StereoType

[Vent]

Dragonair StereoType Ubers 2014
Highest attack in the game, eviolite and marvel scale. Access to: extremespeed, dragon dance, agility.

Dragonair/Dratini are immensely powerful. They have a lot going for them. I consider this further proof that Eviolite should be banned, but maybe they are outliers and simply need to be banned themselves rather than Eviolite.
Fraxure/Axew also may warrant some looking into.

 

[Ghoul King]

Theoretically, yes, but I believe Shedinja is hardcoded to always have 1 HP. If/when this meta is coded, Shedinja will have to be manually set to that base value.

Nope, the game is hardcoded to treat 1 base HP as a special exception to normal HP rules, and Shedinja just happens to be the only Pokemon with 1 HP. Hack a Pokemon game, give any random species a base of 1 HP, and tada its members have 1 HP period.

There's several metas where Shedinja has more than 1 HP, such as 350 Cup, and it behaves like any other Pokemon. But with Wonder Guard.

I think we should start unbanning ubers picked for stats.
I'd love to try Mewtwo out in a meta where it's movepool will trump most things it's type, but it won't be op due to having the same stats as them.

+1

Eviolite

Unless the calculations are reworked so NFE Pokemon use reduced stats fitting to the averages of their stage of evolution, Eviolite really ought to be banned if stuff like Deepseascale is going to be banned.

The meta, generally

Everything with Shell Smash is horrifying. Barbacle in particular is notable for having Tough Claws, letting it get partially outside the stat boundaries.

Shedinja is very nice given that everything has very similar stats anyway, for the most part. The fact that Bug has bad stats isn't even a big deal.

Pixilate, Aerilate, and Refrigerate are more notable for their benefits. Aurorus might actually be useful, since its Physical movepool is much better than its Special movepool -and of course now it makes sense for it to run Return/Frustration.

In general, any Ability that modifies damage output of the user or enemy or affects Speed is a lot more notable. Anger Point stands out in particular, mostly being found on Pokemon that are not tough enough to really take advantage. In this meta Anger Point Primeape might have some appeal. Can't count on it though.

 

[Cookie Butter]

Dragonair/Dratini are immensely powerful. They have a lot going for them. I consider this further proof that Eviolite should be banned, but maybe they are outliers and simply need to be banned themselves rather than Eviolite.
Fraxure/Axew also may warrant some looking into.

Well, most NFEs are going to outshine their evolutions if Eviolite isn't unbanned.

 

[En Passant]

Theoretically, yes, but I believe Shedinja is hardcoded to always have 1 HP. If/when this meta is coded, Shedinja will have to be manually set to that base value.

Shedinja isn't hardcoded to have 1 HP.
EDIT: Greninja'd. I guess I shouldn't make a post then do something else and forget to post it.

 

[EV]

Sheer Force Kingler has 71/71 attack stats. It will probably always be special tho. Other Sheer Force users are worth looking into. Steelix, Tauros, even Lando still, tho it took a big nerf.

 

[Vent]

I think the general consensus is for Eviolite to be banned. If anyone objects, please say why, but for now it's on the banlist.

I'm not sure where I heard Shedinja was hardcoded, but thanks all for correcting me.

 

[Esprite]

How about an "Eviomax", which would give a 1.5 times attack boost to fully evolved pokemon.

 

[canno]

In that case change the Murkrow set to this

Murkrow @ Black Glasses / Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Roost
- Sucker Punch
- Brave Bird / Drill Peck
- Thunder Wave / Taunt

 

[Cookie Butter]

Barbaracle @ White Herb / Life Orb
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spe / 4 SpA or 4 HP
Naughty / Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash / Rock Polish
- Razor Shell
- Infestation / X-Scissor
- Poison Jab / Dragon Claw

 

[EV]

How about an "Eviomax", which would give a 1.5 times attack boost to fully evolved pokemon.

This OM is not in the business of creating new mechanics.

 

[Vent]

Barbaracle @ White Herb / Life Orb
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spe / 4 SpA or 4 HP
Naughty / Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash / Rock Polish
- Razor Shell
- Infestation / X-Scissor
- Poison Jab / Dragon Claw

Personally I'd put on both Dragon Claw and Poison Jab instead of the bug moves, as I can potentially see an overabundance of fairies and dragons. Dragons because they're powerful, fairies because they are immune to dragon.

 

[Cookie Butter]

Personally I'd put on both Dragon Claw and Poison Jab instead of the bug moves, as I can potentially see an overabundance of fairies and dragons. Dragons because they're powerful, fairies because they are immune to dragon.

I was thinking of Infestation mainly because it can trap the opponent, Barba's special attack isn't bad now (especially with Shell Smash and Infestation is affected by Tough Claws), and it hits super effectively against grass types. Shell Smash could be abused against Forretress, for example.
A more offensive moveset is also very good though.

 

[MegaGallade]

Pure Dragon types are extremely powerful in this meta. They have the highest HP and Attack, 3rd highest Defense and speed, joint 2nd highest special attack, and 2nd highest special defense.

 

[Ghoul King]

Let's look at Mega Evolutions that change type.

Mega Charizard X is unhappy -Reshiram has more HP than it and no disadvantage.

Mega Pinsir is also unhappy, having less HP than the likes of Mothim.

Mega Gyarados is a slight cheater -it actually has more HP than the likes of Crawdaunt, due to Flying having a higher HP value than Dark.

Mega Mewtwo X is unhappy -it has less HP than the likes of Medicham.

Mega Ampharos is unhappy, having less HP than Zekrom, and of course no Draco Meteor.

Amusingly, Mega Aggron doesn't care -Rock and Steel have identical HP anyway!

So Mega Gyarados is a little more appealing than normal, being a Pokemon with more HP than its typing "should" have.

I considered covering unreleased Megas but eeeeh.

 

[Disaster Area]

full list of the stats for all stat combos? :]

 

[Akumeoy]

Speed tiers

Speed: Typings (base Spe) (investment)
130: Rock (47) (0)
136: Rock/Fairy (50) (0)
140: Ground/Rock, Rock/Steel (52) (0)
142: Fairy (53) (0)
144: Grass/Rock, Bug/Rock (54) (0)
146: Steel/Fairy (55) (0)
148: Steel, Water/Rock (56) (0)
150: Ground, Grass/Fairy, Ground/Steel (57) (0)
152: Grass/Steel, Fighting/Bug, Bug/Steel (58) (0)
154: Water/Fairy, Grass/Ground, Ice/Rock, Fighting/Rock, Ground/Bug, Ghost/Steel (59) (0)
156: Grass, Bug, Fire/Rock, Water/Steel, Grass/Bug, Poison/Ground, Ground/Ghost, Psychic/Rock (60) (0)
158: Normal/Fairy, Water/Ground, Grass/Ghost, Poison/Ground, Bug/Ghost, Rock/Dark (61) (0)
160: Ghost, Water/Grass, Water/Bug, Grass/Poison, Poison/Bug, (62) (0)
162: Poison, Normal/Ground, Water/Ghost, Poison/Ghost, Psychic/Fairy, Rock/Dragon (63) (0)
164: Water, Normal/Grass, Fire/Steel, Water/Poison, Ice/Ground, Fighting/Steel, Psychic/Steel (64) (0)
166: Fire/Ground, Grass/Ice, Ground/Psychic, Flying/Rock, Dark/Steel (65) (0)
168: Normal/Water, Fire/Bug, Grass/Fighting, Grass/Psychic, Ice/Ghost, Fighting/Bug, Ground/Dark, Dragon/Fairy (66) (0)
170: Fire/Ghost, Water/Ice, Electric/Fairy, Grass/Dark, Fighting/Poison (67) (0)
172: Normal, Water/Fighting, Water/Psychic, Ground/Dragon, Flying/Fairy, Ghost/Dark, Dragon/Steel (68) (0)
174: Water/Dark, Electric/Ground, Electric/Steel, Poison/Dark, Flying/Steel (69) (0)
176: Ice, Normal/Fire, Normal/Fighting, Normal/Psychic, Ground/Flying (70) (0)
178: Fighting, Electric/Grass, Electric/Bug, Grass/Flying, Ice/Psychic, Poison/Dragon, Flying/Bug, Ghost/Dragon (71) (0)
180: Fire, Psychic, Fire/Fighting, Fire/Psychic, Water/Dragon, Electric/Ghost, Ice/Dark, Fighting/Psychic, Flying/Ghost (72) (0)
182: Fire/Dark, Water/Electric, Water/Flying, Fighting/Dark, Poison/Flying, Psychic/Dark (73) (0)
184: Dark (74) (0)
186: Normal/Electric, Normal/Flying, Ice/Dragon (75) (0)
188: Fire/Dragon, Electric/Ice, Ice/Flying, Psychic/Dragon (76) (0)
190: Fire/Electric, Fire/Flying, Fighting/Flying, Flying/Psychic, Dragon/Dark, (77) (0)
192: Flying/Dark (78) (0)
193: Rock (47) (252)
194: Dragon (79) (0)
196: Electric/Dragon (80) (0)
198: Electric, Flying/Dragon (81) (0)
199: Rock/Fairy (50) (252)
200: Flying, Electric/Flying (82) (0)
203: Ground/Rock, Rock/Steel (52) (252)
205: Fairy (53) (252)
207: Grass/Rock, Bug/Rock (54) (252)
209: Steel/Fairy (55) (252)
211: Steel, Water/Rock (56) (252)
212: Rock (47) (252+)
213: Ground, Grass/Fairy, Ground/Steel (57) (252)
215: Grass/Steel, Fighting/Bug, Bug/Steel (58) (252)
217: Water/Fairy, Grass/Ground, Ice/Rock, Fighting/Rock, Ground/Bug, Ghost/Steel (59) (252)
218: Rock/Fairy (50) (252+)
219: Grass, Bug, Fire/Rock, Water/Steel, Grass/Bug, Poison/Ground, Ground/Ghost, Psychic/Rock (60) (252)
221: Normal/Fairy, Water/Ground, Grass/Ghost, Poison/Ground, Bug/Ghost, Rock/Dark (61) (252)
223: Ghost, Water/Grass, Water/Bug, Grass/Poison, Poison/Bug, (62) (252)
223: Ground/Rock, Rock/Steel (52) (252+)
225: Poison, Normal/Ground, Water/Ghost, Poison/Ghost, Psychic/Fairy, Rock/Dragon (63) (252)
225: Fairy (53) (252+)
227: Water, Normal/Grass, Fire/Steel, Water/Poison, Ice/Ground, Fighting/Steel, Psychic/Steel (64) (252)
227: Grass/Rock, Bug/Rock (54) (252+)
229: Fire/Ground, Grass/Ice, Ground/Psychic, Flying/Rock, Dark/Steel (65) (252)
229: Steel/Fairy (55) (252+)
231: Normal/Water, Fire/Bug, Grass/Fighting, Grass/Psychic, Ice/Ghost, Fighting/Bug, Ground/Dark, Dragon/Fairy (66) (252)
232: Steel, Water/Rock (56) (252+)
233: Fire/Ghost, Water/Ice, Electric/Fairy, Grass/Dark, Fighting/Poison (67) (252)
234: Ground, Grass/Fairy, Ground/Steel (57) (252+)
235: Normal, Water/Fighting, Water/Psychic, Ground/Dragon, Flying/Fairy, Ghost/Dark, Dragon/Steel (68) (252)
236: Grass/Steel, Fighting/Bug, Bug/Steel (58) (252+)
237: Water/Dark, Electric/Ground, Electric/Steel, Poison/Dark, Flying/Steel (69) (252)
238: Water/Fairy, Grass/Ground, Ice/Rock, Fighting/Rock, Ground/Bug, Ghost/Steel (59) (252+)
239: Ice, Normal/Fire, Normal/Fighting, Normal/Psychic, Ground/Flying (70) (252)
240: Grass, Bug, Fire/Rock, Water/Steel, Grass/Bug, Poison/Ground, Ground/Ghost, Psychic/Rock (60) (252+)
241: Fighting, Electric/Grass, Electric/Bug, Grass/Flying, Ice/Psychic, Poison/Dragon, Flying/Bug, Ghost/Dragon (71) (252)
243: Fire, Psychic, Fire/Fighting, Fire/Psychic, Water/Dragon, Electric/Ghost, Ice/Dark, Fighting/Psychic, Flying/Ghost (72) (252)
243: Normal/Fairy, Water/Ground, Grass/Ghost, Poison/Ground, Bug/Ghost, Rock/Dark (61) (252+)
245: Fire/Dark, Water/Electric, Water/Flying, Fighting/Dark, Poison/Flying, Psychic/Dark (73) (252)
245: Ghost, Water/Grass, Water/Bug, Grass/Poison, Poison/Bug, (62) (252+)
247: Dark (74) (252)
247: Poison, Normal/Ground, Water/Ghost, Poison/Ghost, Psychic/Fairy, Rock/Dragon (63) (252+)
249: Normal/Electric, Normal/Flying, Ice/Dragon (75) (252)
249: Water, Normal/Grass, Fire/Steel, Water/Poison, Ice/Ground, Fighting/Steel, Psychic/Steel (64) (252+)
251: Fire/Dragon, Electric/Ice, Ice/Flying, Psychic/Dragon (76) (252)
251: Fire/Ground, Grass/Ice, Ground/Psychic, Flying/Rock, Dark/Steel (65) (252+)
253: Fire/Electric, Fire/Flying, Fighting/Flying, Flying/Psychic, Dragon/Dark, (77) (252)
254: Normal/Water, Fire/Bug, Grass/Fighting, Grass/Psychic, Ice/Ghost, Fighting/Bug, Ground/Dark, Dragon/Fairy (66) (252+)
255: Flying/Dark (78) (252)
256: Fire/Ghost, Water/Ice, Electric/Fairy, Grass/Dark, Fighting/Poison (67) (252+)
257: Dragon (79) (252)
258: Normal, Water/Fighting, Water/Psychic, Ground/Dragon, Flying/Fairy, Ghost/Dark, Dragon/Steel (68) (252+)
259: Electric/Dragon (80) (252)
260: Water/Dark, Electric/Ground, Electric/Steel, Poison/Dark, Flying/Steel (69) (252+)
261: Electric, Flying/Dragon (81) (252)
262: Ice, Normal/Fire, Normal/Fighting, Normal/Psychic, Ground/Flying (70) (252+)
263: Flying, Electric/Flying (82) (252)
265: Fighting, Electric/Grass, Electric/Bug, Grass/Flying, Ice/Psychic, Poison/Dragon, Flying/Bug, Ghost/Dragon (71) (252+)
267: Fire, Psychic, Fire/Fighting, Fire/Psychic, Water/Dragon, Electric/Ghost, Ice/Dark, Fighting/Psychic, Flying/Ghost (72) (252+)
269: Fire/Dark, Water/Electric, Water/Flying, Fighting/Dark, Poison/Flying, Psychic/Dark (73) (252+)
271: Dark (74) (252+)
273: Normal/Electric, Normal/Flying, Ice/Dragon (75) (252+)
276: Fire/Dragon, Electric/Ice, Ice/Flying, Psychic/Dragon (76) (252+)
278: Fire/Electric, Fire/Flying, Fighting/Flying, Flying/Psychic, Dragon/Dark, (77) (252+)
280: Flying/Dark (78) (252)
282: Dragon (79) (252)
284: Electric/Dragon (80) (252)
287: Electric, Flying/Dragon (81) (252)
289: Flying, Electric/Flying (82) (252)

Decide what you want to outspeed, see where it goes here, EV appropriately. For example, anything that wants to wear a scarf and outspeed the whole unboosted tier needs to hit 193 Speed; thus, Scarf Ferroseed probably doesn't need to run more than 164 Speed EVs... well, 180 to speed-creep other scarfers, really, but you know.

Anyways, if I missed anything relevant, just let me know.

----

I foresee Vulpix/Ninetales (for a bulky or Choice/LO set, respectively) being good here. With powerful moves at their disposal boosted by sun, at max speed outsped by little that runs Super-Effective STABs, and access to Nasty Plot, as well as the ability to provide Sun to sun-loving teammates, they should be quite useful. Hippopotas has the movepool, Eviolitery, and weather support to be a royal pain in the ass.

also >mfw this was actually just necro'd from October for no fuckin' reason and I just spent over an hour on speed tiers for a meta that isn't even active :| serves me right for not reading. gonna post anyways because sunken cost fallacy lol

 

[Disaster Area]

sorry for the necro xD maybe that'll bring some life into it

 

[sunny004]

MOAR LIFE ASDFASDFASDAHJKHGFD

Anyway Vent one of the sample sets contains a banned item.

gg

 

[FlameUser64]

The spreadsheet stats need to be updated for ORAS. The ones on Bulbapedia are outdated. Why Bulbapedia hasn't yet used a template to automate the process is beyond me.

Edit: I feel like it would be good to include all alternate formes of Pokémon, even if this makes the species come up multiple times. For example, Bulbapedia's average stats do not include things like Floette-Eternal or Mega Salamence. Arceus formes are also not included.

Edit2:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/159_FQLEx5hH2XWPaFb9pjKWWTD8EPJwjbwyJO4jZMA4/edit?usp=sharing

This contains the average stats for all types, with types other than Normal having both Arceus-included and Arceus-excluded stats listed. Stats are calculated by using Serebii's list of distinct formes of each type.
Exceptions: Keldeo-Resolute is not included due to being a purely cosmetic change, as its stats, Ability, and typing are the same. Deoxys formes are included despite not being listed by Serebii. The two formes of Basculin are both included as they have differing Abilities, even though their stats and typing are the same.