Shiftry (Attacking Lead)

EonADS

EonADS

While I'm aware that this set has been rejected before, it was only because I wasn't around to fix it for two weeks thanks to computer failure, and didn't make the necessary changes. This time, I've fixed it up a great deal, and I'd like to try again, if possible.

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http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/shiftry

QC Approved: [2/2]
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(uragg)
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(Bluewind)

QC Rejected: [0/2]

GP Checks: [1/2]
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(Snorlaxe)
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(Flora)

Updates/Changes Log:

-Removed all mentions of Taunt from the analysis.
-Switched Focus Sash to the primary slash on the item.
-Added information to the choice of Sucker Punch over Fake Out and over Explosion.
-Added Arcanine to Team Options.
-Added more information on Focus Sash or Life Orb as the item choice.
-Removed Fake Out for Low Kick
-Changed EV spread to Uragg's suggested 120 Atk / 252 SpA / 136 Spe spread
-Removed Life Orb and relevant information.
-Removed Sucker Punch as a choice for the first slot.
-Added changes and relevant information.
-Added Early Bird as ability of choice
-Added the possiblity of Extrasensory to hit Venusaur and Heracross.
-Replaced Explosion as the primary choice for the fourth slot, as per Bluewind's suggestion.
-Changed uragg's EV spread slightly. Moved 4 EVs from Attack to Speed, allowing Shiftry to outrun 4 Spe Uxie. Note that this doesn't qualify as Speed Creep because the standard Uxie doesn't invest any more EVs in Speed than its extra 4, and and its other target (Max Timid Omastar) can't get any faster. Also, it doesn't significantly weaken Low Kick, Explosion, or Sucker Punch, so change is a better use of available EVs.
-Added HP Rock to AC as per wynought's suggestion.
-Posted full writeup and awaiting GP checks.
-Removed Team Options and Counters sections, and fleshed out the Set Comments a bit more. Thanks to Flora for the suggested edits.
-Added Snorlaxe's GP changes, and changed writeup to fit Oglemi's guideline of removing Heracross.
-Added Flora's GP changes, and finalized analysis for uploading, unless Oglemi or RD has something to change.


[SET]
name: Attacking Lead
move 1: Low Kick
move 2: Leaf Storm
move 3: Dark Pulse
move 4: Explosion / Sucker Punch
item: Focus Sash
ability: Early Bird
nature: Rash
evs: 116 Atk / 252 SpA / 140 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Shiftry is a useful Attacking Lead in UU due to its ability to KO and cripple many common leads, including Alakazam, Mesprit, Uxie, Cloyster, Omastar, and Qwilfish. Shiftry’s strong offensive movepool, stats, and typing allow it to act as a cleaner as well, granting it superb mid- and late-game usability. Dark Pulse is Shiftry's most consistent STAB attack, and it also allows Shiftry to 2HKO the ever-common Uxie and Mesprit leads. With Leaf Storm being Shiftry's strongest STAB attack, it can effectively KO most Pokemon that don't resist it after a Dark Pulse. Low Kick helps damage Registeel, which would otherwise wall Shiftry completely. There are two possible options in the final moveslot. Explosion allows Shiftry to completely wipe out leads that it can't beat otherwise, such as Moltres and Arcanine. However, using Sucker Punch allows Shiftry to deal with Alakazam leads almost 100% of the time, and it also gives it an option to attack Moltres before dying, should you choose to keep Shiftry in.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Focus Sash is the best item choice for this set because it allows Shiftry to heavily damage a large variety of leads and continue attacking after a potentially fatal blow from the opponent. Holding a Focus Sash also allows Shiftry to use Explosion more assuredly. Early Bird is the best choice for Shiftry's ability, as sleep moves are more common in UU than Sunny Day. The EV spread allows Shiftry to outrun 4 Speed Uxie and max Speed Omastar leads, with the remaining EVs pushed into Attack to increase the power of Low Kick and Explosion (or Sucker Punch). The Rash nature is required to for the 2HKO the on standard Uxie leads without weakening Explosion or slowing Shiftry down.</p>

<p>The only unfortunate thing about a Shiftry Anti-Lead this set is that it has very serious four moveslot syndrome, with many of its lesser options being ousted from the set in favor of the main ones already listed. Protect is an option over Low Kick as it gives Shiftry a chance to beat Ambipom, provided that Shiftry holds a Focus Sash, but Shiftry is usually better off just switching. Extrasensory can hit Venusaur and Fighting-types hard, but there isn't really a place for it. Likewise, Hidden Power Rock can eliminate Moltres and Scyther while dealing heavy damage against any other Fire-type leads, but it doesn’t fit into the set any better than Extrasensory.</p>
 
Hm...could specially defensive Arcanine also be mentioned as a teammate? It can deal with opposing fire types, Ambipom, and Scyther quite well.
 
^I've never tested Arcanine as a Shiftry partner, but it'd be interesting to see, at least. I'll give it a look.
 
Man this thing has some serious 4MSS.

What are you beating with Fake Out exactly? If you use Taunt + Focus Sash, you beat all of the same leads while preventing Stealth Rock from going up. You lose to Ambipom anyway, so it's not like Life Orb is helping you too much there.

I almost think the set should be:

[SET]
name: Anti-lead
move 1: Taunt
move 2: Sucker Punch
move 3: Leaf Storm
move 4: Explosion
item: Focus Sash
nature: Naive
evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe (maybe more attack now to give Sucker Punch more, well, punch?)

Vs:

Ambipom = lose, switch out

Uxie/Mesprit = Taunt, switch out or Explode to avoid U-turn (meh)

Hippopotas = Taunt, Leaf Storm, have fun (win)

Cloyster/Omastar/Kabutops = Taunt, Leaf Storm, Sucker Punch (win)

Spiritomb = Taunt, Leaf Storm, Sucker Punch (win)

Qwilfish = Taunt, Leaf Storm (lose, gets layer of Spikes, and Poison Jab + Aqua Jet KOs)

Alakazam = Sucker Punch, Sucker Punch

Arcanine/Moltres = switch out, Explode (lose/meh)

Scyther = switch to Rhyperior plz (lose)

Mismagius = Leaf Storm, Sucker Punch (depending on Destiny Bond, win/meh)

Registeel/Regirock = Taunt, switch or Leaf Storm (win, prevent Stealth Rock)

Snover = Taunt, switch or Sucker Punch (will kill you if it uses Blizzard on turn 1, meh/lose)
 
Oglemi said:
Man this thing has some serious 4MSS.

What are you beating with Fake Out exactly? If you use Taunt + Focus Sash, you beat all of the same leads while preventing Stealth Rock from going up. You lose to Ambipom anyway, so it's not like Life Orb is helping you too much there.
Click to expand...

Great idea! Now, if only Shiftry could actually use Taunt...

EDIT: You should probably remove all mentions of Taunt from the analysis.
 
^What... I was so sure it could. Oh well, guess the set is better that way anyway. Removed all mentions.

@Oglemi: Since Shiftry can't learn Taunt, what do you recommend I do instead? Should I replace Fake Out with Sucker Punch, or leave them as is? Also, Fake Out+Leaf Storm allows you to completely stop Omastar leads, and makes it impossible to mispredict unless your opponent switches. It also gives you a much higher chance to beat Qwilfish, so long as you don't get Poisoned by Poison Point.
 
I don't know what to tell you, this set is a lot worse without Taunt. I would keep it as is, as you prevent hazards going up from at least Omastar, Cloyster and Hippopotas. I would, however, vouch for having Focus Sash as the main item, instead of Life Orb to ensure you can at least Explode on Arcanine/Moltres, but that's just me.
 
^I would agree, but Arcanine/Moltres leads are a lot less common than Uxie/Mesprit, which he almost requires Life Orb to beat.
 
I think this lead has potential.

Oglemi said:
I don't know what to tell you, this set is a lot worse without Taunt. I would keep it as is, as you prevent hazards going up from at least Omastar, Cloyster and Hippopotas. I would, however, vouch for having Focus Sash as the main item, instead of Life Orb to ensure you can at least Explode on Arcanine/Moltres, but that's just me.
Click to expand...

Doesn't Shiftry OHKO all three with Leaf Storm? They can't even survive a hit with Sash because of Fake Out. Not having Taunt is going to suck against Registeel though, especially since it'll be switching in on Fake Out all the time.

I think (without testing) that Sash is the preferred option. Not many people are going to keep the pixies in against Shiftry, and it just so happens that Shiftry is 4x weak to U-turn. 0 Attack Mesprit has almost a guaranteed OHKO, although Uxie fails. As it is even if you have a guaranteed 2HKO on them with Dark Pulse, they're not going to stay in so it doesn't matter.

I question Explosion on the set, although it could be just me. Based on first looks I would prefer Fake Out / Sucker Punch / Leaf Storm / Dark Pulse, because having priority attacks are just too useful. You could Explode on Arcanine and Moltres, but why not just switch out to your Water-type?
 
^The main reason for Explosion is to pick off troublesome leads early on. Sure, you could switch to a Water type against Moltres, but then you'd risk a hard hit from Air Slash or possible burns from Fire Blast, and then Moltres could switch out and create more of a problem later. I'd much rather just trade my Suicide Anti-Lead for my opponent's longevity oriented lead, and then have a fresh start next turn.

You got the bit about Cloyster / Omastar / Hippopotas wrong, he's saying that they can't get up entry hazzards if you have Fake Out.

Also, I'll slash in Focus Sash as the primary item. It seems to work a lot better than Life Orb, my testing is indicative of this.
 
Ok, so this lead turned out to work decently. However, I'm gonna suggest some changes before I approve it. Some of the Speed EVs need to be moved into attack, as 252 Speed with a neutral nature and base 80 is completely pointless. The spread that I tried out uses 136 Speed and 120 Attack, letting it outspeed max Speed Omastar and 0 Speed Uxie. the Attack EVs also beef up its physical attacks, as Shiftry's base 100 attack would sure love to be utilized. I also ran Low Kick in the 1st slot, as it dents Registeel (who is surely going to switch in) quite heavily and provides good coverage.

Also, Fake Out is pretty much pointless. It deals shit damage, and nothing important has a Focus Sash that needs to be broken first turn. Put it in the additional comments, imo it doesn't deserve a slash anywhere. The final slot should then be Sucker Punch / Explosion, as STAB priority is awesome, while Explosion is also very useful. I guess you can also slash Explosion in the first slot, if you want. Finally, I would never run Life Orb on this, given the propensity of U-turn and stuff that can easily KO Shiftry in general. I don't like it as a slash, but other QCers may disagree. I say remove it. Finally, ability should be Early Bird to deal with sleep leads or just sleep in general.

edit: maybe try Extrasensory somewhere? it hits Venu and Heracross hard.

overall:
-new EV spread
-reorganize moves
-change item (for now) and state ability

good work on this, I think the order in the last slot should be Sucker Punch and then Explosion because priority is too good to pass up. Explosion can also be slashed in on the first slot because it still is an amazing wallbreaking move.

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This set does indeed have a lot of potential. Just one question though; what is the need for Dark Pulse? Just for a reliable secondary STAB I'm guessing, but you'd benefit so much more from Hidden Power Rock which allows you to effectively deal with Scyther and Moltres while still keeping a Focus Sash. Judging from your list above you don't use Dark Pulse once, seeing as how you flat out lose to the only two Pokémon you would consider using Dark Pulse on - Mespirit and Uxie. You may as well consider it.

252 SpA Rash Shifry Hidden Power Rock vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Neutral Moltres: 92.2% - 109.7%
0 HP / 4 SpD Neutral Scyther: 112.5% - 132.4%

Calcs aren't necessary as it is plain obvious. But unless I'm missing something I think is the better choice because Scyther is pretty common, and unless it chooses to U-turn, you'll unexpectedly nail it hard. Not sure about Arcanine, I've never encountered one of them before. I'm sure someone will fill me in on the EVs and common set.

Still a good set, I had a similar set with Victreebel but with Encore and Sleep Powder.
 
In my opinion make Explosion the primary option. Outside of that, uragg said pretty much everything I had in mind:

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^After doing a bit of testing, I've come to the same conclusion. I just haven't had time to update it until now.

I'll start writing the full analysis, then.
 
Double post/bump.

Full writeup posted, with three significant edits that can be seen at the bottom of the updates and changes log. Now ready for GP Checks.
 
You don't really need the Team Options and Counters sections as the recent Shiftry Update covered them.

More information in Set Comments would be good. Like about Dark Pulse (the unexplained moves) and how the set plays.

edit: Actually, that looks like your first Additional Comments paragraph. Merge the parts from that paragraph that talk about the above into the Set Comments.

edit for bottom: Yeah, that's why I said "first", lol. =P

edit: Looks better. =D Adding to queue.
 
Flora said:
You don't really need the Team Options and Counters sections as the recent Shiftry Update covered them.
Click to expand...

True. Removed.

More information in Set Comments would be good. Like about Dark Pulse (the unexplained moves) and how the set plays.

edit: Actually, that looks like your first Additional Comments paragraph. Merge the parts from that paragraph that talk about the above into the Set Comments.
Click to expand...

The second paragraph of my AC talks about the lesser move options, not the main set ones. I'll add a bit more information in the Set Comments.

EDIT: ^ Wow, I clearly wasn't paying attention when I posted that. Fix'd, and edits made. Thanks Flora!
 
GP CHECK 1/2

blue is additions
red is removals

[SET]
name: Attacking Lead
move 1: Low Kick
move 2: Leaf Storm
move 3: Dark Pulse
move 4: Explosion / Sucker Punch
item: Focus Sash
ability: Early Bird
nature: Rash
evs: 116 Atk / 252 SpA / 140 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Shiftry is a useful Anti-Lead in UU, able to kill KO or cripple many common leads, including Alakazam, Mesprit, Uxie, Cloyster, Omastar, and Qwilfish. Shiftry’s strong offensive movepool, stats, and typing allow it to act as a cleaner as well, granting him it superb mid-game mid- and late-game usability. Dark Pulse is a stable Shiftry's most consistent STAB attack, and it also allows Shiftry to 2KHO the ever-common Uxie and Mesprit leads. Leaf Storm is Shiftry's most powerful attack that doesn't require its own death STAB option, effectively KOing most Pokemon that don't resist it after a Dark Pulse. Low Kick helps to damage Registeel, which would otherwise wall Shiftry completely. Priority in the form of Sucker Punch, and the ever-useful Explosion round out Shiftry as an excellent addition to any team requiring an Anti-Lead There are two possible options in the final moveslot; Explosion allows Shiftry to "go out with a bang", KOing essentially any foe that doesn't resist it, while Sucker Punch gives Shiftry a useful priority move.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Focus Sash is the best item choice for Anti-Lead Shiftry because it allows you Shiftry to heavily damage a large variety of leads and continue attacking after a potentially fatal attack blow from the opponent. Holding a Focus Sash also allows you Shiftry to use Explosion more assuredly. Early Bird is the best choice for his Shiftry's ability, as Sleep sleep moves are more common in UU than Sunny Day. The EV spread allows Shiftry to outrun 4 Speed Uxie and Max Speed Omastar leads, with the rest remaining EVs pushed into Attack to increase the power of Low Kick and Explosion (or Sucker Punch). The Rash nature is required to 2HKO the standard Uxie Lead without weakening Explosion or slowing Shiftry down.</p>

<p>The only unfortunate thing about a Shiftry Anti-Lead is that it has some very serious four moveslot syndrome, with many of its lesser options being ousted from the set in favor of the main ones already listed. Protect is an option over Low Kick; It allows you Kick as it gives Shiftry a chance to beat Ambipom provided you hold Shiftry holds a Focus Sash, but Shiftry is usually better off just switching. Sucker Punch is the only move that should be given consideration over Explosion. It allows you Shiftry to deal with Alakazam leads almost 100% of the time, and it also gives you it a more powerful weapon against Moltres, should you choose to stay keep Shiftry in. However, using Explosion allows you Shiftry to completely wipe out leads you it can't beat otherwise, such as Moltres or Arcanine. Extrasensory can hit Venusaur and Heracross hard, but there's isn't really a place for it. Likewise, Hidden Power Rock can eliminate Moltres and Scyther while dealing heavy damage against any other Fire-type leads, but it doesn’t fit into the set any better than Extrasensory.</p>

the biggest problem throughout this write-up was the word "you". "you" can only be used when referencing the battler. when it is used how you used it (i.e. "explosion allows you to completely wipe out pokemon you couldn't beat otherwise"), it is incorrect, as you are using it in reference to the pokemon. aside from that issue, this was a very solid analysis.

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Eon, be sure to remove that comment about Heracross from the analysis, as per my post here. You can sub in one of the other multitude of Fighting-types in its place or something like, idk, Weezing.
 
^I'll change it to "the various fighting and poison types in UU, such as Toxicroak." Or something like that. I'll get to it tomorrow, with the rest of Snorlaxe's changes.

EDIT: Changes made. Thanks guys!
 
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