Starting Anew (is that spelled right?) A OU Rewrite

Hotrocket

Hey Smogoners and Smogonettes (xoxo)​

So some time ago I made my first RMT (or at least my first respectable one) and got some great feed back. But of course now I've made some pretty big changes to where I figured HEY WHY NOT JUST MAKE A NEW THREAD!? (plus i'd take any excuse to make a new thread just to get some fame...BLACK STAR!!!) This team is a little all over the place but hey...they're kind of like my punk gang of friends (yea go for a outsiders theme, good one BB) I'm trying to make a all around balanced team that's going to be able to take on a lot of common threats seen in the OU game. Like always, all advice is appreciated and I love you all (especially you my little smogonettes)

TEAM AT A GLANCE
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Scizor
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Adament w/ Choice Band
Ability:Technician
EV: 248 HP 252 Att 8 Spe
Pursuit
Superpower
Bullet Punch
U-Turn​

This is my ninja spy of the group. His job you ask? Lead my team into the enemy base, kill someone right off the bat if he can but almost always U-Turn out of there so he can strike from the shadows once again. Pursuit is my Anti-Reundiculous (see what I did there) as well as taking out psychic and ghost pokemon (I'M LOOKING AT YOU SUPER LATIO BROTHERS) u-turn is of course for scouting but also for psychics. I always use pursuit though when I think they will switch (go for the kill) Bullet punch for priority and Superpower for steels and dark (I was thinking brick break in case i wanted to sweep without the lose in attack?)​


Gengar
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Timid Nature w/Black Sludge
Ability:Levitate
EV: 252 SAtk 252 Spd 4 HP
Sub
Disable
Shadow Ball
Focus Blast​

Gengar, the idgaf imma go in there a take them all out ghost pokemon. I told a friend using this set to try something else. Then I tested it for myself and guess what PIMP? I'm in love (he totally hooked us up) Gengar is my favorite pokemon. When it comes to teams, I'll let go of whoever I need to for the good of the team but...when it comes to Gengar...I just...can't. Sub and Disable can really scramble a team. When they scramble they get mad and when they get mad they make mistakes (and everybody makes mistakes) Shadow Ball for STAB and focus blast...well focus blast is kinda just there, I'm thinking about switching for psychic, the accuracy is 100% (right? well you know what i mean) and now that he runs disable, he can take out that conkuldurrdurr's payback. Although Gliscor already does a good job of finishing fighting pokemon...the fact that I have 3 pokemon weak to fighting leads me to believe I need multiply ways of taking them out. huh huh am i right?​

Heatran
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Calm Nature w/ Air Ballon
Ability: Flash Fire
EV:252 HP 252 SDef 4 SAtk
Lava Plum
Stealth Rock
Will O Wisp
Roar​

Well...I once had a very strong relationship with a flash fire Chandelure until one day he caught me sleeping with a flash fire Heatran and well...you get the point. I change up Heatran's set so much it hurts...until New World Order gave me a great set to run with him. Lava Plum for the 30% burn. Stealth Rock if I can set it up, I will only use it when I predict a switch, and WOW to screw physical switch ins. If the other team has a Heatran I won't use it until they are gone. I don't wanna risk the opposing flash fire boost. I mean, when you WOW a Gliscor switching in...you just feel like a dick...(a badass dick trolololol)​

Gliscor
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Impish Nature w/ Toxic Orb
Ability Poison Heal
EV: 252 HP 40 Def 216 Spd
Ice Fang
Earthquake
Swords Dance
Taunt
Speaking of Gliscor, allow me to introduce my Edward whatever the hell his last name is character (its a twilight joke get it lol ok w/e) His job is to switch in and woo the opposing pokemon with a dance...A SWORD DANCE!!! EQ for that STAB SAUUCCCE (Epic Meal Time) Ice Fang is for those Dragon punks trying to steal his girl and also for opposing vamps trying to...steal...his girl...the belle girl right...thats her name? I usually run protect on him so I can stall and heal but taunt is a really important move IMO and I could really use it in case someone tries to sub or boost. I use to run Roar on Heatran for the same reason and now that I don't have it...I feel like I have to have something like it somewhere on this team.​


Blissey
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Bold Nature w/ Leftover
Ability Natural Cure
EV: 252 HP 252 Def 4 SDef
Toxic
Ice Beam
Aromatheraphy
Softboiled​

Let me introduce you to the biggest bitch in town (yea I said the b word deal with it! sorry if i offended anyone) SHE IS SUPPORT REINCARNATED!!! Toxic to mess you kids on the street up. Aroma to heal the burns of the sick children and Softboiled to keep herself alive in this cruel and difficult world. Protect, well thats for the stall and to protect herself (even though no one can protect themselves forever IN THE STREETS!) Anyway...yea I know that if she gets taunted shes done for but I mean, every move she has serves a purpose. I tried the whole wish thing but I just can't play it right, maybe I just suck ok? Shes beautiful, useful, fat, and dare I say it I love her.​

Ferrothorn
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Relaxed Nature w/ Leftovers
Ability Iron Barbs
EV: 252 HP 48 Def 208 SDef
Power Whip
Spikes
Leech Seed
Protect​

This ones for all the Playah Hater Rain Users out there. This ones for you. I'm planting a garden, a garden of pain. I've made some recent changes, adding spikes and protect over thunder wave and bulldoze. Spikes is going to help add to my hazards and protect is to stall the leftovers and leech seed heal.​

Well there it is, me sharing a piece of myself with you. yes you. I enjoy this team very much and i think I'm on the verge of greatness (just in general ya know?) I'm becoming a lot more familiar with the whole forum thing and I'm really liking it. I want to be a true Smogoner. Also, just fyi I'm really trying to get into the Battle 101 program to get tutored. Soooo if you are a tutor and you're reading this and would like to have a really charamastic and determined apprentice DON'T WORRY! You don't have to wait! I'm free whenever!!!! (am i desperate? yes) All advice appreciated as always.​
 
Don't use thunder wave on ferrothorn, it lows the power of gyro ball, you can replace it with toxic or Bulldozer.
On heatran i suggest you to replace SR or WoW with dragon pulse or Hp Fighting/ice, because with just EP and flamethrower you risk against another Heatran with air baloon. Hp Fighting can hit heatran and other air baloon pkmns like empoleon. Hp ice/dragon pulse are for coverage.
Blissey is too vulnerable to taunt, so I suggest you to change aromatherapy or protect with seismic toss or Blizzard/thunder/fire blast.
 
Good point! Although I would replace Gyro Ball with Bulldoze before getting rid of Thunder Wave. Reduction in speed is huge for my team. It would benefit Gliscor, Scizor and Heatran greatly.

I like your suggestion for Heatran, I'll try out the moves you suggested. Do you think I should keep the balloon on him?

As for Blissey, I agree to what you are saying about the taunt. Aroma is way too valuable for me to get rid of. I replace Protect with something.
 
First of all, if I were you, I'd use Heatran to lead over Scizor.

On Scizor, you question whether or not to use Brick Break over Superpower. Stick with Superpower, Scizor will always need the extra strength to break through Chansey / Blissey.

Why are you running max EVs on Heatran instead of a Specially Defensive set if you've got Will-o-Wisp and Stealth Rock? Change the EVs to 252 HP / 252 SDef with a Calm Nature, it'll help Heatran stick around longer. Also, you might consider running Hidden Power Ice over Will-O-Wisp if you choose to stick with your offensive EV spread.

On Blissey, you're not running Wish support, so Protect is just a waste of a moveslot. I recommend Ice Beam in place of Protect, because Taunt Gliscor > your team. Also, you're running Aromatherapy on the same team as a Poison Heal Gliscor, which is just stupid.

On Ferrothorn, never run Thunder Wave in conjunction with Gyro Ball. If you're using Bulldoze then it's fine to keep. And there's no EV spread on this guy. Fix that.

Overall, it's a really mediocre team. You cover weaknesses pretty well but some decent predictions leave you wrecked. Sub + Pain Split Gengar can leave your team begging for mercy. Rain seems like it would be a problem, as Ice Punch Toxicroak will destroy your entire lineup after hazards. Fix your major flaws, then work on the minor ones.
 
Ghuru said:
First of all, if I were you, I'd use Heatran to lead over Scizor.

On Scizor, you question whether or not to use Brick Break over Superpower. Stick with Superpower, Scizor will always need the extra strength to break through Chansey / Blissey.

Why are you running max EVs on Heatran instead of a Specially Defensive set if you've got Will-o-Wisp and Stealth Rock? Change the EVs to 252 HP / 252 SDef with a Calm Nature, it'll help Heatran stick around longer. Also, you might consider running Hidden Power Ice over Will-O-Wisp if you choose to stick with your offensive EV spread.

On Blissey, you're not running Wish support, so Protect is just a waste of a moveslot. I recommend Ice Beam in place of Protect, because Taunt Gliscor > your team. Also, you're running Aromatherapy on the same team as a Poison Heal Gliscor, which is just stupid.

On Ferrothorn, never run Thunder Wave in conjunction with Gyro Ball. If you're using Bulldoze then it's fine to keep. And there's no EV spread on this guy. Fix that.

Overall, it's a really mediocre team. You cover weaknesses pretty well but some decent predictions leave you wrecked. Sub + Pain Split Gengar can leave your team begging for mercy. Rain seems like it would be a problem, as Ice Punch Toxicroak will destroy your entire lineup after hazards. Fix your major flaws, then work on the minor ones.
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Thank you for the advice I needed to hear. Although I could have gone without the "stupid" comment. I appreciate the given set for Heatran. His survivability is key, this set seems to have that in mind. Should I smack a leftover on him or keep the balloon?

With Blissey, I might just go for a Blizzard instead of Ice Beam. Her SAtk is low, i might as well take the chance with blizzard so I can hit hard (or is that just stupid too?) The Aromatheraphy helps out Scizor in case he gets burned as well as any other pokemon that suffers a para. Having it on the same team as a Poison Gliscor doesn't earn the title of stupid IMO. Gliscor easily gets his poison back, not like I'm using it multiple times.

Ferrothorn is going with bulldoze not gyro, it helps him more. Gengar is also packing psychic, so your ice punch toxicroak shouldn't give me as much trouble as you think. Scizor easily OHKOs Gengar with Bullet Punch.

I really apreciate your advice. I hope I fixed most of my problems.
 
For a SubDisable Gengar, I prefer Focus Blast over Psychic, since it provides flawless coverage. Ghost and Psychic overlap in resistances, like Dark. But then Toxicroak has an easier time with your team :/. Also, I suggest you put Leftovers over Air Balloon on Heatran, since it is one of your special tanks, which you want to take all sorts of moves. He'd really appreciate the recovery. Also, Ice Beam is better for Blissey, especially since Blizzard has low PP. You could consider running Flamethrower too, if you find Ferro, Forretress or Scizor causing problems.
 
CheezyMoon said:
For a SubDisable Gengar, I prefer Focus Blast over Psychic, since it provides flawless coverage. Ghost and Psychic overlap in resistances, like Dark. But then Toxicroak has an easier time with your team :/. Also, I suggest you put Leftovers over Air Balloon on Heatran, since it is one of your special tanks, which you want to take all sorts of moves. He'd really appreciate the recovery. Also, Ice Beam is better for Blissey, especially since Blizzard has low PP. You could consider running Flamethrower too, if you find Ferro, Forretress or Scizor causing problems.
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Yea I understand the focus blast situation for gengar :/ but since half my teams weak to fighting, I need to rely on more than just gliscor to handle them. I agree with leftovers for Heatran. Besides, I have plenty of switch ins in case I spot a EQ.

I might just have to deal with the lower power of ice beam for Blissey. I forgot the pp was so low. I don't have room for two attack moves, I can't give up Aroma or Softboiled and Toxic just seems too valuable.

Thanks for your help man :)
 
Hi, this is a solid team, many problems can be fixed internally. One pokemon I can see rampaging through your entire team is Substitute Volcorona. So you have your Heatran. Great. Now what's Heatran going to do to it? Volcorona is just going to get to +6 and power through with Bug Buzz. Similarly, while Blissey can take hits from it, Volcorona can simply block Toxic with Substitute, get to +6, and well, destroy your team. I suggest swapping Earth Power on Heatran for Roar, and swapping Air Balloon for Leftovers. This allows Heatran to come in repeatedly on Volcorona, get up Rocks, and Roar to take out a huge chunk of its health the next time it comes in. The only problem with making this change is that you are now walled by other Fire types, namely Heatran and Infernape. However, Volcorona is much more powerful than Heatran and Infernape combined, and Heatran never had any business against Infernape anyways.

Mynism's Toxicroak can easily set up on Blissey and proceed to run through your team. The same can be said about SD Lucario that run Ice Punch and Bullet Punch. I suggest swapping Gliscor's EVs to 252 Hp/ 40 Def/ 216 Spe to alleviate these problem. The only thing Gliscor ever needed those Defense EVs for was Excadrill, who is now banned. The extra Speed allows Gliscor to outspeed and OHKO both threats.

The defensive nature of this team means that you rely a lot on Entry hazards for damage... except you don't have many. Thunder Wave for one, is detrimental to team synergy. It clashes with the other status moves on this team. Once again, this is a very defensively oriented team and you need as much passive damage as possible, and you cannot afford to paralyze a Pokemon that you absolutely needed Poisoned or Burned. Definately use Spikes instead. When combined with Heatran's Roar, as well as the switches Scizor and Gengar force with U-Turn and Disable, and you will find the opponent being worn down very quickly. Bulldoze as well, has no use outside of the Choice Band set for hitting Steels. Since you're clearly not running Choice Band, there are three moves here that you should explore: Gyro Ball, Protect, and Toxic. The former is an obvious secondary STAB, the second allows Ferrothorn to whore Leftovers recovery as well as rack up Leech Seed damage, the final move lets Ferrothorn join the show in spreading status: this time in a manner that fits this team's stall oriented playstyle. I also suggest going with a 252 Hp/ 88 Def/ 168 SpD EV spread. This allows Ferrothorn to survive a 2HKO from DD Haxorus and either hit it with Gyro Ball, or cripple it with Leech Seed.

One last thing. Focus Blast>>>>>>>>Psychic. Yes, I get it. Focus Blast misses a lot. But Ghost+Fighting coverage is just too good to pass up. Focus Blast hits everything you need Psychic to hit, but also ensure that Steel types, Hydreigon, and Tyranitar don't walk all over you. The last part is especially important since you rely on Blissey like a crutch, and if Blissey goes down to a Pursuit, you're in serious trouble. The chance of OHKOing Tyranitar can prove clutch in so many situations. If you still feel Focus Blast is too unreliable, I'll put it into perspective for you. Once, my CM Reuniclus missed Focus Blast all 8 times in a match, but did I regret having it? No. Because Focus Blast quite simply provided too good of neutral coverage to pass up.

In Summary:
Roar and Leftovers>Earth Power and Air Balloon on Heatran
pros: Volcorona can now be stopped, can rack up entry hazards damage
cons: walled cold by opposing Heatran

Gliscor new EV spread>Gliscor old EV spread
pros: beat Lucario and Mynism's Toxicroak
cons: has slightly less bulk

Spikes and other move>Thunder Wave and Bulldoze on Ferrothorn
pros: Spikes is very important for a stall oriented team to limit opposing switchins, Thunder Wave no longer clashes with other status moves
cons: none whatsoever, Thunder Wave and Bulldoze are cancerous and useless respectively

Focus Blast>Psychic on Gengar
pros: perfect coverage on every pokemon in the game, need I say more?
cons: more ragequits due to Focus Blast missing 4 times in a row or something

GL

Sets:
Heatran @ Leftovers
Flash Fire
Calm
252 Hp/ 252 SpD/ 4 Def
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Will-o-Wisp

Gliscor @ Leftovers
Poison Heal
Impish
252 Hp/ 40 Def/ 216 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Taunt

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Iron Barbs
Relaxed
252 Hp/ 88 Def/ 168 SpD
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball/ Protect/ Toxic

Gengar @ Leftovers
Levitate
Timid
252 SpA/ 252 Spe/ 4 Hp
- Substitute
- Disable
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
 
Thanks a lot New World Order. This is some really interesting stuff to test out. Love the Evs for the Gliscor and the defensive Tran set.

I'm letting go of the psychic, you guys are right. Perfect coverage is going to help me a lot more.

I'm going to add protect and spikes to ferrothorn. If i need him to be more offensive then i'll put gyro over protect, but the healing stall should be nice. I'm going to need him alive if i'm against rain teams. thanks again.
 
Hey there.

First off, run Leftovers on Heatran over Air Balloon. Air Balloon is really only good for sweepers, and since Heatran will be taking many hits, it's not as worthwhile.

Now, Pokemon such as Nasty Plot Celebi can cause you problems if the opponent has Toxic Spikes support; the Rotom-W + Scizor combination can cause you major problems as well. CM Virizion can also sweep you with hazard support since Scizor will get worn down easily by constantly switching into Spikes and Stealth Rock. By replacing Gengar with a Latias, you can defeat all of these threats easily. Latias can also retain Gengar's 110 Base Speed stat and sweep late game.

Calm Mind Latias
Latias @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Timid Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef 252 Speed
-Dragon Pulse
-Recover
-Hidden Power [Fire]
-Calm Mind

Your team would also benefit greatly from Rapid Spin support, since many of your team members can we worn down easily by Spikes. Latias and Blissey can take on rain teams quite easily, so I suggest that you replace Ferrothorn with a Forretress. Forretress can provide you with another defensive behemoth, and also support your team with Toxic Spikes in addition to Spikes and Rapid Spin. It can also utilize Volt Switch to allow you to indirectly rack up entry hazard damage and retain momentum.

Rapid Spin Forretress
Forretress @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
Relaxed Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
-Volt Switch
-Rapid Spin
-Toxic Spikes
-Spikes

Overall, solid team. Hope I helped, and good luck!
 
ShakeItUp said:
Hey there.

First off, run Leftovers on Heatran over Air Balloon. Air Balloon is really only good for sweepers, and since Heatran will be taking many hits, it's not as worthwhile.

Now, Pokemon such as Nasty Plot Celebi can cause you problems if the opponent has Toxic Spikes support; the Rotom-W + Scizor combination can cause you major problems as well. CM Virizion can also sweep you with hazard support since Scizor will get worn down easily by constantly switching into Spikes and Stealth Rock. By replacing Gengar with a Latias, you can defeat all of these threats easily. Latias can also retain Gengar's 110 Base Speed stat and sweep late game.

Calm Mind Latias
Latias @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Timid Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef 252 Speed
-Dragon Pulse
-Recover
-Hidden Power [Fire]
-Calm Mind

Your team would also benefit greatly from Rapid Spin support, since many of your team members can we worn down easily by Spikes. Latias and Blissey can take on rain teams quite easily, so I suggest that you replace Ferrothorn with a Forretress. Forretress can provide you with another defensive behemoth, and also support your team with Toxic Spikes in addition to Spikes and Rapid Spin. It can also utilize Volt Switch to allow you to indirectly rack up entry hazard damage and retain momentum.

Rapid Spin Forretress
Forretress @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
Relaxed Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
-Volt Switch
-Rapid Spin
-Toxic Spikes
-Spikes

Overall, solid team. Hope I helped, and good luck!
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Interesting suggestion with the Latias. I'll be sure to try it.

I actually did think about using Forrettress to have access to Spin and Toxic Spikes. The only reason I chose Ferrothorn was that he would size up better against rain teams, which give me a tough time. Hazards are annoying but not too much of a deal for my team. Taking out Ferro takes out my one answer to rain.

Thanks for your help, I really appreciate it.
 
Latias can also take on rain though, which is why losing Ferrothorn wouldn't be too much of a problem since you would still retain 2 rain counters in Latias and Blissey. And no problem :]
 
BankaiBro, do you know what i've seen right now in your team? that Infernape can destroy all your team except for Gengar: Fire blast for Scizor/Ferrothorn, Close combat for Blissey/Heatran and Hp Ice for Gliscor, you ABSOLUTELY need latias.
Infernape is outspeeded by Gengar but if his Shadow ball doesn't kill Infernape (but it's rare) and let's blaze activated with a fire blast say goodbye to all your pkmns!! Just a banded bullet punch can hit him if he's at low Hp, for example with focus sash.
CM Latias is a good option to check the ape: is faster, has got a good type (Usually Hp ice doesn't OHKO her), and with a boost of calm mind dragon pulse is dangerous. she's also less frail than Gengar.
 
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