Team Elemental War

Maci12 · Sep 28, 2009

Overview

This team is one I have used over the past month and a half, and it has brought me great success, consistently getting around 1540 average rating. With the HG/SS changes added to the Smogon server, I think it's best for me to retire this team and start on another. Please give me any feedback, as I will be using this team for a little longer, and any feedback will help me to make even stronger teams in the future.

One of my consistent problems with past teams is that they don't have great synergy, and therefore I can't switch around too much. This team was built to rectify that, giving me the freedom to switch around to my hearts content. It is quite dominantly an offensive team with hints of balance. Without further ado, here is Team Elemental War.

At A Glance:

Team

Stealth Rock Anti-Lead

Mamoswine (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Oblivious
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Protect
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
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Mamoswine is, in my oppinion, the best lead in the current OU metagame. It literally beats every common lead. Metagross is 2HKOd with the Earthquake/Ice Shard combo, provided it is Standard EVs. ShucaTran is OHKOd by STAB Earthquake. Azelf is 3HKOd by Ice Shard, meaning they are KOd if they use Stealth Rock on the first turn. Roserade is brought to its knees by Ice Shard. The list goes on and on. The only common lead that this has trouble with is Swampert, who is 3HKOd by Earthquake, and Mamoswine can set up rocks against him really easily, as that is generally Swamperts first move as well. Protect is the reason Mamoswine can tear down leads such as Infernape, Ambipom, and Weavile. Protect on the Fake Out, Earthquake then Ice Shard for a 2HKO.

SR is the support ability here, but after realizing that Mamoswine had so much dangerous potential as an anti-lead, they became a lesser focus. Leads that SR is easy to use on are: Swampert, Hippowdon, Bronzong, Tyranitar, and other slower & bulky leads. Because of Mamoswine's unique typing, no weather effect can break his sash, making him a great anti-stall lead.

I usually keep Mamoswine until late game when DDmence and Choice Scarf Flygon come out. With their 4x weaknesses, they are both promptly OHKOd by Ice Shard, and often aren't expecting it. Gliscor also suffers from this KO, though many bulkier ones use Yache Berry to cussion the blow. In short, while he has a great many weaknesses, Mamoswine is one of the most valuable members of my team.

I have grown to love Mamoswine's weakness to Steel. Choice Band Scizor are always drawn out to finish a Mamoswine with 1% health that can't be damaged by weather. Empoleon, sporting a 4x resistence to steel absolutely loves this opportunity to come and begin a sweep. All of Mamoswine's weaknesses are covered well.

Versus Popular Leads
RED = Problem
ORANGE = Mild Challenge
BLACK = Neutral

- OHKO through Shuca Berry.

- Get up SR, 3HKO with Earthquake, but it's risky because its about a 50% for it to be a 4HKO I lose to it.

- Earthquake then Ice Shard for guarenteed OHKO if it is a standard lead Metagross. If they go for SR first turn, then they don't get damage, and I still get SR.

- Guarenteed 3HKO with Ice Shard, I win if they SR first, but lose if they don't and therefore generally will SR second turn if they don't SR first.

- Guarenteed 2HKO with Ice Shard.

- Protect on Fake Out, then Earthquake + Ice Shard for 2HKO.

- Earthquake as they SR, then Ice Shard, as they are brought into VERY low health and are prone to Aqua Jet.

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Special Sweeper

Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Draco Meteor
- Surf
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Fire]
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For a while, I had the Offensive Calm Mind set as Latias' set, but was consistently destroyed by the same threats over and over, and I found that it needed several turns of setup to be nearly as effective as it needed to be for a sweeper. I then discovered this lovely set. Sporting perfect coverage, short of (Fat Bitch) Blissey, there is really nothing that can wall this thing. It actually rips apart some of the foremost defensive pokemon.

The difference between this and the CM set is that I don't use this set to sweep so much as blow out the damage. By that I mean I switch it in when it makes sense to do so (i.e. on a resisted attack such as Grass Knot), and choose the best option based on my situation. If I'm sure that the player will stay in, I obviously will use the best attack suited to the situation, but otherwise, I usually lead with Surf, as nothing short of Water Absorb users are immune to it, so it'll generally damage something. Draco Meteor is a destructive attack, dealing around 34% to most things that resist it. The Rotom appliances are OHKOd by it, making Latias a good switch in to them. This may seem counter-intuative, as they should counter her, and that's why it works, because they don't fear her so they don't switch out.

Draco Meteor provides the most powerful STAB possible. Water + Dragon provides almost unresisted coverage (Empoleon + Shedinja), and Surf is Latias' most reliable Water attack. Thunderbolt makes short work of the majority of Bulky Waters, in particular Vaporeon, who causes a lot of grief for many of my sweepers, and takes care of Empoleon. Hidden Power [Fire] OHKOs Scizor and Forretress, who are both fairly common switch ins, and also takes out Shedinja.

Latias is a great pokemon period, and is vital to the success of this team.

Latias Is Weak To:
-Bug (2x) - Empoleon | Scizor | Infernape
-Dark (2x) - Empoleon | Scizor | Infernape
-Dragon (2x) - Empoleon | Scizor
-Ghost (2x) - Empoleon | Scizor
-Ice (2x) - Empoleon | Scizor | Infernape
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Agility Powerhouse

Empoleon (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Modest nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Agility
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Grass Knot
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The beast that is Agility + 3 Attacks Empoleon catches many people by surprise. Come in on a Scizor locked into Bullet Punch or Pursuit (or anything that can't really damage you), use Agility once, and sweep! It is such a simple concept, and yet I find that this Empoleon is one of the most destructive forces in the OU metagame. It has brilliant type coverage, only needs one turn of setup, and comes off a hefty 353 Special Attack stat. Not only that, but, unlike Agility SubPetaya Empoleon, it doesn't waste his defensive capabilities, and on a synergenic team, being able switch in repeatedly is very important.

Agility allows Empoleon to outspeed positive natured base 115s after a single boost, and then can deal huge damage with its respective attacks. Also, with 12 resisted attack types, it is not hard to find a time to setup. Surf is 95 Base Power STAB, and is more reliable than Hydro Pump. The only thing that Surf misses out on is the ability to OHKO Magnezone, but he is becoming less and less frequent. Ice Beam OHKOs Flygon, Salamence, Gliscor, a multitude of Grass pokemon, just to name a few. Grass Knot + Ice Beam + Surf = Unresisted coverage. It also provides a OHKO on Swampert (a frequent switch in), Starmie (after Stealth Rock), and a 2HKO on Suicune and Gyrados (after Stealth Rock).

Empoleon is brilliant when used with Latias, as they cover each others weaknesses perfectly. In fact, they cover each other so well, they resist every attack type in the game together. Also, while sharing a Fighting weakness with Mamoswine, they work decently togther, as Empoleon can take Steel and Water type attacks for Mamoswine, and Mamoswine can take Electric attacks.

Empoleon is one of my team's powerhouses (as evidenced by his title) and is the easiest one to find a time to switch in and setup. If he gets into Torrent range, nothing is safe, as a Torrent boosted Surf can 2HKO a bulky Gyrados.

Empoleon Is Weak To:
-Electric (2x) - Mamoswine | Latias | Celebi
-Fighting (2x) - Latias | Celebi
-Ground (2x) - Latias | Celebi
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The Team So Far

Stealth Rock Anti-Lead

Special Sweeper

Special Sweeper

I have accomplished one of my goals with this first set of three; I resist every type in the game and can damage every pokemon in the game neutrally. However, there are some very clear things that stick out here:

1) Blissey walls the **** out of me.
2) Thunder Wave makes my sweepers absolutely useless.

Despite having such great synergy now, there is always room to grow, so I want someone who can continue the theme, and achieve my first goal; absorbing status.
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Supporting Wall

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP/220 Def/36 Spd
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Thunder Wave
- Leech Seed
- Recover
- Grass Knot
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Celebi is another great addition to the team. Having near perfect synergy with Empoleon, he can come in on any of Empoleon's weaknesses, and raise some hell through Paralysis or Leech Seed. Celebi acts as my main status absorber due to Natural Cure, and because of Thunder Wave, he can force many other pokemon out of the picture, reopening a sweep for someone. Celebi also has brilliant 100 Base Defenses, so fine-tuning him to counter certain things is a synch. This particular Celebi is made to counter Gyarados, and there is nothing that does its job better in my oppinion. Celebi is also a very telling pokemon when it comes up against physical attackers. If a physical attack deals 80% or higher, then the chances are that the user is banded, and switching the appropriate counter is easy, and the bandeer is now paralysed.

The attacks used are a little off base for Celebi, as it is rare to see both Thunder Wave and Leech Seed on the same set. My general strategy when up against a +2 or higher Gyarados is to Thunder Wave, Recover until paralysis hits, then Leech Seed until they die. This applies to just about any physical attacker. Thunder Wave is great team support, even on a team with sweepers that are as fast as mine. Leech Seed allows Celebi to switch more freely, as the incumbant will have cussioned blows against them. Recover allows for Paralysis stall. Grass Knot is the obligatory STAB move that can deal 20-30% on Metagross who resists it, not to mention a guarenteed 2HKO on Vaporeon, Suicune, Milotic, and less bulky Gyarados.

The only problem with Celebi is the Pursuit weakness he shares with Latias. However, this can also be looked at in a positive way, as many Pursuit users are Choiced (Weavile, Tyranitar, Metagross, Scizor) quite often, so Empoleon can come in and begin to sweep.

So now I have my status absorber, but Blissey still walls this team so far, so some heavy hitters need to be introduced to keep her on her toes.

- While I love Altaria in UU with a passion, it has no place on this team, as Latias already takes the spot of the semi-bulky Dragon on this team, and besides this, Altaria is Stealth Rock weak, and that doesn't help her when she may need to repeatedly switch in and out.

- Blissey, while being the Special Wall with the most, also doesn't have a place on this team, as it would mean that half my team was weak to Fighting, a fairly common offensive team in OU. It didn't have the synergy or balanced stats I was looking for, and obviously couldn't counter hard-hitting physical attackers.

- I actually tested with Roserade, as her typing has decent Synergy with the rest of the team, but I quickly found that Sleep Powder and Stun Spore missed way to often to be viable competetively, and while she has a monstrous SAtk stat and a resistence to Stealth Rock, she didn't have the all around defense stats I waas looking for.

- Had rather redundant resistences and opened up another Pursuit/Bug/Electric/Ghost weakness, making her a lackluster choice. And again, she lacked the bulk.
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Choice Band Scout

Scizor (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP/248 Atk/8 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- Pursuit
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Choice Band Scizor. The #1 Most Used Pokemon. He is one of the best abusers of priority due to Technician + STAB on Bullet Punch, though I use him mostly to U-Turn and scout my opponent. He counters any Blissey lacking Flamethrower fantastically, due to his ability to play every mind game in the book with U-Turn, Pursuit, and a super-effective attack. On this team, he fulfills this niche particularly well, as he brings out his counters, and with U-Turn, I bring out mine.

His excellent typing is what gave me interest in him. He covers Latias' and Celebi's weaknesses exceptionally well, sharing only a Fire weakness with Celebi, which is covered by Latias and Infernape. U-Turn and Pursuit coming off Technician was what made him ultimately more viable then Weavile or Metagross. Besides being a scout for the team, I also employ him late in the game when almost all my opponents pokemon are down to ~30% health, at which point he can take them out with Bullet Punch, provided they don't have a 4x resistence or high defenses. He is really the glue of the team, as U-Turn lets me switch in any pokemon who best suits the situation.

Scizor Is Weak To:
-Fire (4x) - Latias | Infernape

Why Scizor Over Other Similar Banders

- Metagross was my #2 choice for the bander, because it helped with the Ice weaknesses and had much better Physical defensive capabilities. However, after playtesting for a while I found that U-Turn was to indispensible to lose, and the better resistences offered by Scizor for my team were too much to lose.

- Weavile, while getting STAB Ice Shard and Pursuit didn't have what it took in my book to be a successful Bander on a team where switching in and out was important, due to its weakness to Stealth Rock, so it was quickly removed from the table.

- Choice Band Tyranitar, while it is a monster, is far too predictable for my tastes. When you switch into a Psychic, you are clearly going to pursuit, and so they do as much damage as possible before dying. It is only good for trapping Ghosts and the like, where as Scizor has opportunities to play mind games with anything it has the potential to trap.

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Physical Sweeper

Infernap

e (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk/192 Spd/64 SAtk
Naive nature (+Spd, -SDef)
- Close Combat
- U-turn
- Mach Punch
- Overheat
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Physically Based MixNape finds a home on this team. Originally, I used the Specially Based variant, but quickly realized that, while powerful, it didn't counter the threats that were so dangerous to the team, such as a +2 Lucario. With a 120 Base Power STAB move coming off a 307 Atk Stat, almost everything is going to be seriously maimed for switching in, with the exception of Ghosts. U-Turn is well suited on a pokemon as fast as Infernape, as it allows him to get out of sticky situations while still doing damage to an opponent. Mach Punch OHKOs standard SD Lucario, so they have no chance to sweep if he is alive. Overheat does as much damage as Fire Blast does with 252 SAtk EVs, and since it is the only Special Attack on the set, Infernape isn't badly hurt from the -2 SAtk.

Infernape really seals Blissey's fate on this team, as if there was a pokemon built only to counter Blissey, it would be Infernape. As a past Blissey user, I can say that there is nothing more frightening than an Infernape switching in, because he can hit from both spectrums. In addition, he provides good synergy with Scizor + Latias + Celebi, resisting Fire, Dark, Ice, and Bug attacks for them, while they can resist Ground and Water attacks for him. He is a great late game sweeper as well, with priority and speed decent enough to break many late-game threats. (Agili-Sub Petaya, Lucario, Scizor, Metagross, Etc.)

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Ending Notes

So that's the team =). I spent a lot of time on the typing and synergy as that has never been my area of strength, but this time I think I did well with it. You'll notice that only one of my sweepers is a setup sweeper, and even then its only a one turn set up that I only use if I can force a switch. This is due to the fact that I have started to think that moves like Calm Mind, while destructive, aren't always worth a spot on faster sweepers such as Latias/Infernape. Also, on a team where you may have to switch and therfore lose any boosts you attained, it is simply not practical to have many setup moves. Without further ado, I present to you the Team Building section.

Team Building

I start off with no pokemon having a spot guarenteed. I know for a fact I want an offensively geared team, and therefore I'm going to want Stealth Rock to compliment my team. I'm not a fan of Aerodactyl leads, and haven't had good success with Metagross leads, and so I go for someone I have heard amazing things about; Mamoswine.

Mamoswine, while being an excellent lead and late game disruptor, sports 5 weaknesses to very common attack types, so I need someone who resists Mamoswine's weaknesses in order for my team to have good synergy. A special sweeper makes sense, as Mamoswine is largely a physical sweeper, but if they are to come in on Mamoswine's weaknesses, they need to have some decent bulk and a handful of resistences and immunities. At first I thought mixed Salamence or Dragonite would be good, but then realized they both had rather average speed stats and are SR weak, so I needed a faster, similarly typed pokemon; Latias.

Latias covers 4/5 of Mamoswine's weaknesses, but brings 5 of her own with her. All of the attack types that hit her Super Effectively are resisted by Steel types, the only problem is that many of the competetively viable Steel types in OU are Steel/Psychic, which makes these attack types neutral and not resisted. Magnezone is an interesting option for me to consider, as it eliminates the only thing that can resist Latias' STAB, however, to be effective, it needs to carry a scarf, and wasting a spot on something where another pokemon can cover the weaknesses better seems silly to me, and so I decide to go with a second Special Sweeper; Empoleon.

Empoleon & Latias have great synergy due to their ability to resist every type when put together. However, both of them being fast, special sweepers means that they are absolutely destroyed by Blissey & Thunder Wave, and so pokemon are going to need to be brought in to deal with these important areas. I immediately go to Smogon to look at all the Natural Cure users. Altaria, I have used to success great success in UU, but the SR weakness on a team that switches often isn't appealing. Blissey with her Fighting weakness is not appealing as that opens up 3 fighting weaknesses and only one resistence. Roserade, while having interesting options in Sleep Powder & possibly even setting up Toxic Spikes/Spikess, is not bulky enough for the job. Starmie provides redundant resistences and opens up a multitude of weaknesses on the team; 2 weak to Dark/Ghost/Bug & 2 weak to Electric. Lack of bulk also applies to Starmie. My only options left are Shymin and Celebi. Celebi, while opening up Pursuit weaknesses, has resistences to every super effective attack aimed at Empoleon, and he can do the same for Celebi, with the exception of Fire attacks. This makes Celebi the preferred option and so that's who'll be on the team.

Now that I have the status absorber on my team ready, it is time for some brute force from a Choice Bander. I need several requirements fulfilled at this point for my bander. They need access to STAB Priority, Pursuit, resist Ice, and cannot be weak to Stealth Rock. This brings the numbers down to Metagross and Scizor. Metagross has more brute force and can utilize Earthquake effectively, however it doesn't cover the weaknesses opened by Celebi very well due to Psychic being its secondary typing. Scizor on the other hand, has almost as much brute force, has better synergy, and has the ability to U-Turn, which is an extremely useful ability in any scenario, as it grants an essentially free switch in. So therefore, Scizor gets the spot.

The final spot is a challenging one to fill. I need a Fire type to cover Fire & Bug weaknesses, and I also want to cover Dark as a good portion of my team is weak to that as well. It came down to Heatran and Infernape for me in the end, as they both met those requirements. I originally went with SubTran as it had brilliant synergy with Celebi, but found the speed to be a major turn-off, and it added another thing for Blissey to wall on the teaam. Infernape met the requirements as well, and while not having the defensive stats or typing Heatran did, it had much better mixed offensive stats so that Infernape could hit hard from either end of the spectrum, with Close Combat and Overheat doing a shitload to anything that switched in. Infernape also provided Scizor with a U-Turn buddy that could come in on his weaknesses. It was a challenging decision, and took lots of testing, but ultimately, Infernape was the better choice for the team.

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That's the team! Please give any useful feedback you may have. I will add the threat list as soon as possible.

Maci12 · Sep 28, 2009

THREAT LIST (STOLEN STRAIGHT FROM JABBA'S THREAD!)
Offensive Threats:

Azelf - (Addressing As Lead) Azelf vs. Mamoswine is tricky. I find that most Azelf setup SR on turn one. I go for Ice Shard. Ice Shard is a guarenteed 3HKO, so they die if they SR turn one. If they attack turn one, I SR turn two, as that is generally what they will do, and then still bring Azelf down to about 30% with Ice Shard #2. It's annoying to sacrifice Mamoswine so early, but its necessary.

Breloom - Sacrifice whatever has lowest health to Spore, switch to Mamoswine to break sub with Ice Shard, if Mamo is still alive (unlikely) then Ice Shard for kill, otherwise go to Infernape and OHKO.

Gengar - I rarely face Gengar, though they are a minor annoyance. Scizor can take pretty much anything Gengar throws at it short of HP [Fire] and OHKO with Pursuit/Bullet Punch.

Gyarados - Celebi.All.The.Way.

Heatran - Lead: Destroyed by Mamoswine. Sweeper: Destroyed by Infernape. Requires some careful prediction to take out but its very doable. Choice Scarf is easy to take out, simply lure with Infernape and bring in Latias.

Infernape - Latias forces Infernape out 95% of the time, and the othr 5% of the time, Infernape dies to Surf.

Jolteon - Choice Specs = Lure with Empoleon & Switch to Mamoswine. Life Orb Sweeper, Latias answers it well, as HP [Ice] doesn't do too much damage, while Draco Meteor OHKOs.

Latias - Choice Specs = Lure with Latias & Switch to Empoleon. CM sweeper is setup for Empoleon if they lack Thunderbolt (which they often do) and is 2HKOd by Ice Beam.

Kingdra - Every set except Specially Based Rain Dance is walled by Empoleon.

Lucario - Infernape OHKOs with Mach Punch. Celebi survives boosted Crunch to paralyze and make it easier to deal with.

Machamp - Machamp is just a bitch to deal with. Nothing likes confusion from Dynamic Punch. Thunder Wave makes No Guard versions easier to deal with but hurts my team considerably if they are Guts. Requires careful switching.

Magnezone - Rather predictable, and increasingly rare. This thing is extremely annoying to deal with as unless Empoleon is in Torrent range, it won't OHKO short of a hax crit. Once it is locked into an attack, and has taken out one of my steels, it is very easy to deal with. Celebi can take a Thunderbolt and paralyze any switch in that comes.

Mamoswine - Opposing Mamoswine are stopped dead in their tracks by Celebi and Infernape. Celebi is 3HKOd due to ridiculous bulk, so Leech Seed + Recover + Grass Knot is very effective in taking it out. Infernape with Mach Punch will take one out that has taken some damage.

Metagross - LeadGross is always defeated by Mamoswine. AgiliGross is more annoying but is dealt with by Celebi/Latias.

Salamence - Celebi will survive a +1 attack to Thunder Wave and stall. Empoleon can come in during outrage, setup and OHKO with Ice Beam. Scizor does upwards of 60% with Bullet Punch. Mamoswine can revenge kill with Ice Shard. Still a very potent threat.

Scizor - Most Scizor users are overly predictable and are therefore very easy to counter through proper switching. Empoleon comes in after Pursuit, or on a Bullet Punch, Agility, and Surfs that bastard to hell.

Starmie - Starmie doesn't really have the power to hurt Latias too badly with non-stab Ice Beam, and Latias OHKOs with Thunderbolt. Celebi paralyzes and makes it much easier to deal with.

Tyranitar - Infernape all the way. Close Combat is a clean kill, Mach Punch revenge kills a DDer. Choice Bander is easy to get around with good prediction/Close Combat. Scizor does around 95% with Bullet Punch.

Zapdos - Celebi's Thunder Wave + Ice Shard + Latias' good resistences take it down. Offensive Zapdos is rather frail so powerful attacks take it down easily enough.

Defensive Threats:

Blissey - Scizor, Infernape, Mamoswine

Bronzong - Infernape Overheat OHKOs non-Heatproof, otherwise Mamo.

Celebi - A bitch to deal with, which is why I have one on my team. Overheat OHKOs, but without Infernape, it becomes harder to counter. MUCH HARDER.

Cresselia - Let me preface by saying that I FUCKING HATE CRESSELIA it has collectively better Defensive stats than Deoxys-D. Why not make Deoxys-D OU and Cresselia Uber? God its such a pain in the ass with Reflect cutting Scizor's attack. Scizor's U-Turn takes a sizeable chunk out of it no matter what the condition is. Leech Seed will aid in stalling Cresselia out, particularly if it lacks Moonlight or a Sandstorm is occurring.

Forretress - Latias HP [Fire] OHKOs. Infernape Overheat OHKOs. Hope it doesn't go boom.

Gliscor - If it switches into a +2 Spd Empoleon, then Empoleon will get the chance to OHKO with Ice Beam. Mamoswine OHKOs with Ice Shard. Most Gliscor are hardpressed to break Celebi.

Gyarados - Celebi again, Latias can use Thunderbolt to deal heavy damage to it.

Hippowdon - Empoleon deals huge damage with Surf (80% OHKO with Stealth Rock to Standard wall)

Jirachi - My description of Jirachi: People at GameFreak were at a business meeting and were discussing their clients. "Our clients are angry, but they aren't insane with rage...how can we focus that rage? Oh, lets give a 100 Base Pokemon the ability to Flinch to death its "Counters" and see how much fun noobs have when they win after 33 Iron Head spams!" But seriously: Trickrachi is generally only seen as a lead, so Protect lets me scout whether Jirachi will trick or Iron Head Mamoswine. If he Iron Head's Empoleon will like setting up, and if he tricks, then my opponent has a pokemon with some of the best offensive STABs runnning around. Support Jirachi is OHKOd by Infernape.

Rotom-H - Not my favorite thing to deal with. Celebi can take Shadow Ball, which they usually go for over Overheat right away. If they DO Overheat, my options expand, as they lose their ability to damage my sweepers. Latias OHKOs Rotom-H if they have taken some prior damage (about 25%).

Skarmory - Latias' Thunderbolt, Infernape's Overheat, easy set-up for Empoleon.

Snorlax - Not hard to deal with so much as it takes a while and I have to be careful. Leech Seed + Thunder Wave means he takes damage and occasionally won't attack. Latias' Draco Meteor does a fair amount of damage to him, and from there, provided he doesn't have too many Curses up, Mamoswine Earthquake or Choice Band Super Power/STAB Close Combat can finish the job.

Suicune - Celebi laughs at Suicune. Empoleon can setup on Suicune lacking Hidden Power Electric and 2HKO a +1 Suicune.

Swampert - Celebi laughs harder at Swampert with Ice Beam doing laughable damage to it and Grass Knot OHKOs. Empoleon always outspeeds them and OHKOs with Grass Knot, which they never expect

Tyranitar - See offensive counters.

Vaporeon - Vaporeon is quite possibly the strongest physical wall in OU, or at least the hardest to break without boosts. Cresselia will fall to status and lack of healing, Skarmory will die to Thunderbolt, but with Heal Bell, Wish, Protect, and Surf, Vaporeon does NOT DIE. This team of mine actually beats her very well, it is just that almost every other team of mine struggles with her. Celebi 2HKOs with Grass Knot & Latias 2HKOs with Thunderbolt.

Zapdos - Same as offensive counters.

(By the way, edits to the formatting of the first opening statement will be made, right now my edit button is not working properly, but I'll post form a different computer tomorrow with edits made. At that point I'll delete this little message =))

Fleursily34 · Sep 28, 2009

Stealth Rock Anti Lead would be something that stops SR from being played on the field no? I don't see how protect is very helpful on Mamo... You also forgot to mention Shuca/Metagross which would annihilate with Meteor and Bullet...

Kachalski · Sep 28, 2009

Couple of things I'm picky about:

On that Mamoswine, I would give Endevour a try. Edouver + Focus Sash + Ice Shard is psuedo-F.E.A.R. and KO's most Pokemon who expect to kill that Mamo.

On Empoleon, 12 HP / 28 Def / 216 Spe / 252 SpA lets you survive a Earthquake from a DD TTar before a set-up, potentially letting you win if those are the only two Pokemon left.

On Scizor, I would try this EV spread: 160 HP / 176 Atk / 4 Spe / 168 SpD. This lets you survive a Draco Meteor from LO/Choice Scarf Latias on the first DM before the SpA drop, and as most Latias stay in, U-Turn will OHKO.

Other than that, good team.

Maci12 · Sep 28, 2009

7ay - As I explained, Protect lets me beast Fake Out leads. Infernape, Weavile, and Ambipom all lose to this lead because of Protect. I did not forget to mention ShucaTran, please read more carefully. Mamoswine OHKOs ShucaTran with STAB Earthquake. Metagross is covered as well, Earthquake + Ice Shard beats him. Please read my RMT, I put a lot of work into it.
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Stormkid5 - Thanks for the rate! Endeavor can raise some hell, but it requires that I drop Stealth Rock or Protect, meaning I don't set up Stealth Rock, or I lose to Fake Out leads hard. Endeavor is good for screwing with a whole bunch of things, but it actually kills the same things that Protect + Earthquake + Ice Shard do, as no matter what, Metagross & other common leads are usually within Ice Shard KO.

Addressing your Empoleon suggestion: I have tested a spread like that (40 HP/216 Spd/252 SAtk. It helpful in surviving attacks, but it barely survives those attacks, and the Life Orb recoil KOs it afterwards. The speed is also important, as I found that many more pokemon were able to switch in and outspeed it, even after the Agility boost, where as with 252 Speed, base 130's are outsped.

The Scizor spread is one I most certainly will test, thank you for the suggestion. = ) Thank you for taking the time to read through my RMT, I appreciate it.

Kachalski · Sep 28, 2009

Maci12 said:
7ay - As I explained, Protect lets me beast Fake Out leads. Infernape, Weavile, and Ambipom all lose to this lead because of Protect. I did not forget to mention ShucaTran, please read more carefully. Mamoswine OHKOs ShucaTran with STAB Earthquake. Metagross is covered as well, Earthquake + Ice Shard beats him. Please read my RMT, I put a lot of work into it.
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Stormkid5 - Thanks for the rate! Endeavor can raise some hell, but it requires that I drop Stealth Rock or Protect, meaning I don't set up Stealth Rock, or I lose to Fake Out leads hard. Endeavor is good for screwing with a whole bunch of things, but it actually kills the same things that Protect + Earthquake + Ice Shard do, as no matter what, Metagross & other common leads are usually within Ice Shard KO.

Addressing your Empoleon suggestion: I have tested a spread like that (40 HP/216 Spd/252 SAtk. It helpful in surviving attacks, but it barely survives those attacks, and the Life Orb recoil KOs it afterwards. The speed is also important, as I found that many more pokemon were able to switch in and outspeed it, even after the Agility boost, where as with 252 Speed, base 130's are outsped.

The Scizor spread is one I most certainly will test, thank you for the suggestion. = ) Thank you for taking the time to read through my RMT, I appreciate it.

I thought you were running SubPetaya sorry. I would give SubPetaya with that Spread a go though, most of you team can kill the things that would stop a SubPetaya sweep.

Maci12 · Sep 28, 2009

Haha, I used to run SubPetaya, but that destroys Empoleon's sweeping potential if any priority user comes in (Even 4x resistence CB Bullet Punch from Scizor is about 20%). So I turned to AgiliThree Attacks. With much better speed, it sacrifices a little power for a lot of destruction.

Colonel M · Sep 28, 2009

Actually ShucaGross could beat Mamo one-on-one but that's besides the point.

One glaring problem is said Paralysis. We have Celebi in here, but what is up with the lack of Heal Bell? This move would be good to implement on Celebi over Leech Seed since it would help keep the team afloat.

Nice team though. I'd try Heal Bell if you can so Paralysis and Will-O-Wisp doesn't screw around with you.

Maci12 · Sep 28, 2009

ShucaGross could yes, but most run Occa. Oh wait 7ay, I thought you meant ShucaTran, not ShucaGross, for some reason. Sorry for flipping out =(. Yeah but still ShucaGross is really rare and is still beatable if they SR first turn or I switch.

Heal Bell makes sense on Celebi, especially with supporting team, but often times, Leech Seed Stall is vital to its survival. I'll test that out and see how it fairs. Thanks for the suggestion =)

Roflmao23 · Sep 28, 2009

I also use a Mamoswine lead, and I think your right they are the best! ;D
I use Endeavor instead of Protect and I think you should do the same. Endeavor beats Swampert, Azelf and rare Gyarados Leads. Fake out leads aren't a problem, you could easily change to Celebi and then switch back to Mamoswine. What is so great about Mamoswine is that with Endeavor nothing can set up on them. (Unleash they break the Sash first). Please test it.
Note: I take atleast 2 pokemons down with Mamoswine 3 times per day. (No kiding.)

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