Metagame SV UU Metagame Discussion - The Indigo Disk

:Iron Crown:

Iron Crown @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 200 HP / 176 Def / 124 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Agility
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Tachyon Cutter

This is a set I've currently been using for Iron Crown, after some ladder games + discussions in the UU disc. The 124 Speed EV's are to outspeed scarfed base 150's after an Agility boost, such as Latios, Booster Speed Moth, and Ogerpon. The rest of its EVs are dumped into bulk to ensure it can take a super effective hit quite well, especially behind screens. Tera Fairy is used to help it avoid being phazed by Dragon Tail.

This set is quite potent behind screens, and Stored Power + Tachyon Cutter is solid enough coverage for the majority of the mons it will encounter. I haven't experimented yet with a more offensive variant, but I think that would do just as well of a job.
 
Iron Crown @ Assault Vest
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Tachyon Cutter
- Future Sight
- Focus Blast
- Volt Switch
Introducing:Magearna,but in UU!
Is your team crippling weak to special attackers?
Take a look at these calcs:
+2 252+ SpA Moltres-Galar Fiery Wrath vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 246-290 (64 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO(HO be damned)

+1 252 SpA Life Orb Greninja Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 198-237 (51.5 - 61.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO(what a fraud mon)

+2 132 SpA Quark Drive Iron Moth Fiery Dance vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 302-356 (78.6 - 92.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO(insane)

+2 0 SpA Sinistcha Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 186-218 (48.4 - 56.7%) -- 89.5% chance to 2HKO(mmm yes i love my tea hot and spicy)

252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 123-145 (32 - 37.7%) -- 93.5% chance to 3HKO(free momentum yippee)

As you can see,our newest dish offers momentum unlike anything else.
side note:this might not be that good,but i suggest you try it out and give me some feedbacks.
 
:Iron Crown:

Iron Crown @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 200 HP / 176 Def / 124 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Agility
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Tachyon Cutter

This is a set I've currently been using for Iron Crown, after some ladder games + discussions in the UU disc. The 124 Speed EV's are to outspeed scarfed base 150's after an Agility boost, such as Latios, Booster Speed Moth, and Ogerpon. The rest of its EVs are dumped into bulk to ensure it can take a super effective hit quite well, especially behind screens. Tera Fairy is used to help it avoid being phazed by Dragon Tail.

This set is quite potent behind screens, and Stored Power + Tachyon Cutter is solid enough coverage for the majority of the mons it will encounter. I haven't experimented yet with a more offensive variant, but I think that would do just as well of a job.
ive been using a SP set with booster, but I think this is better since you're actually bulky and can outspeed things with agility anyways
 
Interested in experimenting with how Cyclizar does in UU now as a possible utility compression/spinner now that Treads is gone.

EDIT: I wonder if the Post DLC Meta might have become too hostile to our lil bikelizard since it last dropped to RU but I wouldn't be too surprised if it sees some popularity again following the latest shifts considering it was THE UU knock-spinner before Treads became legal in the tier IIRC, has more longevity than other spinners like Donphan/Forretress due to classic U-turn/Regen shenanigans but less bulk.
 
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H... i forgot to post on the gren thread..

But my opinion is basically in that its prob a top 5 mon. With battle bond + LO very little can stop you if you come in on smth like slowking, sandy shocks, or a garchomp and they dont have tera... but the thing s tera easily stops gren as gren usually isnt living hits even with def tera so is kinda is shit, stuff that beat it are t wave tink, booster treads (bye bye) or bulky tera water, av azu, moth can live shurking and retaliate with gleam or energy ball, ogerpon can come in vs non activated bond gren....

The thing is very very hard to stop at +1/+1 as depending on its 4th move half the options stop working... smth like moth gets outsped, slowking prob dies, av azu takes a lot more damage and its pretty easy to chip into. I think it prob could deserve a suspect but its to late now since droppes happened and pex dropped which could be fother for dark pulse spam considering it does shit in return besides eat flinches or someone can tech av and wall the crap out of it
 
The thing is very very hard to stop at +1/+1 as depending on its 4th move half the options stop working... smth like moth gets outsped, slowking prob dies, av azu takes a lot more damage and its pretty easy to chip into. I think it prob could deserve a suspect but its to late now since droppes happened and pex dropped which could be fother for dark pulse spam considering it does shit in return besides eat flinches or someone can tech av and wall the crap out of it
But in practice Greninja can rarely afford the 4th move. It is one my concerns as well but in reality its a rather fake one all things considered. Also Pex doesn't do shit in return, with SpDef investement it can Haze the Battle Bond away meaning that now you can switch in Iron Moth and outspeed or another counter and they don't take as much damage and Pex can also Toxic it to put the mon that is already on a timer on an even stricter one. I don't see how being able to remove Grens whole ability and the thing that makes it snowball is "doing shit in return"
 
Ive been trying Iron Thorns recently as a lead for my offensive (hazard) teams

Big Throngus (Iron Thorns) @ Booster Energy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 23 Atk
- Rock Blast
- Fire Blast or Ice Beam
- Taunt or T-wave
- Stealth Rock or Spikes

Fire blast for veil HO teams as the opposing scizor/steel type will likely lead to counter A-ninetales
Ice beam for non veil to chip the incoming Garchomp/Donphan
Rock blast is nice for Ribombee/ Iron Moth
It is also technically the fastest spiker/rocker (not counting scarf kleavor), and fast taunt is nice for opposing A-ninetales
Thorns eats from Scizor quite well, good into Zapdos, Tornadus (if i don't sack it)

I think its doing ok because i dont face many quaquavals, but Thorns has decent bulk bar its x4 ground weakness
Some teams don't need the fire/ice coverage so a fast T-wave to hax the opponent is always nice

BUT it is not great when facing opposing Ttar and other bulkier leads so I'll run a secondary lead in the team like Chomp or Ribombee or try to counter lead with my team members

Just my random ideas since Iron Treads is gone - Tinkaton is cool again ;)
 
But in practice Greninja can rarely afford the 4th move. It is one my concerns as well but in reality its a rather fake one all things considered. Also Pex doesn't do shit in return, with SpDef investement it can Haze the Battle Bond away meaning that now you can switch in Iron Moth and outspeed or another counter and they don't take as much damage and Pex can also Toxic it to put the mon that is already on a timer on an even stricter one. I don't see how being able to remove Grens whole ability and the thing that makes it snowball is "doing shit in return"
the 4th move has been pretty flexible for me, knot isnt always needed in my opinion since hydro, dark, ice beam usually hits everything u want in return.. quav isnt smth that really wants to switch in and other stuff like gastrodon can get haxed down
 
I think a sleeper winner of the tier shifts is none other than my boy Weezy G

:weezing-galar:
Weezing-Galar @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Strange Steam
- Pain Split
- Will-O-Wisp
- Defog

WHY IT IS GOOD: In my view, Weezing-G got a lot better because: (1) we lost Iron Treads, who happened to be the best hazard removal option in a tier where Garchomp made an appearance on more than 30% of teams; (2) Treads' absence made TankChomp, who was already rated as a S- rank option, even better; (3) Weezing-G absolutely dunks on every variant of TankChomp (being immune to both STABs) while pretty freely removing its hazards; (4) Weezing-G provides the additional utility of threatening to Will-O offensive steel types who may otherwise threaten it out (Scizor, Metagross, Jirachi); and (5) Weezing-G's access to Strange Steam ensures that other special threats who may come in (including but not limited to Latios, Greninja, Molt-G) have to be weary and oftentimes require other Pokemon to generate the momentum for them in order to apply pressure to Weezing.

POTENTIAL STRUGGLES: Weezing-G is not without flaws - a number of Paradox mons threaten it with extreme ease (Iron Moth quad resists Strange Steam and is immune to Will-o; Iron Crown isn't bothered by status and threatens to OHKO) while other strong special attackers like Manaphy and Zapdos can push Weezing-G around if you aren't willing to play a little bit more aggressively with your team. While Weezing-G's counters can't be adequately addressed by compacting everything into one teamslot/partner, there are legitimate options to counter these Pokemon (namely things like mixed defense Hippo, Toxapex, and Suicune are particularly good partners), Weezing-G provides enough utility in one teamslot (status + levitate + defog) to make it a really viable option.

TL;DR: Weezing-G was a huge beneficiary of February's tier shifts and while it certainly remains far from a blanket check to most of the tier, its combination of utility and TankChomp deterrence poses a lot of value to creative teambuilders.
 
I think a sleeper winner of the tier shifts is none other than my boy Weezy G

:weezing-galar:
Weezing-Galar @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Strange Steam
- Pain Split
- Will-O-Wisp
- Defog

WHY IT IS GOOD: In my view, Weezing-G got a lot better because: (1) we lost Iron Treads, who happened to be the best hazard removal option in a tier where Garchomp made an appearance on more than 30% of teams; (2) Treads' absence made TankChomp, who was already rated as a S- rank option, even better; (3) Weezing-G absolutely dunks on every variant of TankChomp (being immune to both STABs) while pretty freely removing its hazards; (4) Weezing-G provides the additional utility of threatening to Will-O offensive steel types who may otherwise threaten it out (Scizor, Metagross, Jirachi); and (5) Weezing-G's access to Strange Steam ensures that other special threats who may come in (including but not limited to Latios, Greninja, Molt-G) have to be weary and oftentimes require other Pokemon to generate the momentum for them in order to apply pressure to Weezing.

POTENTIAL STRUGGLES: Weezing-G is not without flaws - a number of Paradox mons threaten it with extreme ease (Iron Moth quad resists Strange Steam and is immune to Will-o; Iron Crown isn't bothered by status and threatens to OHKO) while other strong special attackers like Manaphy and Zapdos can push Weezing-G around if you aren't willing to play a little bit more aggressively with your team. While Weezing-G's counters can't be adequately addressed by compacting everything into one teamslot/partner, there are legitimate options to counter these Pokemon (namely things like mixed defense Hippo, Toxapex, and Suicune are particularly good partners), Weezing-G provides enough utility in one teamslot (status + levitate + defog) to make it a really viable option.

TL;DR: Weezing-G was a huge beneficiary of February's tier shifts and while it certainly remains far from a blanket check to most of the tier, its combination of utility and TankChomp deterrence poses a lot of value to creative teambuilders.
I was a big weezing supporter before the shifts, but I’d argue it’s gotten worse now.

Firstly, sandy shocks being good again is bad since it’s a hazard stacker that weezing can’t deal with.

Secondly, weezings lack of reliable recovery wasn’t that bad pre shifts as alomomola could wish it back to full easily, but that’s obviously not the case anymore.

Finally, treads rising means that Jirachi, scizor and Latios have gotten better, all of which weezing can’t switch into very well. Scizor is the best matchup but weezing takes a lot of damage against scizor to burn it, and the lack of reliable recovery mentioned previously makes this worse now.

Overall, I think weezing still has a niche, but it’s a lot worse than it was and I think it’ll likely remain niche for the foreseeable future.
 
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Thoughts on SD Scale Shot Haxorus? Personally, I think it was better when Dirge was UU since it could catch them off guard with Mold Breaker SD and/or Tera Fire, but I'm interested to hear your views. (using this on screens HO btw)
 

Crushy

UUPL Champion
Howdy fellers, even with this meta still being pretty new I'd like to bring something to attention that I believe is worth discussing with regards to the future of SV UU. UU still has a few centralizing mons around that probably should be discussed further about whether their centralization is good for the tier or not. I think some mons that come to mind for most range from Latios, Garg, Greninja, Gmoltres, Garchomp, and Moth for many reasons. However, in the new meta id like to bring attention to hazard dynamics in uu.
and that is the current hazard dynamics in sv uu. :latios: :garganacl: :greninja: :moltres-galar: :garchomp: :iron-moth: :ogerpon-cornerstone:

Before i get into it, id like to clarify that im not saying Treads leaving alone was the culprit in the state of hazard stack, but rather its absence makes the issue more apparent. Hazard stack is crazy good at the moment, perhaps even too good in the current state of uu. It's no secret that hazard removal has been rather scarce in all of sv with the omnipresent setters this gen has created, but for the most part uu to me has never really had it that badly the way other tiers have. In recent dlcs the hazard dynamics have gotten worse for uu even with or without Iron Treads in the tier. There's a few different things that play into how good hazard stacking is, but it can be simpled down to too many good setters existing, limited viable removal options, and removal deterrents.

:sandy-shocks: :garchomp: :chesnaught: :toxapex: :greninja: :ogerpon: :ribombee: :garganacl: :deoxys-defense: etc.

:mandibuzz: :weezing-galar: :quaquaval: :donphan: :tentacruel: :tsareena: :cyclizar: :talonflame: :tatsugiri: :noivern: :avalugg: :coalossal: :maushold: :cinccino: etc.

:sinistcha: :pecharunt: :gengar: :zoroark-hisui: :mimikyu: :polteageist: :basculegion: :palossand:

For the different setters, there can be solid removal mons that matchup into them well. However, this usually only goes so far depending on the type of removal in question. UU has always been a tier primarily dominated by rapid spinners with occasional defoggers that could also be used. At this point in time, much of this remains true. There may be a few more legit defogging options now in Mandibuzz and Weezing-g (and less traditional means of control in Maushold, Cinccino, Smeargle lol), but for how good hazard stack can be, players are just much more inclined to run spinners to maintain the strategy easier. With this preference for spinners in mind, it's also worth considering the removal deterrents the tier has that the spinners must be mindful of. In this meta, the spinblockers are quite the potent forces that largely enable hazard stacking, along with occasional tera ghost techs that also play into this a bit. The ghost(s) in question is usually bulky ghosts like sinistcha, with the occasional offensive ghosts in gengar/zoroh/polteageist/mmq/etc., but has also now developed into pecha being part of the dynamic. I think by now most are no stranger to something like tera ghost garg, ribombee, garchomp, sandy shocks, ursaluna, etc. that can also put in immense pressure for hazard teams. Hazard removal options only get so far with these things to where over the half the mons performing these roles are more likely to not accomplish what they've set out to do. Now this only doesn't apply to bulky structures, but it tends to manifest for offensive structures too in HO to an extent, some weathers, and even psychic terrain builds. Because of the current hazard dynamics making it very difficult to really manage them effectively, some of these playstyles end up being rather oppressive. Perhaps the weather playstyles less than the others, but psychic terrain especially has gotten more potent than it previously was with the addition of Iron Crown, on top of all the other fan favorite staples of the playstyle, and part of that is because of how limited the hazard dynamics are in current uu. The thing about this playstyle being very good when offense as whole is rather dominanting the tier, traditional means for checking some of the offensive teams aren't effective versus this particular structure just taking into account what psychic terrain does. Surely you get the point I'm trying to make here in mentioning all of this. Essentially, I believe that hazard stack might be too good in current uu to where some action might be required for the health of the tier.

One could argue that there's other pressing issues that could be looked at first, but I do think it's worth discussing how this sort of issue would be addressed if at all. Ideally, the answer to this would result in some of the hazard control options benefiting in some way. Perhaps any of the setters could be looked at, but that doesn't necessarily address the removal dynamics to get better. Essentially, if this were to be looked at in some way, I believe one of the bulky ghosts should be looked at, namely Sinistcha. When you look at rapid spin options the tier has, most of them can be hard punished by this mon or usually have to tech in something very specific just for this mon. Quaqaval has run flying coverage as knock off isn't enough, Tsareena has to run triple axel if it wants to come close to 2hkoing it, Cyclizar doesn't do enough damage despite its typing theoretically being effective against it, Donphan just gets outsped and outlasted by any of the moves Sinis uses, Tentacruel actually does okay for the most part but can also potentially lose to repeated shadow ball, Tatsugiri does threaten it but has other issues beyond just this matchup as do most of the other spinning options also considering that Sinis is not frail, etc. I've advocated before for Sinis being too good of a mon and I think more than ever is it the most unhealthy it's been, on top of having legit tech options for some of its supposed checks like Stun Spore + Hex into a lot of the flying types, scald into some of the darks, a variety of berry options, and multiple tera options as well. Now you might ask why not Pecharunt? well, this mon is still rather new but so far it facing it, it has struck m as a mon that is almost as annoying as Garganacl is, but I think it could definitely be argued to interact with the tier in a healthier way than Sinis does, most namely that it's easier to pressure it and doesn't have the same longevity that Sinistcha's movepool allows. Now, if the issue of bulky ghosts is being addressed, one could definitely argue that random tera ghost plays into this as well for something like Garganacl especially, but even with tera ghost this does have a cost to it whereas for something like Sinis it's more of a benefit pre-tera. I'm curious to hear other peoples' thoughts on this and how they would go about this issue.

:iron-treads: :alomomola: :toxapex: :pecharunt: :iron-crown:
Anyways, the tier has just lost one of the most impactful influences that sv uu has for a while with the rise of Iron Teads. It's splashability onto teams will surely be missed, but at the same time changes like this can be a good thing in broadening teambuilding a bit more creatively rather than being complacent in using "safety net" mons. Alomomola also played into this a bit in single-handedly carrying an entire playstyle that we have also lost with its rising. UU has acquired Pecharunt, Toxapex, and Iron Crown, some interesting drops to say the least. The feel of the tier seems gloomy overall while it has to adapt without two very influential presences, but maybe that's just an overreaction to the new meta flow. While some things in the tier may change drastically, others not so much. It should be interesting seeing what new surprises arrise from these changes.

Thanks for reading if you got this far :D
 
My contribution to the war against hazard stack is this dumbass idea

:sv/cryogonal:

On paper, cryogonal actually fits quite well into this mess of a metagame. Great matchups into both garchomp and sandy shocks, the ability to switch into these mons somewhat reliably, and its access to rapid spin to clear hazards in general is always appreciated. It’s solid special bulk is also good at switching into certain threats to check them, like hydrapple and zapdos lacking heat wave.

I’ve been using this set so far and it’s been doing pretty good (when it’s teammate isn’t missing hurricanes)


Cryogonal: @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 140 HP / 136 SpA / 232 Spe
Timid Nature
- Freeze-Dry
- Tera Blast
- Rapid Spin
- Recover

The speed allows it to outrun offensive garchomp and the special attack evs confirm a 2hko into a JirachI that has a little bit of bulk investment. This set acts as both a solid clearing option and a lure for scizor and Jirachi that thought they could snipe an easy kill. I’ve been using it with donphan to have a second spinning option against kleavor or garganacl, so hazards can be off the field consistently. Cryo and donphan actually pair really well together as cryo’s ability to check chomp takes pressure off of donphan as a physical tank and allows it check other mons without fearing a late game garchomp sweeping.

As far as teammates go, I’ve paired it with ogerpon-cornerstone and hisuin arcanine as they both enjoy hazards being off the field to facilitate their offensive potential. Arcanine also enjoys cryo’s ability to switch in on eqs threatening it and removing tankchomps so it can keep flare blitzing and head smashing its way through teams.

Overall, while still a niche pick, I think cryogonal could be an interesting choice for people who are struggling with hazards and are willing to do something different.
 
Hi everyone! This is my first post on the forum (though I've been playing on ps for a while now!). I played about 100 games yesterday trying out a few teams in the tier and I wanted to talk about a few mons I think are pretty good after the tier shift! Also, I don't know how to add those little pkmn sprites so just gonna be words here.

Necrozma has been really solid for me on Psy-terrain, but the more I think about it the better it seems in general, even outside of terrain, as an offensive rocker.

1707054980379.png

1707055000115.png


Hazard removal is hard to come by in UU right now. necrozma really takes advantage of that, being able to OHKO every defogger/spinner in the tier, and most in the below tiers too (except donphan!). Psychic move/Meteor beam/heat wave coverage off 353 spatk is really good.

+1 252 SpA Necrozma Meteor Beam vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Mandibuzz: 402-474 (95 - 112%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Necrozma Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Scizor: 372-440 (108.1 - 127.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Necrozma Photon Geyser vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Weezing-Galar: 320-378 (95.8 - 113.1%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Necrozma Photon Geyser vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Quaquaval: 408-482 (109.3 - 129.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Psychic-types on a whole seem pretty hard to switch into right now. Offense teams usually seems to carry 1 or 2 mons that aren't blown up by an expanding force, but are super weak to certain coverage moves (gren/lokix/moltres/latios/scizor/crown), and the bulkier options are scarce (ttar/mandi/deo-d/goodra/rachi).

Metagross looks to me like a mon that takes advantage of this both ways, being a fairly bulky psychic resist, a check to the new crown and pex, and pretty hard to switch into with steel/psychic coverage.

Lastly, Toxapex is really good! It checks or counters a lot of the tier with a mixdef set with haze. It beats most versions of Azu/Keld/Quavo, covers Lokix/Scizor/Moth/Gren nicely, eats a draco from Latios/Goodra/Hydrapple and pivots out with regen, hazes on Sinistea/Moltres/Kommo-O, and if you throw a rocky helmet on covers Cinccino pretty well too! This is the set I was running that a lot of teams seemed unprepared for

Toxapex @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Surf
- Recover
- Toxic
- Haze


haven't played the ladder lately, is toxapex any good down here?
To answer your question, I think it is!

Hope everyone else is having fun with the meta, and looking forward to seeing what new sets and techs you guys cook up!
 
Hi everyone! This is my first post on the forum (though I've been playing on ps for a while now!). I played about 100 games yesterday trying out a few teams in the tier and I wanted to talk about a few mons I think are pretty good after the tier shift! Also, I don't know how to add those little pkmn sprites so just gonna be words here.

Necrozma has been really solid for me on Psy-terrain, but the more I think about it the better it seems in general, even outside of terrain, as an offensive rocker.

View attachment 600852
View attachment 600853

Hazard removal is hard to come by in UU right now. necrozma really takes advantage of that, being able to OHKO every defogger/spinner in the tier, and most in the below tiers too (except donphan!). Psychic move/Meteor beam/heat wave coverage off 353 spatk is really good.

+1 252 SpA Necrozma Meteor Beam vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Mandibuzz: 402-474 (95 - 112%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Necrozma Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Scizor: 372-440 (108.1 - 127.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Necrozma Photon Geyser vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Weezing-Galar: 320-378 (95.8 - 113.1%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Necrozma Photon Geyser vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Quaquaval: 408-482 (109.3 - 129.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Psychic-types on a whole seem pretty hard to switch into right now. Offense teams usually seems to carry 1 or 2 mons that aren't blown up by an expanding force, but are super weak to certain coverage moves (gren/lokix/moltres/latios/scizor/crown), and the bulkier options are scarce (ttar/mandi/deo-d/goodra/rachi).

Metagross looks to me like a mon that takes advantage of this both ways, being a fairly bulky psychic resist, a check to the new crown and pex, and pretty hard to switch into with steel/psychic coverage.

Lastly, Toxapex is really good! It checks or counters a lot of the tier with a mixdef set with haze. It beats most versions of Azu/Keld/Quavo, covers Lokix/Scizor/Moth/Gren nicely, eats a draco from Latios/Goodra/Hydrapple and pivots out with regen, hazes on Sinistea/Moltres/Kommo-O, and if you throw a rocky helmet on covers Cinccino pretty well too! This is the set I was running that a lot of teams seemed unprepared for

Toxapex @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Surf
- Recover
- Toxic
- Haze




To answer your question, I think it is!

Hope everyone else is having fun with the meta, and looking forward to seeing what new sets and techs you guys cook up!
to add pokemon sprites to your forum post just do :pokemon:, so like :weezing-galar:
 
How would a psyspam user pivot out of Indeedee? As far as I know it doesn't have pivoting moves. In OU one would use Eject Button Hatt to either bounce back hazards or give one free switch. Obviously you don't want to hard switch into a frail attacker, and you'd be less inclined to waste terrain turns going into a bulky mon and pivoting out. Does anyone have any solutions here? Thanks in advance!
 
How would a psyspam user pivot out of Indeedee? As far as I know it doesn't have pivoting moves. In OU one would use Eject Button Hatt to either bounce back hazards or give one free switch. Obviously you don't want to hard switch into a frail attacker, and you'd be less inclined to waste terrain turns going into a bulky mon and pivoting out. Does anyone have any solutions here? Thanks in advance!
I personally go with Eject Button Espeon. Like Hatt, it also has magic bounce, which helps to prevent hazards most of the time (except against mons like Kleavor/Tinkaton). Its frail, but like you said, you don't want to waste psy terrain turns.
 
Howdy fellers, even with this meta still being pretty new I'd like to bring something to attention that I believe is worth discussing with regards to the future of SV UU. UU still has a few centralizing mons around that probably should be discussed further about whether their centralization is good for the tier or not. I think some mons that come to mind for most range from Latios, Garg, Greninja, Gmoltres, Garchomp, and Moth for many reasons. However, in the new meta id like to bring attention to hazard dynamics in uu.
and that is the current hazard dynamics in sv uu. :latios: :garganacl: :greninja: :moltres-galar: :garchomp: :iron-moth: :ogerpon-cornerstone:

Before i get into it, id like to clarify that im not saying Treads leaving alone was the culprit in the state of hazard stack, but rather its absence makes the issue more apparent. Hazard stack is crazy good at the moment, perhaps even too good in the current state of uu. It's no secret that hazard removal has been rather scarce in all of sv with the omnipresent setters this gen has created, but for the most part uu to me has never really had it that badly the way other tiers have. In recent dlcs the hazard dynamics have gotten worse for uu even with or without Iron Treads in the tier. There's a few different things that play into how good hazard stacking is, but it can be simpled down to too many good setters existing, limited viable removal options, and removal deterrents.

:sandy-shocks: :garchomp: :chesnaught: :toxapex: :greninja: :ogerpon: :ribombee: :garganacl: :deoxys-defense: etc.

:mandibuzz: :weezing-galar: :quaquaval: :donphan: :tentacruel: :tsareena: :cyclizar: :talonflame: :tatsugiri: :noivern: :avalugg: :coalossal: :maushold: :cinccino: etc.

:sinistcha: :pecharunt: :gengar: :zoroark-hisui: :mimikyu: :polteageist: :basculegion: :palossand:

For the different setters, there can be solid removal mons that matchup into them well. However, this usually only goes so far depending on the type of removal in question. UU has always been a tier primarily dominated by rapid spinners with occasional defoggers that could also be used. At this point in time, much of this remains true. There may be a few more legit defogging options now in Mandibuzz and Weezing-g (and less traditional means of control in Maushold, Cinccino, Smeargle lol), but for how good hazard stack can be, players are just much more inclined to run spinners to maintain the strategy easier. With this preference for spinners in mind, it's also worth considering the removal deterrents the tier has that the spinners must be mindful of. In this meta, the spinblockers are quite the potent forces that largely enable hazard stacking, along with occasional tera ghost techs that also play into this a bit. The ghost(s) in question is usually bulky ghosts like sinistcha, with the occasional offensive ghosts in gengar/zoroh/polteageist/mmq/etc., but has also now developed into pecha being part of the dynamic. I think by now most are no stranger to something like tera ghost garg, ribombee, garchomp, sandy shocks, ursaluna, etc. that can also put in immense pressure for hazard teams. Hazard removal options only get so far with these things to where over the half the mons performing these roles are more likely to not accomplish what they've set out to do. Now this only doesn't apply to bulky structures, but it tends to manifest for offensive structures too in HO to an extent, some weathers, and even psychic terrain builds. Because of the current hazard dynamics making it very difficult to really manage them effectively, some of these playstyles end up being rather oppressive. Perhaps the weather playstyles less than the others, but psychic terrain especially has gotten more potent than it previously was with the addition of Iron Crown, on top of all the other fan favorite staples of the playstyle, and part of that is because of how limited the hazard dynamics are in current uu. The thing about this playstyle being very good when offense as whole is rather dominanting the tier, traditional means for checking some of the offensive teams aren't effective versus this particular structure just taking into account what psychic terrain does. Surely you get the point I'm trying to make here in mentioning all of this. Essentially, I believe that hazard stack might be too good in current uu to where some action might be required for the health of the tier.

One could argue that there's other pressing issues that could be looked at first, but I do think it's worth discussing how this sort of issue would be addressed if at all. Ideally, the answer to this would result in some of the hazard control options benefiting in some way. Perhaps any of the setters could be looked at, but that doesn't necessarily address the removal dynamics to get better. Essentially, if this were to be looked at in some way, I believe one of the bulky ghosts should be looked at, namely Sinistcha. When you look at rapid spin options the tier has, most of them can be hard punished by this mon or usually have to tech in something very specific just for this mon. Quaqaval has run flying coverage as knock off isn't enough, Tsareena has to run triple axel if it wants to come close to 2hkoing it, Cyclizar doesn't do enough damage despite its typing theoretically being effective against it, Donphan just gets outsped and outlasted by any of the moves Sinis uses, Tentacruel actually does okay for the most part but can also potentially lose to repeated shadow ball, Tatsugiri does threaten it but has other issues beyond just this matchup as do most of the other spinning options also considering that Sinis is not frail, etc. I've advocated before for Sinis being too good of a mon and I think more than ever is it the most unhealthy it's been, on top of having legit tech options for some of its supposed checks like Stun Spore + Hex into a lot of the flying types, scald into some of the darks, a variety of berry options, and multiple tera options as well. Now you might ask why not Pecharunt? well, this mon is still rather new but so far it facing it, it has struck m as a mon that is almost as annoying as Garganacl is, but I think it could definitely be argued to interact with the tier in a healthier way than Sinis does, most namely that it's easier to pressure it and doesn't have the same longevity that Sinistcha's movepool allows. Now, if the issue of bulky ghosts is being addressed, one could definitely argue that random tera ghost plays into this as well for something like Garganacl especially, but even with tera ghost this does have a cost to it whereas for something like Sinis it's more of a benefit pre-tera. I'm curious to hear other peoples' thoughts on this and how they would go about this issue.

:iron-treads: :alomomola: :toxapex: :pecharunt: :iron-crown:
Anyways, the tier has just lost one of the most impactful influences that sv uu has for a while with the rise of Iron Teads. It's splashability onto teams will surely be missed, but at the same time changes like this can be a good thing in broadening teambuilding a bit more creatively rather than being complacent in using "safety net" mons. Alomomola also played into this a bit in single-handedly carrying an entire playstyle that we have also lost with its rising. UU has acquired Pecharunt, Toxapex, and Iron Crown, some interesting drops to say the least. The feel of the tier seems gloomy overall while it has to adapt without two very influential presences, but maybe that's just an overreaction to the new meta flow. While some things in the tier may change drastically, others not so much. It should be interesting seeing what new surprises arrise from these changes.

Thanks for reading if you got this far :D
Thank you for mentioning Sinistcha, it's been really good on hazard stacking teams , especially with helmet chomp, even when treads was in the tier
and it's something that can go out of hand pretty quickly .
I think it's weird that :garchomp: was somehow not on the previous survey, it plays a role in the hazard stack problem too imo
 
what are some good screen setters for UU? I think grimm's pretty neat with its sizable bulk and prankster, but I also think that A9 is good as well to hit Mandibuzz
I think those two are, far and away, the best options: Grimm's access to Prankster makes it viable (optimal?) to run zero attacking moves because it can pivot around non-dark types with Parting Shot while Alolan Ninetails gets both screens up at once. However, the following Pokemon get access to screens as well:

Screenshot 2024-02-05 at 12.15.37 PM.png



Of the following Pokemon, only a few would create a niche as screen setters.

:jirachi:
Jirachi has access to Wish + U-Turn in addition to screens, meaning you can pivot hazard weak Pokemon into the game and restore them to full under the protection of screens. I can really only see this being viable with something like Moltres-G (who would like to be at full following SR damage and only needs two turns to really run away with the game, meaning it doesn't lose as much from only having 5~ turns to work with screens due to Wish+U-Turn)

:ribombee:
The only real niche I could see this having is that it has U-Turn + Webs, meaning that some really fragile Pokemon who are good into webs (namely stuff like Crawdaunt) could shake off some priority and potentially checkmate teams who rely on priority to pick off setup sweepers.

:deoxys-defense:
I could maybe, maybe see how this would have a role: fast taunt, both screens, and teleport gives it a similar moveset to Grimm while letting your sweeper Pokemon pivot in second (as opposed to first at +1 priority when compared to Grimm's parting shot). Further, it doesn't necessarily invite in stuff like Scizor and Metagross like Grimm does.

Overall, I think the two Pokemon you listed (Grimmsnarl and Ninetails-A) are by far the best screen setters due to the aforementioned benefits. Jirachi, Ribombee, and Deo-D technically provide a few niches over them - but I think they're both tailored to extremely specific circumstances and are defininitvely worse on the vast, vast majority of teams.
 

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