ORAS OU Sableye Stall peak'd #195

Kioskate

sableye.gif
sableye-mega.gif

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Foul Play

Sableye does many great things for my team. Magic Bounce makes iteasy to keep hazards off the field, with a few exceptions like Clefableand Infernape. My team can sometimes be over run by physical attacks, especially those who set up so despite already having Will-O-Wisp. The main problem with Will-O-Wisp is that fire types are immune so Knock Off and Foul Play are used to create 50/50's. Sableye usually gets multiple chances so I usually make the right choice at some point. I've tried the CM sets but I found it inferior and an awful win condition. I much prefer a utility set which puts in work every singlegame.

clefable.gif

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Thunder Wave
- Protect

Clefable is here for a couple dangerous threats to stall, namely Manaphy and Serperior. Moonblast is standard for all Clefable, and needed to force outopposing Sableye, Wish is used mainly to heal itself or when I'mpredicting a switch but don't want to risking trying to double switch. Protect is used for scouting rarely but is often needed to gain more leftovers recovery. Moonlight isn't used because of rain dance Manaphy and althought I generally prefer Toxic over TWave for stall but Clefable is often answered by Steel types. I'm considering going back to CM over TWave to better deal with Manaphy.

bronzong.gif

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Earthquake

Bronzong is here primarily for Mega Gardevoir, Mega Diancie and Lati@s. I've tried both this and Rachi but I've come to prefer Levitate over Bulk+Hax. Gyro Ball is the main attack, hitting Lati@s hard, killing Garde after rocks and of course killing Diancie. Toxic is mainly for hitting things on the switch, sadly it's the only source of Toxic this team has. Earthquake is for Magnezones that try to trap it as well as Excadril who come to spin rocks away.

skarmory.gif

Skarmory @ Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 236 Def / 24 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Whirlwind
- Defog
- Roost
- Counter

I don't know what the Spe EV's are for but I figured I'd leave them. Shed Shell because I'd be playing 5-6 against a team with Magnezone without it. I honestly don't how people can run Leftovers and Rocky Helmet. Roost is for recovery and Defog is for the few pokemon that can force Sableye out and set hazards. Whirlwind is for racking up hazard damage and forcing switches. I like Counter a lot because Skarm only takes physical attacks and is often only needed to wall one pokemon, so if I know I won't need Defog I have no problem with letting it go to 1 hp to kill something. Having Whirlwind and Counter seems kind of redunant, especially with max Sdef unaware Clefable on my team so I'm conidering Spikes in place of Whirlwind, and would love some import on that.

gyarados.gif

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance

Gyarados is my latest change to this team and I love him. Having both Sableye and Skarm as physical walls made it clear that physical Fire pokemon were trouble for me. It also takes on Gengar, Landorous without Psychic or even with if I knock off life orb and Choice Specs Keldeo without HP Electric and Sub/CM Keldeo. RestTalk is for recovery as Gyara since it doesn't have anything else. Waterfall is for stab and Dragon Dance allows it to be the team's win condition. If I were to replace Whirlwind with Spikes on Skarmory then I might also use Dragon Tail over Dance.

chansey.gif

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Heal Bell
- Wish
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss

Chansey was added primarily because this team is from before the Greninja ban. My other special walls have their flaws, Clefable hates burns and toxic due to the nature of Wish and Bronzong has no recovery moves so Chansey eases a lot of pressure from them especially against VoltTurn teams. Heal Bell is mandatory on a stall team in my eyes and Chansey is the best user of it. Even if Chansey is put to sleep or frozen it can cure it's own status by switching out, which I find amazing. Both Wish and Soft-Boiled are used as Clefable has a hard time healing anyone besides herself and I find WishTect too easily taken advantage of. Seismic Toss is to hit things on the switch, and it's damage is often quite crucial in my games. Nothing forces switches like Chansey. I've actually thought of replacing this with Lantern for Volt Absorb.

Considered Changes:

Most of the EVs, Calm Mind>Thunder Wave, Spikes>Whirlwind, Dragon Tail>Dragon Dance and Lanturn>Chansey

Threatlist:
Mega Gyarados
Taunt DDance can easily beat me, piercing Magic Bounce and Sturdy

Gothitelle
All the Gothitelle I've seen will trick the first thing they trapped, so I try to double whoever I would most like trick'd (usually Bronzong) into an obvious goth switch

Azumaril
+6 252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 291-343 (87.3 - 103%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Gengar
T-Bolt/SludgeWave/Shadow Ball/Taunt needs to be killed by Sableye, who can be 2hko by Shadow Ball

Keldeo
Choiced with HP Electric, it can kill or dent everyone on my team with the right move.

Beedril
If it runs knock off and is paired with Magneone
-1 252+ Atk Adaptability Beedrill Poison Jab vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 174-206 (44.2 - 52.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Adaptability Beedrill U-turn vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Sableye: 116-138 (38.2 - 45.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Victini
Gyarados is the only one who wants to take V Create but dies to Fusion Bolt
Replays:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-203103916
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-202899502
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-202530671
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-202363755
http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/ou-202346673
Importable
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Thunder Wave
- Protect

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Foul Play

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Earthquake

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance

Skarmory @ Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 236 Def / 24 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Whirlwind
- Defog
- Roost
- Counter

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Heal Bell
- Wish
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss

Any recommendations for changes or to be added to the threat list would be appreciated. Also what's a good site to link sprites from?
 
Last edited:
I quite like your choices of Pokemon but I don't think the actual spreads you're running can be improved. I would actually run a spread of 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 SpD on Clefable. 72 SpD is all that is needed to beat Serperior and Manaphy, beyond that you're not really gaining anything from increasing your SpD. Investing the rest in physical defense enables you to better take on physical attackers in general, particularly setup sweepers such as MHeracross and Azumarill a bit better (even though it's not a perfect anwser like the physicallly defensive spread, you kind have to choose between being Azu/MHera and Manaphy/Serperior. Feel free to tweak the EVs according to what you'd rather not lose to) I also think you should run max SpD on Gyarados as opposed to max physical defense: this enables it to more easily switch into Gengar who otherwise kinda ruins your team, and lets it take on the special attackers you mention it being used to check such as Keldeo and Landorus-I and also Charizard-Y. Also, if you do decide to run a phazing move on I would recommend Roar rather than Dragon Tail since this stops Azumarill from setting up on you.

A big threat to your team you either didn't notice or forgot to mention is Charizard-X. You do have Gyarados as a check, but it can't really stop him from setting up if you decide not to run Dragon Tail/Roar, especially if you follow my advice and run SpD Gyarados over the physically defensive variant. Ultimately, I don't think you need Chansey too much. Even though it does provide you with Heal Bell support, you can easily fit it on Clefable too, and provided that you run SpD Gyarados you already deal with pretty much all special attackers very well with the rest of your team. So, I would replace it with Rhyperior. It's an excellent counter to Charizard-X, Victini, Talonflame (which running SpD Gyarados makes you a bit weaker to), deals with Beedrill without having to fear Magnezone, provides your team with an electric immunity and is a great physical wall in general. It fixes a lot of holes in your team so be sure to try it out. Unfortunately, this makes you weaker to Magnezone which you don't really have a perfect answer to anymore, and makes YZard and HP Electric Keldeo more of a pain.

Finally, I would definitely try out Jirachi over Bronzong, you gain a much more self-reliant and consistent stop to MGardevoir and Latis and a secondary wishpasser if you decide to follow my advice and get rid of Chansey. Even though you do lose Bronzong's ground immunity, you already have 2 other ground immunities so I don't think it's too big a deal.. And though it might seem like the loss of Earthquake makes your team weaker to Magnezone, Jirachi avoids the 2HKO from even the Choice Specs set and can therefore stall it out, so that's not really a problem either.

(On a side note, if you want to fix your weakness to MGyarados, Crawdaunt and to a lesser extent Bisharp then Chensaught is pretty much your best option but I doubt it can manage to fit on your team. Still, I guess it wouldn't hurt to try it out)
clefable.gif

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 184 Def / 72 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Heal Bell
- Protect

gyarados.gif

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Waterfall
- Roar

rhyperior.gif

Rhyperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 SpD (enough SpD to take 2 HP Ice from Specs Raikou)
Impish Nature
- Rock Blast / Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic / Ice Punch / Fire Punch

jirachi.gif

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Iron Head
- Body Slam / Fire Punch

chesnaught.gif

Chesnaught @ Leftovers
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Drain Punch
- Leech Seed
- Spikes
- Spiky Shield
By the way, you can find sprites right here. Hope this helps!
 
Last edited:
I'm going to try your Clefable spread and Gyara+Chansey changes but I see 144 SDef is all I need to wall Char-Y so I think I'll try that. These changes would leave me wek to Mega Diancie though so Bronzong has to stay, as much as Rachi feels like a better fit. I use to have Chesnaught on my team actually, but I really needed a fire resist so it was replaced by Gyarados. If I could have 7 mons it would definitely be my next choice though. I'm going to play with these changes for now and I'll update the OP if I decide to keep them.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 188 Def / 72 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Heal Bell
- Protect

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Foul Play

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Toxic
- Gyro Ball
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 116 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance

Skarmory @ Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 236 Def / 24 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Defog
- Roost
- Counter

Rhyperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 248 HP / 188 Def / 72 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Blast
- Roar
- Toxic
 
Stall teams usually do a lot of switching, so I dislike Gyarados's set. I recommend Mega-Sableye to become your win condition.

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA(D) / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Dark Pulse / Shadow Ball

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 116 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Waterfall / Bounce
- Roar / Dragon Tail

Skarmory @ Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 236 Def / 24 Spe
Bold Nature
- Spikes
- Defog / Whirlwind
- Roost
- Steel Wing / Drill Peck
 
I've seen your RMT and your replays and your Sableye never won games with CM that wouldn't have been won without it. Also losing knock off without giving it to someone else would make opposing stall much harder to deal with. Due to my team needing both Rhypherior and Bronzong for reasons stated above and them having similar utility I have no reason not to use Rhypherior to phaze, and 2 phazers seems unnecessary, or I would use that moveset as suggested by Albacore. Regarding Skarmory, your stall team has both Sableye and defog, so I'm sure you understand why I feel it's needed with mons like Clefable, Infernape and Mold Breaker Excadril setting rocks on you. As for using Steel Wing or Drill Peck, Counter wins me many games and has become an even better choice now that it has Spikes. I'd almost always choose to set up spikes instead of going for chip damage.
 
Those replays are terrible with things like air baloon Nidoking and you getting to boost to +6 against a ferrothorn despite them having a sylveon to force you out. When you get higher up on the ladder every team has something that can kill Sable, it's the face of stall. So the only time you actually get to CM is with prankster or late game, and if it's late game you most likely can win through other ways. Dragon Dance on the other hand can be used to force things out that could otherwise beat you, and let's me break Keldeo's subs at +1, which is very helpful, letting me set up on keldeo instead of the other way around. Also in general I don't like depending on defense boosts to win the game as crits ignore them.
 
It seems LO HP[electric] Keldeo ruins half your team. Paired with Bisharp and/or Talonflame it is good game.
 
Last edited:
Your team is actually very weak to Mega Gyarados, especially with addition of Rhyperior.

If Sableye was Mega Evolved, Taunt+DD Mega Gyarados 6-0s your team. Granted, it sweeps a lot of stall teams, but well-made stall teams with good players shouldn't lose to it.

Running 248 HP / 204 Def / 56 SpD (Calm Nature) on Clefable for example, enables you to survive +2 Waterfall from Mega Gyarados (Mold Breaker breaks Unaware) at full HP without any previous damage.

If you want to keep AM's set of Clefable, than I REALLY advise putting a Chesnaught on your team.

Just remember if you see a Gyarados that is potentially mega (nothing else on the team has mega evolved) do not mega evolve Sableye until your burn it.
 
Yeah that's how I've been handling Gyara so far but it's definitely the biggest threat to this team. Lately I've been thinking about running Mega Venesaur over Sableye, also helping with hp electric keldeo weakness, but I haven't had too much time for testing things lately.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top