Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4

Well deoxys speed is absurd as predicted.
it has a variety of sets and trick scarf is suprisingly reliable against many common leads currently allowing it to easily get up hazards and fuck with other leads
 
Alright.
I finished the doc, got out a bit to see what the sunlight was again, made some food, hit the gym, showered and had a glass of water. Now back to this game.
This is OU, so I won't be saying anything about big LT staples that got hard nerfed (
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), only go in what I feel can be OU tournament-viable options.

Quik shoutouts to those guys:
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Good setups opportunities with Tera, just hitting decently hard, or providing alternatives in terms of Rocks or Webs. Could maybe build around Rhyp/Coba soon, I'll have to wait for the meta to calm, but cool new additions.

Same for this bois:
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New options for weathers, setups, also good checking presence from Tias/Cune, and the Hazards from both Deos are gonna be annoying, but they lost Seismic, at least, I guess. Just don't want to expand further on those..

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I don't really know what to think about Keldeo, but it's bound to shake up the fat teams, that's for sure. Checking this will be easier than it seems tho thanks to the Clef/Hatt/Reus of the meta.

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This is my 'I think there's very interesting potential but don't know yet how it will playout' crew.
I think for one that Reu is amazing, setups destroy bulky teams, and Magic Guard patching Gliscor + Garg is clearly awesome in negating flaws in your team structure. And it can now Tera to get rid of this awful typing.
Dura ++ seems interesting. I think it will struggle against fatter team, but fair well against Offense? Don't really know yet but it looks promising, might downgrade to the Cobalion range above, but we'll see.
Think Necky-Raikou will be interesting, not as strong as people might expect (comparing it to Gambit's un-immunized Sucker and stupid Fallen is something I can't even begin to understand), but it will undeniably be usable, and very probably good.
I have fate in Hydraplin, seems like a decent answer to things once the meta will calm down a bit, not passive, can play Eject, probably Boots, very cool in to Garg, definitely a Mon I'd like to build around.
Boulder seems way stronger than people can give it credit for, Booster Attack is no joke, and Booster Speed allows you to spec into Bulk, and use SD sets, seems very solid, and clearly what Leaves would have liked to be.
I think Pert will fill out a nice niche with Rocks Koff Flip once the meta settles, we'll see.

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Tios getting Flip and Tera is a great thing for it. Might have flashbacks from BDSP's Tios, but he should be manageable here, even tho setups will be annoying early on in cheesy HOs.

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... Uuuugh... Again...? To be fair I'll wait to see how it fairs in the metagame, but I was hoping the end of stupid Acro sets after the ban of Sneasler :eeveehide:

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I think Drill be good, very good even. Definitely not as much as when Tyranitar was a good Mon, and Tusk did not exist, but a good one nonetheless, Mold Breaker to SR on Hatt, and ignore Unaware Dozo, makes it quite a superior option than what people give it credit for.

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... Yeah so we'll see how the meta goes. Quite a lot of options have been added, so I hope it somehow patches it out? I guess?

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Such a hard mess to figure out, both in Draft and in here. So yeah, it has a lot of very unfair advantages, be it its unique 'keep STAB Stellar all game' thing, its god movepool, and superb stats in Tera. But yeah the lack of Recovery might be its downfall, giving it effectively zero ability through the game, in a Spikes/SRs infected metagame, where you have to run Boots to even try to have an ability. Seems like such an interesting Mon, I don't think it will be banned, but who knows, I'm very blurry on this one.

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This thing will be soooo interesting to build with. Best two moves in this meta are Trick and Koff, such a powerhouse doesn't always need Specs/Setup, and I think the boots four attacks with Koff will be one of the best sets, and will help immensely getting ride of some Gliscors/Garg/Ting/Dos, by baiting them in and taking the Koff/Damage on them, fastening immensly the game. For such an option to be on the lookout for.

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A decent check to Valiant/Enam is back, it's been a while. I'm excited to see it back in the meta, we'll have to see how it goes for it in a meta with Gliscor.

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The only man happy with Gliscor being back. I think it will be too much with DD Scale Icicle Loaded, but losing Roost and thus Sub sets is such a big nerf that it could single handedly keep it OU. Will have to see, but Veil teams with this thing are no different and better than with Bax.

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Immensely overhyped. You guys do realize that it getting coverage does not make an insane difference outside of Draft compared to HP, right? Like, it will be the same dilemna around playing Ground or Fire if you want to hit Tran, Corv, Zor, etc. The new Tera is cool for it, but you want to spam Leaf Storm more than Tera Blast, so... yeah I think this is a good one as always, just a tad overhyped.

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Don't know how this could even stay in the metagame. Tera Blaziken sounds like a nightmare emerging from the abysses. Maybe I'm wrong, as it will have a harder time now than ever before to setup, with Tusk and the likes reigning in the tier, and CC exposing it to Sucker Gambit, but SD Speed Boost Blazi is for me the strongest addition of this DLC.

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Silver medal going to this fella. Proto Attack under Sun, Sun Boosted Flare Blitz, with DD, will have a though time being switched on.

+1 252+ Atk Protosynthesis Entei Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 192+ Def Toxapex in Sun: 160-189 (52.6 - 62.1%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery.
+1 252+ Atk Protosynthesis Entei Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 156+ Def Garganacl in Sun: 185-218 (45.7 - 53.9%) -- 3.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery.
+1 252+ Atk Protosynthesis Entei Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Great Tusk in Sun: 264-312 (60.8 - 71.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery.

This is just random calcs, but a resisted move doing this much to Pex/Garg with just +1 goes to show that this thing will be though to handle imo, retaining a decent Speed while Adamant, and having the DD Speed Boost for that. It basically will run DD Flare Blitz Fire Protect and EQ most of the time, but it can also opt for Morning Sun instead of the Tect, as it will be 75% under Sun. This thing clearly can play Band also, and will probably be on par with Wake under Sun. Outside, without Koff and pivoting, it's hard for it to be as relevant.

I'll maybe edit this post or do another about the new Tera, but that's basically it for now, for me. Have some nice games everyone, and enjoy the DLC as much as possible, during those early stages of the metagame :blobthumbsup:

Let's make this Gen the very best, like not one ever was :bloblul:

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first impressions:
  • terapagos-stellar is completely insane. i'm talking screaming, limbs flailing, speaking in tongues, straitjacket-and-padded-room full-on insane. the only thing i've seen that can realistically beat terapagos-stellar is another terapagos-stellar
  • based on my experience so far, hypnosis + nplot + dpulse + fairyblast darkrai has been exactly as bullshit as i said it would be and is the only reason you should ever tera anything besides terapagos right now
  • deoxys-speed has been on literally every team i've seen or even heard about. deo-d has zero place here right now because everyone is running deo-s
  • surprisingly, the only person i've seen running kyurem is myself. it's wrecking shit with veiltales support, though
  • also surprisingly, iron boulder isn't performing quite as well as i thought. it suffers from an iffy matchup against gambit and nothing against ghold, both of which seem to still be quite popular. it's also outsped by darkrai if you aren't running booster speed, and the previous two mentioned mons force it out a lot and make it lose booster speed. not in a great place right now it seems
  • i've only played like 5 battles so far (because it dropped half an hour ago and i spent most of that half-hour doing other stuff) so i have no clue whether these assessments will prove valid overall. except for terapagos-stellar being broken, that i'm staying strong on
 
Just want to say that I am happy there is a new thread, and thank you to the council for all your hard work thus far this generation!!!

So far, I don't really know what to say about all these new toys.
I'm excited to see the intelligent discourse discussion that is guaranteed to arise in the coming weeks.
Volcarona is free! Long live the Fire Moth!
Roaring Moon is free! Long live Mega Salamance-Scarlet!
Darkrai is free! Long live... nightmares(Seriously, what is Darkrai supposed to "be"?)

I fully condone and accept any and all tiering action taken by the council or otherwise in the coming weeks!

And most importantly, Gouging Fire is Sun Team's Dracovish have fun everyone!!
 
Talking about this gen. Although I'd say there's a case that early gen 9 OU had things just as ridiculous (FM, Palafin, IB, Chi-Yu) or uncompetitive (Shed Tail, Espathra)

None of those were as unanimously despised to the point they got 100% of a ban vote like Skymin did, so nah. Like, thats nott a thing that happens almost ever with OU ban votes lol
 
Just want to say that I am happy there is a new thread, and thank you to the council for all your hard work thus far this generation!!!

So far, I don't really know what to say about all these new toys.
I'm excited to see the intelligent discourse discussion that is guaranteed to arise in the coming weeks.
Volcarona is free! Long live the Fire Moth!
Roaring Moon is free! Long live Mega Salamance-Scarlet!
Darkrai is free! Long live... nightmares(Seriously, what is Darkrai supposed to "be"?)

I fully condone and accept any and all tiering action taken by the council or otherwise in the coming weeks!

And most importantly, Gouging Fire is Sun Team's Dracovish have fun everyone!!
In the few games I've played, Roaring Moon seems to be just as ridiculous as it was in DLC1. Although maybe as the meta stabilizes and there's more room for defensive counterplay it might be more manageable.
 
if you are complaining about a ban within the first hour of a metagame being playable, perhaps consider being normal and just clicking the fun, colorful buttons

thanks.

Taking bets on how well this is gonna age.

Door swings both ways. It's entirely possible that everyone is overreacting. It is equally if not more possible that one hour is all it takes to realize that something needs to be shown the door.
 
if you are complaining about a ban within the first hour of a metagame being playable, perhaps consider being normal and just clicking the fun, colorful buttons

thanks.
oh i ain't complaining, just making some observations. i'm enjoying the chaos and just slapping things on teams for now, it's been fun. i agree that there's no need to get all crazy about bans this soon, even for the broken stuff, since we have a lot longer than any previous meta to tier stuff. besides, i've always dreamed of traveling to the discworld, so i could get used to being carried by a giant turtle
 
Door swings both ways. It's entirely possible that everyone is overreacting. It is equally if not more possible that one hour is all it takes to realize that something needs to be shown the door.
what I said has nothing to do with what is or is not broken -- I am very sure many things can be seen as broken, but this is just not yet the time for it
 
Taking bets on how well this is gonna age.
How is it going to age poorly? It's pretty much an admission that early OU metas are unbalanced (look at DLC1, nothing was freed and it was still Bax/Hearthflame hell for a few days)

None of those were as unanimously despised to the point they got 100% of a ban vote like Skymin did, so nah. Like, thats nott a thing that happens almost ever with OU ban votes lol
Don't feel like arguing semantics, but most of those were quickbanned because the council felt like there was a clear consensus from the community. I imagine many of those would have 80-90%+ ban percentages like Blood Moon
 
How is it going to age poorly? It's pretty much an admission that early OU metas are unbalanced (look at DLC1, nothing was freed and it was still Bax/Hearthflame hell for a few days)

Because it looks a little silly if the initial reaction is 'give it a second' and then the council comes back with a unanimous QB in under 24 hours. It ages great if counterplay evolves quick and it makes it to at least a suspect test. Ages real bad if the QB comes back incredibly quick.

what I said has nothing to do with what is or is not broken -- I am very sure many things can be seen as broken, but this is just not yet the time for it

That's not true. It's an extreme case where it's true, but it's entirely possible that 1 hour is enough to make the call. It would require a ludicrously broken mon to do so, but it's not impossible. If Mray dropped to OU as the extreme example, the correct speed of the quick ban is 'as fast as a council majority can come together, instant if possible'.
 
That's not true. It's an extreme case where it's true, but it's entirely possible that 1 hour is enough to make the call. It would require a ludicrously broken mon to do so, but it's not impossible.
sir i literally just said this has nothing to do about broken determinations and it is just not the time. it has been 30 minutes. go have fun. stop being lame. stop misinterpiting something i have said a half dozen times. it is not rocket science.
 
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