Team Gyarados OU RMT

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Hi, about 3 months ago I picked up Pokemon Platinum and got back into pokemon for the first time since about 2005. At this time I simply played the games, never really having battles in tournaments or with friends. Well after completing platinum ,which I was playing on and off for about 2 months I tried to get into competitive battling. Thats why I downloaded Shoddy. At the time I loved watching UU matches on Youtube so I made some UU teams and started playing. It is only recently however that I started on OU. Here is the best team I have made so far.


My idea was a bit of a crazy on but it was to base a team around Gyarados. I will now show how my team building process went:
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My first pokemon will obviously be Gyarados who is one of my faourite pokemon along side Pinsir and Miltank. I think it has great Physical attacking stats with a decent speed stat that can be boosted by DD. It is also bulky enough to take some hits before going down.
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Next I chose Electivire thanks to it's great ability Motor Drive. This means when I initially bring Gyra in. If they bring in an electric pokemon I can normally switch for the speed boost thn EQ it to get rid of Gyardos's main counter.
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I now didn't have a lead and I needed another electric counter as this was what mostly threatens a Gyarados sweep. I also needed a pokemon to set up rocks so Swampert seemed perfect for the role.
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I then thought that I needed a special sweeper. Salamence was the first thought to enter my mind but then I thought of a SpecsLucario. I knew that most people would counter with a physical wall and also Lucario is one great special sweeper with anawesome Sp atk stat of 115. If i'm honest it is amost stealing the show from Gyarados.
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I then realised that other thn Swampert I needed some bulk. Latias seemed perfect as it could take hits but also be just as offensive so I went for the CM one.
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The last spot on my team was a very hard decision. I was going from belly passing Smeargles to WishBliss' so I asked for help in the main chat. That was when someone gave me the idea of Dusknoir and it seemed good. It could block any rapid spinners trying to blow away the rocks and had good defensive stats to be the wall that i needed.
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After a few rates I could tell that Rotom-H would easily outclass Dusknoir and this set was mentioned twice therefore I thought I sould give it a shot so Dusknoir leaves as Rotom-H comes in. He adds a noral and fighting immunity while also having levitae to be immune to ground.
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After at least 3 people mentioning it I went for T'tar as it is good at eliminating threats as lots of people said and can easily reveng ekill most pokemon as I have given it a scarf for it's birthday. (in depth look at T'tar coming soon)


After all of the above thought I put it into Marrilands team builder and this is the result I got:

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I have a lot of resistances with no real holes although a few types only have 1 switch in on my team. I also have quite a lot of immunities including 3 ground immunities (Rotom and Latias didnt come up as immune for some reason although they both have the ability levitate) Some people have a Magnezone in their team purely to take out Scizor but I have never had any problems with it as it's main move, Bullet Punch is steel and I have 4 steel resistances.

Anyway lets look at the team in a bit more detail:
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Swampert - Relaxed @Leftovers
EVs: 240HP/216Def/52SpcAtk

-Stealth Rock
-Ice Beam
-Roar
-Earthquake

On the first turn I will obviously set up rocks as that is Swamperts main purpose. Ice Beam and EQ is to try and hit most pokemon well. Here is what I would do against the top 5 leads in OU.

Azelf - Set up Stealth rock then use Ice beam to weaken it somewhat. I try to get it into KOable area then switch to Rotom-H to take the predicted Explosion,
Metagross - Will normally EQ it straight away to get rid of it as fast as possible then when I next get the chance, I set up rocks, normally after the Gross is dead.
Jirachi - Set up rocks while they do then use EQ for the 2HKO
Aerodactyl - Set up SR then Ice beam, This can normally tke it to the sash and then KO on next turn.
Swampert - As it completely walls my own one I normally roar it away straight away then set up rocks on the new pokemon.

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Gyarados - Adamant @Life Orb
EVs: 252Atk/252Spd/4def
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge

Gyarados is my favorite pokemon due to it's sheer power. It's amazing how often I can switch in and set up a DD on the switch or while taking a hit which gyarados normally does well. This pokemon is normally left till late game when the opponent only has about 2-3 pokemon left and it can set up and sweep the whole team. Stone edge and EQ combination speaks for itself as they both compliment each other coverage wise. I also try to use waterfall if it as effective as EQ or SE on a pokemon because it is STABed which obviously adds even more power.


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Tyranitar - Adamant @Choice Scarf
252Atk/252Spd/4HP

- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Stone edge
- Aqua Tail

At first I couldn't get this to work. I tried adding a CB to it as everyone was telling me to but it was outsped by everything. I then thought to myself, why not scarf it. It has worked, this thing is revenge killing, Switching in and killing and basically killing everything in it's path. I don't understand how you can have a T'tar that isn't scarfed and I can tell you that when it is, it owns. It can beat any electric pokemon with Earthquake any rock or ground pokemon with Stone Edge for Gyara are taken out by Aqua Tail and any ghost or psychics such as celebi are taken down by crunch. All of these pokemon threaten gyara. And are threatened by T'tar

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Lucario - Jolly @Life Orb
EVs: 252Atk/252Spd/4HP

- Swords dance
- Close Combat
- ExtremeSpeed
- Crunch

While my team is meant to be based around Gyarados it is more a Gyarados and Lucario team as both of them are extreme problems for unprepared teams and if a team hasn't thought about Gyarados or Lucario when team-building then they will run riot. It used to be a Specs one to try and balance out my attackers but if I'm honest SD Lucario rips through physical walls anyway. Close combat kills off Metagross and Porygon-z - two Gyarados counters. Crunch OHKOes most Ghost switch-ins on Lucario and also Celebi, another counter to the great Gyarados. ExtremeSpeed can revenge kill relatively well as long as the opposite pokemon is weakened however due to his decent speed. Lucario can revenge kill with Crunch or Close Combat.

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Latias - Timid @Leftovers
EVs:252SpAtk/252Spd/4HP

- Calm mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Surf
- Recover

Ok first of all, HOW THE HELL IS THIS OU. It is soo good at Calm minding up against anything. A lot of things find it hard to OHKO this pokemon unless they can hit it with an Ice beam or a Ghost/Dark move so Recover keeps it alive. This thing laughs in the face of mence once it has calm minded up. Recently while facing a mence I had +1 Calm minds and a Mence used Draco meteor and I used Dragon Pulse. Guess who came out on top. Yes latias with enough HP to allow it to recover back to full in the following two turns. Surf is mainly there to hit any grounds or fire pokemon. This means that no pokemon but Empoleon resists this set. Surf also helps with Heatran which is a bit of a problem to my team unless I bring out Gyarados as Swampert can't normally KO it.

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Rotom-H - Modest @Choice Scarf
4HP/252SpA/252Spe

- Thunderbolt
- Overheat
- Shadow Ball
- Trick

This pokemon is kind of holding the team together. It can switch in against any fighting, ground or normal type attack and be immune and kill the opponent off with one of it's powerful moves. It is also my main Latias killer switching in and KOing with Shadow ball then switching out again. Rotom with a scarf also happens to be a great revenge killer as it outspeeds quite a lot of unscarfed pokemon. It also ripples Blissey or any other walls with trick. Locking them into one move then allows me to kill it a lot easier.


So I will give you a basic idea of what I do to my team. I will do my best to set up rocks with swampert. I then often find myself roaring through a lot of his teams. This gives me an idea of what pokemon I need to lure in and take out who may be threats to Lucario or gyarados getting a sweep. If my Swampert does get killed though I will revenge kill with Rotom or Tyranitar who generally can revenge kill any thing between them. I normally then have to switch out with them as they realize I am scarfed and bring in a counter. I will then normally switch in swampert or Latias as they can take whatever hit he throws at me. I will go through trying to revenge kill all the counters and killing a few with Latias and Swampert. When I get the chance I then switch in A sweeper when I get the chance and set up. It will normally take a few pokemon for them to stop my sweeper and can clean up with the other sweeper.

Threat List:

Azelf: Generally a lead I have explained how I take it to the point where it will use explosion and then switch to Rotom-A.

Breloom: This is an annoying pokemon to any team due to spore. However, once it has spored one of my team (I usually make it spore swampert because after SR it is just used to take hits and roar. I can then kill it with Rotom easily or any other decently fast pokemon)

Celebi: A very annoying pokemon especially to Swampert as it OHKOes with grass knot. However it can't do too much against my other pokemon. Grass knot doesnt do much to gyarados and Lucario or Tyranitar can outspeed it and hit it with crunch. Rotom also has overheat and can outspeed it with it's scarf.

Electivire: Swampert is immune to any electric attacks and can kill it with earthquake. Tyranitar also outspeeds and kills with Earthquake.

Empoleon: A quite annoying pokemon if it gets torrent and a speed boost from a berry or agility. It completely walls Latias and

Flygon: Ground/Dragon. Waterfall from Gyarados, Ice beam from Swampert, Close Combat from Lucario. A lot of things can take this out

Gengar: Used to be a weaka point but due to Tyranitar and Lucario now having crunch with Rotom having Shadow ball, I can easily take it out unless its scarfed.

Gliscor: Generally a lead which is 2HKOed by Ice beam from Swampert who can then SR and the following turn

Gyarados: Ironically, one of my best counters is my own gyarados as long as it's got a DD under its belt Stone Edge KOes. Rotom-A can also thunderbolt it although this is very predictable. I can also roar it while it DDs to stop it setting up.

Heatran: Tormenttran is annoying as it is to any team but any water or ground attack which my team has many of can kill it.

Heracross: Is outsped by Lucario and can be KOed with CC or Rotom-A with scarf can outspeed and overheat. If this is scarfed then I can lure it into close combat and switch to Rotom.

Infernape: This pokemon is one of the best ways to check if your team has resistances but I think I can take it with either of my sweepers or an Earthquake from Swampert

Jirachi: Another annoying pokemon with it's serene Grace boosted Iron head. If I do get a kit in though it can be crunch from Luc or Tyranitar or shadow ball and Overheat from Rotom or even

Kingdra: A pokemon that is quite underrated, can do some damage to my team however a thunderbolt Rotom can generally kill it or an Ice beam from Swampert hurts.

Latias: My Own Latias beats it if it already has a Calm mind up but it generally doesn't so Rotom with shadow ball becomes my Latias killer.

Lucario: My own Lucario can kill it if it wins the speed tie. It beats any adamant ones though. Other than that I can beat it with Rotom unless Lucario packs crunch.

Machamp: Machamp with dynamic punch is literally broken. It does generally spam it though which allows a free Rotom switch in and doing some damage with thunderbolt

Magnezone: No trouble as it only traps Lucario which can kill it with a close combat.

Mamoswine: Earthquake immunities stop it from using that and most of my pokemon have Ice as neutral so Ice shard is pretty weak. Avalanche can do damage but Rotoms Overheat kills it

Metagross: Killed by Close Combat, Overheat or Earthquake.

Ninjask: Generally a lead that gets Roared by my Swampert. After that it is hurt a lot by SR and an easy kill.

Porygon-Z:One of the problems my Gyarados is countered by. My Lucario can kill it though.

Rhyperior: Killed by Aqua Tail, waterfall, Close combat, Ice beam.

Roserade: Roared before it gets 2 T spikes out and when it comes back in it can be overheated or ice beamed. Quite a frail pokemon.

Rotom-A: Actually quite a problem when scarfed that is only really countered by my own Rotom and who wins is based on the speed tie.

Salamence: How do you predict this thing, Anyway my Latias can sometimes take it but if not it is OHKOed by a stone edge from Gyarados or Tyranitar.

Scizor: Not much trouble for my team as it is quite fast paced and Scizors speed is pretty low and Scizor's BP does nothing to my team thanks to 4 steel resists

Snorlax: More than threaten my team it just annoys by trying to stall me out with rest and sleep talk however Lucario goes to town on it.

Suicune: Quite good as a Lucario and Gyarados counter so I made it listed as problematic. Rotom can kill it however.

Togekiss: Another annoying Serene Grace user but this time with Air slash. This pokemon is quite easily taken out with any Stone edge user so it isn't too difficult.

Tyranitar: As nearly everyone gives theres a Choice band I can easily outspeed and kill with any water or ice pokemon.

Weavile: Due to it's frailness any Priority or scrfer can kill it after stealth rock really.

Yanmega: If it leads I roar it straight away and SR. If it is switched in then it is already at 50% health and I roar it again. This makes it pretty much dead if my Tyranitar has been in at all due to sandstorm.

Zapdos: Due to being immune to Earthquake it isn't as easy to take out as other electric types however Ice beam or Stone edge can kill it.​

This threat list was taken from this thread:http://www.smogon.com/forums/announcement.php?f=52&a=29. If there are any pokemon missing then tell me.

Thanks you for reading.

Including the team building and writing out this page, this RMT took me about 3 1/2 hours.

Here is a last look at the team:
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Looks fine, but I have a few suggestions:

- On Gyarados, make his nature Adamant or Jolly.

- On Dusknoir, you might wanna change Fire Punch to Shadow Sneak.

- There are NO ev's on Electivire! I suggest: 4 HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spe

Otherwise the team looks fine.
Hope I helped ^^
 
Sorry they were mistakes. My gyarados has Adamant nature and I will add in Electivire EVs now. And I was thinking the same thing about putting shadow sneak on Dusknoir just didnt know what move to swap out Ill ake those changes now.
 
Hey porygon-d. I see you took my advice on synergy and that kind of stuff. There are many spelling errors in your RMT which i am sure you can edit quickly and easily if you just proofread it. A small note, You have missed out a lot of imformation on your Electivire. Mainly the EVs. As for the team itself, I'd say it's pretty good except i can see you being sweeped by a gengar, especially a life orb variant. It can T-bolt you Gyara, Focus Blast/HP Fire your Lucario, Shadow Ball your Latias and Dusknoir. Electivre could possibly be beaten as well and Swampert is easily 2HKO'd. I'd recommend something which can easily beat it, a good special wall like Blissey (actually i don't like Blissey even though it's effective) or maybe even a Bronzong. Suicune, after a few CMs, can take Gengar's T-bolts and Umbreon might be able to survive ffor a bit. Blissey will still be your best bet though.
As for Each Indiviual pokemon:

Swampert- Good, sturdy lead but is easily beaten by taunt leads. For Swampert, it's top prioirty is to get SR down but with Trickers and Taunters around, this is an extremely tough thing for a slow lead like Swampert to do. You could add a list detailing what you would do against the top 10/15 leads.

Gyarados- I'd use Return/EQ over Stone Edge. Only other thing is, change the nature to Adamant. Lonely is lowering how bulky it is. Besides, you have no special attacks on the set.Otherwise, it would be better to run a Bulky set with Taunt. Just keep than in mid for future teams.

Electivire: Fine here although for the choice of item, you could possibly have Life Orb or the ever useful Leftovers. IMO, Expert Belt would be the best since you're pairing it with Gyara and trying to kill as many things as you can with it.

Lucario: Everything is fine.

Latias: Great but i'd suggest Recover over Grass Knot. You've already got Surf after all seeing as Grass Knot is only for Suicune.

Dusknoir: No problems here.
 
Will proof read and fix tommorrow am too tired now so going to bed. Thanks for rate and will look in more detail tommorrow cya also I have put in Electivires EVs and item now
 
Hey Porygon, there are 2 pokemon who i would like to suggest different movesets.

For Gyarados,

Gyarados - Adamant @Life Orb
EVs: 252Atk/252Spd/4def
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge


Earthquake is chosen over Ice Fang because its more than 50% more powerful, covers Steel Types for Super, and you really don't lose any coverage. Ice moves are usually used for dealing with dragon types and gliscor. However, Stone edge destroys Salamence/Dragonite, and Waterfall kills gliscor.

Also,

Latias - Timid @Leftovers
EVs:252SpAtk/252Spd/4HP

- Calm mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Recover
- Refresh/Roar

I will tell you, this latias is a beast. It has killed Blisseys. Refresh when they t-wave/toxic you, and just CM away :)

Also, Refresh is replacable with Roar. When someone starts CMing, just come in and CM along. Then, just roar them away.

Recover is NECESSARY if you want to pull of 3-6 CMs. CM and Dragon Pulse are no brainers. I just explained Roar.
 
This team has alot of potential, and I think I can make this team realize it. There might be quite a bit of changes though, so bear with me. Firstly, Rotom-A outclasses Dusknoir in nearly every way, having the electric-type and levitate, giving it more resistances, and acts as a better spin blocker/ explosion absorber for your team. the sets I'd suggest depend on the set of Lucario really. I'm going to suggest SD luke in a bit, and therefore if you decide to change to SD luke, you really want a Scarf version of it to help against opposing SD Lucario. The best spread to use for this team should be something like 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe, Timid, with the item Choice Scarf, and the moves: Shadow Ball, Thunderbolt, Overheat, Trick. Any combination of evs and moves work just make sure you outspeed all Gyarados (216 Spe evs with timid) and have something to kill Lucario. If you decide to keep Lucario as a Specs version, I'd suggest a defensive version to help you against opposing Gyarados, as you'll check Luke with a Spec'd vacuum wave. 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD, Bold, with the item Leftovers, and the moves: Thunderbolt, Rest, Sleep Talk, and Will-o-wisp or Shadow Ball would be the most optimal spread for a defensive Rotom OHKOing Gyarados with thunderbolt and helping check against offensive threats in general while being an excellent anti rapid spinner. I'd personally suggest defensive as I'll be suggesting another thing with this rate, and he'll give you a bulky check to Scizor.

You should really use Swords Dance Lucario over your current specs Luke. This team has excellent synergy with it, and can provide you with a late game sweep most of the time. Lucario can and will weaken and/or kill Gyara's counters allowing it to sweep. Nothing can really survive a LO +2 Close Combat, and things like Swampert and Skarmory will get OHKOed provided you have Stealth Rock on the field. 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe, with an Adamant nature, the item Life Orb, and the moves: Swords Dance, Close Combat, ExtremeSpeed, and either Stone Edge or Crunch. I listed both Stone Edge and Crunch because it really depends on what you want it to do. If you opt for Stone Edge, you can take on opposing Zapdos and Gyarados, and if you go with Crunch, you can hit most defensive Rotom-a, Dusknoir, and Cresselia for Super-Effective damage as as having nearly perfect coverage alongside Close Combat (only resisted by Heracross in OU, which Extremespeed takes care of). It really depends on your preference as to what you want to hit.

Swampert really wants Roar over Surf. Surf has really redundant coverage with Ice Beam and Earthquake, and Ice Beam has more power against the things you really want to hit, like Gliscor, Flygon, and Salamence. Roar helps you prevent opposing pokemon from setting up on you. Things like Gyarados can't set up because you can just Roar them out as well as some set up pokemon and adding up more stealth rock damage overall. I also suggest you use a spread of 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk, just so you can never be OHKOed by a +1 LO Outrage coming from an Adamant Salamence. The spread you are currently using was for the OHKO on Garchomp, but since he is uber, the spread I suggested is much better.

Gyarados really wants Leftovers and some other move over Ice Fang. Ice Fang has very low Base Power and in most cases can't even help you take out Celebi. Bounce or Earthquake can work over Ice Fang for a little better coverage. Bounce gives you another STAB move, and it does plenty more against celebi and, as long as they don't have protect lol, you can beat them. Earthquake completes the quakedge combo and with waterfall gives you perfect coverage, while also helping you out with sub-petaya Empoleon.

Electivire isn't really a big threat and gets walled by so much, and it really holds your team back offensively and defensively. Swampert resists Electric and you still struggle against random scarfers like Rotom-a and Latias. Choice Band Tyranitar would do wonders on this team, helping to effectively switch in, pursuit, and kill those Scarfers that can check Lucario and Gyarados, helping them to sweep unhinged most of the time. 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 SpD, Careful, the item Choice Band, and the moves: Pursuit, Crunch, Stone Edge, and Earthquake. With Sandstorm and the evs, you can take on pretty much any special attack, including Scarftran Fire Blasts, and it can even take a Life Orb Focus Blast from Timid Gengar.

Finally, try out a Scarf Latias over your current one. Even with Swampert, you really have a lot of trouble with Salamence, and another check/revenge to Gyarados can't hurt. Latias helps against other things too, be it a timely trick against stall or killing off some big threats like the aforementioned Salamence and Gyarados. 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe, Timid, with the item Choice Scarf, and the moves: Draco Meteor, Thunderbolt, Surf, and Trick. Just try it out and see how it works. I know this is a lot of changes, but I feel this was needed to help you make the best team possible. Just try all of them out and see what works best :)

Good Luck!
 
I recommend Rotom over Dusknoir. Rotom-A can basically do what your Dusknoir is currently doing, but better. Rotom-h is usually better than Dusnoir because Rotom's Electric typing with Levitate gives it a significant defensive advantage, since it can effectively counter Scizor with little to no problem, Metagross, Scarf Jirachi, etc, all of which give Dusknoir more trouble. Both Dusknoir and Rotom share one main threat, CB Tyranitar, who can OHKO both with Crunch. Rotom is quicker, has the ability to use more powerful attacks, has better typing, is immune to Spikes and Toxic Spikes, can one or two-hit KO every Rapid Spinner in OU, and has more status inducing options while being able to carry out more than one strategy unlike Dusknoir.

Have you ever considered trying a Swords Dance Lucario over your current Choice Specs set? The reason I say this is because you have two Pokemon who gives Lucario an opportunity to set up a Swords Dance to cause plenty of trouble for your opponent. These Pokemon are none other than Latias and Dusknoir. Both Dusknoir and Latias attract Pursuit users, mainly Tyranitar, to come in and kill them. When Latias/Dusknoir is killed by Crunch/Pursuit, Lucario can come in and set on what would most likely be a locked Crunch or Pursuit from Choice Band Tyranitar, and begin to deal massive damage to your opponent. Swords Dance Lucario is also great at opening up holes for your Gyarados to take advantage of, making it something to consider. The typical SD set for Lucario is: Swords Dance, Close Combat, Crunch, ExtremeSpeed, 252 Speed, 252 Attack, 6 HP, Life Orb Adamant. Close Combat for STAB, Crunch for Pokemon such as Cresselia, Celebi, etc while ExtremeSpeed gives Lucario a priority move to kill fast frail threats such as Azelf, among many others.

If you want to stick with Choice Specs Lucario, try Hidden Power Rock over Hidden Power Ice. You'll be able to OHKO Gyarados and Salamence factoring in Stealth Rock while 2HKOing Gliscor. Your team doesn't really have problems with Gliscor at all for Lucario to be using HP Ice, so HP Rock can be used. Gliscor will outrun Lucario most of the time as well, so the only way you'll beat Gliscor is by catching it on the switch-in.

If you want to keep Electivire, suggest you make it a mixed sweeper. Your current set has a hard time getting past sturdy physical walls such as Swampert, Hippowdon, Donphan, etc, meaning you'll have a hard time getting a sweep off with Electivire. On the other hand, mixed Electivire can take out some of it's usually counters by using a Special Attacking set. Think about what Pokemon tend to switch-in on Electivire often. Those Pokemon are Hippowdon, Forretress, Donphan, Celebi, Bronzong, etc. All of those Pokemon tend to invest on more physical Defense than Special Defense, meaning you'll hit them harder with your special attacks. The set can be found here.

Now what I was really thinking of using over Electivire was a Scizor. Nothing on your team can really take a Draco Meteor from Salamence or even Latias, and with Scizor, you'll be able to do that. In addition, Scizor has the added benefit of using Pursuit to rid of Pokemon such as Scarf Latias which can halt a Gyarados sweep. Furthermore, with U-turn, Scizor can wear down Pokemon such as Rotom-A, making it easier for Gyarados to finish them. With Bullet Punch, Scizor serves as a nice revenge killer and check to Salamence, making it a nice choice over Electivire. I have a bulky Scizor set in mind, such as the trapper found here here.

Lastly, Surf does not provide much coverage on Swampert. Surf hits Rock, Water, and Ground-types super effectively. You have Rock-types dealt with by Earthquake, most Fire-type dealt with by Earthquake and most Ground-types dealt with by Ice Beam. Consider Roar instead. It will allow you to phaze away a Pokemon that is threatening you and can scout some of your opponents Pokemon while racking up some SR damage as well.
 
I also suggest a Rotom-A over Dusknoir. Rotom-H provides the great defensive capabilities of Dusknoir, serves as a great spin-blocker, has levitate, but has better resists as an electric-ghost type. I recommend the choice scarf version to come in and outspeed and OHKO a SD lucario. Heres the set:

Rotom-H @ Choice Scarf
4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature

~ Thunderbolt
~ Overheat
~ Shadow Ball
~ Trick

Serves as a pretty good revenge killer with its nice coverage and respectable special attacker. It can also be great at crippling walls if you predict correctly, which will help out your sweepers.

I'm also not satisfied with your Gyarados's moveset. Ice Fang + Stone Edge gives minimal coverage, so you should really choose one. I'd recommend Stone Edge as it is great against Ice and Bugs, which could shrug off Gyara's other attacks. Ice Fang, for me, seems just too weak and really only serves one purpose, to take out dragons. Since almost all of em fly too, you should be able to take out things like Salamence in one hit after a Dragon Dance anyways. Stone Edge is also great for taking down other Gyaras that you might run into.

Use this moveset:

Gyarados @ Life Orb
Jolly Nature
252Atk/ 252Spd/ 4Def

~Dragon Dance
~Waterfall
~Stone Edge
~Earthquake

Earthquake is the most used move in all tiers, and rightfully so, ground just pairs well with water and rock moves. It provides a great move to go to against electric switch ins, and can take down the poisons and steel types that Stone Edge and Waterfall cannot. Overall, a great move, at 100 base power and 100 accuracy. And in my opinion, worth having over Ice fang.

well, i think about everything else has been covered by other raters. Overall, this team is pretty good, the GyaraVire combo has always been one of my faves.

gl with the team
 
On looking through the above posts, the changes I would make straight away is to swap Ice fang for EQ on Gyarados, Roar on Swampert and Recover on Latias.

Now I will change Dusknoir to Rotom - H. Everyone is saying that it is better in almost every way so will get that changed soon. I am willing to change out Electivire but I would prefer to do it for a Special attacking pokemon especially if everyone is asking me to switch to an SD luc which I'm not too sure about as it is my only Special sweeper on the team unless you count Latias which is now going more defensive.
I will make the obvious edits now but don't want to switch luc to physical without having another special sweeper to take his place so I will wait it out. That isn't to say I won't follow all of your advice I just don't see how my team can function with it being so physically based when it was already on the physical side
Thanks for the help guys its given me something to think about.
 
Well, you are probably using Electivire for an Electric immunity, so I'd suggest Jolteon as a replacement.

Jolteon @ Life Orb
4 HP, 252 Special Attack, 252 Speed, Timid
Volt Absorb
Thunderbolt
Shadow Ball
Hidden Power [Grass]
Baton Pass / Charge Beam

A basic Special Sweeper. The last slot is up to you, Baton Pass scouts for counters, while Charge Beam can give you a Special Attack boost.
 
You could change lucario to the SD or CB variation and switch electivire with a LO or specs jolteon.

Jolteon - Timid/Modest @ Life Orb/Choice specs
EVs 252 spA, 252 spd, 4 hp

Charge Beam/Thunder bolt
Hidden Power grass
Shadow Ball
Signal Beam

With volt absorb jolteon can come in on electric attacks and recover off residual damage from rocks or whatever. I would recommend using hp grass over ice for better synergy with your team. Use Thunderbolt on the specs set and charge beam on the LO set.

If you go with Jolteon, I would recommend changing lucario to a physical set. Extremespeed from lucario will be very helpful for revenge killing weak enemies too.
 
Agreeing with almost evreything joshe and bloo said. However, I'd rather see Special Defensive CB Scizor instead of Special Defensive CB Tyranitar because Scizor checks all the scarfers that Tyranitar checks and has the added bonus of checking Salamence with his Bullet Punch. I recommend this set:

Scizor @ Choice Band
160 HP / 176 Atk / 4 Spe / 168 SpD
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SpA)
-U-turn
-Bullet Punch
-Superpower
-Pursuit

Also, go with that bulky choice scarf rotom Joshe suggested, except use this spread:

Rotom-H @ Choice Scarf
156 HP / 228 Spe / 124 SpA
Modest nature (+SpA, -Atk)
-Thunderbolt
-Shadow Ball
-Overheat
-Trick

quoting slowpokes:
"Speed evs allow rotom to beat all base 130's including jolly max speed breloom and adamant max spe mamoswine after tricking them a scarf. Maximum lefties point after getting a leftovers through tricking the scarf which is one of the most common items in todays metagame and 128 Sp atk is a jump point and is able to OHKO standard mamo with overheat IIRC. Rotom doesn't need timid as he is scarfed with specific speed evs that allow him to outspeed what needs to be outsped, and modest gives him an extra kick attack-wise. Tbolt is the main STAB on the set as well as shadow ball. They have almost unresisted coverage and overheat covers almost everything else."
 
I rewrote most of the RMT to make it a bit more detailed. I am also now not wanting to swap out E'vire because it is starting to look good. My team is now operating how I want it to so I won't be making much changes atm. That doesn't mean I won't make any changes at all. I just probably won't swap out any pokemon. And anyone who says SDluc is better than a Specs one has never tried a specs one because they rape so badly. I might even take off the specs and give it LO for sweeping potential as it is so good at just killing the opponent.

After seeing above post: After re-reading Joshe's post I understand what he was saying about the CB T'Tar. I dont really want to have a scizor on my team because:
1) Really boring, I mean how many times can you click bullet punch before you want to stab yourself in the eyes.
2) People bring pokemon along purely to counter scizors now so I don't really want on my team.

I will try out the T'Tar set though which would open up even more of a gap for me to LO Lucario. This would then allow me to have a mixed one which is so much harder to wall against. I also will add some bulk to the Rotom as I have noticed it can normally only take 1 hit so is not really good as a wall and is used more as an unexpected revenge killer. Thanks again for the rates guys. Really helping me to think bout different counters to my teams.

Another option I have is going with the Jolteon over E'vire. This would allow me to switch to an SD luc which soo many people have been telling me to do but I still think a specs one is awesome. I will do some testing of some of the options and find out which one works out the best.


After testing, Dugtrio and Jolteon seemed the best so I will continue to use the to to try and see what is the best
 
If your point in using electivire is eliminating counters rather than being a mixed sweeper, I'd like to suggest using dugtrio since it retains the immunity to electric but also traps (and easily kills in most cases) gyara's counters. Just a suggestion.
 
I agree with many that a Choice Band Tyranitar would be a good addition over Electivire on this team. Electivire is really only a gimmick IMO and isn't that good in this metagame. Choice band Tyranitar can greatly increase your chances of a Gyrados sweep as it can pursuit both Rotom and Latias which are two major obstacles in Gyra's path. Also, with these two becoming so popular you will often be able to take out both with Tyranitar carving a huge hole in the opponents team. Letting Gyrados sweep. Gyrados and Tyranitar is a great combination and this team has all the needs to support it.

About the Lucario. You say that you do not want to use SD Lucario because you want to split your attackers into the two spectrums. However, I would advise you to go with SD Lucario over Specs Lucario. There are a few reasons for this. One is that not many teams can survive a DD Gyra and an SD Lucario sweeping through them. Even if the opponent does have a physical wall, Gyrados should have weakened it enough for Lucario to sweep or vice versa. On top of this if you were to name the number one counter for Gyrados and Lucario it would most probably be Choice Scarf Rotom. However with a Choice Band Tyranitar this threat is basically gone bythe time you come to sweep and so Gyrados and Lucario are free to wreck havoc on your opponents team. Another reason for going with SD Lucario, is that you have the two most Pursuit bait pokemon out there in Latias and Scarf Rotom-H. If one of these dies then yes you can send in specs Luke but all it can do is attack and can't really utilise the free turn with a set up move. Therefore I think SD Lucario would be superior to Specs Luke on this team.


I also have a bit of a problem with your Latias. A calm minder is great but IMO I think you should go with a more defensive calm mind set with a moveset of CM/Roar/Dragon Pulse/Recover. Dragon is a great mono-attacking type so you don't need surf on this set. A more defensive latias with roar gives you a nice counter to other calm minders such as Jirachi and Crocune which really run through this team. Here you can calm Mind up with them and lol as you roar out there boosts. This thing can also run through teams as it can recover off weaker attacks and continue to set up. Another good thing about this latias is that as it is more defensive it will probably need a strong physical dark or bug type attack to actually knock it out which are just set up bait for Gyrados and Lucario. Max speed timid is a must on Latias IMO and you will probably want a lot of Hp Evs to take a few hits. Apart from that just play around with the Evs untill you like it.

Overall I suggest you implement these changes as they will help your team succeed better. Good luck and hope I helped.
 
OK all changes I'm probably going to make are made. May change one or two moves but at the moment I like the team. Please continue to rate it by simply rating or changing some minor things, it is my goal to get a rate off 20 people at least. I have 10 at the moment so come on people rate to your hearts content.
 
I have to agree with seven on the Latias. Its cool to have it hit hard right off the bat, but if youre going to give a moveslot to Calm Mind I think youll get a lot more of it by investing in its HP. I really like this team and the way the RMT was presented
 
Since you have now got a TTar, i recommend replacing your gyarados' item to something which doesnt lower it's health. Shell Bell is a fantastic alternative since it can be used to heal your gyarados too.
 
hey there,thanks for letting me know about your team,i might have some stuff for ya,some little changes that can be useful depending on the situation,here we go

on tyranitar,i sugest you run jolly over adamant,while adamant give you extra power,jolly allow you to outrun base 115 positive nature pokemons,you can count starmie on that list,a common counter to gyarados,i sugest you do almost the same in rotom,change to timid,if you do that you can revenge kill oposing gyarados even after a dragon dance,since you will still outspeed then even if they are jolly,because if they can outspeed your rotom they can sweep your team with waterfall,earthquake and ice fang(swampert will probaly be dead by that time or damaged enough to be finished by the gyarados).
i cant think of anything else by now,if i see anything else i will tell you,try try those nature changes out ok? oh! one more thing,change crunch on t-tar for pursuit,this way pokemons like starmie,rotom and other ghost types will have no way to escape,given that lots of pokemons that counter gyarados are weak to dark and fear pursuit,it might help you out,crunch or pursuit you are still setup bait for lucario so try pursuit ok?

edit=forgot one thing,gyarados dont outspeed anything running max speed with adamant nature since he reach about 392 or 393 after DD(cant remember how much) so you might want to lower the speed evs OR change the nature to jolly,if you want to change the evs put speed evs to 236 and dump the rest into HP,with that you will outspeed jolly weavile after DD,if you run max speed the only thing you will get is to speed tie with other max speed adamant gyarados,and the extra evs might help you survive a hit..
 
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