Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4 [Gouging Fire is banned]

[Heatranator]

I wanted to take a moment to talk about Tera Blast on Normal types. With the mechanic of Tera, you can use it to get two different STAB coverages even in a choice locked set. My use of this on Indeedee made me look for other examples. I believe the reason why we don't see this more is the lack of viable normal types in OU. Blissey is the only one that is truly OU and it's a pure defensive mon. The only UU normal types are Ursaluna and, again, Indeedee. They can be used in OU, but both are limited to niches. In the case of Ursaluna in particular, it makes little sense. Its speed is too slow for a Choice Scarf set and it makes less than zero sense to run Choice Band over Guts Flame Orb.

The leaves us with 6 more niche lower tier mons that are maybe possible to use in OU under certain conditions. RU has Chansey, Cinccino, Maushold, Cyclizar, and H-Zoroark. Nu has Porygon-Z. Of these, the only two that make any sense for this TB strat are H-Zoroark and Porygon-Z. Chansey is maybe viable on that one hazard clear stall team where it wouldn't be required to run boots, but it is still a pure defensive mon. Maushold and Cinccino are Technician and/or Skill Link mons that would prefer to run better Normal type moves like Population Bomb or Tail Slap. Cyclizar has weak attacking stats and would really need something more powerful like Double Edge to do any decent damage.

Porygon Z starts pretty easy. Most sets run Tri Attack, so just replace that with a different 80 base power move. Or run both to have a Normal STAB for after you Tera. The difficulty there is the 90 speed tier being really bad for gen 9. You could maybe get around this a bit with Choice Scarf, but the boosted metagame wouldn't be very kind to it. Z might be better as a wallbreaker on webs. A lot of teams are designed to check physical attackers first, so having a strong special attacker could be nice either way. It would likely need its own dedicated team, though.

H-Zoroark is a bit trickier for me to figure out. My best guess is it would probably want Choice Specs for the power. I think the main niche would be the double surprise factor. You are surprised once by Illusion, maybe, and then Tera Blast switching type could mess with what the initial check should be. There is the possibility of mixed attacking, but this might be harder to justify on a choice locked set

For the record, I believe that Ghost is the best Tera type for this strategy. Plus, H-Zoroark in particular is already a Ghost type. So it would essentially get an Adaptability level boost. Porygon-Z already has the Adaptability ability, although Download is supposed to be better. Aside from Blissey, which can be crippled by Trick, the only types that resist Ghost moves are Dark types due to Normal types being so rare in gen9 OU. The only Dark type in OU that resists both Normal and Dark type STAB is Gambit. If you have a team that can deal with Gambit, or even somehow find a way to fit a Magnezone, that would make it so that you essentially have no resistance to this combination.

Of course, this is pure theory right now. I have not tested it yet. These mons tend to be lower tiered for a reason. I'm just brainstorming out loud right now. There is maybe room for more special attackers since the physical threats in this meta seem to carry the most weight overall.

One thing about un-tera'd tera blast is that it always is a special move, it only does the thing where it changes between a physical and special move when you tera. This means that ursaluna, maushold and cinccino will be so weak using it. Thus, you have to use it purely on special attackers.
The only other mon I can think of that would use it is meloetta but meloetta's main niche is that of a devastating wall breaker by using relic song to switch between forms. Relic song is just a really good move due to it's sleep chance. You could potentially use tera blast to stay in aria form, while also abusing the form change, but you then have to drop psychic or knock off, which is not ideal.

 

[Bold School]

One thing about un-tera'd tera blast is that it always is a special move, it only does the thing where it changes between a physical and special move when you tera. This means that ursaluna, maushold and cinccino will be so weak using it. Thus, you have to use it purely on special attackers.

I had forgotten this. It's kinda funny that I wound up dismissing all the potential physical attackers for other reasons. Luckily for me, Indeedee and the two I didn't dismiss are primarily special attackers. So there's no need to change too much of what I said.

I did briefly mention mixed attacking on H-Zoroark, which I guess would have only been for Low Kick to maybe hit Gambit and Blissey anyways. I just ran the calcs on that and even Choice Specs Focus Blast does much more to Blissey than uninvested Low Kick. Yeah, that would have never worked. I think a 252/252 speed/special attack set is the only way to go on for this particular Tera Blast strat.

 

[RS25802580]

I wanted to take a moment to talk about Tera Blast on Normal types. With the mechanic of Tera, you can use it to get two different STAB coverages even in a choice locked set. My use of this on Indeedee made me look for other examples. I believe the reason why we don't see this more is the lack of viable normal types in OU. Blissey is the only one that is truly OU and it's a pure defensive mon. The only UU normal types are Ursaluna and, again, Indeedee. They can be used in OU, but both are limited to niches. In the case of Ursaluna in particular, it makes little sense. Its speed is too slow for a Choice Scarf set and it makes less than zero sense to run Choice Band over Guts Flame Orb.

The leaves us with 6 more niche lower tier mons that are maybe possible to use in OU under certain conditions. RU has Chansey, Cinccino, Maushold, Cyclizar, and H-Zoroark. Nu has Porygon-Z. Of these, the only two that make any sense for this TB strat are H-Zoroark and Porygon-Z. Chansey is maybe viable on that one hazard clear stall team where it wouldn't be required to run boots, but it is still a pure defensive mon. Maushold and Cinccino are Technician and/or Skill Link mons that would prefer to run better Normal type moves like Population Bomb or Tail Slap. Cyclizar has weak attacking stats and would really need something more powerful like Double Edge to do any decent damage.

Porygon Z starts pretty easy. Most sets run Tri Attack, so just replace that with a different 80 base power move. Or run both to have a Normal STAB for after you Tera. The difficulty there is the 90 speed tier being really bad for gen 9. You could maybe get around this a bit with Choice Scarf, but the boosted metagame wouldn't be very kind to it. Z might be better as a wallbreaker on webs. A lot of teams are designed to check physical attackers first, so having a strong special attacker could be nice either way. It would likely need its own dedicated team, though.

H-Zoroark is a bit trickier for me to figure out. My best guess is it would probably want Choice Specs for the power. I think the main niche would be the double surprise factor. You are surprised once by Illusion, maybe, and then Tera Blast switching type could mess with what the initial check should be. There is the possibility of mixed attacking, but this might be harder to justify on a choice locked set

For the record, I believe that Ghost is the best Tera type for this strategy. Plus, H-Zoroark in particular is already a Ghost type. So it would essentially get an Adaptability level boost. Porygon-Z already has the Adaptability ability, although Download is supposed to be better. Aside from Blissey, which can be crippled by Trick, the only types that resist Ghost moves are Dark types due to Normal types being so rare in gen9 OU. The only Dark type in OU that resists both Normal and Dark type STAB is Gambit. If you have a team that can deal with Gambit, or even somehow find a way to fit a Magnezone, that would make it so that you essentially have no resistance to this combination.

Of course, this is pure theory right now. I have not tested it yet. These mons tend to be lower tiered for a reason. I'm just brainstorming out loud right now. There is maybe room for more special attackers since the physical threats in this meta seem to carry the most weight overall.

I actually think Arboliva could work pretty well with this concept. Its base 125 special stat is a good starting point. Add on Choice Specs and a Modest nature and you have a powerful normal type to spam STAB Tera Blast.

That’s where Tera Ghost comes in. Arboliva invites in checks like Corv, Spdef Glowking, Dragapult, and Gholdengo. Click Tera Ghost, and suddenly you get a Specs-boosted Ghost STAB to nuke these mons.

Might actually be a pretty fun set.

 

[RyukTheDarkrai]

Didn't Arboliva used to have a niche in OU? I swear prior to DLC1, some people were talking a bit about it and it was sitting somewhere in / near D Tier.

 

[Heatranator]

Didn't Arboliva used to have a niche in OU? I swear prior to DLC1, some people were talking a bit about it and it was sitting somewhere in / near D Tier.

I searched through the past viability rankings, and nope, arboliva did not.
Though here are some mons that did have a ranking:
Sylveon: C- Rank
Masquerain: C- Rank
Flamgio: C- Rank
Golduck: C Rank
Charizard: C Rank
Floatzel: B- Rank
Pawmot: B Rank
Breloom: B Rank
Zoroark Hisui: A- Rank
These are all for the first viability rankings.

 

[GummyRowlets]

I searched through the past viability rankings, and nope, arboliva did not.
Though here are some mons that did have a ranking:
Sylveon: C- Rank
Masquerain: C- Rank
Flamgio: C- Rank
Golduck: C Rank
Charizard: C Rank
Floatzel: B- Rank
Pawmot: B Rank
Breloom: B Rank
Zoroark Hisui: A- Rank
These are all for the first viability rankings.

Slyveon was c- rank? Man, people were desperate for any decent fairy types. RIP the Tapus

 

[Eeveeto]

Slyveon was c- rank? Man, people were desperate for any decent fairy types. RIP the Tapus

Fuck the Tapus, hopefully every Fairy returns except them. Long life to Specs Tera Fairy Hyper Beam Sylveon.

 

[Heatranator]

Fuck the Tapus, hopefully every Fairy returns except them. Long life to Specs Tera Fairy Hyper Beam Sylveon.

While that is a good tech, the tapus were mostly good.
Tapu Lele is the only one I would say, yeah, fuck that shit. Tera on top of that or in general is too much. Psychic Terrain was just busted on a mon with that power.
Tapu Koko was alright. Yes, it was very fast but it only had decent power. 95 special attack is only alright and since it didn't get any good physical electric or fairy moves (none for fairy lmao), that stat was mostly worthless. Yes, electric terrain does boost its damage output, but not too much. It's also decently frail, so it was overall not bad. A good offensive mon that could be used to outspeed other fast threats like darkrai and cinderace.
Tapu Fini was a blessing. Now, it may potentially be outclassed by primarina, or may do the outclassing, but it was still good. Misty surge allowed it to ignore status and not be only an alright mon with that ability. Great defense stats and defog allow it to be a good defensive mon. Though I will never understand why people used scald on it when its abilities mean running scald is mostly inferior to surf (flying types are not worth lmao).
Tapu Bulu sadly is ass. It's just worse rillaboom unfortunately. Decent defensive stats and a great attack stat, but no physical fairy coverage and no grassy glide. Honestly, the meta would not change much if it returned. I do hope when it returns, it gets the justice it deserves.

Basically, you should said "Fuck Tapu Lele" instead of "Fuck the Tapus".

 

[tigers jaw]

Heatranator yes i’m ignoring ur wider post to nitpick, no hate tho

people run scald on fini because the power difference when compared to surf is negligible - especially considering how common it was for greedy players to switch in bulu/koko to reset terrain or check fini. these potential burns legit win games on the spot a lot of the time, especially with cm fini. also, in g8 where roost is a million pp, burning the likes of corv is massive.

speaking of cm, that set (especially sub cm) appreciates the ability to burn the likes of ferrothorn, toxapex, & gking amongst others, once misty terrain is no longer active.

tho on scarf i always run surf, as 99% of the time scarf fini with spatt investment was a near-mandated 6th on optimal ho teams, imo.

 

[Heatranator]

Heatranator yes i’m ignoring ur wider post to nitpick, no hate tho

people run scald on fini because the power difference when compared to surf is negligible - especially considering how common it was for greedy players to switch in bulu/koko to reset terrain or check fini. these potential burns legit win games on the spot a lot of the time, especially with cm fini.

speaking of cm, that set (especially sub cm) appreciates the ability to burn the likes of ferrothorn, toxapex, & gking amongst others, once misty terrain is no longer active.

tho on scarf i always run surf, as 99% of the time scarf fini with spatt investment was a near-mandated 6th on optimal ho teams, imo.

Okay, that makes way more sense. I think surf is probs the better option but I can see why people use it. It most likely is a case by case scenario of whether your team can handle them well or not to choose which one.

 

[Eeveeto]

While that is a good tech, the tapus were mostly good.
Tapu Lele is the only one I would say, yeah, fuck that shit. Tera on top of that or in general is too much. Psychic Terrain was just busted on a mon with that power.
Tapu Koko was alright. Yes, it was very fast but it only had decent power. 95 special attack is only alright and since it didn't get any good physical electric or fairy moves (none for fairy lmao), that stat was mostly worthless. Yes, electric terrain does boost its damage output, but not too much. It's also decently frail, so it was overall not bad. A good offensive mon that could be used to outspeed other fast threats like darkrai and cinderace.
Tapu Fini was a blessing. Now, it may potentially be outclassed by primarina, or may do the outclassing, but it was still good. Misty surge allowed it to ignore status and not be only an alright mon with that ability. Great defense stats and defog allow it to be a good defensive mon. Though I will never understand why people used scald on it when its abilities mean running scald is mostly inferior to surf (flying types are not worth lmao).
Tapu Bulu sadly is ass. It's just worse rillaboom unfortunately. Decent defensive stats and a great attack stat, but no physical fairy coverage and no grassy glide. Honestly, the meta would not change much if it returned. I do hope when it returns, it gets the justice it deserves.

Basically, you should said "Fuck Tapu Lele" instead of "Fuck the Tapus".

Only acceptable one for me is Bulu. Koko and Fini make defensive Mons unable to use Rest. Right now Dondozo is the main thing holding the civilization of OU Meta, if Tapus come, lots of Bans will be needed.

 

[tigers jaw]

Okay, that makes way more sense. I think surf is probs the better option but I can see why people use it. It most likely is a case by case scenario of whether your team can handle them well or not to choose which one.

personally i'd say there are instances in which you'd prefer surf, but the majority of sets (defog, cm, taunt+nm being the big ones) i'd go with scald regardless. with defog, you're removing your own terrain anyway, so you get the opportunity to burn grounded mons afterwards regardless, cm & nm are typically going to be fishing once or staying in past the point that terrain has ended.

anyway other stuff i've seen mentioned that i thought i'd tangentially add my 2 cents to:

a non-negotiable on offences in my eyes. the meta is so overinflated that you'd be hard pressed to not use it - especially given that we lost a mon in volc that both had defensive overlap with zama & acted as one of the scarier checks to it.

that being said, zama is pure cheese, lol. idk why people are using so much tera fire in a meta where ep lando is such a common first response to zama, but i think this set of tera flying is the best zama set atm. ancient set yes yes, but shit is just so many free wins against common structures. zama should eventually go (after wellspring because lol), & we should deal with the ramifications accordingly."just use a special attacker!!!" exclaim the masses. shush you're silly.

one vanilla tera blast function i've been toying about with recently has been on . Highv0ltag3 came in ou chat a few days (a week? idk time is a blur) ago crafting with some boots tera fairy knock+volt+weather ball shit along with gking. we spoke about it & i took the basic idea & adapted it to hos which i'd been working on. here is the result. long & short of it is that with tera fairy, thund acts as a hardstop to raging bolt, allows you to rkill the likes of chipped gambit in a pinch, provides some nice utility with volt absorb+ground immune+steel res etc, and breaks hard as fuck. coolest part, though, is tera blast & just how well it slots into thund. it allows thund, without investing tera(!!!), to 2hko gliscor & lando at +2, as well as ohkoing tusk with like 20% chip. i promise you people, thund-t is legit.

fuck it i'm gassing hiiiiiiiiiim. i assume we're all familiar with the epack+psyboost+spower set so i'm not covering new ground here, but in my eyes that set & sets similar to it are like, top5-10 slots for hyper offence. i've been dropping spower because i wanted to invest in my strongest move for rkilling potential & i lost like 10 games from misses vs tusk, & i already have zama obvs. tera psy obviously turns it into a straight nuke, and is a get out of jail for so many instances in which you'd be fucked otherwise. the consistency by which the mon will, in a single game, get off one epack, a spike, a knock, and then revenge kill a crucial threat is great. so much value & it deserves to be recognised as more than a fad.

have a middling squad featuring all this shit if u want.

 

[Heatranator]

Only acceptable one for me is Bulu. Koko and Fini make defensive Mons unable to use Rest. Right now Dondozo is the main thing holding the civilization of OU Meta, if Tapus come, lots of Bans will be needed.

I mean, dondozo is definetely hurt by their introduction but I don't think they would mean it can't always run rest (Dozo is literally the only thing running it, I don't think any other OU mon runs it at all). Tapu Fini is another bulky water type so it can help with that, plus dozo does appreciate it not getting statused necessarily. If you really are worried about the terrains, put a clodsire and defog corv and tapus terrains are dealt with. The terrains only are around for 5 turns which means they constantly have to switch in to prevent dozo resting which is somewhat exploitable, and defog and ice spinner remove it, so tusk helps too. If somebody builds a offense team around using tapu terrains to abuse dozo, then that's just a creative strategy though one that benches on the fact the opponent will bring dozo. Dozo already sometimes needs support to deal with physical attackers such as meow, wellspring and rilla and it would be needing that a bit more.
I don't think it will be the downfall of dozo as you are stating, maybe there will be more dozo's who don't use rest, but plenty will and it will still be a great mon, just like a slightly worse mon.

 

[MC Squared]

Tapu Fini was a blessing. Now, it may potentially be outclassed by primarina, or may do the outclassing, but it was still good. Misty surge allowed it to ignore status and not be only an alright mon with that ability. Great defense stats and defog allow it to be a good defensive mon. Though I will never understand why people used scald on it when its abilities mean running scald is mostly inferior to surf (flying types are not worth lmao).

Tapu Fini outclassed Primarina in the previous two gens. If it existed in Gen 9 it would put Primarina in UU once again

 

[arnimacarni]

Didn't Arboliva used to have a niche in OU? I swear prior to DLC1, some people were talking a bit about it and it was sitting somewhere in / near D Tier.

I was looking for weird and unviable shit and realized Arboliva is the only mon in SV that still has access to Terrain Pulse if that's something. It's a nice counterpart to Weather Ball I guess but even then the only really viable terrain is already Grass.

I guess Terrain Pulse ain't even that relevant of a move. I'm trying since new years to develop a hack with perma-weather and perma-terrain with ADV balancing (so like, nothing minmaxed and moves with lower BP) where Castform can run WBall and TPulse and has up to two types depending on weather and terrain. It's called POKEMON: TROPIUS IS GOATED EDITION and it will probably never come out. All I did thus far is copy the Ground-Fairy Milotic they have in Radical Red and then I got tired

But yeah Arboliva sucks :( have a great friday my dudes

 

[GummyRowlets]

I was looking for weird and unviable shit and realized Arboliva is the only mon in SV that still has access to Terrain Pulse if that's something. It's a nice counterpart to Weather Ball I guess but even then the only really viable terrain is already Grass.

I guess Terrain Pulse ain't even that relevant of a move. I'm trying since new years to develop a hack with perma-weather and perma-terrain with ADV balancing (so like, nothing minmaxed and moves with lower BP) where Castform can run WBall and TPulse and has up to two types depending on weather and terrain. It's called POKEMON: TROPIUS IS GOATED EDITION and it will probably never come out. All I did thus far is copy the Ground-Fairy Milotic they have in Radical Red and then I got tired

But yeah Arboliva sucks :( have a great friday my dudes

Yeah, Arbolbia sucks. Especially with Rowlet being the supreme grass type of the tier and being number 1 via usage and outclassing it in every way

 

[658Greninja]

Filling In The Icy Gap
​

With Volcarona’s ban, concerns about Kyurem have risen. It is worth noting that Volcarona was never a consistent check. Specs Draco 2HKOs Bulkrona while Boots variants tech Scale Shot or Rock Slide to hit the moth. Today I want to bring attention to some pre-existing checks to Kyurem, as well as some possible routes we could explore in the post-Volc ban meta, especially with this year’s WCOP around the corner.

Poison In The Mind
Slowking-G is often cited as a Kyurem check. It avoids a 2HKO from Specs Kyurem Ice Beam and could either status it or Chilly Reception out, while it eats Boots Kyurem’s hits more comfortably. The main counterplay to Specs Kyurem is to limit the switch-ins it gets with rocks and careful manuevering, Glowking is one of the best mons on Balance or BO to achieve that. Glowking will remain a staple on bulkier teams regardless of meta changes.

Gazing Upon The Wishing Star
If you’ve played early Gen 8 OU, you remember that SpD Clef was the most common check to Kyurem. In this metagame, SpD Clef does the same and it could be argued it has some merit in Gen 9. It can pivot into Darkrai, and check mixed Valiant, Dragapult, and Deoxys Speed. It also lets it avoid a 2HKO from Glowking Sludge Bomb, so Clef could get up Rocks, a Knock, or a T-Wave. Its Kyurem checking capabilities are still prominent, even if it Teras, a quick Tera Fire or Steel can patch that. Clefable is a mon that benefits from the controlled pace the meta has been taking lately.

A Rising Crown
On multiple occasions I’ve discussed Iron Crown. This Pokemon has recently received enough usage to be OU if tier shifts were still done each month. There’s a popular sample team that uses Crown and another factor for its higher usage is cause its quite good rn. Iron Crown is what I would describe as a more offensive version of Glowking. With Volcarona out of the tier, 98 Speed appears more impressive. Outpacing every relevant base 90 and 80 speed mon. Assault Vest checks CM Prima, Glimmora, CM Val, and more importantly, Kyurem. All while providing useful utility with Volt Switch and Future Sight. Specs can 2HKO most of the tier with Tera Steel Tachyon, and even incredibly bulky mons like Ting-Lu or Skeledirge are 3HKOd. Plus in the chance you don’t Tera, Psychic Noise/Future Sight/Psyshock and Volt Switch are still good at breaking holes. Being a Steel type also gives it ample switch-in opportunities, taking minimal chip from SR and switching into Moonblasts, Toxics, and Dracos. It fits a specific mold that Glowking and Ghold cannot, the main reason being that speed tier. Another cool thing about Crown is it anti-leads Glimmora which is incredible as it’s been receiving higher usage. I am interested to see if slower, but bulkier Iron Crown spreads develop that can tank more hits and also generate slow Volt Switches. Crown will most likely continue to rise with the absence of Volc and a projected increase in Kyurems.

Ice-Breaking Bullets
Scizor’s viability in OU is an interesting case. It has promising traits such as being neutral to Ground, boasting strong priority in Bullet Punch, and utility with Knock and U-Turn, but they were not enough to propel Scizor into OU stardom. Though we shouldn’t dismiss what it offers to teams that can fit it. It has solid matchups into mons like Valiant, Fire Punch-less Dragonite, Rillaboom, Deoxys-Speed, Grasspon, Weavile, etc. CB Tera Steel Bullet Punch is strong enough to send Roaring Moon and other offensive sweepers to the ER after some chip. Even vs bulkier teams, U-Turn and Knock can chunk through bulky targets. CB Close Combat is even strong enough to 2HKO something as bulky as physically defensive Corviknight after rocks + a single Knock Off. A couple trends have been favorable to this set in particular. Volcarona is banned, and Gliscor running more specially bulky spreads for Dragapult. As a Kyurem check, it is rather odd. Even with some bulk investment, Specs Ice Beam 2HKOs Scizor after rocks, though you do OHKO with Bullet Punch after some chip. I think the approach Scizor should go is to run more bulk so it can more reliably check Kyurem. The loss of attack investment isn’t terrible as Bullet Punch off 130 Attack is still strong vs offense. Scizor has the makings of an OU underdog, functioning vs both offense and defensive styles, but there is an argument that the lack of Roost and poor special bulk may hold it back, but we’ll see as we start May and WCOP.

Lifting The Hammer
Tinkaton has a ton of valuable traits in the metagame. Fairy/Steel is by far the best defensive typing in the game with decent special bulk to back it up. Tinkaton has found itself on different archetypes and sees decent usage in tours. Its most notable standing is on Vert’s Molt/Ting-Lu/Darkrai team. The utility she provides on builds is incredible. Encore is the most notable, being one of the more, speedy users of the move in the tier, and that compliments Tinkaton’s useful defensive typing. For example, you can bait Raging Bolt to click Dragon Pulse/Draco on your Ground type and switch into Tinkaton to Encore it. There is also Knock Off, Rocks, and T-Wave which it uses to good effect. For Gliscor, Tinkaton can run Ice Hammer to threaten decent damage against it and also Lando. Pickpocket Tinkaton also functions as a semi-Knock absorber, stealing items from Boots mons like Weavile, Dragonite, and Dragapult. You can even read a U-Turn from Cinderace and take its Boots away which is funny as shit. Mold Breaker is also another option that lets you T-Wave Garg/Ghold and Encore the latter. However everything ties to that sweet typing. Being able to switch into Kyurem, Deoxys-S and Darkrai is pivotal for many team styles that traditionally have awkward matchups into these threats. The most common Tinkatons go full-out with the speed EVs, but I’d say going bulkier with enough EVs to outrun R-Bolt could be a route we can take with Tinkaton. Here’s the spread for reference.

Tinkaton (F) @ Air Balloon/Leftovers/Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pickpocket/Mold Breaker
Tera Type: Water/Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 152 SpD / 104 Spe
Careful Nature
- Gigaton Hammer
- Knock Off/Thunder Wave
- Encore
- Stealth Rock/Knock Off/Ice Hammer

Penguin Spottings
Empoleon is interesting. If you look at this month’s 1825+ ladder usage statistics, Empoleon is seeing a surprisingly high amount of usage, sitting at 60th place and being used more than Pokemon like Serperior, Volcanion, and Rockpon. Why is that? Empoleon exhibits unique traits. Being a bulky Steel type with reliable recovery, and several good support options such as Knock Off, Flip Turn, Stealth Rocks, Haze, and Roar. It checks/soft checks Kyurem, Primarina, Walking Wake, Manaphy, Glimmora, Gholdengo, and AV Glowking. You can also tech Ice Beam over Surf to threaten an OHKO on Gliscor and also hit Grasses. Empoleon is also a Knock user that threatens most Knock absorbers with big damage, even Clefable loses due to the eventual Moonblast SpA drops causing Competitive to give it SpA boosts. Being able to check Primarina is huge because it’s one of the hardest matchups for Balance. It synergizes with Pokemon like SD Gliscor, Ting-Lu, Grasspon, and Darkrai, either complementing them defensively or Flip Turning into them safely. Empoleon isn’t amazing though. It has difficulties fitting all the utility it wants, it’s a Water type without a Fire resistance, and you 100% need to pair it with something that checks Wogre because its a free switch-in for it.

An Old Gen Fable
Jirachi was a pillar of old gen OU, functioning as a bulky and annoying asf Steel type. Even with power creep hitting the later gens, Rachi still found viability in its SpD utility and Scarf sets, checking Pokemon like the Lati twins, Tapu Lele, and Magearna. Unfortunately it would find no niche as power creep finally caught up to it in Gen 8. In SV OU, Rachi may find a small niche as a check to threatening mons like Kyurem, CM Primarina, and Raging Bolt due to great special bulk + Encore to shut down setup. It also has some utility with U-Turn, Rocks, Wish, and Healing Wish. Not to mention Iron Head flinches will never not be annoying as shit, so Rachi can find something to do in this metagame. The big selling factor is being a Kyurem check. However Rachi is not fond of a meta dominated by Darks, Ghosts, and competition from other Steels. It also can’t fit all these utility moves at once. Though there is an interesting route to explore with it.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 204 SpD / 56 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Wish/U-Turn/Psychic Noise/Body Slam
- Protect/Stealth Rock/Healing Wish
- Encore

Don’t use these
These are just meme picks I included for fun. The problem with these are that they check Kyurem, but don’t do anything else of note. Yes, Bronzong hard checks Kyurem and BU Tusk, but you’re also using a mon that’s vulnerable and easy switch ins for a ton of OU threats like Wogre. Copperajah is an NU role compressor with Rocks, Knock Off and Whirlwind, but doesn’t check anything besides Kyurem. There’s also the fact you’re using Copperajah. Registeel has incredible stats and potential with the Crit-Me-Not sets, but it lost some of its good moves like Toxic and Seismic Toss but sure Game Freak, buff Urshifu cause it 100% needed Swords Dance. The Crit-Me-Not sets are extremely matchup reliant. Walled by Ghosts, beaten by Encore, phazing, Taunt, or Unaware walls.

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Gyro Ball
- Future Sight/Psychic Noise
- Earthquake

Copperajah @ Leftovers
Ability: Sheer Force
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Whirlwind

Registeel @ Mental Herb/Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
Tera Type: Flying/Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Iron Defense
- Amnesia
- Body Press
- Rest

Bonus Entry

Old Dogs Learn New Tricks

Zamazenta @ Leftovers
Ability: Dauntless Shield
Tera Type: Dark/Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 56 Def / 176 SpD / 28 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Crunch/Heavy Slam
- Rest/Roar/Substitute

Behold, the jankiest looking Zama spread ever. That’s right, Specially Defensive Zamazenta. In a nutshell, this is ev’d to live 2 Specs Ice Beams from Kyurem after spikes and scare it out while speed creeping it. In return, you are also better at switching into Darkrai and your matchups vs Ghold, Pult, and specially offensive Fairies improve. However you become much worse into Wogre who outspeeds and OHKOs you at +2. If it worth losing to Wogre just to not get 2HKOd by Specs Kyurem? Maybe. After all, these are just possible options we have to directly check Kyurem. What are your thoughts?​

 

[tigers jaw]

my thoughts are, that as ever, the supposed answers to kyurem are unreliable into specs alone (tera obviously exacerbates this issue). on the other hand, kyurem is most pressed in an offensive metagame such as this one, though volc’s ban eases this up a little.

the question is, whether or not the metagame can be considered valid as is, which many disagree with, & to what degree does kyurem shape the metagame into what it is, thus potentially being a malign presence.

 

[GummyRowlets]

View attachment 630267
Filling In The Icy Gap
​

With Volcarona’s ban, concerns about Kyurem have risen. It is worth noting that Volcarona was never a consistent check. Specs Draco 2HKOs Bulkrona while Boots variants tech Scale Shot or Rock Slide to hit the moth. Today I want to bring attention to some pre-existing checks to Kyurem, as well as some possible routes we could explore in the post-Volc ban meta, especially with this year’s WCOP around the corner.

View attachment 630269
Poison In The Mind
Slowking-G is often cited as a Kyurem check. It avoids a 2HKO from Specs Kyurem Ice Beam and could either status it or Chilly Reception out, while it eats Boots Kyurem’s hits more comfortably. The main counterplay to Specs Kyurem is to limit the switch-ins it gets with rocks and careful manuevering, Glowking is one of the best mons on Balance or BO to achieve that. Glowking will remain a staple on bulkier teams regardless of meta changes.


View attachment 630270
Gazing Upon The Wishing Star
If you’ve played early Gen 8 OU, you remember that SpD Clef was the most common check to Kyurem. In this metagame, SpD Clef does the same and it could be argued it has some merit in Gen 9. It can pivot into Darkrai, and check mixed Valiant, Dragapult, and Deoxys Speed. It also lets it avoid a 2HKO from Glowking Sludge Bomb, so Clef could get up Rocks, a Knock, or a T-Wave. Its Kyurem checking capabilities are still prominent, even if it Teras, a quick Tera Fire or Steel can patch that. Clefable is a mon that benefits from the controlled pace the meta has been taking lately.


View attachment 630271
A Rising Crown
On multiple occasions I’ve discussed Iron Crown. This Pokemon has recently received enough usage to be OU if tier shifts were still done each month. There’s a popular sample team that uses Crown and another factor for its higher usage is cause its quite good rn. Iron Crown is what I would describe as a more offensive version of Glowking. With Volcarona out of the tier, 98 Speed appears more impressive. Outpacing every relevant base 90 and 80 speed mon. Assault Vest checks CM Prima, Glimmora, CM Val, and more importantly, Kyurem. All while providing useful utility with Volt Switch and Future Sight. Specs can 2HKO most of the tier with Tera Steel Tachyon, and even incredibly bulky mons like Ting-Lu or Skeledirge are 3HKOd. Plus in the chance you don’t Tera, Psychic Noise/Future Sight/Psyshock and Volt Switch are still good at breaking holes. Being a Steel type also gives it ample switch-in opportunities, taking minimal chip from SR and switching into Moonblasts, Toxics, and Dracos. It fits a specific mold that Glowking and Ghold cannot, the main reason being that speed tier. Another cool thing about Crown is it anti-leads Glimmora which is incredible as it’s been receiving higher usage. I am interested to see if slower, but bulkier Iron Crown spreads develop that can tank more hits and also generate slow Volt Switches. Crown will most likely continue to rise with the absence of Volc and a projected increase in Kyurems.


View attachment 630272
Ice-Breaking Bullets
Scizor’s viability in OU is an interesting case. It has promising traits such as being neutral to Ground, boasting strong priority in Bullet Punch, and utility with Knock and U-Turn, but they were not enough to propel Scizor into OU stardom. Though we shouldn’t dismiss what it offers to teams that can fit it. It has solid matchups into mons like Valiant, Fire Punch-less Dragonite, Rillaboom, Deoxys-Speed, Grasspon, Weavile, etc. CB Tera Steel Bullet Punch is strong enough to send Roaring Moon and other offensive sweepers to the ER after some chip. Even vs bulkier teams, U-Turn and Knock can chunk through bulky targets. CB Close Combat is even strong enough to 2HKO something as bulky as physically defensive Corviknight after rocks + a single Knock Off. A couple trends have been favorable to this set in particular. Volcarona is banned, and Gliscor running more specially bulky spreads for Dragapult. As a Kyurem check, it is rather odd. Even with some bulk investment, Specs Ice Beam 2HKOs Scizor after rocks, though you do OHKO with Bullet Punch after some chip. I think the approach Scizor should go is to run more bulk so it can more reliably check Kyurem. The loss of attack investment isn’t terrible as Bullet Punch off 130 Attack is still strong vs offense. Scizor has the makings of an OU underdog, functioning vs both offense and defensive styles, but there is an argument that the lack of Roost and poor special bulk may hold it back, but we’ll see as we start May and WCOP.


View attachment 630273
Lifting The Hammer
Tinkaton has a ton of valuable traits in the metagame. Fairy/Steel is by far the best defensive typing in the game with decent special bulk to back it up. Tinkaton has found itself on different archetypes and sees decent usage in tours. Its most notable standing is on Vert’s Molt/Ting-Lu/Darkrai team. The utility she provides on builds is incredible. Encore is the most notable, being one of the more, speedy users of the move in the tier, and that compliments Tinkaton’s useful defensive typing. For example, you can bait Raging Bolt to click Dragon Pulse/Draco on your Ground type and switch into Tinkaton to Encore it. There is also Knock Off, Rocks, and T-Wave which it uses to good effect. For Gliscor, Tinkaton can run Ice Hammer to threaten decent damage against it and also Lando. Pickpocket Tinkaton also functions as a semi-Knock absorber, stealing items from Boots mons like Weavile, Dragonite, and Dragapult. You can even read a U-Turn from Cinderace and take its Boots away which is funny as shit. Mold Breaker is also another option that lets you T-Wave Garg/Ghold and Encore the latter. However everything ties to that sweet typing. Being able to switch into Kyurem, Deoxys-S and Darkrai is pivotal for many team styles that traditionally have awkward matchups into these threats. The most common Tinkatons go full-out with the speed EVs, but I’d say going bulkier with enough EVs to outrun R-Bolt could be a route we can take with Tinkaton. Here’s the spread for reference.

Tinkaton (F) @ Air Balloon/Leftovers/Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pickpocket/Mold Breaker
Tera Type: Water/Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 152 SpD / 104 Spe
Careful Nature
- Gigaton Hammer
- Knock Off/Thunder Wave
- Encore
- Stealth Rock/Knock Off/Ice Hammer

View attachment 630274
Penguin Spottings
Empoleon is interesting. If you look at this month’s 1825+ ladder usage statistics, Empoleon is seeing a surprisingly high amount of usage, sitting at 60th place and being used more than Pokemon like Serperior, Volcanion, and Rockpon. Why is that? Empoleon exhibits unique traits. Being a bulky Steel type with reliable recovery, and several good support options such as Knock Off, Flip Turn, Stealth Rocks, Haze, and Roar. It checks/soft checks Kyurem, Primarina, Walking Wake, Manaphy, Glimmora, Gholdengo, and AV Glowking. You can also tech Ice Beam over Surf to threaten an OHKO on Gliscor and also hit Grasses. Empoleon is also a Knock user that threatens most Knock absorbers with big damage, even Clefable loses due to the eventual Moonblast SpA drops causing Competitive to give it SpA boosts. Being able to check Primarina is huge because it’s one of the hardest matchups for Balance. It synergizes with Pokemon like SD Gliscor, Ting-Lu, Grasspon, and Darkrai, either complementing them defensively or Flip Turning into them safely. Empoleon isn’t amazing though. It has difficulties fitting all the utility it wants, it’s a Water type without a Fire resistance, and you 100% need to pair it with something that checks Wogre because its a free switch-in for it.


View attachment 630276
An Old Gen Fable
Jirachi was a pillar of old gen OU, functioning as a bulky and annoying asf Steel type. Even with power creep hitting the later gens, Rachi still found viability in its SpD utility and Scarf sets, checking Pokemon like the Lati twins, Tapu Lele, and Magearna. Unfortunately it would find no niche as power creep finally caught up to it in Gen 8. In SV OU, Rachi may find a small niche as a check to threatening mons like Kyurem, CM Primarina, and Raging Bolt due to great special bulk + Encore to shut down setup. It also has some utility with U-Turn, Rocks, Wish, and Healing Wish. Not to mention Iron Head flinches will never not be annoying as shit, so Rachi can find something to do in this metagame. The big selling factor is being a Kyurem check. However Rachi is not fond of a meta dominated by Darks, Ghosts, and competition from other Steels. It also can’t fit all these utility moves at once. Though there is an interesting route to explore with it.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 204 SpD / 56 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Wish/U-Turn/Psychic Noise/Body Slam
- Protect/Stealth Rock/Healing Wish
- Encore

View attachment 630277View attachment 630278View attachment 630279
Don’t use these
These are just meme picks I included for fun. The problem with these are that they check Kyurem, but don’t do anything else of note. Yes, Bronzong hard checks Kyurem and BU Tusk, but you’re also using a mon that’s vulnerable and easy switch ins for a ton of OU threats like Wogre. Copperajah is an NU role compressor with Rocks, Knock Off and Whirlwind, but doesn’t check anything besides Kyurem. There’s also the fact you’re using Copperajah. Registeel has incredible stats and potential with the Crit-Me-Not sets, but it lost some of its good moves like Toxic and Seismic Toss but sure Game Freak, buff Urshifu cause it 100% needed Swords Dance. The Crit-Me-Not sets are extremely matchup reliant. Walled by Ghosts, beaten by Encore, phazing, Taunt, or Unaware walls.

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Gyro Ball
- Future Sight/Psychic Noise
- Earthquake

Copperajah @ Leftovers
Ability: Sheer Force
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Whirlwind

Registeel @ Mental Herb/Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
Tera Type: Flying/Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Iron Defense
- Amnesia
- Body Press
- Rest

Bonus Entry


View attachment 630283
Old Dogs Learn New Tricks

Zamazenta @ Leftovers
Ability: Dauntless Shield
Tera Type: Dark/Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 56 Def / 176 SpD / 28 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Crunch/Heavy Slam
- Rest/Roar/Substitute

Behold, the jankiest looking Zama spread ever. That’s right, Specially Defensive Zamazenta. In a nutshell, this is ev’d to live 2 Specs Ice Beams from Kyurem after spikes and scare it out while speed creeping it. In return, you are also better at switching into Darkrai and your matchups vs Ghold, Pult, and specially offensive Fairies improve. However you become much worse into Wogre who outspeeds and OHKOs you at +2. If it worth losing to Wogre just to not get 2HKOd by Specs Kyurem? Maybe. After all, these are just possible options we have to directly check Kyurem. What are your thoughts?​

Just something I wanted to bring up but both Glowking and AV Iron Crown aren't perfect. Despite being able to tank a draco/ ice stab, they will take heavy damage from earth power.
- 252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power (90 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 184-218 (55.9 - 66.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power (90 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Slowking-Galar: 200-236 (50.8 - 60%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
They still function as checks since you can still pivot out on ground-type attacks with a pokemon like Lando, Gliscor, Corviknight, or more but just wanted to say they aren't 100% safe if you get predicted. Kyurem can also BS you with freeze, which has happened to me more times than I'd wish to admit. My overall opinion of Kyurem is mixed. Against most balances, it feel busted if it specs yet there are still some ways of answering on balance, mainly just outspending with its poor speed tier with something like Pult or valiant. Against more offensive teams, it can struggle since dragon/ice isn't good at all defensively meaning it can't trade with mons like valaint, gouging, prim (if calm mind), and more. Against stall, it can be very good but you need to play slowly when against Blissey. It doesn't seem broken but the lack of reliable defensive answers may be enough for a ban since nothing can truly answer all of its stabs having the fabled ice/ ground coverage that's notorious of how many mons it can hit in the meta for neutral/ super effective answers

 

[Bold School]

View attachment 630267
Filling In The Icy Gap
​

With Volcarona’s ban, concerns about Kyurem have risen. It is worth noting that Volcarona was never a consistent check. Specs Draco 2HKOs Bulkrona while Boots variants tech Scale Shot or Rock Slide to hit the moth. Today I want to bring attention to some pre-existing checks to Kyurem, as well as some possible routes we could explore in the post-Volc ban meta, especially with this year’s WCOP around the corner.

View attachment 630269
Poison In The Mind
Slowking-G is often cited as a Kyurem check. It avoids a 2HKO from Specs Kyurem Ice Beam and could either status it or Chilly Reception out, while it eats Boots Kyurem’s hits more comfortably. The main counterplay to Specs Kyurem is to limit the switch-ins it gets with rocks and careful manuevering, Glowking is one of the best mons on Balance or BO to achieve that. Glowking will remain a staple on bulkier teams regardless of meta changes.


View attachment 630270
Gazing Upon The Wishing Star
If you’ve played early Gen 8 OU, you remember that SpD Clef was the most common check to Kyurem. In this metagame, SpD Clef does the same and it could be argued it has some merit in Gen 9. It can pivot into Darkrai, and check mixed Valiant, Dragapult, and Deoxys Speed. It also lets it avoid a 2HKO from Glowking Sludge Bomb, so Clef could get up Rocks, a Knock, or a T-Wave. Its Kyurem checking capabilities are still prominent, even if it Teras, a quick Tera Fire or Steel can patch that. Clefable is a mon that benefits from the controlled pace the meta has been taking lately.


View attachment 630271
A Rising Crown
On multiple occasions I’ve discussed Iron Crown. This Pokemon has recently received enough usage to be OU if tier shifts were still done each month. There’s a popular sample team that uses Crown and another factor for its higher usage is cause its quite good rn. Iron Crown is what I would describe as a more offensive version of Glowking. With Volcarona out of the tier, 98 Speed appears more impressive. Outpacing every relevant base 90 and 80 speed mon. Assault Vest checks CM Prima, Glimmora, CM Val, and more importantly, Kyurem. All while providing useful utility with Volt Switch and Future Sight. Specs can 2HKO most of the tier with Tera Steel Tachyon, and even incredibly bulky mons like Ting-Lu or Skeledirge are 3HKOd. Plus in the chance you don’t Tera, Psychic Noise/Future Sight/Psyshock and Volt Switch are still good at breaking holes. Being a Steel type also gives it ample switch-in opportunities, taking minimal chip from SR and switching into Moonblasts, Toxics, and Dracos. It fits a specific mold that Glowking and Ghold cannot, the main reason being that speed tier. Another cool thing about Crown is it anti-leads Glimmora which is incredible as it’s been receiving higher usage. I am interested to see if slower, but bulkier Iron Crown spreads develop that can tank more hits and also generate slow Volt Switches. Crown will most likely continue to rise with the absence of Volc and a projected increase in Kyurems.


View attachment 630272
Ice-Breaking Bullets
Scizor’s viability in OU is an interesting case. It has promising traits such as being neutral to Ground, boasting strong priority in Bullet Punch, and utility with Knock and U-Turn, but they were not enough to propel Scizor into OU stardom. Though we shouldn’t dismiss what it offers to teams that can fit it. It has solid matchups into mons like Valiant, Fire Punch-less Dragonite, Rillaboom, Deoxys-Speed, Grasspon, Weavile, etc. CB Tera Steel Bullet Punch is strong enough to send Roaring Moon and other offensive sweepers to the ER after some chip. Even vs bulkier teams, U-Turn and Knock can chunk through bulky targets. CB Close Combat is even strong enough to 2HKO something as bulky as physically defensive Corviknight after rocks + a single Knock Off. A couple trends have been favorable to this set in particular. Volcarona is banned, and Gliscor running more specially bulky spreads for Dragapult. As a Kyurem check, it is rather odd. Even with some bulk investment, Specs Ice Beam 2HKOs Scizor after rocks, though you do OHKO with Bullet Punch after some chip. I think the approach Scizor should go is to run more bulk so it can more reliably check Kyurem. The loss of attack investment isn’t terrible as Bullet Punch off 130 Attack is still strong vs offense. Scizor has the makings of an OU underdog, functioning vs both offense and defensive styles, but there is an argument that the lack of Roost and poor special bulk may hold it back, but we’ll see as we start May and WCOP.


View attachment 630273
Lifting The Hammer
Tinkaton has a ton of valuable traits in the metagame. Fairy/Steel is by far the best defensive typing in the game with decent special bulk to back it up. Tinkaton has found itself on different archetypes and sees decent usage in tours. Its most notable standing is on Vert’s Molt/Ting-Lu/Darkrai team. The utility she provides on builds is incredible. Encore is the most notable, being one of the more, speedy users of the move in the tier, and that compliments Tinkaton’s useful defensive typing. For example, you can bait Raging Bolt to click Dragon Pulse/Draco on your Ground type and switch into Tinkaton to Encore it. There is also Knock Off, Rocks, and T-Wave which it uses to good effect. For Gliscor, Tinkaton can run Ice Hammer to threaten decent damage against it and also Lando. Pickpocket Tinkaton also functions as a semi-Knock absorber, stealing items from Boots mons like Weavile, Dragonite, and Dragapult. You can even read a U-Turn from Cinderace and take its Boots away which is funny as shit. Mold Breaker is also another option that lets you T-Wave Garg/Ghold and Encore the latter. However everything ties to that sweet typing. Being able to switch into Kyurem, Deoxys-S and Darkrai is pivotal for many team styles that traditionally have awkward matchups into these threats. The most common Tinkatons go full-out with the speed EVs, but I’d say going bulkier with enough EVs to outrun R-Bolt could be a route we can take with Tinkaton. Here’s the spread for reference.

Tinkaton (F) @ Air Balloon/Leftovers/Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pickpocket/Mold Breaker
Tera Type: Water/Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 152 SpD / 104 Spe
Careful Nature
- Gigaton Hammer
- Knock Off/Thunder Wave
- Encore
- Stealth Rock/Knock Off/Ice Hammer

View attachment 630274
Penguin Spottings
Empoleon is interesting. If you look at this month’s 1825+ ladder usage statistics, Empoleon is seeing a surprisingly high amount of usage, sitting at 60th place and being used more than Pokemon like Serperior, Volcanion, and Rockpon. Why is that? Empoleon exhibits unique traits. Being a bulky Steel type with reliable recovery, and several good support options such as Knock Off, Flip Turn, Stealth Rocks, Haze, and Roar. It checks/soft checks Kyurem, Primarina, Walking Wake, Manaphy, Glimmora, Gholdengo, and AV Glowking. You can also tech Ice Beam over Surf to threaten an OHKO on Gliscor and also hit Grasses. Empoleon is also a Knock user that threatens most Knock absorbers with big damage, even Clefable loses due to the eventual Moonblast SpA drops causing Competitive to give it SpA boosts. Being able to check Primarina is huge because it’s one of the hardest matchups for Balance. It synergizes with Pokemon like SD Gliscor, Ting-Lu, Grasspon, and Darkrai, either complementing them defensively or Flip Turning into them safely. Empoleon isn’t amazing though. It has difficulties fitting all the utility it wants, it’s a Water type without a Fire resistance, and you 100% need to pair it with something that checks Wogre because its a free switch-in for it.


View attachment 630276
An Old Gen Fable
Jirachi was a pillar of old gen OU, functioning as a bulky and annoying asf Steel type. Even with power creep hitting the later gens, Rachi still found viability in its SpD utility and Scarf sets, checking Pokemon like the Lati twins, Tapu Lele, and Magearna. Unfortunately it would find no niche as power creep finally caught up to it in Gen 8. In SV OU, Rachi may find a small niche as a check to threatening mons like Kyurem, CM Primarina, and Raging Bolt due to great special bulk + Encore to shut down setup. It also has some utility with U-Turn, Rocks, Wish, and Healing Wish. Not to mention Iron Head flinches will never not be annoying as shit, so Rachi can find something to do in this metagame. The big selling factor is being a Kyurem check. However Rachi is not fond of a meta dominated by Darks, Ghosts, and competition from other Steels. It also can’t fit all these utility moves at once. Though there is an interesting route to explore with it.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 204 SpD / 56 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Wish/U-Turn/Psychic Noise/Body Slam
- Protect/Stealth Rock/Healing Wish
- Encore

View attachment 630277View attachment 630278View attachment 630279
Don’t use these
These are just meme picks I included for fun. The problem with these are that they check Kyurem, but don’t do anything else of note. Yes, Bronzong hard checks Kyurem and BU Tusk, but you’re also using a mon that’s vulnerable and easy switch ins for a ton of OU threats like Wogre. Copperajah is an NU role compressor with Rocks, Knock Off and Whirlwind, but doesn’t check anything besides Kyurem. There’s also the fact you’re using Copperajah. Registeel has incredible stats and potential with the Crit-Me-Not sets, but it lost some of its good moves like Toxic and Seismic Toss but sure Game Freak, buff Urshifu cause it 100% needed Swords Dance. The Crit-Me-Not sets are extremely matchup reliant. Walled by Ghosts, beaten by Encore, phazing, Taunt, or Unaware walls.

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Gyro Ball
- Future Sight/Psychic Noise
- Earthquake

Copperajah @ Leftovers
Ability: Sheer Force
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Whirlwind

Registeel @ Mental Herb/Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
Tera Type: Flying/Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Iron Defense
- Amnesia
- Body Press
- Rest

Bonus Entry


View attachment 630283
Old Dogs Learn New Tricks

Zamazenta @ Leftovers
Ability: Dauntless Shield
Tera Type: Dark/Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 56 Def / 176 SpD / 28 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Crunch/Heavy Slam
- Rest/Roar/Substitute

Behold, the jankiest looking Zama spread ever. That’s right, Specially Defensive Zamazenta. In a nutshell, this is ev’d to live 2 Specs Ice Beams from Kyurem after spikes and scare it out while speed creeping it. In return, you are also better at switching into Darkrai and your matchups vs Ghold, Pult, and specially offensive Fairies improve. However you become much worse into Wogre who outspeeds and OHKOs you at +2. If it worth losing to Wogre just to not get 2HKOd by Specs Kyurem? Maybe. After all, these are just possible options we have to directly check Kyurem. What are your thoughts?​

Good post. But I'm not seeing much in the way of Fire types here. You'd think something like Iron Moth and maybe even H-Arcanine would get a look to fill that void on more offensive teams the way Volc used to. Ceruledge also has surprisingly decent special defense, the ability to heal with Bitter Blade, and Shadow Sneak priority to maybe finish it off.

For more defensive Fire types. Skeledirge and Incineroar make some sense. Heatran makes sense as a situational check if you can deal with Earth Power. Volcanion can double resist Ice moves without being specifically weak to Freeze Dry.

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

If it worth losing to Wogre just to not get 2HKOd by Specs Kyurem?​

i can think of a solution where you don't have to worry about either of them but we gotta wait until the post-volc meta settles so we can get the support for it

 

[pixelpenguin]

H-Zoroark is a bit trickier for me to figure out. My best guess is it would probably want Choice Specs for the power. I think the main niche would be the double surprise factor. You are surprised once by Illusion, maybe, and then Tera Blast switching type could mess with what the initial check should be. There is the possibility of mixed attacking, but this might be harder to justify on a choice locked set.

I think boots utility might be better. Scare some mons with Illusion, get some cheeky knocks and u-turns, maybe surprise Gambit with tera blast fighting.

Maybe like Shadow Ball/Tera Blast/Knock/U-turn, but mind you this doesn't sound amazing. Especially with almost 0 actual defensive utility.

 

[SittinGamer]

H-Zoro really seems like a fun mon, especially with that Tera Blast tech. I could see either Nasty Plot 3 attacks or all coverage being decent but you'd basically need boots to stay hidden or removal to use an item like expert belt or a choice item. I've been wanting to experiment with it for a while and wonder what teammates could go well with it to try and lure normal/ghost/fighting moves.

Only thing is I feel it's kinda strictly outclassed by Darkrai at doing almost exactly the same thing just without the memes, so maybe it would needed some pre dlc2 magic.

 

[DaRotomMachine]

Just something I wanted to bring up but both Glowking and AV Iron Crown aren't perfect. Despite being able to tank a draco/ ice stab, they will take heavy damage from earth power.
- 252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power (90 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 184-218 (55.9 - 66.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power (90 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Slowking-Galar: 200-236 (50.8 - 60%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
They still function as checks since you can still pivot out on ground-type attacks with a pokemon like Lando, Gliscor, Corviknight, or more but just wanted to say they aren't 100% safe if you get predicted. Kyurem can also BS you with freeze, which has happened to me more times than I'd wish to admit. My overall opinion of Kyurem is mixed. Against most balances, it feel busted if it specs yet there are still some ways of answering on balance, mainly just outspending with its poor speed tier with something like Pult or valiant. Against more offensive teams, it can struggle since dragon/ice isn't good at all defensively meaning it can't trade with mons like valaint, gouging, prim (if calm mind), and more. Against stall, it can be very good but you need to play slowly when against Blissey. It doesn't seem broken but the lack of reliable defensive answers may be enough for a ban since nothing can truly answer all of its stabs having the fabled ice/ ground coverage that's notorious of how many mons it can hit in the meta for neutral/ super effective answers

I think thats what a Check means, if i'm correct?

 

[tigers jaw]

I think thats what a Check means, if i'm correct?

they are technically checks, yes, but they’re shaky at best. a sturdier example of a check, would be dragapult switching in one time vs. urshifu-r in g8. bar, say, random cb ice punch, which people didn’t really run, you could 100% switch in once and threaten it out.

you can pivot around kyurem with the likes of slowking-g, but if you take an earth power/tera ice ice beam, you are instead the one forced out. the next time you switch in, you will be 2hkod by ice beam, for example.