The Twin Turtles (Currently peaked at #51 on PO)

[Majestic Electric]

The Twin Turtles

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Hiya Smogon! It's me again with another RMT! I figured I should post my newest team before we move to PS. Anyway, I've been working on the team for awhile now and any help would be greatly appreciated, as there is always room for improvement. Currently, it is sitting at #51 on the PO ladder. Yeah, it's not an impressive peak, but for someone new to NU, I'd call it an accomplishment.
This team is focused around the core of Torterra and Carracosta. The idea came to mind when I wanted to use Torterra for a new team and I saw that he had decent synergy with his Water-type "cousin." So, without further ado, I present to you, The Twin Turtles! ​

*Changes will be in Blue.​

Team Building Process:​

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I started with Torterra and Carracosta, the twin turtles.

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Carracosta has decent synergy with Torterra, taking Fire, Flying, and Ice attacks for him. Grass-types would be a problem (Tangela, I hate you!), and so would Bugs. To take care of these issues I added Braviary to the mix. Later on, FLCL suggested I replace him with a Rotom-S, so I did! Thanks go out to FLCL for this idea!

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Right off the bat, I saw a big weakness to Electric. Torterra could take lightning like a boss, but I would be screwed if he went down early. Eelektross solved this problem, as he has enough bulk to take care of a bothersome Pikachu. Eelektross also has good synergy with Torterra and can take Ground moves for Carracosta. However, Emboar and Choice Banded Sawk turned out to be very hard to face and usually wrecked me. FLCL suggested I use Musharna instead, and it works very well with the team!

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At this point, I knew I needed a Poison-type to get rid of Toxic Spikes. I chose to use Skuntank. His good typing would help get rid of Toxic Spikes, while also giving Psychics a run for their money.

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Gurdurr filled the last slot of the team, serving as the glue and giving me more priority. Gurdurr could also come in and kill opposing Skuntank, or other Dark-types.

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And with that, my team was finally finished and ready for battle! :)​

The Team

Torterra (M) @Leftovers
Trait: Overgrow
EVs: 252 HP/56 Atk/200 Def
Impish Nature (+Def, -SpA)
-Stealth Rock
-Wood Hammer
-Earthquake
-Synthesis​

Torterra is easily one of the MVPs of the team and forms the first part of the twin turtle core. He serves the team as my physical wall and also sets up the ever important Stealth Rocks. Torterra also puts pressure on the opponent right from the start of the battle. If my opponent brings in their Stealth Rocker, it will die. If they don't bring it in, Rotom-S can come in without worry. An Impish nature, max HP, and 200 defense EVs makes Torterra very bulky. The remaining EVs are put into attack to give off more damage. Wood Hammer provides Torterra with a powerful STAB move, while Synthesis helps to replenish Torterra's health. This allows him to come in multiple times when needed.​

Carracosta (M) @White Herb
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 20 HP/252 Atk/236 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
-Shell Smash
-Aqua Jet
-Stone Edge
-Waterfall​

Carracosta, the second part of the core. Once he sets up, he turns into a dangerous sweeper! We all know how Shell Smash works. I gave him an Adamant nature so he can do as much damage as possible, especially after Shell Smash. With a White Herb, Carracosta does not have to worry about his lowered defenses after the boost, too. However, he is still pretty slow even with a boost, which is why Aqua Jet comes in handy. Waterfall is a more reliable STAB move and together has decent coverage with Stone Edge. ​

Rotom-S @Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
-Thunderbolt
-Air Slash
-Hidden Power (Ice)
-Volt Switch​

It's pretty clear that this is a poke specifically made to troll. It's typing and ability says it all! However, in NU, it is a lot more useful than some might think. It allows me to check Sawk (to an extent) and makes Grass-types squirm. Air Slash is great on this poke (and it suits him). A potential flinch is just icing on the cake! I gave him Hidden Power Ice to provide more coverage and potentially kill Swoobat. Volt Switch is a must on choiced Electrics, enough said.​

Musharna (F) @Leftovers
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 240 HP/252 Def/16 Spe
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
-Calm Mind
-Psychic
-Signal Beam
-Moonlight​

Musharna is hands down the best Psychic-type in NU! After a few boosts from Calm Mind, she becomes very dangerous! Sawk and Emboar will usually cower in a corner when they see her. The EVs and nature give her great bulk on the physical side. The remaining 16 EVs were put in Speed to outspeed other Musharna. Psychic is her best STAB move, causing ridiculous damage after Calm Mind. Signal Beam was used because it is helpful for catching things like Absol on the switch.​

Skuntank (M) @Life Orb
Trait: Aftermath
EVs: 20 HP/252 Atk/236 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
-Sucker Punch
-Crunch
-Poison Jab
-Taunt​

Another one of the team's MVPs. Skuntank is definitely one of the best Pokemon in the metagame! It gets rid of Toxic Spikes. It kills Psychics. It stops set-up sweepers in their tracks. Skuntank is just a great mon! Jolly nature and the given EVs allow Skuntank to outspeed Gardevoir. Max Attack with a Life Orb lets me do as much damage as possible. Sucker Punch gives me more priority, killing off weakened pokes with ease. Crunch is for a more reliable STAB move. Poison Jab is another STAB move and helps kill off Grass-types. Taunt stops set up sweepers from, well, setting up and makes clerics such as Lickilicky completely useless for the rest of the match. What can I say? Skuntank is just awesome!​

Gurdurr (M) @Eviolite
Trait: Guts
EVs: 252 HP/252 Atk/4 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
-Bulk Up
-Mach Punch
-Drain Punch
-Ice Punch​

Herp Derp Derp. On a serious note, Gurdurr is another great mon. He can set up on Skuntank and other Dark-types for days. It's also nice to know that he scares Cinccino away, too. Eviolite makes Gurdurr pretty bulky, allowing him to take a few hits while setting up in my foe's face. The Adamant nature and 252 attack EV's allows Gurdurr to do as much damage as possible. Mach Punch is a nice priority move and becomes quite powerful after a couple boosts. Drain Punch is for replenishing his health and it helps him last longer in battle. Ice Punch gives me a way to beat Golurk. ​

Importable​

Hide

Torterra (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Overgrow
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Atk / 200 Def
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Seed Bomb
- Earthquake
- Synthesis
Carracosta (M) @ White Herb
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Aqua Jet
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
Rotom-S @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA/ 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Thunderbolt
- Air Slash
- Hidden Power (Ice)
-Volt Switch
Musharna (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def/ 16 Spe
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Signal Beam
- Moonlight
Skuntank (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Aftermath
EVs: 20 HP/ 252 Atk/ 236 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SAtk)
- Sucker Punch
- Crunch
- Poison Jab
- Taunt
Gurdurr (M) @ Eviolite
Trait: Guts
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Mach Punch
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch​

So, that is the team! I'll continue playing around with it to try getting higher up on the ladder. If you guys have any suggestions, feel free to let me know. Thank you for reading and I hope you enjoyed it! :)​

 

[watashi]

This team is extremely weak to Choice Band Sawk; you literally have nothing that can switch into it. I would suggest replacing Braviary with Choice Scarf Rotom-S, which performs similar roles as a Scarfer and can check Sawk to an extent. Since Rotom would be pretty redundant with Eelektross, I would suggest replacing it with Choice Specs Musharna, which is a powerful Special Attacker that can pick up where Eelektross started. It also forms a great core with Skuntank and Gurdurr, as they can eliminate each others' counters.

There are also a few nitpicks that I would like to make. Seed Bomb is an outclassed move on Torterra; try using Bullet Seed to break through Sturdy or Wood Hammer, which is a much more powerful move with negligible recoil. For Carracosta, Earthquake doesn't really hit anything that Waterfall doesn't. Electric-types are already hit hard by Stone Edge so there isn't really a reason to use it. Skuntank's EV spread should be 72HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe with an Adamant nature to outspeed standard Absol or 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe to beat Jolly Samurott. You could also consider Leftovers as an item since it really helps with Skuntank's durability and allows it to beat Amoonguss and bulkier Pokemon that don't hit as hard. Gurdurr should use a spread of 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def with an Adamant nature to maximize recovery from Drain Punch and hit harder in general. Even with the Special Defense EV's, it still won't beat the Psychic-types that commonly check it. Payback is not as useful as Ice Punch, which allows it to hurt Rotom-S, Golurk, and Amoonguss, to name a few.

Summary of changes

Braviary —> Scarf Rotom-S
Eelektross —> Choice Specs Musharna
Seed Bomb —> Wood Hammer or Bullet Seed on Torterra
Stone Edge —> Waterfall on Carracosta
72HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe or 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe spread on Skuntank
Life Orb —> Leftovers on Skuntank (Optional)
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def spread on Gurdurr
Payback —> Ice Punch on Gurdurr

Hide

Musharna (M) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Trick
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

Rotom-S @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Air Slash
- Thunderbolt
- Trick

Good luck with the team!

 

[Majestic Electric]

This team is extremely weak to Choice Band Sawk; you literally have nothing that can switch into it. I would suggest replacing Braviary with Choice Scarf Rotom-S, which performs similar roles as a Scarfer and can check Sawk to an extent. Since Rotom would be pretty redundant with Eelektross, I would suggest replacing it with Choice Specs Musharna, which is a powerful Special Attacker that can pick up where Eelektross started. It also forms a great core with Skuntank and Gurdurr, as they can eliminate each others' counters.

There are also a few nitpicks that I would like to make. Seed Bomb is an outclassed move on Torterra; try using Bullet Seed to break through Sturdy or Wood Hammer, which is a much more powerful move with negligible recoil. For Carracosta, Earthquake doesn't really hit anything that Waterfall doesn't. Electric-types are already hit hard by Stone Edge so there isn't really a reason to use it. Skuntank's EV spread should be 72HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe with an Adamant nature to outspeed standard Absol or 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe to beat Jolly Samurott. You could also consider Leftovers as an item since it really helps with Skuntank's durability and allows it to beat Amoonguss and bulkier Pokemon that don't hit as hard. Gurdurr should use a spread of 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def with an Adamant nature to maximize recovery from Drain Punch and hit harder in general. Even with the Special Defense EV's, it still won't beat the Psychic-types that commonly check it. Payback is not as useful as Ice Punch, which allows it to hurt Rotom-S, Golurk, and Amoonguss, to name a few.

Wow, that must have taken a lot of time to write. Thank you for your suggestions. I'll make the changes asap!

 

[Explorer]

A few things:

I would agree that Torterra should use Wood Hammer over Seed Bomb. While this is not always the case, here it is your best option since you have Synthesis.

As for Gurdurr, Skuntank is already probably the best Psychic and Ghost-killer in the tier, and you don't have Stone Edge on Torterra, so Stone Edge is a good option for Gurdurr over Payback.

By the way, I love your concept.

 

[Majestic Electric]

@FLCL I've been using Wood Hammer and Ice Punch and they work wonders! Musharna, however, is another story. I've noticed that it dies faster than I'd like it to, so I changed it to the Calm Mind variant. I've found Calm Mind better suited for my play style.

@Explorer Thanks for the rate and I'm glad you like it! :) The only problem with using Stone Edge is that it will leave me vulnerable to Golurk. I agree with FLCL that Ice Punch would be more useful, as the only thing Stone Edge can really do is act as a nasty surprise for Flyings on the switch. Ice Punch can do the same thing, but will also help against Golurk and others. Nevertheless, I will try it and see how it goes.

 

[WhiteDMist]

Hey Majestic! You may want to edit the OP with your changes just so that I know what your current team is ^_^. Being the broken record that I am, I agree with almost everything that FLCL said, other than a Specs Musharna. Your idea of using CM Musharna is probably better for your team's playstyle. In all honesty, FLCL has said everything I needed to say (as always ;) ) so there is no real need for me to make any suggestions other than the fact that you should stick to the standard Rotom-S set, because being locked into Hidden Power isn't exactly a good thing, especially since you seem to always end up having it late game.

 

[Majestic Electric]

@WhiteDMist Hey, thanks for the rate! ^^ I just edited the OP. All changes I make will be shown in blue. Also, on Rotom, I think I will keep Hidden Power. It's been very helpful for surprise OHKO's and gives it decent coverage with its STAB moves.

 

[jake]

Hey man,

This team is honestly pretty cool. The Dark / Fighting / Psychic core that Skuntank, Musharna, and Gurdurr make is a solid core and takes on a ton of the metagame's threats well. Coupled with the fact that you've got birds covered with Carracosta, you've got the makings of a good bulky offensive team. There are a few weaknesses that I can see, although all I have are a bunch of small changes with a lot of reasoning behind them. Primarily, any form of SubCM Psychic-types are very difficult for your team to handle; the two important ones will be Gardevoir and Simple Swoobat. Gardevoir is naturally the bigger threat as its defenses are much better, it's got a higher SpA stat, and it isn't bothered by SR, but Swoobat can easily set up on Musharna and has the ability to cleanly OHKO anything on your team after a single boost thanks to Simple.

Let's address Substitute Swoobat first. As long as Rotom-S is solidly weakened or if they have SR up, Swoobat can wreak havoc on your team. The best way to handle Swoobat for this team is to eliminate any possible set-up opportunities, since its defensive stats are so terrible that it struggles to find a moment to boost up. I'd suggest changing HP Grass on Rotom-S to Hidden Power Ice. It prevents easy set-up for Swoobat (it cleanly OHKOes after SR) and is significantly better in this metagame anyways, as Quagsire is gone and Whiscash doesn't have enough usage to warrant a move specifically for it. Although it's not strictly necessary, I'd also like you to consider Stone Edge on Torterra > Synthesis primarily to prevent it from being complete set-up bait for Swoobat, and also to hit some common switch-ins like Swellow or Braviary hard. Outside of this, facing Swoobat is really just a matter of being smart with your Pokemon, getting SR up quickly, and being very careful with Musharna, as a single turn of set-up on Swoobat's part can quickly end your game.

SubCM Gardevoir is the biggest threat to the team overall, as right now you only can rely on tanking out Signal Beams with Skuntank and trying to Crunch it to death, since its Substitute allows it to dodge Sucker Punch. Thankfully, SubCM Gardevoir isn't a very common set, but when/if you do fight it you're going to struggle. You could do a number of things here but I'd specifically try out ChestoRest Skuntank, which is simply your current set with Chesto Berry > LO and Rest > Poison Jab. A Jolly nature is also worth considering, since it gives Skuntank the ability to outspeed Gardevoir. This gives your Skuntank a semi-reliable healing method, which is vital when trying to beat out Gardevoir since it has no recovery of its own and can't keep trying to set up Substitutes while you can simply Rest off damage.

A few smaller changes; Torterra's EV spread seems a bit arbitrary. You'll want to change it to 252 HP / 56 Atk / 200 Def, as that gives you a jump point in Defense and changes little of its offensive output. I notice you haven't changed your Gurdurr spread to the offensive one FLCL mentioned earlier. Is there a reason for this? If not, I'd recommend you stick with 252 Attack Adamant Gurdurr rather than the specially defensive variant you have right now. Specially defensive Gurdurr is too weak to do what it wants to do and doesn't have a significant enough difference in bulk to really justify the spread. You should be using Adamant > Jolly on Carracosta, imo; "outspeeding other Carracosta" isn't a large priority, since a Jolly nature gives literally no other benefits and you aren't going to be OHKOing other Carracosta anytime soon. Sturdy should also be the primary ability, as Solid Rock doesn't avoid many OHKOes or 2HKOes, and the ability for Carracosta to act as a safety net is far more valuable than guessing whether or not it will survive a Braviary's Superpower. If anything, it can save a potentially lost game by tanking a hit from a boosted sweeper and 2HKOing with Stone Edge + Aqua Jet. It can also buy you a set-up turn late in the game, which might spell the difference between a victory and a loss. Waterfall > Earthquake on Carracosta is also better in nearly every situation, as FLCL pointed out earlier as well.

summary

Hidden Power Ice > Hidden Power Grass on Rotom-S
Sturdy, Adamant nature, and Waterfall > Solid Rock, Jolly, and Earthquake respectively on Carracosta
Chesto Berry and Rest > Life Orb and Poison Jab on Skuntank
252 HP / 252 Atk and Adamant on Gurdurr
252 HP / 56 Atk / 200 Def and Impish on Torterra

Optional

Stone Edge > Synthesis on Torterra
Jolly nature > Adamant on Skuntank​

Um, that was a lot to digest, sorry about that. Hopefully I was understandable and managed to help out your team a little bit, haha. GL with your team

 

[Majestic Electric]

@Zebraiken That must've taken you forever! Thank you for the kind words and the rate! :) I do tend to choose more bulky mons for teams and it is my favorite playstyle, now that you mentioned it. There are a few things I would like to say though and hopefully I can clear up any confusion.

Let's address Substitute Swoobat first. As long as Rotom-S is solidly weakened or if they have SR up, Swoobat can wreak havoc on your team. The best way to handle Swoobat for this team is to eliminate any possible set-up opportunities, since its defensive stats are so terrible that it struggles to find a moment to boost up. I'd suggest changing HP Grass on Rotom-S to Hidden Power Ice. It prevents easy set-up for Swoobat (it cleanly OHKOes after SR) and is significantly better in this metagame anyways, as Quagsire is gone and Whiscash doesn't have enough usage to warrant a move specifically for it.

I was honestly considering using Hidden Power Ice for awhile now. Out of the two, it is definitely more useful in the long run. However, although it is rare, I have seen Whiscash before on the ladder. That was the reason I used Grass, as I didn't want to get swept by a Whiscash if I ever saw it again. You are right though. Ice is useful for the above reasons you mentioned and I can think of other situations where it would be of use. I will make the change.

Although it's not strictly necessary, I'd also like you to consider Stone Edge on Torterra > Synthesis primarily to prevent it from being complete set-up bait for Swoobat, and also to hit some common switch-ins like Swellow or Braviary hard.

This was hard to consider, to be honest. Torterra's main goal is to set up Stealth Rock and to support the team. While laddering, I have been in situations where I was happy to have Synthesis. Also, whenever I see a potential threat or a counter, I save him for later. Often, this ends up being right on target, as the opponent will usually bring in the threat right away or try to set up on Torterra. I guess you could say I am more likely to play it safe than to take a big risk. This is why I chose to keep Synthesis. However, I did change the EVs to the one you recommended.

SubCM Gardevoir is the biggest threat to the team overall, as right now you only can rely on tanking out Signal Beams with Skuntank and trying to Crunch it to death, since its Substitute allows it to dodge Sucker Punch. Thankfully, SubCM Gardevoir isn't a very common set, but when/if you do fight it you're going to struggle. You could do a number of things here but I'd specifically try out ChestoRest Skuntank, which is simply your current set with Chesto Berry > LO and Rest > Poison Jab. A Jolly nature is also worth considering, since it gives Skuntank the ability to outspeed Gardevoir. This gives your Skuntank a semi-reliable healing method, which is vital when trying to beat out Gardevoir since it has no recovery of its own and can't keep trying to set up Substitutes while you can simply Rest off damage.

I've never truly had problems with Gardevoir and I've not yet faced a SubCM variant. I usually bring Skuntank in and Sucker Punch it to death and there were times where I really appreciated having a Life Orb on him. Anyway, that set does look quite interesting and I will be sure to try it! Btw, I did have a Jolly nature at first, but FLCL suggested using Adamant instead. I'm not sure about changing it. I like the extra power Adamant provides. However, if Jolly allows me to outspeed a potential threat, I'll be sure to make the change and use Jolly again.

I notice you haven't changed your Gurdurr spread to the offensive one FLCL mentioned earlier. Is there a reason for this?

This was just a noobish mistake on my part. While editing the OP, I forgot to change the nature and EVs. I will do so right away!

You should be using Adamant > Jolly on Carracosta, imo; "outspeeding other Carracosta" isn't a large priority, since a Jolly nature gives literally no other benefits and you aren't going to be OHKOing other Carracosta anytime soon. Sturdy should also be the primary ability, as Solid Rock doesn't avoid many OHKOes or 2HKOes, and the ability for Carracosta to act as a safety net is far more valuable than guessing whether or not it will survive a Braviary's Superpower. If anything, it can save a potentially lost game by tanking a hit from a boosted sweeper and 2HKOing with Stone Edge + Aqua Jet. It can also buy you a set-up turn late in the game, which might spell the difference between a victory and a loss. Waterfall > Earthquake on Carracosta is also better in nearly every situation, as FLCL pointed out earlier as well.

I changed the nature to Adamant and the ability to Sturdy. Carracosta has benefitted from these changes greatly, so thanks! :) There is one thing I want to mention, though. I know Waterfall is more useful, but I've had a lot of success with using Earthquake. From my own experience, Earthquake has been more helpful by killing off Choiced Electrics and 2HKO'ing most others. From here, I can bring in a different poke later on and finish what Carracosta started. I'll consider making the change, but I'll most likely leave it as is.

 

[WhiteDMist]

I changed the nature to Adamant and the ability to Sturdy. Carracosta has benefitted from these changes greatly, so thanks! :) There is one thing I want to mention, though. I know Waterfall is more useful, but I've had a lot of success with using Earthquake. From my own experience, Earthquake has been more helpful by killing off Choiced Electrics and 2HKO'ing most others. From here, I can bring in a different poke later on and finish what Carracosta started. I'll consider making the change, but I'll most likely leave it as is.

Waterfall does enough to the frail Electric-types, and you're using Stone Edge or a predicted Waterfall on a Rotom-A switch-in anyways. More importantly, it gives you a reliable STAB attack where Aqua Jet and Stone Edge fail. If you insist on Hidden Power on Rotom-S, then I agree that Ice is the better type. Having Grass just for the off-chance that you face a rare Whiscash isn't worth it, when Ice still grants you the 2hko on things like Golem. I'll still vouch for Trick, but its your choice of course.

As for Skuntank, Jolly is really only helpful for outspeeding things like Timid Gardevoir and Jolly Braviary. I'd stick with Adamant and simply have enough speed to outrun Jolly Samurott, who can 2HKO your entire team with a boost and residual damage.

Water-types in general can be tough for your team to deal with, especially if Rotom-S is out of the way. Ludicolo, as well as Rain teams in general have a field day with your team. Still, they aren't common enough to really be worth adjusting your team for, but its still nice to keep an eye out for them.

 

[Majestic Electric]

@WhiteDMist Okay, I'll make the changes to Carracosta's moveset. Also, I haven't faced a Rain Team yet, but I'll be on the lookout just incase. I completely forgot about rain, so thanks for mentioning that! :)