ORAS OU "Screw Mainstream!" - Ft. Hydreigon

[ItzzGaming]

Edit 11/10/15
My bad for inactivity. Currently testing Defog Latios, SR Hippowdon, LO Hydreigon, and Expert Belt Scizor. :p
Introduction
Hey there! :D So recently I have been coming across these 6/7 Pokemon in at least every other battle (and there's a reason for that; they're pretty good!):

(Thank you to the power of Google for that animated Talonflame sprite x3)

And these are pretty common as well (but unlike the rest of the above 'mons, excluding Garchomp and Lando-T, I like these guys but I still dont' wanna use 'em xP):

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So yeah. :3 It was a bit of a challenge; trying to find counters to these guys while attempting to remain seni-original, and I'm having some trouble with it so this team won't be as polished as some of my other ones, but I found out about a really neat core consisting of Hydreigon and Mega Metagross, which are coincidentally 2 guys I've always wanted to try out, so the decision on what to base the team around was fairly easy, Without further ado, let's get into it!
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READ PLEASE BEFORE RATING

Things I'd really rather not change:
-Hydreigon
-Mega Metagross

Things I'm reluctant to change but will do so if necessary:
-Scizor
-Volcarona

Things I'm willing to change:
-Starmie
-Tyranitar

Retired 'Mons

None... Yet.

Importable

Hydreigon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Fire Blast

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm
- Ice Punch

Scizor @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Knock Off

Volcarona @ Leftovers
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SpA / 184 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Fire Blast
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Ground]
- Quiver Dance

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin

Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 240 HP / 80 Def / 180 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Ice Beam
- Stealth Rock

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Team at a glance

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The Team

Hydreigon
Item:

Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Fire Blast

I have been wanting to use Hyreigon for aaaages, and now I finally found a good team to slap him on. :3 Nobody really expects him, so when they attempt to abuse that 4x weakness to Fairy, I can deal a lot of damage via Flash Cannon. :3 Now, Choice Scarf is chosen to make up for this guy's lack of speed (although I'm considering Specs instead, but eh I think he works pretty well with a Scarf). The EVs are pretty self explanatory. Draco Meteor is a powerful STAB move that just nukes everything that isn't Steel or Fairy. Dark Pulse is another STAB, who's flinch chance is a blessing sometimes (although you should be careful not to overestimate it!). Flash Cannon is to lure and deal a ton of damage against Fairies, while Fire Blast is to round off the coverage, hitting things like Ferrothorn, Scizor, and more. However, that leaves this thing weak to Heatran unless you want to spam Dark Pulse, but I think it's worth it and better than Earth Power so that Hydreigon can hit Ferro and Scizor in return.

Metagross-Mega
Item:

Ability: Tough Claws
Ability (Pre-Mega): Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm / Earthquake
- Ice Punch / Thunder Punch

The mega of the team, and main physical attacker! :D Metagross is such an underrated 'mon. With that godly Steel typing, and beautiful rounded-off stats, he is just so good and forms a brilliant duo with Hydreigon, how could I not use him on this team? :3 The reason he forms such a good core with Hydreigon is because Metagross resists/takes neutral damage from all supereffective attacks against Hydreigon, and vice versa. One is a special attacker, one is physical. One is speedy, the other has some bulk. It's almost as if they were meant for each other! ;D My annoying praise aside, the EVs are self explanatory. Meteor Mash is this guy's main STAB move, and that 20% of an attack raise is just too awesome to give up. Zen Headbutt is the 2nd STAB move of choice, which can dish out some pretty solid damage while also having some flinch hax along with Hydreigon's Dark Pulse. :3 Hammer Arm is used to murder Ferro, Heatran, etc. but I'm also considering EQ for hitting Fire types and Heatran even harder, but unlike Hammer Arm, it doesn't receive the Tough Claws boost, so I'm stuck between those 2. I'm also torn for the last slot; Ice Punch can outright-murder Garchomp, Lando-T, and Gliscor (albeit the last one isn't as common), while Thunder Punch can help me hit Water types and do a bit to Talonflame on the switch in.

Metagross Calcs-WARNING: LONG

Meteor Mash vs Fairies
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 252 HP / 172 Def Clefable: 446-528 (113.1 - 134%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Standard CM Set)
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 252 HP / 172 Def Clefable: 446-528 (113.1 - 134%) -- guaranteed OHKO (SR Setter)
52 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 372-440 (94.6 - 111.9%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO (Unaware Wall)
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Clefable: 552-650 (140.1 - 164.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO ("Tank" Clefable; don't make me laugh)

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Altaria: 390-462 (134 - 158.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO (DD Offensive)
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 248 HP / 136+ Def Mega Altaria: 314-372 (88.9 - 105.3%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO (DD Defensive)

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Gardevoir: 582-686 (210.1 - 247.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Wallbreaker)
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 248 HP / 244 Def Gardevoir: 440-522 (129.7 - 153.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Support)

Hammer Arm vs Steels
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Hammer Arm vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 298-352 (92.2 - 108.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO (Offensive)

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Hammer Arm vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 300-354 (77.9 - 91.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (Specially Defensive)

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Hammer Arm vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: 212-250 (60.2 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (Utility)

Earthquake vs Steels and Fires (for Fires: really only meant to be used when they switch in, try to play carefully):

252 Atk Mega Metagross Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Charizard X: 216-256 (72.7 - 86.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Offensive DD)

252 Atk Mega Metagross Earthquake vs. 144 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 216-256 (64.8 - 76.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Defensive DD)

252 Atk Mega Metagross Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 452-532 (117.4 - 138.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Specially Defensive)

Ice Punch vs Ice-Weak 'Mons

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 164+ Def Garchomp: 384-452 (91.4 - 107.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO (Standard Tankchomp)

-1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Landorus-T: 340-400 (106.5 - 125.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Scarfed)
0 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Metagross: 210-248 (69.7 - 82.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Defensive)
^Both of these are with Intimidate. Without Intimidate, it will be a OHKO regardless. :3

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Gliscor: 340-404 (96 - 114.1%) -- 75% chance to OHKO (Defensive)
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Ice Punch vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 392-464 (111.3 - 131.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Specially Defensive)

Thunder Punch vs Elec-Weak 'Mons
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Thunder Punch vs. 172 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 284-336 (73.9 - 87.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Choice Band)

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Thunder Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Keldeo: 258-304 (79.8 - 94.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(Meanwhile in return, Metagross takes this from Keldeo: 252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Metagross: 246-291 (81.7 - 96.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO ~ Since Metagross outspeeds Keldeo unless it's scarfed, it will always kill it)

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Thunder Punch vs. 96 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 238-280 (65.2 - 76.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
(Meanwhile in return, Metagross takes this from Manaphy: +3 252 SpA Manaphy Scald vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Metagross: 250-295 (83 - 98%) -- guaranteed 2HKO ~ Again, Metagross will always outspeed Manaphy, securing the 2HKO (and let's be honest no run runs Scarf Manaphy)
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So yeah. :3

All in all a very solid fun and solid guy to use, and he forms an important core in my team.

Scizor
Item:

Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -Spe)
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Knock Off

Ahh, Scizor. :3 Now you may be wondering, "why are you running 2 'mons weak to Fire?". The answer? "I don't know". I just wanted a a revenge killer that could also take care of Fairies fair(l)y (heheh) well, so the first thing that came to my mind was Scizor. Anywho, the EVs are for maximum bulldozing-potential and a bit of bulk. Bullet Punch is used to revenge kill weakened 'mons, and servers as a Fairy eliminator and spammable Technician-boosted STAB move. U-Turn is for a bit of momentum. Superpower is to eliminate Heatran and Ferrothorn (and then I U-Turn the heck outta there thanks to the stat drops), and Knock Off is to hit the Latis while arguably being the best move in the game, being able to screw up entire movesets, scout, and reveal Megas. I'm considering changing this to an Expert belt set with Defog and Roost, but eh, I'll leave that up to you guys. :3

Volcarona
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SpA / 184 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Fire Blast
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Ground]
- Quiver Dance

OhmyfreakinggodIloveVolcaronasomuch. ;w;' Moving on, I realized that at this point I lacked a Special Attacker and a wincon of the sorts. Usually, I'd shove something like Keldeo in there and call it day (because Specs Keldeo just punches holes in everything), but alas, anti-mainstream team (and Keldeo is super predictable anyways, so eh), sooo I went with Volcarona. :3 Despite its 4x rock weakness, I just absolutely love this guy (I beat the entire BW Elite 4 using a level 75-ish Volcarona and a level 46 Altaria, ayy <3), and it's so fun to use. :3 I chose Leftovers over Lum Berry/something else because I used Lum Berry in a couple battles and it honestly didn't help that much where Leftovers could have, so I just swapped it out. The EVs are to provide a bit of bulk while setting up a QD, and with the Speed EVs invested, it can still outpace a lot of things (but I guess that if you wanted to, you could change it max Speed and 4 HP). It has the IVs shown because of HP Ground, but eh you can live with -1 SpA/SpD IVs anyways. :3 Fire Blast is the spammy STAB move chosen, which can deal so much damage after a QD. The only problem is the PP and the accuracy, but eh I can live with it I guess (although I have lost some matches due to that ;-;'). Giga Drain is for some recovery as well as providing coverage against everything Fire types are weak to, heheh. HP Ground is to hit Heatran, Char-X, etc. hard, and Quiver Dance is to boost this guy's stats even further.

Starmie
Item:

Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin

It was at this point that I realized I lacked a Water type, and a spinner. Thus, I chose the super-standard offensive Starmie. guess I'll go ahead and explain, even though the majority of the Smogon community know this set (I guess). :P The EVs are for maximum damage output obviously. Hydro Pump hits really hard and can outright-murder things like Heatran and Talonflame, but the accuracy can really hurt. Psychic is used over Psyshock for the extra power (+everyone expects Psyshock, I dunno why because if you ask me Psychic is way better) and to hit stuff like Keldeo. Thunderbolt is to round off the coverage by being able to hit things like opposing Starmie, Manaphy, Slowbro, etc. Rapid Spin is self-explanatory and greatly helps Volcarona.

Tyranitar
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 240 HP / 80 Def / 180 SpD
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spe)
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Ice Beam
- Stealth Rock

I am really unsure about running this thing, but i really don't have any other ideas. I wanted a SR setter with a somewhat-offensive presence (and, again, no mainstream mons such as Garchomp and Lando-T), so I was stuck with either Excadrill or Tyranitar. Now, don't tell me to replace Starmie with Excadrill and turn this into some sand team, because I don't WANT that. xP So yeah. Unnerve>Sand Stream because Sand Stream would honestly just hurt this team and make it worse against opposing sand teams. The EVs are for sustainability aka bulk. Stone Edge is to hit Talonflame and whatnot, along with being a powerful STAB move (with some lucky crits as well; those can never hurt). Pursuit is to destroy anything trying to Defog/Rapid Spin away my SR that's named Starmie or Lati@s. :3 Ice Beam is a weird choice, I will admit. It's used to hit Garchomp, Lando-T, and Gliscor like Metagross (except I didn't want to reply on solely one 'mon to do that, so Tyranitar was chosen I guess despite having a weakness to Ground so it can hurt 'em on the switch in). Stealth Rock is pretty obvious. Like I said, I'm really unsure about putting this guy in but eh I needed rocks.
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What I'm thinking about doing, is making Scizor an Expert Belt set and adding Defog, then removing Starmie and Tyranitar (spinner and SR setter) to add in more viable options, but like I said earlier, I'll wait for your guys' approval on that. :P Remember, this is a team that is meant to be fun to play, and unique, so honestly if you tell me to add any of the guys I listed above with MAYBE the exception of Lati@s, I will most likely ignore it, sorry. :L
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Final Notes
Well, I guess that's it then. xP I know this isn't the most "viable" team at the moment, which is guy I'm asking for your feedback. Just, please don't suggest to add an overused af 'mon, or try to turn it into a sand team. This is a really fun team to play with, and I love using it a lot thanks to all the new 'mons I got to try out, but I think that it could definitely use some improvement. Thanks guys! <3
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[Clair]

Starmie is fine don't worry -.-

Anyway, there are a few major problems with the team (predominantly stemming from the lack of a physical wall, so threats like DD Zard-X, Exca, Lando-T, M-Lopunny etc will just run straight through it). Before addressing those, though, CB Scizor + M-Metagross is largely redundant (in terms of defensive coverage, and offensively, neither wallbreaks especially well for the other). There also isn't much point running Scarf Hydreigon in my opinion - sure, it patches its average speed, but removes any wallbreaking prowess which justifies using it in the first place. Life Orb is much more effective at breaking down bulky cores, which is the kind of support Metagross needs.

Some possible changes:

• 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• LO Spin Excadrill > Scizor, Slowbro > Starmie, LO Hydreigon. This gives you a physical wall in Slowbro, reducing your vulnerability to the threats mentioned earlier, a revenge killer / cleaner in Excadrill, and an improved matchup against balanced and stall. The only issue here is that Excadrill won't reliably keep Rocks off, and the team is somewhat overreliant on Slowbro to check all physical threats as well as Keldeo, so replacing Volc (for something along the lines of Rotom-W, which can pressure Skarmory as well as checking remaining threats like Keld, Lando-T, Weavile etc) would probably be best. Use your coverage moves on Tyranitar and M-Metagross to lure both Lando-T and Skarmory to help Excadrill (e.g. Fire Blast and Ice Punch respectively, or Ice Beam and Thunder Punch).
• 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• This is a simpler option - Scarf Lando-T replaces CB Scizor, again for a physical catch-all (and to check stuff like Thundurus and Specs Raikou), and MG Stealth Rock Clefable replaces Tyranitar to check Weavile and Keldeo and help pressure stall.

Hope that helps! :)

 

[EraiMHFU]

Starmie is a horrible sweeper and a horrible hazard controller, Starmie fails only a few feet short in almost every aspect except speed. If you want hazard control think about this Latias > Skarmory > Starmie you have plenty of steel types and Physical Defense, Latias covers your Keldo problem, covers your hazard problem, and is resistant to Fire types which two of your pokemon are devastated by. I can't recommend an honest build because I haven't found a good Pokemon to control hazards, but moves I find most useful include Psyshock, Energy Ball, Roost, and Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse (depending on if you're trying to support or sweep) Life Orb and Leftovers are about the only items I've had success running on Latias. (but if you want to do some crazy specs build send me a replay)

Did you even tried Starmie? You dont know what you talk about, and choice specs wastes Latias support potential.( Specs Psychic Types suck anyway because they are Pursuit baits)

ItzzGaming, I agree with Clair's second suggestion, and you can even use Healing Wish on Clef to give Volcarona a second chance to sweep.

Clefable

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
-Stealth Rock
-Moonblast
-Soft Boiled
-Healing Wish / Fire Blast

Just a nitpick , run Passho Berry>Leftovers on Volcarona because it lets you set up on things like Rotom-W.
Hope i helped!

 

[EraiMHFU]

I actually used this build for about two weeks:

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Thunderbolt
- Psyshock
- Ice Beam

More times than I could count Starmie failed as a sweeper, I originally tried to use it has a hazard remover, but got very frustrated because often it would only land a Rapid Spin followed by another move and decided it was better to be used as a sweeper since it was incredibly fast with mediocre power. Hydro Pump was just too unreliable, and an unexpected burn proc won me more matches than a missed Hydro Pump. Of course Starmie hits about half of all types super-effectively, but can't do jack about ANYTHING with priority like Bullet Punch, Mach Punch, Extreme Speed, or a Scarfed Rotom, Magnezone, anything with a Scarf really. If Starmie had 105 or 110 instead of 115 speed it would be in UU without a doubt.

You should send this in a PM, not here, i'll PM you.

 

[ItzzGaming]

Starmie is a horrible sweeper and a horrible hazard controller, Starmie fails only a few feet short in almost every aspect except speed. If you want hazard control think about this Latias > Skarmory > Starmie you have plenty of steel types and Physical Defense, Latias covers your Keldo problem, covers your hazard problem, and is resistant to Fire types which two of your pokemon are devastated by. I can't recommend an honest build because I haven't found a good Pokemon to control hazards, but moves I find most useful include Psyshock, Energy Ball, Roost, and Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse (depending on if you're trying to support or sweep) Life Orb and Leftovers are about the only items I've had success running on Latias. (but if you want to do some crazy specs build send me a replay)

I kind of do like Starmie, though. It provides me with a check to certain Fire types when I can't send in anything else to punish them and it also kinda works well as a revenge killer (bar no priority). I'm trying to veer away from Lati@s as I said in the main post so I'll try out Skarmory instead, but if that doesn't work then I'll go with Latias. I guess Healing Wish support could be good. I've never seen Latias with Energy Ball either so that could be interesting to catch things off-guard.

Did you even tried Starmie? You dont know what you talk about, and choice specs wastes Latias support potential.( Specs Psychic Types suck anyway because they are Pursuit baits)

ItzzGaming, I agree with Clair's second suggestion, and you can even use Healing Wish on Clef to give Volcarona a second chance to sweep.

Clefable

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
-Stealth Rock
-Moonblast
-Soft Boiled
-Healing Wish / Fire Blast

Just a nitpick , run Passho Berry>Leftovers on Volcarona because it lets you set up on things like Rotom-W.
Hope i helped!

Never considered Clefable (actually, I did, but forgot it while adding some stuff on the team xP). So I'll replace TTar and try it out, thanks. :3

Starmie is fine don't worry -.-

Anyway, there are a few major problems with the team (predominantly stemming from the lack of a physical wall, so threats like DD Zard-X, Exca, Lando-T, M-Lopunny etc will just run straight through it). Before addressing those, though, CB Scizor + M-Metagross is largely redundant (in terms of defensive coverage, and offensively, neither wallbreaks especially well for the other). There also isn't much point running Scarf Hydreigon in my opinion - sure, it patches its average speed, but removes any wallbreaking prowess which justifies using it in the first place. Life Orb is much more effective at breaking down bulky cores, which is the kind of support Metagross needs.

Some possible changes:

• 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• LO Spin Excadrill > Scizor, Slowbro > Starmie, LO Hydreigon. This gives you a physical wall in Slowbro, reducing your vulnerability to the threats mentioned earlier, a revenge killer / cleaner in Excadrill, and an improved matchup against balanced and stall. The only issue here is that Excadrill won't reliably keep Rocks off, and the team is somewhat overreliant on Slowbro to check all physical threats as well as Keldeo, so replacing Volc (for something along the lines of Rotom-W, which can pressure Skarmory as well as checking remaining threats like Keld, Lando-T, Weavile etc) would probably be best. Use your coverage moves on Tyranitar and M-Metagross to lure both Lando-T and Skarmory to help Excadrill (e.g. Fire Blast and Ice Punch respectively, or Ice Beam and Thunder Punch).
• 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• This is a simpler option - Scarf Lando-T replaces CB Scizor, again for a physical catch-all (and to check stuff like Thundurus and Specs Raikou), and MG Stealth Rock Clefable replaces Tyranitar to check Weavile and Keldeo and help pressure stall.

Hope that helps! :)

Yeah, I sort of realized that Char-X had a field day with this team. I was indeed hesitant about putting Scizor and Metagross but it worked fairly well, although I'm willing to change it. I ran Scarf Hydreigon because I really hated being outsped by common threats so I just slapped a scarf on it. I used him more as just a simple way to attack rather than a wallbreaker but I'll give that a shot as well.

Slowbro is pretty fun to use (was on my first team after I came back to competitive) so I might give it another go as well. Rotom-W is something I'll be trying out as well maybe. I really don't want to run Lando-T even if it's so much fun to use (Normal Gem+Explosion suicide lead, heheh...), sorry. Clefable is something that, as I said, will be trying out.

TL;DR I'm gonna try: Clefable>TTar, Skarmory>Starmie, play around with a couple of other things. :3 Thanks everyone!

 

[EraiMHFU]

I kind of do like Starmie, though. It provides me with a check to certain Fire types when I can't send in anything else to punish them and it also kinda works well as a revenge killer (bar no priority). I'm trying to veer away from Lati@s as I said in the main post so I'll try out Skarmory instead, but if that doesn't work then I'll go with Latias. I guess Healing Wish support could be good. I've never seen Latias with Energy Ball either so that could be interesting to catch things off-guard.


Never considered Clefable (actually, I did, but forgot it while adding some stuff on the team xP). So I'll replace TTar and try it out, thanks. :3


Yeah, I sort of realized that Char-X had a field day with this team. I was indeed hesitant about putting Scizor and Metagross but it worked fairly well, although I'm willing to change it. I ran Scarf Hydreigon because I really hated being outsped by common threats so I just slapped a scarf on it. I used him more as just a simple way to attack rather than a wallbreaker but I'll give that a shot as well.

Slowbro is pretty fun to use (was on my first team after I came back to competitive) so I might give it another go as well. Rotom-W is something I'll be trying out as well maybe. I really don't want to run Lando-T even if it's so much fun to use (Normal Gem+Explosion suicide lead, heheh...), sorry. Clefable is something that, as I said, will be trying out.

TL;DR I'm gonna try: Clefable>TTar, Skarmory>Starmie, play around with a couple of other things. :3 Thanks everyone!

Skarmory doesnt pair well with Volcarona, because both die to Talonflame and both Zard forms, is better to keep Starmie.

Thats why i think Clair suggested Lando, to revenge kill both Zards.

 

[busyguy]

Hey, I like

+

too because they do so well together.
However, like Clair said Charizard-X, Excadrill (scarf or in sand teams), Landorus-T and Mega Lopunny as well as Talonflame are problematic. Very fast electric types just Volt Switch and gain momentum freely on your team.
I recommend

>

because it checks all the problematic Pokemon I listed above. It helps against Mega Manectric and Raikou using Volt switch all the time, it walls Charizard-X, Lopunny and Excadrill because of its bulk. It gets up Stealth Rock too and has recovery. You can also scout for T-Wave on opposing Clefable first, because they might want to paralyze your Metagross, which is your Fairy(mostly Clefable) switchin.

At this point I want to quote Clair because of the importance of that change:

CB Scizor + M-Metagross is largely redundant (in terms of defensive coverage, and offensively, neither wallbreaks especially well for the other). There also isn't much point running Scarf Hydreigon in my opinion - sure, it patches its average speed, but removes any wallbreaking prowess which justifies using it in the first place. Life Orb is much more effective at breaking down bulky cores, which is the kind of support Metagross needs

So Life Orb>Scarf on Hydreigon.
Wallbreaking is key for winning the game. But to do that, you need a "safe" way to bring in your wallbreaker (Hydreigon and Metagross) to damage the opposing team. U-turn is one of the best ways. Because of that, following change is a good fit on that team.

>

Seeing that Metagross, Hydreigon and Hippowdown all fear Gengar(Speed Tie with Metagross, coinflip) and (Mega) Alakazam, I recommend running Assault Vest Tornadus. Tornadus also switches into strong special attacks which Metagross hates like Draco Meteor from Latios which does ~45% to Metagross which is a lot. This would releave the pressure on Metagross, so it doesn't have to take the special hits all on its own.

>

Team looks weak to Weavile now but Clefable is a pretty good check against it, if you don't get haxed. Clefable also switches in on many Pokemon that might threaten Metagross like Sableye, Hippowdon, Celebi, Rotom at full health and Slowbro. It is a very solid glue to the team. With Calm Mind Clefable is a potential wincondition too which sets up and walls everything. Flamethower to hit Steels. Since CroCune (Suicune) is a huge threat to your team and walls everything after a +1, running Psyshock on the last slot is an option, as it allows you to 3hko it after a Calm Mind War at +6. If you don't use Psyshock, you either have to flinch it with Dark Pulse and then go for Draco the turn after, or catch in with a Dark Pulse on the swichin and then go for draco.

Calcs

252+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 263-309 (65 - 76.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 161-191 (39.8 - 47.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

I don't like to change too much usually, but I hate how you lose a Pokemon every time Charizard-Y attacks.

>

While also providing hazard removal and a keldeo-check, Latios still pressures Metagross checks. It has recovery too and it can switch in on Charizard Y to roost or attack.

One last thing: I'd run Bullet Punch on it, because you might not get mons like Alakazam(lives a U-turn, but BP range), Gengar and Lopunny to 0% so BP would be great for a late game sweep. It also solves the Weavile weakness immediatly.

Sets/Team

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Flamethrower

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Roost
- Defog

Tornadus-Therian @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 96 HP / 160 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
- Knock Off

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Stone Edge

Hydreigon @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Fire Blast

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm
- Bullet Punch

 

[ItzzGaming]

Skarmory doesnt pair well with Volcarona, because both die to Talonflame and both Zard forms, is better to keep Starmie.

Thats why i think Clair suggested Lando, to revenge kill both Zards.

True, true. I did get destroyed by the Chars so I can relate to that.

Hey, I like

+

too because they do so well together.
However, like Clair said Charizard-X, Excadrill (scarf or in sand teams), Landorus-T and Mega Lopunny as well as Talonflame are problematic. Very fast electric types just Volt Switch and gain momentum freely on your team.
I recommend

>

because it checks all the problematic Pokemon I listed above. It helps against Mega Manectric and Raikou using Volt switch all the time, it walls Charizard-X, Lopunny and Excadrill because of its bulk. It gets up Stealth Rock too and has recovery. You can also scout for T-Wave on opposing Clefable first, because they might want to paralyze your Metagross, which is your Fairy(mostly Clefable) switchin.

At this point I want to quote Clair because of the importance of that change:
So Life Orb>Scarf on Hydreigon.
Wallbreaking is key for winning the game. But to do that, you need a "safe" way to bring in your wallbreaker (Hydreigon and Metagross) to damage the opposing team. U-turn is one of the best ways. Because of that, following change is a good fit on that team.

>

Seeing that Metagross, Hydreigon and Hippowdown all fear Gengar(Speed Tie with Metagross, coinflip) and (Mega) Alakazam, I recommend running Assault Vest Tornadus. Tornadus also switches into strong special attacks which Metagross hates like Draco Meteor from Latios which does ~45% to Metagross which is a lot. This would releave the pressure on Metagross, so it doesn't have to take the special hits all on its own.

>

Team looks weak to Weavile now but Clefable is a pretty good check against it, if you don't get haxed. Clefable also switches in on many Pokemon that might threaten Metagross like Sableye, Hippowdon, Celebi, Rotom at full health and Slowbro. It is a very solid glue to the team. With Calm Mind Clefable is a potential wincondition too which sets up and walls everything. Flamethower to hit Steels. Since CroCune (Suicune) is a huge threat to your team and walls everything after a +1, running Psyshock on the last slot is an option, as it allows you to 3hko it after a Calm Mind War at +6. If you don't use Psyshock, you either have to flinch it with Dark Pulse and then go for Draco the turn after, or catch in with a Dark Pulse on the swichin and then go for draco.

Calcs

252+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 263-309 (65 - 76.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 161-191 (39.8 - 47.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

I don't like to change too much usually, but I hate how you lose a Pokemon every time Charizard-Y attacks.

>

While also providing hazard removal and a keldeo-check, Latios still pressures Metagross checks. It has recovery too and it can switch in on Charizard Y to roost or attack.

One last thing: I'd run Bullet Punch on it, because you might not get mons like Alakazam(lives a U-turn, but BP range), Gengar and Lopunny to 0% so BP would be great for a late game sweep. It also solves the Weavile weakness immediatly.

Sets/Team

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Flamethrower

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Roost
- Defog

Tornadus-Therian @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 96 HP / 160 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
- Knock Off

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Stone Edge

Hydreigon @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Fire Blast

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm
- Bullet Punch

Sweet mother of changes. o-o

I was considering Clefable (and I did test it as a SR setter) and it worked pretty well, but it looks like a CM wall set couls work as well. I never actually used Hippowdon before so that's worth giving a shot I guess.

I still don't want to run LO on Hydreigon because he's meant to be a (I don't know what to call it; somewhat like a revenge killer but not really), but since everyone is saying to do it I guess it will (it's just such an amazing feeling to outspeed things I normally wouldn't).

Metagross doesn't have BP because it would dwindle on its coverage+Scarf Hydreigon does whatever BP would do, but if I run LO on it then I'll probably add BP to Metagross as well. I just need to test both versions before deciding, y'know? :P

Since Latios is less-ised than Latias (from what I've seen) (and yes I'm seriously deciding which 'mons to use based on their usage) I will go ahead and give it a shot. However, do you think running Earthquake on it could would be better over Draco/Psyshock since Hydreigon/Metagross both can function the same way, in order to counter Heatran? Just a thought because EQ Latios isn't that comon but it looks interesting.

I love Regenerator with all my heart so I'll definitely try out Tornadus.
-------
Thanks! <3

 

[Karou]

The Bullet punch change on Mega Metagross is really really good, i would at least try it out if i were you.