Rejected Standardize a timer in Official Drafts.

[Bella]

Just a forewarning here: This is my first time ever writing a Tournament Policy post, so sorry if it sounds very bad.

Recently in SCL yesterday, we encountered a situation where 2 managers had ended up spending about ~7 minutes deciding a pick for nomination. This made many people frustrated, including other managers, the casters livestreaming the draft, and even people watching the draft on their own. I feel like as such, to prevent other situations like this and to simply quicken the time an official draft like SCL / SPL takes, a timer should be standardized across all official Smogon Tours. My proposed time would be approximately 3 minutes (giving enough time for managers to think while also not being overly long that it would be pointless), with the punishment for letting the timer go over being randomly nominating someone still available in the draft pool (although, this punishment especially is only one idea i had and could be easily changed given dicussion). This is a relatively minor change, and I personally see it as more of a formality, if anything. Having a timer in place would incentivize that at least one manager from every team stay attentive during the duration of the draft and further highlights the benefits from pre-draft planning. Understandably during tournaments like SCL or SPL where over 140 people are being drafted, plans will change and the goal of adding a timer is not to place stress on managers as they navigate decisions during the tail end of these drafts; but to ensure that the draft itself continues to run fluidly. In drafting processes that regularly runs for 3+ hours, being able to shave off a few minutes here, a faster pick there, can translate to >20-30 minutes being saved and hopefully giving all parties involved a more pleasant drafting experience.

TLDR: Make a timer to help both speed up incredibly long drafts while also promoting managers to prep well in anticipation for huge tours.

 

[Stories]

tmk there is a timer, it just wasn't ever turned on for some reason. definitely got a bit irritating towards the end of the draft it would be nice to make sure it's always on

 

[Finchinator]

I do not think we need a timer on from the very start of the draft as it could make things choppy, but one should be enforced from the moment people start taking more time (I.e: mid-late auction yesterday).

I would leave this up to host discretion personally, but keep it visibly and consistently on for the entire late auction.

 

[Larry]

with the punishment for letting the timer go over being randomly nominating someone still available in the draft pool (although, this punishment especially is only one idea i had and could be easily changed given dicussion).

the punishment in particular seems like the biggest issue with the proposal to me - how are you gonna punish someone? Skipping is sometimes a good thing in drafts so you can't do that, random nom sounds ridiculous, so I think if you do anything its gonna be reduce funds.

That said though, I do not think we need to change anything. This is never really a massive problem (basing this on the almost 30 drafts i did in 2023) because managers do or at the very least should reserve enough time for drafts and hosts can deal with this stuff on a case-by-case basis and - and this is just a passing thought - if required remove a team from the auction in extreme situations and have them pick up their 3k's after everyone else is done. I don't think a situation extreme enough to warrant something like that has ever happened, though.

 

[jake]

Full agree with Larry.

The only "punishment" that sounds even plausible to me is a knock against their managerial resume for future major tournaments, but even then, wasting time deliberating on a late pick is not a heinous act (and it's hardly a punishment in the moment).

Every other suggestion that I have seen impedes the integrity of the tourney (random picks/skipping) and/or creates weird loopholes (take 3k... except when you can't). If a team is holding the draft hostage, then sure, go with Larry's passing thought suggestion above, but this seems like a small problem in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Arcticblast]

If a manager runs out of time (whatever the chosen time is), their pick should be skipped and their team should receive a game loss for week 1 of the tournament. If a team accrues three, they should receive a full match loss. These penalties can be applied either actively during the season (hosts can have the team submit one fewer slot, or can pick a slot at random to give that loss) or can be applied at the end of the regular season (overwriting previous results).

If skipping a pick feels too “dangerous” to allow, then perhaps the timer could keep ticking until they make a pick, but game losses could be applied every three minutes.

I think it’s better for the draft experience to apply penalties after the draft rather than during it.

 

[a fairy]

If a manager runs out of time (whatever the chosen time is), their pick should be skipped and their team should receive a game loss for week 1 of the tournament. If a team accrues three, they should receive a full match loss. These penalties can be applied either actively during the season (hosts can have the team submit one fewer slot, or can pick a slot at random to give that loss) or can be applied at the end of the regular season (overwriting previous results).

If skipping a pick feels too “dangerous” to allow, then perhaps the timer could keep ticking until they make a pick, but game losses could be applied every three minutes.

I think it’s better for the draft experience to apply penalties after the draft rather than during it.

Speaking as myself etc - I would not be super enthusiastic about a punishment that actively rewards an entirely unrelated team's score as a result. If a punishment is necessary (I'm not convinced it is) it should only penalize the team being punished with no structure that awards an opponent.

 

[Colin]

Personally I would support the option of taking away 3k, even if it would force them to go below minbid, because I believe that this would make it always suboptimal to get skipped. alternatively, it could stay the managers turn and just have a ramping price tag for waiting based on how long it is. if we use the timer for bids, it should never be optimal to wait longer than it and it must have a meaningful consequence for the timer to mean anything. preferably we just don't need the timer, but if we decide we do there should be some bite behind its bark

 

[UT]

We will not be implementing a nomination timer for official tours.

As several others have noted, "just" skipping the nomination can actually be advantageous in later rounds, which is a perverse incentive. Additional penalties like deducting credits do not work if it would take teams below the minimum roster size, and assigning random players adds a level of randomness (undesirable) and likely heavily penalizes the person yeeted onto the team, as they will likely be an outsider for the entire tour as they were literally undesired.

Adding a penalty to week one is off the table as well, as that provides a free competitive advantage to their week one opponent.

While the existing system isn't perfect, hosts and Tournament Directors can already threaten bad actors with infractions and future disqualifications from manager selection, which should be sufficient in the unlikely event a team tries to leverage this maliciously. Otherwise, a few extra minutes in an hours-long draft process that only happens twice a year is less of a headache than any of the available solutions.