Should I change with the change (OU balanced)

Sheaz

Hey all. With the release of Pokemon lab, I've been thinking about making some changes to my team. I posted a team that was very similar when I first got an account here months ago, but I've made some key changes and, most importantly, have experience now to better give you an understanding into my team. Any help is greatly appreciated. So here's my balanced team.

140px-475Gallade.png



Gallade @ Life Orb
Adamant
252 atk / 252 speed / 4 HP

-Zen Headbutt
-Close Combat
-Shadow Sneak
-Leaf Blade

The anti-metagame is the metagame, right? This Gallade is made to counter the most common leads, especially the "big two" of Machamp and Azelf. ZH is a clean OHKO on Champ, while leaf blade (in order to bluff that I don't have SS) and SS 2HKO Azelf handily. Most other leads (Aero, Nape, etc) are 2HKO'd by CC + SS, with me switching out to Rotom when a trick lead appears. Leaf Blade is expressly for Swampert leads, which OHKOs; it also brings me added utility in being my team's only grass attack. Ice Punch or Stone Edge are other options I was rolling around in my head, but Swampert is far more common than Dragonite anyway. Life Orb counts down on its longevity a bit, but it's needed to score some crucial OHKOs.

Gallade is handy in that it can easily KO the opposing lead, and possibly come back later in the match to do some damage. It has problems with Roserade (I bluff lum and attack), certain Skarmory, and Dragonite. I can make a detailed vs. list for opposing leads if you guys want.


260Swampert.png



Swampert @ Leftovers
Impish
240 HP / 216 Def / 52 SpD

- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Earthquake
- Avalanche

Ah, Swampert. Not much to say here: it provides rocks, an electric immunity, and phazing. The Impish nature is mostly leftover from when it was a lead, as it was outpaced by Machamp with Relaxed. Avalanche comes in handy, and it mostly does the same thing that ice beam did. I usually try to switch this in right after Gallade, but there are certain matches where rocks don't get laid. Should I go for the standard relaxed/ ice beam?


rotom-wash.jpg


Rotom-W @ choice scarf
Timid
252 spA / 252 spe/ 4 HP

- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Hydro Pump
- Trick

A great revenge killer, trick absorber, spin-blocker, and explosion sponge all in one. Rotom is invaluable for handling trick leads, tearing down opposing Gyarados, and tricking anything particularly troublesome. The Hydro Pump version is chosen to do some solid damage to incoming Heatran and Ttar, and it comes without the annoying attack drop of leaf storm or overheat. His greatest asset is being able to take on Gengar and Starmie, who can prove problematic for my DDos. Even pokemon that come in to pursuit him take pretty heavy damage.

392.png


Infernape @ Life Orb
Naive
252 Atk / 64 SpA / 192 Spe

- Close Combat
- Overheat
- U-turn
- Stone Edge

Infernape serves as my wall breaker and pseudo-scout. He's simply fantastic at forcing switches, and u-turn will get him out of harm's way while allowing my choice of a switch in. While mach punch is tempting, stone edge allows me to better take on Togekiss and Dragonite. He's also handy for absorbing incoming will-o-wisps from ghosts and the like. He's also a back-up for serious threats that I have covered in another way, and there is matches where I don't need him at all. Still, he's great for taking out Celebi and Forretress, two huge hurdles for Jirachi and Gyarados (respectively).

jirachi.jpg

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Bold
252 HP / 224 Def / 32 Spe

- Wish
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt

This is probably my favorite pokemon on the team. Jirachi can easily switch in on one of its many resits or a predicted toxic. from there, it wishes right away, and then either stays in to sweep or switches to heal my teammates; this is especially helpful for healing Dos, as he's immune to the many earthquakes that come its way, and is resistant to the fire attacks. The beauty of this set is that it can set-up on many things that don't like switching out, such as pain-split Gengar under a sub. It can also easily beat Blissey, as thunderwave is only a minor hindrance. It's not hard to get a nice number of calm minds up, and many players aren't wise to the set until it's at +2.

130.png


Gyarados @ Life Orb
Jolly
252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake

This is my main sweeper. Jolly is chosen to outpace Jolteon, but I think I still have some free speed EVs? Anyway, this guy will tear things up, even if life orb tears away at his longevity. I've been thinking about replacing stone edge with return, as he could use the neutral coverage, and stone edge has proven to be very unreliable. As a sweeper, there's not much I else I could ask for.

Threats: It's really dependent on who has been KO'd, of course, but the biggest annoyance I've seen is Kingdra, especially the chesto rest variant. It's decently bulky, damn fast after a DD or two, and I don't have anything to hit super effectively with.

Flygon can also be a pain, outpacing Dos when it carries a scarf, and hitting Jirachi for huge damage with EQ (and everything else with outrage). It's vital that I keep Jirachi alive to survive its outrages, or else it can run over my team.

Life Orb Gengar can also be a pain, especially with hidden power fire. Most other Gengar sets can't out-damage my wish+leftovers recovery on Jirachi, but this one certainly can. Rotom is around to revenge, but I'm in pretty bad shape if he's out of the match.

That's pretty much it. Thanks for viewing and criticizing.
​
 
It's a pretty good set, however, I do not understand what you are trying to achieve with Jirachi besides healing your teammates, the area of expertise for that Jirachi is so small, that in most battles, I'd feel that it's wasted, maybe you should replace Iron Head with one of your other moves in order to take advantage of it's ability of serene grace.

Also, I don't really see a lot of team synergy with this, it seems to be going everywhere but baton passing and stalling, I can't get my head around that lack of one pokemon covering for the other, it just doesn't feel too right that way.
 
Belphagor said:
It's a pretty good set, however, I do not understand what you are trying to achieve with Jirachi besides healing your teammates, the area of expertise for that Jirachi is so small, that in most battles, I'd feel that it's wasted, maybe you should replace Iron Head with one of your other moves in order to take advantage of it's ability of serene grace.

Also, I don't really see a lot of team synergy with this, it seems to be going everywhere but baton passing and stalling, I can't get my head around that lack of one pokemon covering for the other, it just doesn't feel too right that way.
Click to expand...

Wish CM Jirachi is a potent threat in today's metagame, being able to heal itself while setting up Calm Mind, as well as healing its teammates. Why does it need Iron Head?

What do you mean by this team not having team synergy? I don't see more than 2 Pokemon that share the same weakness. Unless I'm wrong?

I don't have much to rate, because this team is pretty solid overall. I don't think you should replace Stone Edge with Return, because Stone Edge allows you to hit opposing Gyarados much harder, as well as dealing with Flying Pokemon like Zapdos.

Good luck!
 
you're probably right, after all, you do have more experience, and I agree with your points, however, I still think it would be nice to fit Iron Head somewhere if POSSIBLE, call me paranoid, but I've just been in too many situations where I wish I had iron head
 
Iron Head is mostly useless, as Jirachi won't be outspeeding much with no investment. I also can't afford to lose the coverage between thunderbolt and psychic, as it's already limited. And what do you mean I have no synergy? Could you expand on that? The "it seems to be going everywhere but baton passing and stalling," comment is especially strange, as this is a balanced team, meant to counteract major threats while readying my own sweep.

Moving on. Thanks for the rate, Shiny. I'll probably keep stone edge, as it has come in handy; I just hate the move's crap accuracy. And Zapdos is an excellent point to keep it.
 
Threats
Offensive Starmie
Dragon Dance Kingdra
Offensive Suicune
Offensive Shaymin
Mixed Dragonite (Mixed Flygon as well, but to a lesser extent)
Heavy Stall
Lack of Ghost- type resist (Sub/PS Gengar, LO/Sub Charge Rotom-A)

Suicune and Starmie can dismantle this team with relative ease, the former getting against Rotom locked into the wrong move, and Infernape's Overheat, as well as Gyarados' Waterfall (if it hasn't Danced, else it will take a hefty hit from +1 Earthquake), set up a Calm Mind and abuse its highly powerful boosted Hydro Pump which no team member can safely switch into, bar Gyarados, who is already outsped and OHKOed by +1 HP Electric. Starmie is similar, albeit more threatening because it doesn't waste a turn setting up, just starts firing attacks by coming in on Swampert's Avalanche, Infernape (anything bar U-turn) and Rotom-W Hydro Pump (if it predicts perfectly). Again, Gyarados is the only "safe switch in" to its Hydro Pump, KOed by Thunderbolt. Do not consider Rotom-W as an end all counter to these two, it has a chance to be OHKOed by Starmie's Hydro Pump after SR, and is always OHKOed by Suicune's +1 Hydro Pump after SR. Shaymin is also a major threat, coming in on Swampert, Rotom-W's Thunderbolt/Hydro Pump, and Jirachi's Thunderbolt (though it'll be tough to KO IF it has a CM) and harassing your team with LO Seed Flares, similar to Starmie's Hydro Pump, but Grass- type. Infernape is not a counter however, it can't come in on anything Shaymin launches against the team. HP Ice is out of the question, there is no reason it would use it against this team, due to Seed Flare always doing greater damage. Infernape can't come in on Seed Flare safely, which does upwards 53%, and at the very least 100% Infernape will be left with 87% after SR, 34% after Seed Flare, and if it attacks and Shaymin switches out, 24% due to Life Orb recoil, meaning next time, its over. Kingdra can set up on Rotom's Hydro Pump, and give hell to your team with +1 Waterfall/Outrage. Mixed Dragonite and Mixed Flygon are not as threatening as the others mentioned, but the former can come in on Swampert's EQ and Rotom's Hydro Pump, while the latter against Rotom's Thunderbolt, Swampert's EQ, and Jirachi's Thunderbolt; both can do heaps of damage with LO STAB Draco Meteor, Jirachi can take it, but is handled by Earthquake, Swampert takes all the way up to 73% from Mixnite's DM (71% from Flygon's), which is huge imo, after some prior damage from a Tyranitar's Crunch or Agiligross Zen Headbutt Swampert was trying to tank hits from, its pretty much over right there. Stall shows its ugly head once again with a standard stall team of Hippowdon/Rotom-A/Skarmory/Blissey/Filler/Filler giving you quite a headache. You may say "but Wish CM Jirachi", it doesn't get many opportunities, especially against the likes of Hippowdon, whom your team will have trouble taking down. Lastly, lack of Ghost- type resist. I'm not too worried about the type itself, but the Pokemon who use it, Sub/PS Gengar all variants of Rotom-A, can threaten this team. Yes, Rotom does revenge them, but the correct attack needs to be lured out to safely dispose of them (Thunderbolt/Focus Blast), because once the opponent knows you lack a Ghost- type resist, they won't have second thoughts about abusing Gengar's LO Shadow Ball or their Specs Rotom's Shadow Ball. Jirachi does check Gengar, however that doesn't mean it can switch into Shadow Ball without worries.

First off, I think a Curse Snorlax with the following set can solve A LOT of the listed problems; firstly it handles Starmie/Suicune/Shaymin that make it hell for this team, and uses them as set up bait for Curse and may even sweep the opposing team clean. It also gives you a very valuable Ghost- type immunity, meaning Gengar and any and every Rotom forme is going to go down to fat blob. Disposing of the Rotom Forme will mean Gyarados can have a much easier time against the opposing team with its counter eliminated from play. I think Snorlax can find a place over Swampert because imo, Swampert's become kinda "ehh" in this metagame, becoming a free ticket of set up to a lot of threats as shown in the above paragraph. A Tyranitar, Agility Metagross, and lack of SR weakness pops up, but I will certainly solve those issues along with the listed ones.

This set should do good over Swampert:

Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 188 HP / 104 Def / 216 SpD
Careful nature (+SpD, -SpA)
~ Curse
~ Body Slam
~ Crunch
~ Rest

Mixed Dragonite/Flygon, Heavy Stall, and the new DD Tyranitar and Agility Metagross problem remains. To handle the Heavy Stall problem, I think Specially based Mixape can do a better job over your current one. Yes, scouting is fun by luring in Starmie, but its handled by Snorlax now, Infernape also finds more versatility in its Specially Based Mixed set due to superior coverage.

Try this set:

Infernape @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 64 Atk/ 192 Spe / 252 Satk
Naive nature (-SpD, +Spe)
~ Close Combat
~ Fire Blast
~ HP Ice
~ Grass Knot

Finally to handle the aforementioned Dragon- types, as well as the DD Tyranitar and Agility Metagross weakness, I think Choice Scarf Flygon should get a slot over Rotom. Everything your Rotom handles, Flygon handles, with the addition of Mixed Dragons, DD Kingdra, Metagross, and DD Tyranitar. 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe with Jolly Earthquake/Dragon Claw/Thunder punch/U-turn is fine. The lead spot is up for grabs and if you have a different idea for a SR lead, feel free to use it over the following suggestion. You can try this Life Orb Azelf set as a lead over Gallade:

Azelf @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Zen Headbutt
- U-turn
- Explosion
- Stealth Rock

This makes a potent U-turn combination with Flygon, and handles all the leads reasonably well, while also being "anti lead metagame", again if you have a better lead in mind, then go for it and use it.

Sorry for the immense wall of text put forth, but I thought some things were too important to be left out, lol.

GL
 
Wow, Legend Killer. Thank you so much for putting the effort into that. To avoid sounding scatter-brained, I'll number my responses.

1) That's a nice bit of theorymon in the paragraph, but it comes off to me that you're underestimating my ability a bit. No big deal, of course, but some of the things you mentioned aren't too scary at all. Sub/split Gengar, for instance, does 38.6% to Jirachi with shadow ball when timid. HP fire does above 50%, but I've never seen a sub/split version use anything aside from shadow ball and focus blast. Dragonite isn't generally a problem, especially if Jirachi is unrevealed, as it's dragon attacks are pretty predictable. I'm not saying I'm a genius at prediction, but most of your scenarios are something I never find myself in.

2) I don't see Snorlax helping all that much. While he gives me an edge against LO Gengar, he also opens up a SD Lucario weakness. It just seems like it evens out.

3) A choice scarf Flygon may actually be a brilliant idea over Rotom. I'm wary of losing of losing the explosion immunity, especially if not using a strong anti-lead (as you're kinda recommending), but it does clear up my Kingdra troubles. He's also not pursuit weak, which is handy. Most importantly, he keeps the ground immunity to cover for Nape and Jirachi.

4) I don't see why the Infernape set is preferred. Stone Edge does massive damage, and is able to OHKO 0 HP Dragonite after rocks and if Dragonite has life orb recoil. Even if it's not a KO, another member of my team can come in and revenge. If Mence was still around, I would be all over this set, but dealing huge damage to its common switch-in of Starmie with u-turn and hitting things like Zapdos hard seem more important than getting Dragonite or a mis-predicted Flygon switch. Or am I wrong in this thinking?

5) I don't see why Swampert sucks in this metagame. He can handle Tyranitar, Lucario, and Dragonite (assuming outrage over draco meteor) decently enough. His phazing is also great. I'm open to changing him, but only for another bulky SR user that isn't Heatran (as then I would be too ground weak).

6) I know that changing my lead to an SR user would free up Swampert's role mentioned above, but that's just way too risky without an explosion sponge. He also won't be stopping any bulky leads aside from Machamp, and he risks getting taunted by Aero or opposing Azelf.

I'm sorry if I come off as a bit defensive here, but I want to really know the gravity of my flaws before fixing them and/or potentially making new holes in my team. If you don't feel the need to respond to this, that's cool, as you already gave out some excellent advice. Thanks again.
 
Sheaz, well crafted team..I only have a few nitpicks.

1) Go for Ice Beam over Avalanche, the range of Pokemon that get hit harder with Avalanche rather than Ice beam is small and Earthquake hits the majority.

2)It's quite hard to get rid of that glaring weakness to fast special sweepers as Thelegendkiller pointed out and the only sneaky way around it without making your team lose any Momentum on the defensive side(your team doesn't suffer from any physically offensive threats) I would suggest adding Blissey instead of Jirachi. For one You can still Wish to other members and also I bet you expereince this as also I have, that Jirachi comes in sets up a calm mind only to be faced with a switched in Heatran or Tyranitar. The point being it slows your team down. Blissey does as well but it provides that sturdy defense against Starmie and Jolteon. LO bomber Heatran is also kept at bay thanks to Protect.

Blissey@Leftovers
252hp/252def/6sp.def Bold
- Seismic toss
- Wish
- Protect
- Flamethrower/ Thunder wave

Good luck !!!!
 
Thanks muchly, SOMALIA. Blissey is an interesting option, but not over Jirachi. Your whole scenario of setting up a CM and being forced out is very untrue, as I pretty much always use wish first, especially when I haven't fully scouted the team. Still, it works awesomely as a status absorber, can spread around twave or poison, and gives me a catch-all answer to the special sweepers plaguing me. Maybe over Swampert? Gah, that still leaves me in a difficult position, as then I'd need an SR lead, but if I take out Rotom I'm weak to explosions. Actually, I think I have an idea.

Gallade
Blissey (over Swampert)
CS Flygon (over CS Rotom)
Heatran (substitute set with fire blast/ earthpower/ stealth rock/ sub)
Jirachi
DDos

How does that look? Just a basic outline, of course, but this solves all of my problems except Kingdra. And it incorporates both of your awesome responses.
 
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