The problem is that it's a specific type combination mentioned nearly every time, and putting it in the concept, even as just an example, sways the polls already. I believe the poll jumping rule was there just to prevent that.
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CAP 6 CAP 6 - Part 1 - Concept Poll 3
- Thread starter darkie
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Wow, I'm off for a bit and now I'm back and I've missed concept polls, and one of my concepts is on the list.
I voted for mine because it's mine, however, Im here to advise you DON'T vote for mine, it would take way to much theorymon to work out. I didn't post mine because I wanted it to win, I posted it so people could think of ideas.
I voted for mine because it's mine, however, Im here to advise you DON'T vote for mine, it would take way to much theorymon to work out. I didn't post mine because I wanted it to win, I posted it so people could think of ideas.
whoa that's pretty bold x)
either way i voted decentralizer, i want to see where a strictly metagame centric concept takes us and how we tackle the problem.
To all people who vote Decentralizer and think "Heatran and Scizor, eat this" eat this:
In Nov the top used Pokemon were Stratagem, Revvy, Fidgit, Tyranitar and Zapdos. Now, this is slightly biased due to the fact that Stratagem was just released made people want to try it out. Tyranitar relates to this, for the Sand Stream support, but Fidgit and Revvy were here after I don't think they are affected that much by Stratagem (correct me if I'm wrong) and Zapdos has been in the game all along, not to mention he shits himself at the thought of Paleolaser (is that the right name?). So, when voting Decentralizer, don't think Scizor and Heatran, think Revvy, Strata, Fidgit.
In Nov the top used Pokemon were Stratagem, Revvy, Fidgit, Tyranitar and Zapdos. Now, this is slightly biased due to the fact that Stratagem was just released made people want to try it out. Tyranitar relates to this, for the Sand Stream support, but Fidgit and Revvy were here after I don't think they are affected that much by Stratagem (correct me if I'm wrong) and Zapdos has been in the game all along, not to mention he shits himself at the thought of Paleolaser (is that the right name?). So, when voting Decentralizer, don't think Scizor and Heatran, think Revvy, Strata, Fidgit.
tie maker nasty pass
(voted Decentrilizer, reasoned out in previous threads)
(voted Decentrilizer, reasoned out in previous threads)
Tie Breaker Sikh...
Electric / Dragon may be underlined but is it in BOLD and in stone too? It was my example of showing what a monster like that can really do. Sure, I would love for it to win, but that doesn't mean I am not flexible. The concept just reads:
Electric / Dragon may be underlined but is it in BOLD and in stone too? It was my example of showing what a monster like that can really do. Sure, I would love for it to win, but that doesn't mean I am not flexible. The concept just reads:
The rest is up to you as it is not part of the concept or description, all I really want is the concept to win right now. The typing is later, as that was just an example, to show that it can tank (AND HIT, YOU GUYS KEEP MISSING THIS PART!) and still be able to decentralize.
I voted The Great Tank of China.
It seems to me that the Decentralizer would be extremely hard to do effectively enough to counter those five and then not trample over the rest of the metagame. Plus, do we even know the top 5 Pokemon in CAP? Or are we just basing this on the standard Platinum metagame?
It seems to me that the Decentralizer would be extremely hard to do effectively enough to counter those five and then not trample over the rest of the metagame. Plus, do we even know the top 5 Pokemon in CAP? Or are we just basing this on the standard Platinum metagame?
I will vote The Great Tank of China again, it seems to be the most open ended project for the community to work with.
Top 5
1. Stratagem
2. Revenankh
3. Fidgit
4. Tyranitar
5. Zapdos
Neither Heatran nor Skymin is there. This may come as a big surprise to some people!
It's actually not that difficult to envisage a pokemon that could check all of those pokes. Mach Punch and Ice Shard would get most of the job done if they come from a strong enough Attack stat. Since the concept only requires 3/5 to be checked, I see a lot of flexibility remaining regarding typing, stats and movepool.
The Tank idea is not something I'm opposed to in principle, but I am violently against the presupposition that it should be Electric/Dragon. No polls should be jumped therefore its typing needs to understand its typing is wide open for discussion. Hopefully everyone agrees on that.
1. Stratagem
2. Revenankh
3. Fidgit
4. Tyranitar
5. Zapdos
Neither Heatran nor Skymin is there. This may come as a big surprise to some people!
It's actually not that difficult to envisage a pokemon that could check all of those pokes. Mach Punch and Ice Shard would get most of the job done if they come from a strong enough Attack stat. Since the concept only requires 3/5 to be checked, I see a lot of flexibility remaining regarding typing, stats and movepool.
The Tank idea is not something I'm opposed to in principle, but I am violently against the presupposition that it should be Electric/Dragon. No polls should be jumped therefore its typing needs to understand its typing is wide open for discussion. Hopefully everyone agrees on that.
The top 5 in CAP may not be the best to try and counter, we would probably want to counter Heatran, Scizor, Zapdos, Revy, and Salamence/Gyarados.
Oh yeah... voted Decentalizer because I have some good type ideas for this one that are not Electric/Dragon. And the decentralizer has more freedom with the selection.
Oh yeah... voted Decentalizer because I have some good type ideas for this one that are not Electric/Dragon. And the decentralizer has more freedom with the selection.
Hydrolphin I am confused by your reasoning. No one is saying Great Tank would be Electric/Dragon.
I am just going to emphasize this to everyone voting, Don't base your choice off of an example typing for Great Tank. It DOES NOT have to be electric/dragon, and people making their choices based off of their paradigm that this Great Tank would have to be Electric/Dragon are not thinking through their vote properly.
I encourage everyone in the next poll to think over their votes carefully. Assuming that one pokemon will have XY typing or this or that move with blabla stats etc. will throw off the votes than if you carefully and unbiasedly think about your vote. I am not bashing anyone's chocie, I am just saying that all of you should be careful in your reasoning. Maybe the Great Wall is the best choice, but by having that paradigm that it has to be Electric Dragon could lead us astray from other typings that could potentially be better. Maybe you guys don't vote for it just because you think it will be Electric Dragon. Either way, just please think over your votes before voting.
I personally have no preference of the 3 up there over the other, as they all can yield interesting, fun, and overall quality pokemon, but chose to vote for decentralizer. I am not encouraging people to change their minds on what they want or to vote differently in the next thread, just to make sure that they are putting reason into their vote and that you don't vote for all the wrong reasons.
I am just going to emphasize this to everyone voting, Don't base your choice off of an example typing for Great Tank. It DOES NOT have to be electric/dragon, and people making their choices based off of their paradigm that this Great Tank would have to be Electric/Dragon are not thinking through their vote properly.
I encourage everyone in the next poll to think over their votes carefully. Assuming that one pokemon will have XY typing or this or that move with blabla stats etc. will throw off the votes than if you carefully and unbiasedly think about your vote. I am not bashing anyone's chocie, I am just saying that all of you should be careful in your reasoning. Maybe the Great Wall is the best choice, but by having that paradigm that it has to be Electric Dragon could lead us astray from other typings that could potentially be better. Maybe you guys don't vote for it just because you think it will be Electric Dragon. Either way, just please think over your votes before voting.
I personally have no preference of the 3 up there over the other, as they all can yield interesting, fun, and overall quality pokemon, but chose to vote for decentralizer. I am not encouraging people to change their minds on what they want or to vote differently in the next thread, just to make sure that they are putting reason into their vote and that you don't vote for all the wrong reasons.
Quoted for emphasis:
I just don't want electric/dragon, which some people are already convinced they are going to vote for it. Its like the Fighting/Flying thing with the EVO project. There are a lot cooler type combos like Ice/Fighting or Fire/Dark.
I just don't want electric/dragon, which some people are already convinced they are going to vote for it. Its like the Fighting/Flying thing with the EVO project. There are a lot cooler type combos like Ice/Fighting or Fire/Dark.
Then you should've voted for The Great Tank, and compile an argument for those typings, and maybe they could have won? I would like to emphasize Lawman's point as well.
I was afraid some sort of Anti-voting thing would arise from this situation as well, hm...
What is done is done I suppose, and when CaP6 ends, regardless of outcome, I will be sure to try to address this in a Policy Review thread. People shouldn't really be voting off of the examples given imho, whether the example caused them to vote for OR against a concept.
Eh, enough rants from me.
EDIT: I actually agree with Sikh, you should make arguments for those typings at a later time if you feel they accomplish the role better than other typings, but for now let's avoid poll jumping.
What is done is done I suppose, and when CaP6 ends, regardless of outcome, I will be sure to try to address this in a Policy Review thread. People shouldn't really be voting off of the examples given imho, whether the example caused them to vote for OR against a concept.
Eh, enough rants from me.
EDIT: I actually agree with Sikh, you should make arguments for those typings at a later time if you feel they accomplish the role better than other typings, but for now let's avoid poll jumping.
Would I with my measly 10> posts have a chance against everyone elses support for Electric/Dragon?
Besides, STAB Vacuum Wave/Ice Beam kills half of the major threats in Standard.
Or maybe the typing shouldn't have been so prominently mentioned in the explanation of the concept? And maybe people shouldn't have been so vocal going "Electric/Dragon? Cool!" before the typing polls. It could be a PR issue.
Rightly or wrongly, it's clear that Electric/Dragon as a popular idea is having a negative impact on The Great Tank's chances in this poll.
(Lets not discuss any more typings Lawman but Ice/Fighting is weak to Fire, Fighting, Psychic, Flying and Steel, so is a Horrible defensive type)
Edit: Ah, good stuff :-)
Rightly or wrongly, it's clear that Electric/Dragon as a popular idea is having a negative impact on The Great Tank's chances in this poll.
(Lets not discuss any more typings Lawman but Ice/Fighting is weak to Fire, Fighting, Psychic, Flying and Steel, so is a Horrible defensive type)
Edit: Ah, good stuff :-)
Voted Great Tank of China. In my opinion, the current metagame is far too offensive, and with the addition of Stratagem, it's going to be as offensive as ever. We need something to beat these sweepers that are running amok.
Also, Dragon/Electric is very interesting typing. Is that STAB combination resisted by only Magnezone?
Also, Dragon/Electric is very interesting typing. Is that STAB combination resisted by only Magnezone?
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