Gen 5 Revisiting BW Monotype

[Kev]

Throughout the past edition of MPL, the community has commented on the state of the BW metagame and some believe that changes are required to balance it. In order to gather the opinions of the community, this thread is being posted to allow people to express their grievances with the metagame in a detailed argument. The only posts that will be accepted in this thread are serious, constructive arguments; do not post any one-liners or make claims without any backing. It should also be clarified that this thread is by no means a guarantee of action, solid backing does not necessarily mean action will be taken. The quality of the arguments is what will lead to decisions being made. The main thing here is that historically BW Monotype has faithfully followed every decision made by BW OU, however there is no actual obligation to do so. The main guidelines for what can be addressed here are bans and unbans of Pokemon, banning luck based items, or removing the sleep ban. Of course, if the community deems there to be no necessary changes, then there simply would not be any.

While it is fine if anyone wants to simply explain all the changes they require, it would be ideal that all suggestions be presented in the form of a timeline of actions. This allows for the formulation of a proper and appropriate plan on how to improve the quality of the metagame. The spoiler tag below has an outline example of a well organized post. I have just taken arguments that were thrown around public for the sample, and they do not necessarily reflect my personal opinions.

Post example

In this post, I will go through the different changes I believe are required to fix the present state of the BW metagame. The order I believe these decisions should be taken in go from top to bottom.

1) Ban luck based items

Reason: ---

2) Ban Jirachi

Reason: ---

3) Unban Tornadus-Therian

Reason: ---

Another thing I would like others to comment on is the interest of participating in a round robin style tournament during the tiering process. It would be great to get a large sample of games of the potential new metagames in order to observe and evaluate the impact of the changes. It would be better to see the people that are invested in BW build and compete in the fresh metagames to prevent making decisions that would be regretted the next time it is played in an official capacity. I would prefer clearing out any issues immediately, than getting to Monotype generations (or whatever old gens tournament will happen first) and everyone realizing that something has suddenly become unbearable. Of course, the issue with this is that we ideally want to go through the modifications period rapidly if there are many, in order to not drag out the process. However, the short timeframe for the changes would also make the round robin groups harder to complete as competitors would be asked to potentially build and play multiple series in a week, or 2 weeks. There is of course, also the option of doing a swiss style tournament, but I do not believe that would give an adequate sample size. There is no obligation to hold any tournament, I just personally believe that it would be an ideal, and fun way to develop the tier before reaching an acceptable status. If any does have other suggestions on how to do this, feel free to give them.

When sufficient replies have been received (ideally within 1-2 weeks), tiering actions will start being taken if any are required. Thanks to anyone constructively helping us improve BW Monotype !

 

[Zar]

1) Unban Spore
Before the Spore / Sleep clause ban, Fighting used to be a top 3 type in the tier and honestly helped keep Psychic in check in some way. The second BW OU banned Spore, Fighting went in the dumpster (it's slowly coming back with more usage this MPL) and Psychic went clear as the undisputed top type in the tier. I'm sure BW OU had its reasons to ban it but Spore wasn't ever broken in Monotype and since the OP mentions we don't have any obligations to follow BW OU, I think we can try it out in the tier. The main problems and differentiators of Spore in BW and other gens is the fact that it affects Grass types and Sleep turns reset on switch in BW. This can put off some people like Attribute saying it's uncompetitive. I think the round robin tournament that was mentioned in OP would be a perfect place to test if this mechanic can be used without it being uncompetitive.

2) Ban Latios / Victini (Or just nerf Psychic in some other way)

This one might be a bit controversial and I'm not sure about which one should go out of Latios or Victini. I'd like to hear the opinions of other people on this as well but I'm sure most people will agree that Psychic is stupidly good in BW and there is honestly no reason for someone to use anything other than Psychic as it has consistently beaten every single type (other than maybe like Fire but I'm sure it has beaten Fire a few times too) in the last few tournaments. Just to back it up with some stats:

MPL 7: Psychic was used 21 times with a win rate of 66.67%. 2nd most used type was Steel with 12.
MWC 2: Psychic was used 11 times with a win rate of 63.64%. 2nd most used type was Water with 7.
MPL 6: Psychic was used 25 times with a win rate of 60%. 2nd most used type was Fighting with 14.

Psychic's usage in the past 3 tours has been almost double the 2nd most used type. But the biggest issue with Psychic is the number of variants of Psychic people run. In the past tours people mainly used the Sabella ScarfGross team but now there are like 3-4 different teams all tech'd to beat different types. It's incredibly hard to prep for all the Psychic's in the tier while also making sure the team doesn't get dumpstered on by some other type. The reason I'm specifically mentioning Latios / Victini is because those two are the main stays in every Psychic team.

 

[Ronman5]

1) Unban Spore
Before the Spore / Sleep clause ban, Fighting used to be a top 3 type in the tier and honestly helped keep Psychic in check in some way. The second BW OU banned Spore, Fighting went in the dumpster (it's slowly coming back with more usage this MPL) and Psychic went clear as the undisputed top type in the tier. I'm sure BW OU had its reasons to ban it but Spore wasn't ever broken in Monotype and since the OP mentions we don't have any obligations to follow BW OU, I think we can try it out in the tier. The main problems and differentiators of Spore in BW and other gens is the fact that it affects Grass types and Sleep turns reset on switch in BW. This can put off some people like Attribute saying it's uncompetitive. I think the round robin tournament that was mentioned in OP would be a perfect place to test if this mechanic can be used without it being uncompetitive.

To also say you might just wanna put sleep in general since stuff like hypnosis is also banned so maybe just yeet no sleep moves as a whole for the argument, it would open up sets for politoed instead of a more one dimensional Specs/scarf

Doing this might also might show the difference between OU and mono some but I’m sure this would need to be heavily tested first to see if users would even like this

 

[Jolly Togekiss ^-^]

1. Ban Latios. By far the most oppressive mon to build against right now. Specs Latios is an insane breaker that can two-shot the defensive core of almost every top type. The only type Specs Latios doesn't instantly nuke is steel, which psychic has plenty of tech for on its other slots. Psychic is incredibly broken right now, and this change would make the water, flying, and ground matchups more competitive.

1) Unban Spore

I am fine with the current sleep clause. IMO the fall of fighting's usage and winrate this year doesn't reflect its actual viability.

2. Unban Tornadus-therian and Thundurus. If we are actually breaking away from the ou metagame then I think these two should be looked at. Their use on rain teams in ou resulted in a ban, however, in Monotype, they are stuck on Flying and Electric teams respectively. I think this would turn flying into a true top type, as opposed to what is right now. The other top types would have to run more tech for flying, which I would imagine would have a greatly improved matchup vs psychic without Latios

 

[Ronman5]

1. Ban Latios. By far the most oppressive mon to build against right now. Specs Latios is an insane breaker that can two-shot the defensive core of almost every top type. The only type Specs Latios doesn't instantly nuke is steel, which psychic has plenty of tech for on its other slots. Psychic is incredibly broken right now, and this change would make the water, flying, and ground matchups more competitive.



I am fine with the current sleep clause. IMO the fall of fighting's usage and winrate this year doesn't reflect its actual viability.

2. Unban Tornadus-therian and Thundurus. If we are actually breaking away from the ou metagame then I think these two should be looked at. Their use on rain teams in ou resulted in a ban, however, in Monotype, they are stuck on Flying and Electric teams respectively. I think this would turn flying into a true top type, as opposed to what is right now. The other top types would have to run more tech for flying, which I would imagine would have a greatly improved matchup vs psychic without Latios

I agree with both points here but one I might want to mention is perhaps banning Latias too?

without Latios, Latias can run very similar sets to her brother just hit slightly less harder, but at the same speed tier.

like the one set Latios can use over Latias is that one super niche set Jyph used in WCOP that involved DDance Latios with orb and EQ

Normally when both are availble they tend to have seperate niches with Latias focusing on setup/bulk and Latios focusing on pure power. But normally when Latios gets banned, Latias starts running similar sets to her brother (and in most cases gets banned after in older gens)

I feel like banning Latios without Latias being banned would just have Latias replace Latios’s role although this is speculation

I agree heavily on unbanning Tornadus Therian and Thundurus as they were truly only banned cause of rain teams and because the two could easily spam their thunders/hurricanes, which will be true now if they face water.

Idk what else more could be said than these points said above in both posts. Last one I can see is unbanning Genesect but even if I am personally biased would love to see that happen, I believe that it would make steel imbalanced and the type would become much stronger perhaps broken while buffing up bug a lot more… which while on paper sounds awful for Psychic types… Genesects matchups are incredibly good against water, steel, flying etc that it would just be stupid of me (or someone else) to recommend unbanning him

 

[Jyph]

All I got to say about this is banning latios effectively does nothing but make Dragon worse. Mons like victini and slowbro are really the glue that holds psy together.

Unbanning sleep is most definitely not the move, with this gen's mechanics a sleeping mon is a dead mon 99% of the time, and being forced to run sleep talk on every team is not healthy for the game.

Also banning latios effectively bans GotCookies (s/o cookies he's very dedicated to dd latios)

 

[Booty]

1. Ban Latios. By far the most oppressive mon to build against right now. Specs Latios is an insane breaker that can two-shot the defensive core of almost every top type. The only type Specs Latios doesn't instantly nuke is steel, which psychic has plenty of tech for on its other slots. Psychic is incredibly broken right now, and this change would make the water, flying, and ground matchups more competitive.



I am fine with the current sleep clause. IMO the fall of fighting's usage and winrate this year doesn't reflect its actual viability.

2. Unban Tornadus-therian and Thundurus. If we are actually breaking away from the ou metagame then I think these two should be looked at. Their use on rain teams in ou resulted in a ban, however, in Monotype, they are stuck on Flying and Electric teams respectively. I think this would turn flying into a true top type, as opposed to what is right now. The other top types would have to run more tech for flying, which I would imagine would have a greatly improved matchup vs psychic without Latios

2. Unban Tornadus-therian and Thundurus. - I second this as well. without getting into what they do for the respective types the main reason they are banned in BW OU is due to perma rain and both of these pokemon are not on water teams and would only aid in mu's vs water (if the user even decides to use rain) It stands to reason if their other forms are unbanned that the banned forms probably aren't unbalanced in monotype but I think they surely deserved to be looked at.

I also believe Genesect and Shaymin sky could potentially be looked at although i am not sure how balanced they would be. But if we are potentially looking to make our own banlist i think opening the door to more pokemon at less to start would be a good process. I agree with jyph that keeping the sleep ban is probably just better off. The ability to sleep any pokemon regardless of type and effectively playing 5v6 in games just takes away the skill part of those match ups to extent. While there arent too many pokemon that can abuse sleep its probably worth it to keep it banned.

 

[Kev]

Thank you to everyone that has contributed to the discussion so far, and we hope to see more quality contributions in the future.

After going through all the posts, Zap and I have made the following decisions:

1) Ban all luck based items (see: items banned in SS + Razor Fang)

These items aren't any more competitive in BW than they are in SS, so they should be removed by the same logic that was applied then.

2) Leaning towards unbanning Thundurus and Tornadus-Therian

We believe that it could be worth testing out Thundurus and Tornadus-Therian in the metagame. As mentioned in the thread, their OU bans are greatly contributed to how dangerous they are when paired with permanent rain. Moreover, they lose access to this in Monotype unless they are facing Water-type teams. Also, they exist on types that have no real hazard removal which also helps keep them in control.

3) Undecided on the course of action for Psychic

As shown by the thread, and other discussions we have witnessed, there is no clear path to mitigating the presence of Psychic in the metagame. There is no consensus amongst the mainstays of the generation on what to remove in order to breakdown this type. There has been such a wide range of opinions: ban Latios, ban Victini, ban Jirachi, do nothing at all...Basically, this point just isn't clear enough.

4) Leaning towards keeping the Sleep ban

We can see the points presented by the unban Sleep argument, but are not convinced that the benefits would outweigh the negatives nor would they be significant enough to modify such a clause.

The listed decisions are not final. These are simply an update of where we are at after seeing the feedback of the community in this thread, and of those that reached out to us in PMs. If anyone disagrees with our decisions on any of these points, or believes other points need to be addressed, they are welcome to continue the discussion. Unlike ORAS which is being represented in an upcoming PL, there is no hard deadline here. There is still quite a bit of discussion to be had for all the points; it would be great to get more perspectives and sides on the different arguments.

 

[Azelea]

This is not going to be a detailed post but just few pointers how I feel like:

1. BW mono is an excellent metagame right now while also being unbalanced. Both things can be true at the same time. There is no denying that Psychic is more versitile and powerful compared to the other types but other than that the balance is great, you can use multiple types, multiple playstyles and you rarely lose the game straight in preview, which is way more present in SS and ORAS right now.

2. Hence, I would be cautious when doing any big changes. Old gens don't need to be "perfected", everytime you ban or unban something it starts a butterfly effect. We made big changes in ORAS, which has lead to the need of making more changes, and will most likely lead us to making more changes in the future.

3. With this kept in mind, the only change I would be for is banning Latios. It is by far the most powerful pokemon in the metagame. It's speedtier means that it is only outsped by 5 usable pokemon in mono, 3 of which are also psychic types. It's so powerful that it has no walls on majority of the types. While Latias can do the same task on psychich and dragon teams as Latios, It can't do it nearly as well.
This would be a change that keeps the metagame the mostly the same, while removing something that is in my opinion very unhealthy.

4. Unbanning the remaining genies is something I would need to look more in to.

 

[Chaitanya]

Luck items can go but dont change anything else for now. psy got worse as mpl went on and the meta will continue to adapt (ex: ground seeing greater usage as tour went on) Banning latios when it has a pretty direct replacement with healing wish isn't going to change anything.

unbanning genies big mistake i think, specs/life orb(lol) torn has no real switchins, thundy speed + coverage is bonkers and flying has enough support to push those over the edge. Turning flying into a top type isn't the goal of this thread or general tiering.

i really hope the ppl talking bout darkrai are joking

I also believe Genesect and Shaymin sky could potentially be looked at although i am not sure how balanced they would be. But if we are potentially looking to make our own banlist i think opening the door to more pokemon at less to start would be a good process. I agree with jyph that keeping the sleep ban is probably just better off. The ability to sleep any pokemon regardless of type and effectively playing 5v6 in games just takes away the skill part of those match ups to extent. While there arent too many pokemon that can abuse sleep its probably worth it to keep it banned.

 

[Booty]

Luck items can go but dont change anything else for now. psy got worse as mpl went on and the meta will continue to adapt (ex: ground seeing greater usage as tour went on) Banning latios when it has a pretty direct replacement with healing wish isn't going to change anything.

unbanning genies big mistake i think, specs/life orb(lol) torn has no real switchins, thundy speed + coverage is bonkers and flying has enough support to push those over the edge. Turning flying into a top type isn't the goal of this thread or general tiering.

i really hope the ppl talking bout darkrai are joking




View attachment 378703

You can throw the genesect and shaymin sky out the window I dont mind as they are probably way too centralizing anyway. There is no reason to follow the OU ban list regarding thundy and Torn just because though. We should have our own banlist and decide as a collective if we think those two pokemon (thund & Torn) are unhealthy. If they are they go right back to being banned.

 

[Ronman5]

Luck items can go but dont change anything else for now. psy got worse as mpl went on and the meta will continue to adapt (ex: ground seeing greater usage as tour went on) Banning latios when it has a pretty direct replacement with healing wish isn't going to change anything.

unbanning genies big mistake i think, specs/life orb(lol) torn has no real switchins, thundy speed + coverage is bonkers and flying has enough support to push those over the edge. Turning flying into a top type isn't the goal of this thread or general tiering.

i really hope the ppl talking bout darkrai are joking




View attachment 378703

I mentioned Genesect as a joke, I can’t seriously believe in us unbanning those three because they are way too powerful

And this is coming from someone who would prob do anything to get Genesect bug back in mono again

Darkrai and Shaymin Sky are way too fast and annoying to put in, Darkrai can prob do sub NP or scarf/specs sets and tear most of the tier a new asshole while Shaymin sky is togekiss on crack (except vs ice types that is)

 

[Kev]

Following the most recent BW OU suspect, gems were banned. These items have never been seen as a problem in the context of Monotype, and we have decided not to follow the OU decision.

Gems remain legal in Monotype, tagging Kris in the case the ban was already implemented or was going to be

 

[Zap]

With the many BW Monotype slots we've had throughout our tournaments, it has become common knowledge that psychic as a pick can hardly go wrong. Taking a deeper look, Kev and I have realized that one of the main reasons for its versatility and power is Latios. It is a staple on all psychic teams and spamming Draco is easy for it, and decides a lot of games. Some teams even with the proper resists may not be able to handle specs Draco's, often resulting in 2hk0s despite the drop. Not to mention the coverage it has, with access to Thunder, Energy Ball, Hidden Power, Psychic, Surf, etc, Latios can become way too overbearing on any team. We want to put our thoughts here and open the discussion to anyone who has any input. We are looking to make the final decision post MPL.

My personal opinion; banning Latios has a straightforward answer, replacing it with Latias. However I feel that the slight power drop may be enough to diversify the metagame. Psychic as a whole has a lot of strengths that can be linked to it's success, but Latios always shined as the main breaker thats pretty much unwallable for some teams.

 

[Jolly Togekiss ^-^]

I think banning Latios is a great idea. Specs Latios is really hard for water- and ground-type teams to deal with defensively. Without it, Psychic-type teams will have to rely on more matchup-specific techs to keep those matchups solidly winning. Without the matchup compression that Latios usually provides, psychic will have to develop new compositions that (hopefully) won't be as safe in every matchup.

There are many, many replays of latios pivoting and getting 4+ kills against ground and water teams without any other matchup specific team support. Here are some examples:

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen5monotype-1392167084
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen5monotype-572287

 

[Attribute]

Latios should be banned. While Psychic probably won't be affected much by the ban, this should encourage the use of other types due to them not having to worry about how they're gonna deal with the many possible Latios sets. Even though Latias is the likely replacement, the difference between Specs Latios and Specs Latias using Draco Meteor, for example, is clear. Banning Latios would nerf Psychic without going too overboard, along with making everything else (bar Dragon, which is already down bad anyway) better.
Would like to hear everyone else's thoughts about this!

 

[nomadderwhat]

I really like to play bw when i do bother to play on showdown, and i have built and helped build a decent number of teams for crashy for the past (3?) mpls. (not boasting just for reference)

I've erased many paragraphs trying to think about what to say here, ultimately I guess I wish more people played the tier often and had joy for building in it and just making things (good or not). In SM most of us know what a standard team looks like for each type, and not only that we know the reason each mon is on there and what it does. BW is much poorer in that sense, no idea what most types are supposed to look like, whether they can perform well in any circumstance, and to more confidently say X type is bad/weak.

I plea for a lower type tour (basically no psychic, steel, water, fighting). Even if the teams produced aren't worth anything to premier tours, at least it would give room for people to build and be relaxed. Any tour would be beneficial, especially ones with custom rules like no latios or no certain type, no drizzle, whatever. Mpl won't be back for a long time so I don't really see a need to rush. But time is of the essence to make a change and be happy about it for the next tour.

 

[sasha]

Would like to hear everyone else's thoughts about this!

ill bite, i get that im responding to old ass posts in this but umm like why not idgaf. this ended up being hella long so im just gonna spoiler tag shit so an essay isnt on this thread

1

hi, ive been rly enjoying bw mono as a of recent, so apologies if this uncessarily long and restates what others have said. i just wanted to post regarding latios in bw. i've been playing the tier recently and been getting more involved since i enjoyed watching a lot of the games in mpl, and having managed mwp and mpl i feel that i can confidently speak on it. i do think that in general, bw is a BALANCED META, where the better player will win. but, much like oras, you really cant go wrong with just bringing psychic every game (not to compare bw with oras, but oras has its own issues with centralization rn that we all know about). anyone with barebones knowledge of the tier can tell you that psychic is never rly a bad bring and while you can say this about the other types that compete with psychic for being top tier (water, fighting, steel) latios pushes psychic over the edge of balanced much like gallade in oras. latios has maybe two reliable switchins that are a catch all for its coverage, those being jirachi and ferrothorn. things like excadrill, heatran, and empoleon are good soft switchins only if latios doesnt choose the right move while being choice locked with specs/scarf. life orb realistically has no switchin besides jirachi and ferro. exca, tran, and empo all fall victim to lorb latios just being able to switch its moves with surf/thunder respectively. even if latios cant immediately break steel its not like the rest of psychic struggles to do this easily, and i think its just way too overbearing in a meta that has a lot of room for growth. i feel that with latios being looked at some underused types could really emerge and promote some exploration within the tier. it would be nice to see some action on bw and oras in general before our next team tour, and i think looking at latios in bw is a step in the right direction for this meta.

2

psy got worse as mpl went on and the meta will continue to adapt (ex: ground seeing greater usage as tour went on) Banning latios when it has a pretty direct replacement with healing wish isn't going to change anything.

i was not here for the mpl when this was posted, and would like your input on this if you ever have time, as touching old metagames is usually controversial for some and my post may be misinformed, so id like the input of someone with more experience since this mpl a year later has just ended. psychic was brought a total of 20 times out of 29 games (latios was brought all 20) with a 60% winrate, with every other type being brought less than 10 times. in the end this statistic may not mean anything but i think its worth mentioning to just show you really cant go wrong with just bringing psychic and not rly caring to prep in general

3

I feel like banning Latios without Latias being banned would just have Latias replace Latios’s role although this is speculation

these calcs are just on the top of my head what i thought was a good demonstration of the power imbalance between latias and latios, if they seem cherrypicked lmk and i can just edit in diff ones

252 SpA Life Orb Latias Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 166-198 (43 - 51.2%) -- 3.9% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Latios Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 187-221 (48.4 - 57.2%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Latias Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 192-226 (49.7 - 58.5%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 214-254 (55.4 - 65.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

while heatran can at least switch into latias, latios prevents that counterplay to begin with by making a 3.9% roll into a 90.6% roll in its favor, assuming we're theorymonning a meta where latias takes latios' spot. this might be a bad example but its just the first one i thought of.

Normally when both are availble they tend to have seperate niches with Latias focusing on setup/bulk and Latios focusing on pure power. But normally when Latios gets banned, Latias starts running similar sets to her brother (and in most cases gets banned after in older gens)

i dont know where this has happened, if theres an example id like to see it, not doubting this im just interested on the circumstances, but chances are any gen older than bw had worse power scaling so seeing that latias was banned to follow suit after a latios ban isnt very surprising to me.

4

All I got to say about this is banning latios effectively does nothing but make Dragon worse. Mons like victini and slowbro are really the glue that holds psy together.

it does a lot besides make dragon worse, basically just restating what i said above, it encourages some more development and creativity in the meta with things like ground and poison (im sure theres more, im just rambling). and reduces how centralizing psychic/latios is on the meta rn.

also, from the monotype tiering policy:

2. Do not favor any one type. The goal of Monotype is for no one type to be overly powerful. A type being too weak or unviable is not a concern for the sake of tiering. This means the suspect for a Pokemon that enables any certain type to be viable should not take into account the resulting unviability of that type. That also means unbanning Pokemon to buff a type is unacceptable.

anyway, sorry if this was too rambly/incoherent, i really like bw mono and would like to see it grow bc i know it has the potential to. i think action over latios should be taken sooner rather than later to let the meta settle if anything will come of this at all. hope everyone has a good day or night!:)

 

[Zap]

Thanks for the input everyone, as there has been major support for this decision, we are going to go ahead and ban Latios from Gen 5 Monotype.
Tagging Kris to implement.

As for next steps, I hope that this helps improve type diversity, but it also may not be enough to stop psychic's overwhelming presence, as shown by usage stats, where psychic was brought to a majority of games with a decently positive winrate. That being said, the next mon I want to keep an eye on is jirachi. It's bulk and typing can be extremely hard to break, add to that it's ability, amazing utility in para, rocks, and access to wish to aid in longevity, it can provide an immense amount of support. Personally I think the wish set is what takes it over the edge as most teams resort to chipping it down with their wallbreakers, but if it can heal back up then it can get very tough. Let me know your thoughts or if there are other things you want to comment on.

 

[GotCookies]

Thanks for the input everyone, as there has been major support for this decision, we are going to go ahead and ban Latios from Gen 5 Monotype.
Tagging Kris to implement.

As for next steps, I hope that this helps improve type diversity, but it also may not be enough to stop psychic's overwhelming presence, as shown by usage stats, where psychic was brought to a majority of games with a decently positive winrate. That being said, the next mon I want to keep an eye on is jirachi. It's bulk and typing can be extremely hard to break, add to that it's ability, amazing utility in para, rocks, and access to wish to aid in longevity, it can provide an immense amount of support. Personally I think the wish set is what takes it over the edge as most teams resort to chipping it down with their wallbreakers, but if it can heal back up then it can get very tough. Let me know your thoughts or if there are other things you want to comment on.

im upset.

 

[Ronman5]

im upset.

Good