Pelistorm - Only the Rarest Pokémon

[Axelotl]

Hello, and welcome to my first RMT! I'm still a bit new to the forums (I've done competitive battling for ~2 years though), so please be gentle :P This is a team I've been having fun with recently (you may have seen it in the Next Best Thing thread over in the NU sub forums, I was swept by Work Up Kangaskhan ^^; ), and I feel like it's got some yet-unreached potential. And so I post it here, to (hopefully) receive some excellent feedback from much better battlers than myself!

Enough ass-licking, let's get on to the team.

So this is Pelistorm and his posse. Before I go into it more, I'd like to note that the team consists essentially of an offensive and a defensive core, so I'll post only briefly about each individual set, and then go into more detail once I've gone through every member.

Offensive Core

Pelistorm (Pelipper) (M) @ Damp Rock
Trait: Rain Dish
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk
Bold Nature
- Hurricane
- Roost
- Hydro Pump
- Rain Dance

The man himself. He makes a decent bulky attacker, with added survivability provided by Rain Dish + Roost. Pretty much the standard on-site set, except I run Bold over Modest because I felt like I was constantly over-estimating Pelistorm's bulk. It also means that I can afford to run Hydro Pump as Pelistorm won't be punished as much by a physical hit if he misses.

Pubertoad (Seismitoad) (M) @ Damp Rock
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 96 HP / 252 SAtk / 160 Spd
Modest Nature
- Earth Power
- Hydro Pump
- Stealth Rock
- Rain Dance

Pretty standard, on-site set again. I run Stealth Rock over Sludge Wave here, because I didn't need the coverage so much considering my next team member. I used to have Stealth Rock on Golurk (which I used over Skuntank), but it wasn't doing much so I slapped it on here instead. Seismitoad is pretty good at forcing switches though so it works.

Bossbuck (Sawsbuck) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Horn Leech
- Double-Edge
- Jump Kick
- Megahorn

Sawsbuck is my Scarfer + Grass type switch in. I have Jolly over Adamant for that little extra speed, and Sawsbuck's job is to get a Sap Sipper boost anyway, so it usually manages to get its Atk boosted anyway. Megahorn and Jump Kick aren't on the on-site Scarf set, but the reasoning is Megahorn takes care of Grass types that Sawsbuck is supposed to switch in on, and Jump Kick is for things like Probopass and Regice (the latter of which is very problematic for this team).


As you may have noticed, there's a lot of synergy going on with this core. Seismitoad beautifully covers all of Pelipper's weaknesses, taking little damage from Rock-type attacks, and none from Electric attacks. Sawsbuck, in turn, covers Seismitoad's Grass weakness, and even gets boosted by it. Also means I don't have to worry about Sleep Powder, which is always excellent. Sawsbuck's weaknesses are Fire, Bug, Poison, Fighting, Flying, and Ice. The previous four are all covered by Seismitoad and Pelipper, with only Ice and Flying left unresisted by this core (coincidentally, these two types aren't covered by the defensive core either...). As you can see, the point of this offensive core is to gain momentum by utilizing the weaknesses of the core's other members.

Defensive Core

Smoker's lungs (Weezing) (M) @ Black Sludge
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Bold Nature
- Clear Smog
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
- Sludge Bomb

Standard Weezing, nothing much to say here. I used to run Thunder over Sludge Bomb which I quickly realized was absolutely ridiculous.

Fab (Lickilicky) (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Body Slam
- Heal Bell

Standard Lickilicky. I have a hard time deciding between Dragon Tail and Body Slam. I have been in situations where I wish I'd had Dragon Tail, but I've also been in situations where I was glad I had Body Slam. Own Tempo also screws up stupid parafusion Liepard which is neat :D

Eau de Merde (Skuntank) @ Dread Plate
Trait: Aftermath
EVs: 252 Atk / 220 SDef / 36 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Crunch
- Pursuit
- Sucker Punch
- Taunt

And to round off my standard defensive core; a standard Skuntank. Really nothing to say here, other than my French skills are unparalleled.


Much like the other core, this one too has a lot of focus on synergy. Weezing covers Lickilicky's Fighting weakness, and Skuntank covers Weezing's Psychic weakness. In return, Weezing can take on Ground-type moves aimed at Skuntank. Here, the offensive core ties in a bit too; Pelipper can come in on Ground-type moves as well, with the benefit of not getting fucked up by Mold Breaker. Weezing can take on Fighting-type moves for Sawsbuck as well, if Pelipper is weakened or dead. Skuntank also helps Sawsbuck by taking care of Jynx (which would be a major pain for this team otherwise), and Drifblim (which totally shuts down Sawsbuck and can be slightly problematic for the team). Licklicky, while not resisting it, can usually take on Ice moves due to his massive bulk. Lickilicky's main support, however, is Wish + Heal Bell, both moves which allow me to play a little more aggressively.


The main threat to this team that I've encountered is Regice. With Ice Beam/Tbolt/Focus Blast it can lay a serious smack on my team, and since my two main sweepers are special, there's not much I can do in return. Whittling it down with something until it dies, then revenging with Sawsbuck's Jump Kick is essentially my best bet, which of course is not at all reliable. Two other threats are Braviary and Swellow, which I (fortunately) have not been running in to too much. Best bet is usually revenging with Sawsbuck and/or finishin off with Sucker Punch from Skuntank. Golbat has also proven to be a slight nuisance, however, it usually can't do too much in return, so it's not really that big of a deal.

That's pretty much all I have to say for now, I'm looking forward to seeing some comments that can allow Pelipper to rise up to Jon's expectations :) Hope you enjoyed!

 

[ryan]

Hey man, nice team you've got here. Don't have a whole lot of time to comment at the moment, but I do question the use of Pelipper over Swanna. I realize that they have similar base Special Attack, but I feel like speed would be better than the bulk that Pelipper provides. I could be wrong; this is just something I noticed right off the bat.

Anyways, I will edit my post later for a more involved rate. Looks like a pretty good team though.

Edit:

Alright, first off, as for the below comment, I always found Poison Jab vs. Crunch to be a matter of personal preference. The main appeal of Poison Jab is hitting Cacturne, but 1. Cacturne isn't really a threat to your team and 2. Cacturne has fallen out of its graces in favor of Scolipede in most scenarios. I think you'd be fine with Crunch, but either works.

Next, I personally don't see much appeal for Scarf Sawsbuck. I will say, though, that if you do want to keep it, typically Chlorophyll would be the better ability on a Rain team, as Sun teams can be threatening with opposing Chlorophyll sweepers. The benefit of outspeeding Sun sweepers is huge. The set itself is good though. But due to the issues you tend to have with Regice, a scarf Fighting-type such as Primeape may be more suited for your needs. It can OHKO Regice reliably with Close Combat without having to worry about the potential to miss Jump Kick, and Fighting-type STAB is always welcome. In addition to that, it can help keep up momentum with U-Turn which is otherwise difficult to come by on your team. Since Primeape sits in the same speed tier as Sawsbuck, you aren't missing out on outspeeding anything.

Another way to handle pretty much all of the Pokemon you state you have trouble with is by using Swords Dance Armaldo in place of Seismitoad. With its Rock-type STAB and access to Swift Swim, I feel it would be a Pokemon that your team would greatly appreciate. With a set of Stone Edge|Rock Blast/X-Scissor/Swords Dance/Earthquake|Rapid Spin, it could really manhandle the threats that Pelipper (or should you decide it would be a better fit, Swanna) cannot typically bypass.

Of course, if you were to do this, your team would appreciate another Rain setter. Because of this, should you replace Seismitoad, it would be a good idea to use Specially Defensive Seismitoad in place of Skuntank. I don't really see many Psychic types causing issues to your team outside of Jynx which is handled with Armaldo. Specially defensive Seismitoad can do a few things for you that Skuntank cannot. First off, it can set the Rain up which is of course always appreciated. Second, it can set up Stealth Rock which your team currently cannot. And finally, and most importantly, Seismitoad can take hits from Water types that would otherwise be massive threats to your team. I think this would be a great fit for you.

Anyways, as I said before, you've got a solid team here, and with a few tweaks, I could see it truly excelling. I may even try the team out with the tweaks I mentioned!

Recap of suggested changes:

Scarf Sawsbuck->Scarf Primeape

Seismitoad->SD Armaldo

Armaldo@Life Orb | Trait: Swift Swim
Jolly Nature | 252 Atk / 196 Spe / 60 HP / 4 Def
- Stone Edge
- X-Scissor
- Swords Dance
- Rapid Spin/Earthquake

Skuntank->Specially Defensive Seismitoad

Seismitoad@Damp Rock | Trait: Water Absorb
Calm Nature | 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 SpA
- Rain Dance
- Stealth Rock
- Hydro Pump/Scald
- Earth Power

Note that the EVs on Armaldo look pretty weird. Max Attack because it wants to hit hard. Enough Speed to outspeed Jolly Swellow in the Rain, 60 HP for a Stealth Rock number, and 4 in Defense because leftover EVs.

Also, if you do care to trade Pelipper for Swanna, the set I would recommend would be:

Swanna@Life Orb | Trait: Hydration
Timid Nature | 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
- Rain Dance
- Surf
- Hurricane
- Roost/Rest

 

[Riley 15]

I also think u have a good team but i have 2 minor suggestions: #1 i think u should run poison jab > crunch on Skuntank just to get another stab attack and to not be limited to one move type and #2 i think u should run toxic instead of heal bell on Lickilicky just to deal with walls or pokemon who are setting up. Hope this helped :D!

 

[Axelotl]

Thanks to both of you for your comments so far, nice to hear that you're liking my team :)

Treecko37: I figured someone would suggest Swanna :P I'm a little bit biased against it, as I started builiding the team around Pelipper, and I do appreciate the grace and ease with which he switches in on physical moves. I won't write Swanna off though, I'll wait for your expanded post before I take a stance on it.

Riley 15: Thanks for your feedback as well :) I really like Heal Bell on Lickilicky though, it allows me to be more reckless (I can allow Sawsbuck to take a Twave for instance if it means can take the opponent out and just heal it off later), as well as softening mispredictions with sleep for instance. As for Skuntank, his role on the team is essentially to take out threatening Ghosts and Psychics to support my other mons, and anything else is a distraction from that, really. Also, Crunch allows me to hit foes that stay in thinking I'll Pursuit much harder, so I think I'll keep those two as they are. Thanks anyway :)

 

[ryan]

Yeah, I mean, I don't blame you for wanting to keep Pelipper; you built the team around it. Personally, I prefer Swanna, but to be completely honest, it's totally up to your preference. If you like it, keep it. But I would test it and see how it works for you. :]

 

[No Luck Involved]

I think you're onto something with Pelipper, but I'd be inclined to go even more defensive: max Spdef + Calm in fact. Pelipper's pretty rare typing makes it a bane of most Rain sweepers, with max investment Ludicolo's LO Giga Drain does this: 37.96% - 44.75% (3 hits to KO) which doesn't look too good at first when you consider Stealth Rock but Rain Dish and Leftover healing means it never 2HKOs. Hurricane does this back: 74.75% - 88.7% (2 hits to KO). Also consider that Ludicolo likely needs a turn to set up rain and you can see Pelipper counters it pretty damn hard under most circumstances.

If you do make that change, I'd suggest ditching Rain Dance and Hydro Pump and putting in Toxic and Surf instead. Rain Dance isn't worth a turn for the minimal healing it provides, Toxic allows you to hurt walls and is a good move to spam. Surf is for PP and reliability since Pelliper isn't going for power anymore. With those changes you should have a pretty good Rain check and decent special sponge on your hands.

Next up, I suggest giving Seismitoad Life Orb instead of Damp Rock. If it's still alive after 4 turns it has most likely already crushed everything in sight. There's no need for 7 turns of Rain, LO will help it bring more pain. Also I'd get rid of SR and put in Sludge Wave because...

I suggest getting rid of Weezing and putting a proper SR setter in there. Something along the lines of Golem. Also I'm not sure you're particularly in need of getting rid of Psychics so I'd be tempted to switch Skuntank with say a Scarf Rotom-S and setting Sawsbuck free with a Sub + SD set to help wallbreak. I think that might give your team a bit more balance and help you handle some more threats. Hope this helped!

 

[Dell]

I really think that you should edit your Pokemon descriptions a bit more, since one of the main reasons upon why the rates here were questionable (though Treecko37 and No Luck Involved ninja'd me so you're fine there) for the time being is that they don't actually have a very clear understanding of why you chose the actual Pokemon nor explaining the roles that they take for this team's actual success. This is something that you have little to no description on.

Treecko37, keep in mind that it's generally not a very viable idea to make a replacement (not counting moveset/EV-wise) on a Pokemon that the team is based around unless it's a really gimmicky or outclassed role that really needs this suggestion, since otherwise that kind of just takes away the focal point of the team and it's somewhat of a letdown in a sense that it would imply that they don't know how to structure the basis of their team. So just be careful with that one and don't arbitrarily make suggestions just because you "think" they're better Pokemon overall.

Needless to say Axelotl, from the looks of the basis of the team, you seem to have a decent understanding of the current metagame, but the problem that I see here is just that there are a few things that just seems rather out of place for the pace and focal role of this team. Treecko37 and NLI did make some fairly solid suggestions (I definitely agree with most of their suggestions, however I agree that you should keep Skuntank to avoid this team's potential troubles with Musharna or Trace Gardevoir), but I'm really questioning the need of Weezing when Pelipper already packs some of the same resists and immunities that you're referring to (not to mention a reliable recovery move), while at the same token the presence of Weezing on your team only makes you extremely vulnerable to some very standard threats such as Jynx or Ludicolo whom in regards to the former nothing can really switch in and it can beat your slower Pokemon 1v1 thanks to Lovely Kiss. Since you don't particularly need the defenses that Weezing provides as of result, I recommend that you should replace Weezing with standard Kangaskhan, as that provides you a very solid revenge killer that is capable of checking a lot of threats that your team has a weakness against like Jynx, Swellow with its variety of priority that it provides on your team and it provides a pretty well-rounded Attack stat that allows you to hit Regice or Eelektross hard, both of what your team is weak to.

I suppose that I really rushed this rate since I'm multitasking a lot for the time being. With that being said, I suppose that my 5:00 PM caffeine-induced mindset right now won't matter too much within the grand scheme of situations going on here, but I'd still give Kangaskhan a try if I were you. You might like what you experience within it.

Kangaskhan @ Silk Scarf | Scrappy
Adamant nature | 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Fake Out / Double-Edge / Earthquake / Sucker Punch

 

[youngjake93]

I'm not sure if it has been said, but you don't have the hazards control to win a bulky war and you don't have any boosting sweepers for a win condition. That makes a team a lot harder to play. I've seen SD armaldo suggested and I think it accomplishes both of those things.

 

[Axelotl]

Thanks everyone for the extensive feedback so far!

Sorry about the layout issues, Agent Dell. I felt like if I went with the traditional RMT layout I wouldn't get enough said about the synergy of the cores themselves, and I figured that if I did it this way, there'd be a lack of explanation on the individual Pokés. I decided that since the synergy was so important I would do it this way, but maybe it would've been better to just have more on each mon as well as having the description of each core, some repetition probably wouldn't have made a big deal. Sorry if it was confusing.

I'm really liking the suggestions Treecko37 made in his expanded post; at first I was considering Agent Dell's suggestion of replacing Weezing, but I think that the Pelipper and Weezing support each other more than they overlap; Weezing can take Stone Edges from Primeape and Sawk, and cripple them back with WoW, while Pelipper can easily come in on Mold Breaker Sawk's Earthquake aimed at Weezing and set up Rain. I'm considering moving some EV's over to Defense on Pelipper though, to further increase survivability, although I don't know how hard this will damage Pelipper's offensive output.

Armaldo seems like a good option, as suggested by both Treecko37 and youngjake93, as it should be able to take hits from the birds, and hit both them and Regice back hard. In addition, it benefits from the Rain, so I really like the idea. It also hits Psychics hard so the lack of Skuntank shouldn't matter too much, as well as possibly provide Rapid Spin for easier switch-ins on Pelipper's part. I also like the idea of S.Def Seismitoad, who can still come in on Electric and Rock moves aimed at Pelipper and Armaldo, and with Water Absorb, rain-boosted Water moves aimed at Armaldo as well.

Switching Sawsbuck to Primeape is probably the one thing that I'm least appealed by of Treecko37's suggestions. Sawsbuck was there for Sap Sipper; taking advantage of Grass moves aimed at Seismitoad. Primeape can still take Sleep Powder though, and does that bit even better than Sawsbuck, being able to switch in to all Sleep moves, not just Sleep Powder. Primeape's ability to hit Regice isn't as necessary with Armaldo on the team, either. In addition, it adds a Psychic weakness to the team, with the only resist being replaced. I'll try the team out both with and without Primeape.

I'll test these changes for now, and report back here for results in a while. Thanks guys, you've all been of great help so far :)

 

[ium]

everyone else failed to point this out, but the main problem with your team is the fact that you are stuck in the idea of covering typing and having perfect synergy between your pokemon to supposedly be able to switch into "anything." doing such a thing has caused you to have absolutely no good win conditions, and like someone said before, even bulkier teams will have a relatively easy time against yours. of course you need synergy, but mostly in being able to cover specific threats, not attacking types. for example, a lot of your switch-ins will still be prediction-reliant against choice band sawk, which can OHKO anything on your team if the opponent makes the right choice, and once it does just that, your next switch will just allow the opponent to switch sawk out with impunity (this is where your lack of a win condition hurts; you don't force the opponent to react). also, once weezing is slightly weakened, how will you keep non-choiced sawk from getting a 6-0 against your team aside from revenge killing? the truth is that many pokemon, like sawk, have superb coverage or boosting capabilities, so you will have trouble with some of them if you look at teambuilding the way you are doing it right now.

firstly, your team has many redundancies. weezing and pelipper mostly cover the same types and it's a waste to have both of them on the same team when they don't accomplish too many different things. some of the special attacking types (water, grass, and psychic) will be covered by seismitoad and skuntank, so i don't really see the need for lickilicky aside from wish passing. additionally, having sawsbuck isn't completely necessary when pokemon like skuntank (or even weezing) can take advantage of many of the same grass-types.

i think that switching over to physically defensive pelipper will allow you to check basically the same threats as weezing. weezing itself can be replaced with something that can take advantage of pelipper's weakness to things like stone edge, rather than just simply switch in and not gain much momentum at all like i said with that sawk scenario earlier. klang would fit best over weezing, because it does just that—using it's wide array of resistances, it'll find opportunities to set up on weak or choice-locked pokemon. it also has the added bonus of checking and taking advantage of some of your trouble pokemon, like swellow, choiced braviary, and non-focus blast variants of regice.

of course this change will leave you even more open to sawk, which can still potentially punch holes in most of your team, and easily if it's not choiced. you already have a good defensive check in pelipper, so having an offensively-oriented and more purposeful check would be a neat idea here. i'm suggesting choice scarf gardevoir over lickilicky for several purposes. the first is having a good check to slower variants of sawk and being able to revenge kill them. additionally, it has access to trace, which means it can do some of lickilicky's job in being able to check special-attacking weather threats that use chlorophyll or swift swim with their respective weather. and lastly, trick allows gardevoir to catch any defensive or boosting pokemon in order to make them easier to handle. of course, gardevoir can't be your catch-all check, so going for the specially defensive seismitoad that was suggested by other people would be good, except with a slightly different set involving earthquake for jynx and toxic or knock off for anything that resists seismitoad's STAB moves. such a set will also give you a buffer against some pokemon like jynx if you end up in a bad situation where gardevoir can't revenge kill or if skuntank is out-predicted and/or put to sleep.

i would also try testing things over sawsbuck, because it's not really an amazing pokemon to have as a choice scarf user, but maybe you or someone else can build off these suggestions. hopefully this puts a slightly different perspective on teambuilding aside from focusing too much on the cookie cutter "cover-all-types" sort of ideology.

sets

pelipper @ leftovers | rain dish
bold nature | 248 hp / 252 def / 8 spd
scald / hurricane / u-turn / roost

klang @ eviolite | clear body
adamant nature | 72 hp / 252 atk / 188 spe
substitute or magnet rise / shift gear / gear grind / return

gardevoir @ choice scarf | trace
timid nature | 4 def / 252 spa / 252 spe
psychic / shadow ball / focus blast / trick

seismitoad @ leftovers | water absorb
sassy nature | 252 hp / 4 def / 252 spd
stealth rock / scald / earthquake / toxic or knock off

 

[Axelotl]

That's some pretty harsh assessment, ium, some of which I feel is unjustified. The win condition of this team is to set up rain with Pelipper/Seismitoad, and the way of doing that is by gaining momentum through utilizing weaknesses, immunities, and resistances. Say Pelipper is in, and the opponent send in Electabuzz. The following turn is an excellent opportunity to go into Seismitoad for free, set up the rain, and start hitting hard with rain boosted attacks. This may not be the best of examples, because if the Electabuzz carries HP Grass and my opponent is even remotely decent, they'll see the Seismitoad switch coming. But that's what the defensive core is for, scouting for the enemies moves and items, as well as allowing me to determine the skill level/playstyle of my opponent.

The changes you suggest start deviating really far from this concept. I don't see the point of running Pelipper at all anymore if there's going to be no rain support on the team, the only benefit it has over Weezing or Misdreavus in that case is countering Rain, which you said Scarf Gardevoir can do anyway. I agree with the idea of having more defensive investment on Pelipper, as it allows it to come in on harder hits and set up the rain, but I just don't see the point of running Pelipper at all on a team with no rain.

I do see the point of Klang, and I'll try running it over SD Armaldo that I was testing. It basically hits the same things, with the addition of handling the birds better than Armaldo. It's ability to take on non-Focus Blast Regice isn't really as relevant though, because Specially Defensive Seismitoad (which you yourself suggested) does that as well.

The way you talk about Sawk makes it seem like it's a huge problem for the team; it's not. As I said before, the combination of Pelipper and Weezing takes care of Sawk perfectly fine. I've encountered it multiple times, and not once has it been an issue to deal with, every time it's been either rain fodder for Pelipper or threatened out by Weezing, who can then spread burns around. I also don't like the idea of replacing Lickilicky; Heal Bell is a great boon to the team. The situation you mentioned with Skuntank asleep, where Seismitoad would be a good buffer against Jynx, wouldn't be a problem at all with Lickilicky, as a) it can take care of Jynx on its own (as long as it doesn't have Focus Blast), and b) it can Heal Bell the sleep off Skuntank so it can proceed to do its job. I might end up using Scarf Gardevoir over Sawsbuck though.

You basically suggested that I change my entire team except for the one Pokémon I was most willing to change...

 

[jake]

if i may interject without being particularly obnoxious, i just want to clarify and amend some things. ium wasn't being harsh, just truthful and intending to help you with your team.

That's some pretty harsh assessment, ium, some of which I feel is unjustified. The win condition of this team is to set up rain with Pelipper/Seismitoad, and the way of doing that is by gaining momentum through utilizing weaknesses, immunities, and resistances. Say Pelipper is in, and the opponent send in Electabuzz. The following turn is an excellent opportunity to go into Seismitoad for free, set up the rain, and start hitting hard with rain boosted attacks. This may not be the best of examples, because if the Electabuzz carries HP Grass and my opponent is even remotely decent, they'll see the Seismitoad switch coming. But that's what the defensive core is for, scouting for the enemies moves and items, as well as allowing me to determine the skill level/playstyle of my opponent.

i don't think you understand what exactly what ium means, here. yes, any individual sweeper can be a win condition, but your team is an incredibly reactive one rather than one that pushes around the opposing team with offensive pressure and good team synergy (not typing synergy!). to use your example, if you have pelipper in and i have electabuzz out, you go to seismitoad. sure, you can scout for hp grass by switching directly to lickilicky afterwards, but what kind of pressure are you actually putting on me here? are you actually getting any advantage, when i can just stay in and keep attacking and you have to switch around to handle me like that? if you're going to wish with lickilicky, i can just volt switch again and send in something threatening like special samurott or scolipede and keep pressing my advantages until i can break through your team while you're forced to keep wasting turns switching around and trying to deal with what i'm throwing at you. you can't do something similar if i run a bulky team either because you don't have a reliable way to do things like breaking through opposing sdef walls apart from hoping that pelipper does enough damage with hydro pump or gets lucky with hurricane confusion.

you're relying on mons that simply resist each others' weaknesses to be effective together, rather than picking ones that work together with one another very well offensively. you're switching around a lot to deal with the opponent's team, not the other way around. you have no realistic way to break through another well-built bulky team because none of your pokemon actually can break through their counters like regice or otherwise assist their teammates. i understand that this is built to be a balanced team and that you have to take some liberties with offensive support, but you're really restricting yourself by focusing on the typing rather than how they actually deal with prominent threats. remember: it's not an attack on you or your teambuilding, but rather showing you some very clear realities - against an equally skilled opponent with a decent or good offensive team, you will almost always start with a disadvantage simply because the nature of your team doesn't really allow you to push for any advantage. it's very reactive rather than proactive.

if there's anything you can get from what i just said there at all, i'd just like you to think about working with pokemon that can actually break through their counters with sheer force or intelligent set design (like sd samurott) on your next bulky offense team. i don't really feel like addressing every bit of what you said in the remainder of your post, but really you shouldn't feel offended by what was suggested, just take it as another way to think about building your next team if you're really that reluctant to test the changes that ium suggested.

You basically suggested that I change my entire team except for the one Pokémon I was most willing to change...

it was two set changes to maximize the effectiveness of those pokemon on your team + two pokemon changes to help you with the weaknesses you listed

 

[WhiteDMist]

Sorry, but I actually agree with ium's rate (and what Zeb said). Pelipper is far too slow to truly be a win condition, and Seismitoad is merely an average cleaner without Life Orb. Even originally, this team was not truly a Rain team since you lacked enough ways to truly abuse the Rain (thus many turns of Rain would easily be wasted if you you were forced to switch into one of your other 4 non-Rain Pokemon). The team itself is an embodiment of a balanced team, and adding Rain to it simply takes up unneccesary turns. Also, Pelipper doesn't NEED Rain to function, since it can still act as a physical wall. I won't go over the problems with relying on a defensive core to switch in to things because ium and zeb both already explained it in great detail.

After playtesting with all the suggested changes from all the other raters (as well as the original team), I found that ium's suggestions did bring the most consistency to your team. The only thing I want to suggest would be changing Scarf Sawsbuck to a Life Orb SD 3 Attacks set. It gives you another win condition that has a lot of initial power; it also does very well in breaking through Alomomola (who Klang still has trouble breaking past even at +4, especially with the lack of recovery preventing it from making too many Subs). This also makes a lot better use of Sawsbuck's great coverage and Speed. It's not like having 2 Scarf users helps you out after all. There are other possible options as a sweeper, like LO Kangaskhan (providing you with excellent priority); I simply feel that keeping your team roster as close to the original as possible works the best.

 

[Axelotl]

I would've posted a longer reply apologising for my butthurtedness and responding to these new suggestions and ideas, but ny finals start on Thursday, so ain't nobody got time fo dat. I'll edit this post/post again when they're over (it'll take a while though). However, I might as well note that my favorite YouTube commentator Nbz used this team in one of his videos. Interestingly enough, he notes the problem on how much switching around there is with the team, but he also shows how much work offensive Pelipper can put in. Check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZSuUEJCPBk