert (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/6 Spd
Relaxed nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Earthquake
- Protect
- Ice Beam
- Stealth Rock
My MixPert. Its important for me because he sets up the Rock, stops Electric attacks and has a great coverage with Ice,Water and Earth. Ill run Protect now to Scout for more informations and it stopps Explosion.After many Tests It works with Surf good and with Ice Beam too but Icebeam kills Dragons so I will use it now over Surf and the EVs are changed to max hp/def and Ill use the rest on Spd to out Speed other Swampert leads.



gyarados.png

Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 156 HP/108 Atk/100 Def/144 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge/Ice Fang
Bulkydos without taunt because i dont like taunt on Gyarados.Its dancing when it gets a chance for it and like Swampert it has a great coverage.The Electric attacks are stopped by Flygon and Swampert and Rock attacks like Stone Edge are not really dangerous. Maybe i test Stone Edge over Ice Fang or EQ.So Im now testing the move set with Stone Edge>Ice Fang.


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Scizor (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP/252 Atk/10 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Pursuit
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
So I changed it so CB-Scizorr again. The scout factor with U-turn is to important and with CB Bullet Punch kills more things. And U-Turn spamm with Scizor and Flygon is great too. The set is not really special its the normal CB-Scizor Set.After all It works great.


raikou.png

Raikou @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 76 HP/252 Spd/116 SAtk/ 76 Sdef
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Substitute
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Thunderbolt
So Now I put Raikou over Gengar. Like Kryuell said the most Dragons are switching out after 1 CM when a Sub is out and with one CM Hp[Grass] will kill Swampert too.So after some other tests I will write more.


flygon.png

Flygon (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 80 HP/252 Atk/176 Spd
Naughty nature (+Atk, -SDef)
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Fire Blast
- U-turn
My revenge killer. Love that thing too because it has a resistance against Electric and Ground. EQ and Outrage are for STAB and Coverage. Fireblast kills the most Steels U-Turn is fantastic^^.


heatran.png


Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Substitute
- Earth Power
- Lava Plume
- Hidden Power [Ice]/[Electric]/[Grass]/Dragon Pulse
I think Subtran is better than Scarftran because the most people really think its scarfed and then they switch out so i get a free turn to use Sub.Ill run Lava Plume over Fireblast because i want to Burn some Pokemons.Earth Power is for good Coverrage. In the last Slot Ill run the most Time HP [Ice] or HP [electric], maybe I test Toxic or WoW.Atm I see many Kingdras so I will test Dragon Pulse too.Ill run atm HP [Electric] but Ill Test Dragon Pulse today.

So thats all now rate plx.
Thx for all people that are helping me.
 
I know that I would like a little more information, its hard to do a fair RMT with such little to work with.

While this is actually a very balanced team (using Scizor to lure in Fire moves for Heatran, nice), I do see a problem in type coverage. Except for Gengar, every other member of your team has a limited amount of pokemon they can hit super-effectively. There are two ground types, two water types, and two steel types. I would rethink maybe one member of your team, because with the proper pokemon and moveset, your team could be wrecked.

P.S. Welcome to Smogon University! :)
 
snorlaxxz said:
I know that I would like a little more information, its hard to do a fair RMT with such little to work with.

While this is actually a very balanced team (using Scizor to lure in Fire moves for Heatran, nice), I do see a problem in type coverage. Except for Gengar, every other member of your team has a limited amount of pokemon they can hit super-effectively. There are two ground types, two water types, and two steel types. I would rethink maybe one member of your team, because with the proper pokemon and moveset, your team could be wrecked.

P.S. Welcome to Smogon University! :)
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Yeah your right but i dont know what should i kick? Maybe Flygon?
 
snorlaxxz said:
Yeah, kick Flygon. Maybe for...? Idk, another revenge killer?
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Having several Pokemon on your team with reasonable power and speed with the move Substitute can drive your opponent insane. Get rid of Gengar's Energy Ball for Substitute, even though Gengar will wear down easy because of Life Orb. But with Substitute, Gengar can hit its usual slower counters twice. Keep Shadow Ball, HP Fire, but Thunderbolt isn't great coverage, replace it with Focus Blast. The Substitute allows you to scout, get out when Pokemon you can't beat switch in, and finally revenge killer Pokemon with Choice Scarf like the Rotom appliances.
Taunt on Gyarados is important to this particular team, you would be surprised how many threats you can eliminate or shut down. Stone Edge definitely outclasses Ice Fang (except for the accuracy drop). CB Scizor is superior to SD Scizor for one reason: it has U-Turn on the standard set. Scizor can U-Turn when Magnezone or others come out to play, and Flygon puts a stop to them. However, both being Choiced, Flygon is forced to U-Turn. Most opponents will forget this, or not be aware of Flygon having it, and will switch to something to take the Earthquake or Fire Blast. You will have U-Turned again, completing yet another circle. This can be both useful and a hinderance, but rather annoying. I'm not sure my changes will make a big difference, but try them out and see.
 
Maybe replace Swampert, actually, with a Gliscor? He can set up rocks, Blocks electric, and gyarados has coverage in all three of those types already. Gliscor is a very strong physical wall and is formidible to any physical attacker. 4x Ice weakness is bad, but so is 4x grass. Just an idea. =)
 
DarkCyberElf said:
Having several Pokemon on your team with reasonable power and speed with the move Substitute can drive your opponent insane. Get rid of Gengar's Energy Ball for Substitute, even though Gengar will wear down easy because of Life Orb. But with Substitute, Gengar can hit its usual slower counters twice. Keep Shadow Ball, HP Fire, but Thunderbolt isn't great coverage, replace it with Focus Blast. The Substitute allows you to scout, get out when Pokemon you can't beat switch in, and finally revenge killer Pokemon with Choice Scarf like the Rotom appliances.
Taunt on Gyarados is important to this particular team, you would be surprised how many threats you can eliminate or shut down. Stone Edge definitely outclasses Ice Fang (except for the accuracy drop). CB Scizor is superior to SD Scizor for one reason: it has U-Turn on the standard set. Scizor can U-Turn when Magnezone or others come out to play, and Flygon puts a stop to them. However, both being Choiced, Flygon is forced to U-Turn. Most opponents will forget this, or not be aware of Flygon having it, and will switch to something to take the Earthquake or Fire Blast. You will have U-Turned again, completing yet another circle. This can be both useful and a hinderance, but rather annoying. I'm not sure my changes will make a big difference, but try them out and see.
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In my last Team I used it so with CB-Scizor and Scarf-Flygon but I wanted to test SD-Scizor but I think that I will kick it and change it to CB Scizor.
Subgar is good but I wanted to use Energy Ball to Kill Swampert and I dont like the accuracy of Focus Blast. Maybe I will kick Tbolt for Sub.Should I test Expert Belt over Life Orb?To the Gliscor>Swampert I think Swampert is better because it has no Ice weak and the grass weakness isnt so worse and with Protect it stopps Explosion and It can scout for more informations.
I dont like Taunt on Gyarados, yeah it can stopp much things with it but 3 attack moves are much better. Stone Edge is good but the PP of Stone Edge is worse. I will test the most things today but not Gliscor.
 
I have tested all but I dont like the Gyarados set and the accuracy of Focus Blast. Ill test Energy Ball and TBolt over it now.
 
well i'm not to good at rating teams just like the thing on gengar just made me chucke you said it will OHKO with just one hit thats what OHKO stands for but still good team like the gengar set the change to gliscor would be nice plus give him roost or something makes him pretty beastly
 
Jakob Friedrich said:
well i'm not to good at rating teams just like the thing on gengar just made me chucke you said it will OHKO with just one hit thats what OHKO stands for but still good team like the gengar set the change to gliscor would be nice plus give him roost or something makes him pretty beastly
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Update on the Team. So I doesnt really like Gliscor because he has a 4x weak to Ice attacks.But thanks for the rate
 
There is one pokemon that can sweep and pull off Substitute much better than Gengar. I am, of course, talking about Raikou. His speed is greater, and he matches Starmie (provided you use HP Grass not Ice - Which is better anyway to deal with Swamperts)

Here is a set that will prove much more effective than Gengar:

Raikou @ leftovers
Timid [+Spe -Att]
Pressure
EVs: 252SpA / 252Spe / 4HP
- Calm Mind
- Substitute
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Thunderbolt

Most dragons will stay away from a +1 Stabbed thunderbolt, so you don't need HP Ice. Mainly Flygon and Snorlax will give you problems here, but you will at least hit a large dent in them since you should be able to get a Substitute in on the switch. This Raikou can't hit better than 0.5 against Celebi, but thanks to calm mind and substitute you can easily CM Stall him (after 1 calm mind it takes the standard Celebi 2 energy balls to break Raikou's Sub - Also, thanks to sub, Celebi can't thunder wave or leech seed Raikou)

Although Raikou has slightly less Special attack than Gengar, the other 5 stats are higher. So unless you're going to take advantage of Gengar's movepool (Hypnosis, Focus Punch etc) then I strongly recommend Raikou in this team.

With SR damage, Raikou can OHKO Salamence if you get a +1, or easily 2HKO if behind a Sub. Guaranteed Dragon pwnage. Also, Raikou Outspeeds Bulkydos after 1 DD. Raikou can do major Damage to Dragonite with +1, but watch that he doesn't use Dragon Dance then Roost stall you (after a couple of thunderbolts anyway there is a nice probability of paralisis - but it's not somethig you can rely on too much, maths is an ass like that) Raikou wipes the floor with Vaporeon, and Raikou can easily beat a Blissey w/o seismic toss.
 
Hello,

your team seems quite weak to opposing Gyarados, none of your pokemons can switch safely into a DD Gyara, while it has plenty of opportunities to switch in and set up. Since you're playing quite offensively, I won't suggest you to add a dedicated counter for it, but at least to have some checks. Firstly, you may try roar on Swampert over surf, I'd prefer ice beam on your mix-Pert to check opposing Flygon and Salamence, I'd also run max HP and Def, since the SpA investment isn't going to help you that much, and you need all the defence you can get to switch into powerful physical attackers like Gyara and Mence. Roar will allow you to, at least, force out taunt less Gyarados while also preventing things like cro-Cune from setting up on you.

I'd also suggest to run stone edge on Flygon over fire blast, switching to an adamant nature. With Heatran and Gengar on the team, Skarmory shouldn't be a problem, and fire blast is not going to ohko it anyway. Stone edge will help you to revenge kill Gyara without locking your Flygon into outrage.

On your own Gyarados, definitely go with stone edge over ice fang, water\rock offers better type coverage, and if you're not going to use taunt, I'd also give bounce a try over EQ: it almost ohkos Celebi and works nicely with leftovers.

On your sub Heatran I'd try toxic in the last slot, it's really useful to cripple bulky waters like Vaporeon, which may also stop your Gyarados sweep later in the game. Also, although lava plume has the appealing 30% burn rate, I'm sure that you'll feel the loss in power without fire blast, so I'd try that too.

Now onto Gengar: since you're using substitute on it, why not trying focus punch too? With an EV spread of: 100 Atk / 156 SpA / 252 Spe and an hasty, you can 2hko Blissey and ohko TTar without having to rely on focus blast crappy accuracy. Also, definitely expert belt on it, or between sub, SR, life orb and possibly sandstorm your Gengar won't last more than 2-3 turns.

Good luck with your team!
 
Haunter said:
Hello,

your team seems quite weak to opposing Gyarados, none of your pokemons can switch safely into a DD Gyara, while it has plenty of opportunities to switch in and set up. Since you're playing quite offensively, I won't suggest you to add a dedicated counter for it, but at least to have some checks. Firstly, you may try roar on Swampert over surf, I'd prefer ice beam on your mix-Pert to check opposing Flygon and Salamence, I'd also run max HP and Def, since the SpA investment isn't going to help you that much, and you need all the defence you can get to switch into powerful physical attackers like Gyara and Mence. Roar will allow you to, at least, force out taunt less Gyarados while also preventing things like cro-Cune from setting up on you.

I'd also suggest to run stone edge on Flygon over fire blast, switching to an adamant nature. With Heatran and Gengar on the team, Skarmory shouldn't be a problem, and fire blast is not going to ohko it anyway. Stone edge will help you to revenge kill Gyara without locking your Flygon into outrage.

On your own Gyarados, definitely go with stone edge over ice fang, water\rock offers better type coverage, and if you're not going to use taunt, I'd also give bounce a try over EQ: it almost ohkos Celebi and works nicely with leftovers.

On your sub Heatran I'd try toxic in the last slot, it's really useful to cripple bulky waters like Vaporeon, which may also stop your Gyarados sweep later in the game. Also, although lava plume has the appealing 30% burn rate, I'm sure that you'll feel the loss in power without fire blast, so I'd try that too.

Now onto Gengar: since you're using substitute on it, why not trying focus punch too? With an EV spread of: 100 Atk / 156 SpA / 252 Spe and an hasty, you can 2hko Blissey and ohko TTar without having to rely on focus blast crappy accuracy. Also, definitely expert belt on it, or between sub, SR, life orb and possibly sandstorm your Gengar won't last more than 2-3 turns.

Good luck with your team!
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First thanks. To Raikou>Gengar I think I will test it the only thing that sucks on Raikou is the Ground Weak but I will test it. So the Gyarados weak on my Team sucks and I known it bevor but Ill test Raikou then and hope it can stop Gyarados. Fireblast on Flygon is better than Stone Edge so I think.I allready tested Toxic on Heatran and I will not use it.Focus Punch on Gengar Is an option. So I will test the most things today and then I will report it her.

EDIT: So I tested and Focus Punch Gengar isnt that great but Raikou is great and I will change it to him.Gyarados is with this set fine and works great for me. Heatrans Slot 4 makes me insane. Nothing really works Dragons Pulse doenst kill all the Dragons like HP [Ice] and HP [Electric] isnt that great, Toxic does really suck because there are to many Steel Types. So maybe I will Test HP [Grass] now.And Stone Edge on Flygon doesnt look that great. So I doesnt change it and Ill leave the Fire Blast.
 
So I want to Update the Thread on the first Site(please dont delete this post!) and Is there something that can be changed?
 
vielIeis said:
EDIT: So I tested and Focus Punch Gengar isnt that great but Raikou is great and I will change it to him.Gyarados is with this set fine and works great for me. Heatrans Slot 4 makes me insane. Nothing really works Dragons Pulse doenst kill all the Dragons like HP [Ice] and HP [Electric] isnt that great, Toxic does really suck because there are to many Steel Types. So maybe I will Test HP [Grass] now.And Stone Edge on Flygon doesnt look that great. So I doesnt change it and Ill leave the Fire Blast.
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Seriously, are you joking? The only steel type which is able to afford to switch into Heatran is an opposing Heatran, and you can ohko it with earth power when behind the sub, every other steel in the game is 1-2hko'd by fire blast. Toxic is a great move on Heatran, if used correctly. It can also force Blissey out if she doesn't carry seismic toss.
 
Haunter said:
Seriously, are you joking? The only steel type which is able to afford to switch into Heatran is an opposing Heatran, and you can ohko it with earth power when behind the sub, every other steel in the game is 1-2hko'd by fire blast. Toxic is a great move on Heatran, if used correctly. It can also force Blissey out if she doesn't carry seismic toss.
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Ok maybe I test toxic again but I dont like It onHeatran.
 
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