Resource RU Viability Ranking

[The Leprechaun]

You all make excellent points, particularly in regard to Shiftry as a Knock-Off user, who I'd somehow managed to completely forget. In my defence, it was two in the morning when I made that post. =]

Quick question, though: given that it gets quite a nice support movepool, including Wish and Heal Bell, would a 252/252+ physdef cleric Leafeon be viable? I haven't done any testing with this variant, but it might be interesting to check out.

Probably not buddy. Grass just isn't that good a defensive type right now, especially on the physical side. It doesn't resist some of the more important types likes fighting and dark and it straight up loses to the powerful fire threats there are. It has a small hp stat (65) so the wishes passed will be very small. Grass isn't that great offesively on its own either, leaving you as set-up fodder for many of the sweepers of the tier. Also it is completely outclassed as a wish passer + cleric by aromatisse who has better defensive typing, bigger wishes, can't be taunted and is less set-up fodder.

 

[EonX]

You all make excellent points, particularly in regard to Shiftry as a Knock-Off user, who I'd somehow managed to completely forget. In my defence, it was two in the morning when I made that post. =]

Quick question, though: given that it gets quite a nice support movepool, including Wish and Heal Bell, would a 252/252+ physdef cleric Leafeon be viable? I haven't done any testing with this variant, but it might be interesting to check out.

Unfortunately, any defensive Leafeon will be compared to Tangrowth, another defensive Grass-type. There's also Aromatisse, a Pokemon that has a much better defensive typing, can be EVed for physical bulk (I personally prefer this) and has access to Wish + Aromatherapy without having to sacrifice much in terms of other support options to run both of these moves. If Lefeon doesn't do cleric + wish passing stuff, then any other defensive support it tries to provide will force it to be outclassed by Tangrowth. Like I said, I love Leafeon, but there's just so much competition it has to face in the tier, which makes it hard to justify using unfortunately.

 

[phantom]

Can people stop acting like the advantage on Sticky Web teams is the ONLY thing that makes Jolteon better than Heliolisk, because that is so far from the truth it isn't even funny. Heliolisk being A- was an absolute joke even before Jolteon came into the tier, mainly because it's so god-damn one dimensional and a complete liability against a team that carries one of its counters. Now with Jolteon in the tier, I see very little reason to keep Heliolisk in B-rank even. Heliolisk should move down to B-/C+. Unlike Heliolisk, Jolteon isn't completely useless if the opposing team has an Amoonguss or Tangrowth. Jolteon's SubPass set allows it to take advantage of switches then turn the tables on its usual switch-ins. For instance, Jolteon can force out a Slowking for instance then set up a Sub. Then let's say Amoonguss or Tangrowth switch in, Jolteon can then pass the substitute to Cobalion, Doublade, or Virizion in the case of Tangrowth, to which it gives those Pokemon the opportunity to get a free, safe Swords Dance off. Being able to exploit its own counters in that form is something that no other Pokemon can do, Heliolisk especially. Second, the speed advantage is huge, with or without Sticky Web. Being able to outpace the entire (relevant) unboosted meta is amazing and makes Jolteon a great tool against offense and as can bee seen, Jolteon being able to outpace slower scarfers such as Emboar gives it a very notable advantage, to the point where it has direct influence on the speed tiers itself. Now on to point three: Heliolisk's so-called "better coverage" advantage. Llamas already made a good point about Heliolisk's standard set being tbolt/grass knot/hp ice/volt switch and that it can't afford to deviate from that otherwise it loses its effectiveness. This is true. All those other moves like surf/focus blast/dark pulse either provide redundant coverage or makes Heliolisk easier as a result of dropping hp ice or something. Jolteon hits the same threats for the most part with hp water + stabs + signal beam, so whatever coverage advantage Heliolisk has is pretty darn minute. Now on to point four: Heliolisk's typing and ability advantage. Both of those things are a double-edge sword. The normal typing might make it easier to check Ghost-types; HOWEVER, the fighting weakness is very notable. Being weak to hitmonlee's mach punch makes it very easy to snipe and forces heliolisk to switch out every. single. time. Giving that type of advantage to such a metagame defining threat is just plain bad no matter how you look at it. In the case of Dry Skin, while it is a nice ability, Water-types aren't completely helpless against it. Mola can still hit it with Toxic, Slowking and Clawitzer can just destroy it with a STAB or coverage move of choice, etc. The ability to switch in on Water-type moves it nice, but Water-types in general have ways to mess with Heliolisk or just flat-out destroy it on the switch, so the advantage itself isn't that great, this is especially true when taking into account that choice-locked water moves don't really exist for the most part except for Clawitzer, which heliolisk shouldn't even risk switching in on anyway. Choice-locked Electric moves on the other hand do still exist, and Jolteon possess the ability to cock block one of the best moves in the game (Volt Switch), which gives its team a huge momentum advantage and prevents the opposition from seizing it just as easily.

tl;dr

Heliolisk is outclassed and only has a few decent "advantages" over Jolteon move it B-/C+

Maybe move Jolteon to A cause it's a lot better than people give it credit for (subpass sets are especially good)

 

[Hot N Cold]

Heliolisk always was hyped and should be like B/B- Rank, outclassed by the rest of electric types in different ways.

Jolteon at least deserved to be A- rank, the ability to be the most faster mon without a Choice Scarf is huge.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ru-creative-underrated-sets-thread.3506246/page-3#post-5499774
This set also is probably the best on my experience, since actually can support your team a lot with subpass / wish and is easy to get that because Jolteon forces to switch.

Aromatisse -> A Rank

Spread syndrome ftw Needs like the bulk on both sides, for example max SpD to check Yanmega, and then at same time have a good type to handle physical stuff which cant handle if dont use the correct spread, Aromatisse is unlike Alomomola in BW RU2 which even using a mixed spreads, tanks still a lot of big threats on the physical side. Overwhelming.

Exploud -> A- Rank

On Shuckle Sticky Web metagame is definitely A- Rank.

 

[Geertos98]

What rank should Jolteon be in? I'd say B+ probably.

 

[Adamantx]

Nominating this guy right here for C rank
In the past, Flareon didn't have a good physical stab move to use, but in this gen, it received a gift from Game freak in the form of Flare blitz. Now, he can deal much more damage to the opposition than before, and with Guts or Flash fire boosted attacks, he's gonna hurt. He even has flame charge to become a late game sweeper, and some decent coverage moves in Superpower and Facade (If you are using guts, which you should be). To top it off, he has good special bulk with his nice 110 special defence to find some setup opportunities against stuff like Amoonguss. However, he kills tends to kill himself very quickly with all the residual damage from Flare blitz (His low hp doesn't help this), a stealth rock weakness, and toxic orb damage, so he doesn't last long enough to really be more of a threat. His defensive typing is also quite poor, and he is slow without a boost and his physical bulk is bad as well. However, I think the power of a guts boosted Flare blitz is enough to warrant him a C rank.

Just to illustrate his power:
252 Atk Guts Flareon Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Shuckle: 114-135 (46.7 - 55.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

 

[dinotrek27]

Hey guys any thoughts on Tyrantrum? Like why is it so low on the viability scale? Haven't really played RU so I would appreciate a little help!

 

[colourcodedchaos]

I agree with Adamantx's assessment of Flareon, though Fire as a defensive type isn't the worst in the world. I think C-rank behooves him.

However, he might just have some competition...

Rampardos GO!
Rank: C

Rampardos has always been my favourite Fossil mon, a position that has only been reinforced now that second-place Omastar has been hijacked by Twitch. However, Big R's not without problems. He's slow and fragile, particularly on the special side. However, with proper support, I think he has a place as a lategame missile, not least because of his obscenely high Attack stat. Here's the set I use.

Rampardos SMASH!
EVs: 4 HP, 252 Attack, 252 Speed
Ability: Sheer Force
Nature: Adamant
Item: Choice Band
Moveset:-
--> Head Smash
--> Earthquake
--> Superpower
--> Fire Punch

It's a fairly standard set from Gen V, but then again, Rampardos didn't get much in the way of new goodies upon arriving in Gen VI. Besides, Rampardos has always been a simple Pokemon with a simple job: Hulk out lategame with the most powerful Head Smash going. Oh, how I long for the day when Mega Rampardos shows up with increased bulk and Rock Head... but we're getting ahead of ourselves. The point of Rampardos is to kill stuff with Head Smash. That's about it. This is for the quite understandable reason that a Head Smash from Rampardos is very bad for your health. Head Smash OHKOs Delphox, Froslass, Hitmonlee, Sharpedo, Aromatisse, Zoroark, Slowking, Yanmega (hoo boy, does it do nasty things to Yanmega), and sundry others. It can dish out some serious hurt to Rhyperior with Superpower, OHKO Durant and Escavalier with Fire Punch, and do ghastly things to Cresselia and Reuniclus with our phrase of the day. Moltres looks at a Rampardos Head Smash with the same expression a fretful child has when locked in a room full of clowns. Cobalion can be eviscerated by Superpower (which I'd use to dodge that nasty Magnet Rise set doing the rounds at the moment), Druddigon gets OHKO'd with Head Smash, Heliolisk and our new friend Jolteon get blown apart by Fire Punch. Gligar is dead and buried if you can find enough left to bury. Registeel can just barely avoid being OHKOd by Superpower if you don't have Rocks up. Gallade dies. Virizion dies. EVERYTHING DIES. ALL IS ASHES AND SKULL FRAGMENTS. RAMPARDOS IS THE KING OF A DEAD LAND OF SHATTERED MONS!

So why am I only giving it a C rank?

Because half the time, you won't get to kill anything. Rampardos is slower than an arthritic tractor and dies if you sneeze on it. Sure, it has the most powerful Head Smash in the game, but that often works against it; since it has bugger-all recovery and lacks the one ability it really needs to succeed (GAMEFREAK WHYYYYYYY), so the recoil from Head Smash often causes the poor dino to keel over. That's why I sometimes use him as a lead; other people have hazard setters, and they may well be able to get a hazard off, but you have spinners and Defoggers for that. Obliterating them with a move of your choice is the best way. In short, with the right support, Rampardos can batter aside pretty much everything in the tier. He's a brutal wallbreaker that can rip apart enemy defences, but make no mistake, he will die doing it.

Hopefully, this sparks some discussion. =]

 

[g]

I agree with Adamantx's assessment of Flareon, though Fire as a defensive type isn't the worst in the world. I think C-rank behooves him.

However, he might just have some competition...

Rampardos GO!
Rank: C

Rampardos has always been my favourite Fossil mon, a position that has only been reinforced now that second-place Omastar has been hijacked by Twitch. However, Big R's not without problems. He's slow and fragile, particularly on the special side. However, with proper support, I think he has a place as a lategame missile, not least because of his obscenely high Attack stat. Here's the set I use.

Rampardos SMASH!
EVs: 4 HP, 252 Attack, 252 Speed
Ability: Sheer Force
Nature: Adamant
Item: Choice Band
Moveset:-
--> Head Smash
--> Earthquake
--> Superpower
--> Fire Punch

It's a fairly standard set from Gen V, but then again, Rampardos didn't get much in the way of new goodies upon arriving in Gen VI. Besides, Rampardos has always been a simple Pokemon with a simple job: Hulk out lategame with the most powerful Head Smash going. Oh, how I long for the day when Mega Rampardos shows up with increased bulk and Rock Head... but we're getting ahead of ourselves. The point of Rampardos is to kill stuff with Head Smash. That's about it. This is for the quite understandable reason that a Head Smash from Rampardos is very bad for your health. Head Smash OHKOs Delphox, Froslass, Hitmonlee, Sharpedo, Aromatisse, Zoroark, Slowking, Yanmega (hoo boy, does it do nasty things to Yanmega), and sundry others. It can dish out some serious hurt to Rhyperior with Superpower, OHKO Durant and Escavalier with Fire Punch, and do ghastly things to Cresselia and Reuniclus with our phrase of the day. Moltres looks at a Rampardos Head Smash with the same expression a fretful child has when locked in a room full of clowns. Cobalion can be eviscerated by Superpower (which I'd use to dodge that nasty Magnet Rise set doing the rounds at the moment), Druddigon gets OHKO'd with Head Smash, Heliolisk and our new friend Jolteon get blown apart by Fire Punch. Gligar is dead and buried if you can find enough left to bury. Registeel can just barely avoid being OHKOd by Superpower if you don't have Rocks up. Gallade dies. Virizion dies. EVERYTHING DIES. ALL IS ASHES AND SKULL FRAGMENTS. RAMPARDOS IS THE KING OF A DEAD LAND OF SHATTERED MONS!

So why am I only giving it a C rank?

Because half the time, you won't get to kill anything. Rampardos is slower than an arthritic tractor and dies if you sneeze on it. Sure, it has the most powerful Head Smash in the game, but that often works against it; since it has bugger-all recovery and lacks the one ability it really needs to succeed (GAMEFREAK WHYYYYYYY), so the recoil from Head Smash often causes the poor dino to keel over. That's why I sometimes use him as a lead; other people have hazard setters, and they may well be able to get a hazard off, but you have spinners and Defoggers for that. Obliterating them with a move of your choice is the best way. In short, with the right support, Rampardos can batter aside pretty much everything in the tier. He's a brutal wallbreaker that can rip apart enemy defences, but make no mistake, he will die doing it.

Hopefully, this sparks some discussion. =]

Rampardos actually has a small niche but not with the set you posted. In fact Mold Breaker Rampardos can OHKO Shuckle through sturdy effectively making it one of the few Pokemon capable of stopping Sticky Web in its tracks. Of course most Sticky Web teams have Doublade to Switch into Rampardos preventing that and Hitmonlee to revenge kill it but for that capability and enourmous attacking power i think it might deserve to be D Rank.

Also i believe Exploud deserves to be A/A-. Like HnC said it is a terrifying Sweeper in Sticky Web, one of the most metagame-defining strategy (ridicolously easy to set and keep on the field) thanks to its ability to 2HKO at worst anything Hitmonlee can't break and straight up destroy most of the tier thanks to Boomburst. Zangoose might also deserve to go to A- for the same reason but i don't have much experience with it.
I also agree on Jolteon going to A/A- as it is an incredible subpasser and wallbreaker while being the fastest force in the tier.

Stuff that should move but i don't have time to write much about about

Fletchinder: B Seriously an amazing mon atm on both Sticky Web teams (really helps in mirror matches) and Spikes offense (appreciates counters being worn down).
Braviary: A- Staple on web teams, strong wallbreaker and late game sweeper in webs
Heliolisk: B+ Pretty much a worse Jolteon bar Water immunity/Surf
Gallade: B+/B I don't know why i should use this
Slurpuff: B
Sceptile: B pretty bad offensive typing, not that powerful, walled by common stuff like Drudd, Esca, Doublade, Drapion. SD outclassed by Virizion

 

[dingbat]

View attachment 14798
Nominating this guy right here for C rank
In the past, Flareon didn't have a good physical stab move to use, but in this gen, it received a gift from Game freak in the form of Flare blitz. Now, he can deal much more damage to the opposition than before, and with Guts or Flash fire boosted attacks, he's gonna hurt. He even has flame charge to become a late game sweeper, and some decent coverage moves in Superpower and Facade (If you are using guts, which you should be). To top it off, he has good special bulk with his nice 110 special defence to find some setup opportunities against stuff like Amoonguss. However, he kills tends to kill himself very quickly with all the residual damage from Flare blitz (His low hp doesn't help this), a stealth rock weakness, and toxic orb damage, so he doesn't last long enough to really be more of a threat. His defensive typing is also quite poor, and he is slow without a boost and his physical bulk is bad as well. However, I think the power of a guts boosted Flare blitz is enough to warrant him a C rank.

Just to illustrate his power:
252 Atk Guts Flareon Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Shuckle: 114-135 (46.7 - 55.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Flareon is p. much outclassed by emboar unfortunately. Emboar can run basically the same set that Flareon can run minus guts and facade, however with far superior coverage moves and a fighting STAB that also neutralizes emboar's weakness to rocks from its fire typing, and its flare blitz from choice band set can hit basically as hard as Flareon's guts boosted one and even harder once emboar hits it's blaze range. Overall, Emboar is clearly the better option as a fire type wallbreaker and IMO I really don't see a justification for ranking Flareon unless there's a niche that Flareon has that I'm totally missing on.

 

[termi]

Flareon can be a specially defensive fire type with wish and heal bell for support, other than that it is outclassed by emboar tho. I can see it in D rank maybe, not much higher than that tho

 

[Adamantx]

Flareon's niche is guts. It let's its flare blitz hit a decent bit harder than Emboar's, and while you will want to use Emboar most of the time for his better coverage and fighting STAB, Flareon is there if you want raw power. Also, it's coverage isn't that much worse, as facade hits a lot of things that resist his fire STAB pretty hard.
252+ Atk Guts Flareon Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Slowking: 302-356 (76.6 - 90.3%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Life Orb Emboar Wild Charge vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Slowking: 325-385 (82.4 - 97.7%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Guts Flareon Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 209-246 (39.1 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery (Can't switch in with a just a little prior damage)
252+ Atk Life Orb Emboar Wild Charge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 224-265 (41.9 - 49.6%) -- 22.3% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Guts Flareon Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 230-271 (53.9 - 63.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Emboar Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 247-292 (57.9 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

So, you trade SLIGHTLY less damage for this increase in power with flare blitz:
252+ Atk Life Orb Emboar Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Gligar: 126-149 (37.7 - 44.6%) -- 3.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Guts Flareon Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Gligar: 151-178 (45.2 - 53.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Not a huge difference, but it does gain some KO's. While I agree, Emboar does mostly outclass Flareon, it still has a niche, which is basically the description of C rank. Eclipsed, but can still be effective. Also, if you are really ballsy, you could even use both on the same team to form an un-wallable dou.

 

[dingbat]

Flareon can be a specially defensive fire type with wish and heal bell for support, other than that it is outclassed by emboar tho. I can see it in D rank maybe, not much higher than that tho

Cleric set is outclassed by aromatisse and lickilicky though because they can pass larger wishes, aren't hurt as much by having to switch out and back in, and most importantly, they're immune to taunt given the correct abilities. Not to mention, their special bulk p. much matches that of Flareon's and their physical bulk beats it by a longshot.

Lava plume/flare blitz are certainly great options as opposed to body slam/moonblast but I don't see it being nearly as effective in the medic role. On this note I still fail to see a useful niche on Flareon and overall I don't see Flareon performing any better than, let's say, the 'mons in the D or even E ranks.

 

[EonX]

I have one nomination I want to make before I move on to a couple of others:

Nominating Braviary for A-/A rank. Braviary is unbelievable on Sticky Web teams right now as it is a great way to defend against mirror matches and to discourage the use of Defog (it easily beats the common spinners under Sticky Web) While most people generally just slap a Choice item on Braviary and call it a day, I find that a Roost + 3 Attacks LO set is most effective. The ability to heal, switch moves, and generally cause serious problems to almost everything in its path is really cool. You will need defense against Jolteon as such a set needs to run Adamant, but it really doesn't miss out on much else. The power level is crazy good and Braviary has great 3 move coverage that can give virtually every team headaches, even the odd stall teams that Web Offense can sometimes struggle with and ease of handling Choice Braviary, thus allowing them to Defog with more ease against such variants. Outside of Web Offense, Braviary is still a solid enough Pokemon, but it just really shines in Web Offense right now. Definitely feel it's worthy of A-/A rank.

Flareon: I really can't see Flareon being ranked the way the metagame is right now. Flareon is kinda slow and although it can benefit from both Spikes and Sticky Web support, I don't see a reason to use it over other Fire-types, Emboar in particular. While Flareon is stronger with the Guts boost, Emboar has the better overall stats and movepool to work with. There's also the problem that Flareon is weak to Rocks and vulnerable toe very type of entry hazard in the game. Sure, Flareon has raw power, but that low Defense and Speed is just asking for any number of priority users to cut it down (Lee, Zoro, Doublade, etc.) whereas Emboar resists Sucker Punch and has priority of its own to sometimes deal with this issue. As a cleric, there's no way that Flareon compares to Aromatisse. Flare Blitz helps Flareon a good bit, but I just don't see a reason to use it right now. Maybe after Lass and Sticky Web go, but not now.

Rampardos: Pretty sure Mixed was the best set Rampardos had at the end of BW, but maybe I'm not recalling correctly? Anyway, as most Shuckle don't run Sturdy (the good ones shouldn't imo) Rampardos is one of the only things that can, and will OHKO Shuckle. The recoil isn't super terrible either considering Shuckle's tiny HP stat, but the problems with this have already been stated. Doublade is common on Web teams, as is Hitmonlee. Tyrantrum is also a thing, and that secondary Dragon-typing does give it a few more chances to come in than Rampardos has. Rampardos might be a little interesting on Web Offense teams, but there's already so many great abusers of that right now, which makes it hard to justify using Rampardos. I think a Mixed set might be interesting though (something like Head Smash/Fire Blast/TBolt/EQ) since that could actually lure in and destroy Doublade and deal damage to many other typical Rampardos switch-ins, but I still don't see it being much higher than C- at best, though I'd probably go with D.

Back to Braviary for a split second. Here's the set I elluded to as I talked about it:

LO Eagle

Braviary @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 224 Spe
Nature: Adamant
- Brave Bird
- Superpower
- Shadow Claw
- Roost

 

[g]

I have one nomination I want to make before I move on to a couple of others:

Nominating Braviary for A-/A rank. Braviary is unbelievable on Sticky Web teams right now as it is a great way to defend against mirror matches and to discourage the use of Defog (it easily beats the common spinners under Sticky Web) While most people generally just slap a Choice item on Braviary and call it a day, I find that a Roost + 3 Attacks LO set is most effective. The ability to heal, switch moves, and generally cause serious problems to almost everything in its path is really cool. You will need defense against Jolteon as such a set needs to run Adamant, but it really doesn't miss out on much else. The power level is crazy good and Braviary has great 3 move coverage that can give virtually every team headaches, even the odd stall teams that Web Offense can sometimes struggle with and ease of handling Choice Braviary, thus allowing them to Defog with more ease against such variants. Outside of Web Offense, Braviary is still a solid enough Pokemon, but it just really shines in Web Offense right now. Definitely feel it's worthy of A-/A rank.

Flareon: I really can't see Flareon being ranked the way the metagame is right now. Flareon is kinda slow and although it can benefit from both Spikes and Sticky Web support, I don't see a reason to use it over other Fire-types, Emboar in particular. While Flareon is stronger with the Guts boost, Emboar has the better overall stats and movepool to work with. There's also the problem that Flareon is weak to Rocks and vulnerable toe very type of entry hazard in the game. Sure, Flareon has raw power, but that low Defense and Speed is just asking for any number of priority users to cut it down (Lee, Zoro, Doublade, etc.) whereas Emboar resists Sucker Punch and has priority of its own to sometimes deal with this issue. As a cleric, there's no way that Flareon compares to Aromatisse. Flare Blitz helps Flareon a good bit, but I just don't see a reason to use it right now. Maybe after Lass and Sticky Web go, but not now.

Rampardos: Pretty sure Mixed was the best set Rampardos had at the end of BW, but maybe I'm not recalling correctly? Anyway, as most Shuckle don't run Sturdy (the good ones shouldn't imo) Rampardos is one of the only things that can, and will OHKO Shuckle. The recoil isn't super terrible either considering Shuckle's tiny HP stat, but the problems with this have already been stated. Doublade is common on Web teams, as is Hitmonlee. Tyrantrum is also a thing, and that secondary Dragon-typing does give it a few more chances to come in than Rampardos has. Rampardos might be a little interesting on Web Offense teams, but there's already so many great abusers of that right now, which makes it hard to justify using Rampardos. I think a Mixed set might be interesting though (something like Head Smash/Fire Blast/TBolt/EQ) since that could actually lure in and destroy Doublade and deal damage to many other typical Rampardos switch-ins, but I still don't see it being much higher than C- at best, though I'd probably go with D.

Back to Braviary for a split second. Here's the set I elluded to as I talked about it:

LO Eagle

Braviary @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 224 Spe
Nature: Adamant
- Brave Bird
- Superpower
- Shadow Claw
- Roost

The fact is that Rampardos can OHKO Shuckle THROUGH sturdy thanks to Mold Breaker (that also allows it to set up rocks even against Xatu which is minor but w/e)

 

[Molk]

because trop is a faget and wont even post his own post, this is we wrote in ppad.

Meloetta should move from A- ---> A

As for reasoning, It has really solid stats all around to work with, the only relevant stat that's not at least above average is defense, and the good hp makes up for this a little so its not really a huge problem, and just looking at that Special Attack stat its easy to see that Meloetta is a huge offensive threat.

Meloetta can run 4+ viable set, mixed relic song, CM 3 attacks, Specs, sp.def, and subCM are some good examples of what it can run (but not the only sets). This makes Meloetta pretty unpredictable/versatile and lets it fits onto many types of teams in many different roles.

SubCM (the set i like most) Meloetta in particular can give defensive teams a run for their money, setting up on the vast majority of the relevant ones (and it sets up p. easy in general) and cleaving through stall/defensive balance once things like Drapion are removed or weakened (also note that Meloetta has STAB Hyper Voice to hit this hard if it really wants to, Hyper Voice/Shadow Ball actually has perfect type coverage in RU outside of the mighty pawniard). Unlike Reuniclus it has an actual speed stat and an immunity to Ghost-type moves instead of a weakness (great for doublade).

Calm Mind 3 attacks Meloetta performs similarly against stall/balanced teams, but exchanges pseudo status immunity and easier set up for more power, more coverage, and being less reliant on setting up to do actual damage

Specs Meloetta is a pro wallbreaker because of its high power and good coverage options. It gets competition from Exploud but a real speed stat and access to U-turn to use as a fille/scouting move make sure specs meloetta is still an option worth using.

I havent tried Specially Defensive Meloetta yet, but considering it has really good special bulk (have fun 2HKOing 100/128 special bulk if your name isnt yanmega), and some nice support moves such as Heal Bell, Perish Song, and Thunder Wave, i'd give this girl a try on defensive teams if you have a Wishpasser to make up for the make up for the lack of recovery it has itself.

Overall i think that Meloetta is a strong Pokemon in the current meta and i think a move up to A rank from A- is justified, even if trop made me post this.

 

[Kushalos]

because trop is a faget and wont even post his own post, this is we wrote in ppad.

Meloetta should move from A- ---> A

As for reasoning, It has really solid stats all around to work with, the only relevant stat that's not at least above average is defense, and the good hp makes up for this a little so its not really a huge problem, and just looking at that Special Attack stat its easy to see that Meloetta is a huge offensive threat.

Meloetta can run 4+ viable set, mixed relic song, CM 3 attacks, Specs, sp.def, and subCM are some good examples of what it can run (but not the only sets). This makes Meloetta pretty unpredictable/versatile and lets it fits onto many types of teams in many different roles.

SubCM (the set i like most) Meloetta in particular can give defensive teams a run for their money, setting up on the vast majority of the relevant ones (and it sets up p. easy in general) and cleaving through stall/defensive balance once things like Drapion are removed or weakened (also note that Meloetta has STAB Hyper Voice to hit this hard if it really wants to, Hyper Voice/Shadow Ball actually has perfect type coverage in RU outside of the mighty pawniard). Unlike Reuniclus it has an actual speed stat and an immunity to Ghost-type moves instead of a weakness (great for doublade).

Calm Mind 3 attacks Meloetta performs similarly against stall/balanced teams, but exchanges pseudo status immunity and easier set up for more power, more coverage, and being less reliant on setting up to do actual damage

Specs Meloetta is a pro wallbreaker because of its high power and good coverage options. It gets competition from Exploud but a real speed stat and access to U-turn to use as a fille/scouting move make sure specs meloetta is still an option worth using.

I havent tried Specially Defensive Meloetta yet, but considering it has really good special bulk (have fun 2HKOing 100/128 special bulk if your name isnt yanmega), and some nice support moves such as Heal Bell, Perish Song, and Thunder Wave, i'd give this girl a try on defensive teams if you have a Wishpasser to make up for the make up for the lack of recovery it has itself.

Overall i think that Meloetta is a strong Pokemon in the current meta and i think a move up to A rank from A- is justified, even if trop made me post this.

Not to mention underrated defensive typing :]

 

[The Lucky Absol]

I agree with EonX, Especially with Braviary. I've run a sticky web team and it wrecks. Choice band, life orb, roost+3 attacks, all of these are effective. It is a hard hitting pokemon, even without any boost. Definite A rank to me.

 

[Corporal Levi]

Nominating mienfoo for D rank
Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
Impish Nature
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch / High Jump Kick
- Taunt / Fake Out
Mienfoo can't really be compared to any other Pokemon in the tier because nothing else available has access to a combination of Regenerator and U-Turn. Slow U-Turns are incredibly useful, not only for generally maintaining momentum, but to get powerful but frail Pokemon such as Swellow and Sharpedo in safely, putting even more pressure on the opponent. This meshes brilliantly with Regenerator, because Mienfoo's constant switching will be able to make plenty of use from the ability and allow Mienfoo to continue U-Turning throughout the match. On top of this, Mienfoo packs a solid disruptive movepool, containing options such as Knock Off, Taunt, and Fake Out. Although Mienfoo isn't extremely bulky, Eviolite allows it to avoid the OHKO from most unboosted neutral attacks with some investment. Mienfoo's offensive presence can be somewhat lacking occasionally, even with a powerful STAB move in High Jump Kick, but access to Taunt and its pivoting nature mean this tends not to be too large of an issue. Mienfoo also gets Baton Pass and a multitude of boosting moves, although I'm not sure how much of a niche it has over other Baton Passers, even with Regenerator, due to its average bulk and inability to abuse these boosting moves itself.
The main thing holding Mienfoo back is that its BST is lower than Dugtrio's

 

[The Lucky Absol]

While I can see the appeal of Mienfoo, I believe it lies in the same boat as Pawniard. They have similar stats, and both of their evolved forms are fantastic in their respective tiers. However, they both have the issue of being worth the team slot. While regenerator+ u-turn is definitely something that many pokemon would enjoy having, Mienfoo can't utilize it to its extent. Even with Eviolite it is still extremely frail, and slow. I think Mienfoo outranking even Hitmonchan is a bit of a stretch, I could understand it being used in NU but not here. It just doesn't seem to be worth a team slot.

 

[phantom]

Nominating mienfoo for D rank
Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
Impish Nature
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch / High Jump Kick
- Taunt / Fake Out
Mienfoo can't really be compared to any other Pokemon in the tier because nothing else available has access to a combination of Regenerator and U-Turn. Slow U-Turns are incredibly useful, not only for generally maintaining momentum, but to get powerful but frail Pokemon such as Swellow and Sharpedo in safely, putting even more pressure on the opponent. This meshes brilliantly with Regenerator, because Mienfoo's constant switching will be able to make plenty of use from the ability and allow Mienfoo to continue U-Turning throughout the match. On top of this, Mienfoo packs a solid disruptive movepool, containing options such as Knock Off, Taunt, and Fake Out. Although Mienfoo isn't extremely bulky, Eviolite allows it to avoid the OHKO from most unboosted neutral attacks with some investment. Mienfoo's offensive presence can be somewhat lacking occasionally, even with a powerful STAB move in High Jump Kick, but access to Taunt and its pivoting nature mean this tends not to be too large of an issue. Mienfoo also gets Baton Pass and a multitude of boosting moves, although I'm not sure how much of a niche it has over other Baton Passers, even with Regenerator, due to its average bulk and inability to abuse these boosting moves itself.
The main thing holding Mienfoo back is that its BST is lower than Dugtrio's

this is my waifu

and: mienfoo is pure fucking aids and if anybody considers using it outside of lc they are more than likely retarded/trash at this game - Passion

 

[Imanalt]

The main thing holding Mienfoo back is that its BST is lower than Dugtrio's

Anytime you type this sentence, other than when discussing lc, you should just stop and either a) reconsider whether its a good idea, or b) reconsider your entie life

 

[complete legitimacy]

<%funbro> llamas stop editing my post

DOWN WITH LLAMAS 2014

Llamas edit: I didn't edit his post, just yours loser

 

[sparktrain]

Nominating mienfoo for D rank
Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
Impish Nature
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch / High Jump Kick
- Taunt / Fake Out
Mienfoo can't really be compared to any other Pokemon in the tier because nothing else available has access to a combination of Regenerator and U-Turn. Slow U-Turns are incredibly useful, not only for generally maintaining momentum, but to get powerful but frail Pokemon such as Swellow and Sharpedo in safely, putting even more pressure on the opponent. This meshes brilliantly with Regenerator, because Mienfoo's constant switching will be able to make plenty of use from the ability and allow Mienfoo to continue U-Turning throughout the match. On top of this, Mienfoo packs a solid disruptive movepool, containing options such as Knock Off, Taunt, and Fake Out. Although Mienfoo isn't extremely bulky, Eviolite allows it to avoid the OHKO from most unboosted neutral attacks with some investment. Mienfoo's offensive presence can be somewhat lacking occasionally, even with a powerful STAB move in High Jump Kick, but access to Taunt and its pivoting nature mean this tends not to be too large of an issue. Mienfoo also gets Baton Pass and a multitude of boosting moves, although I'm not sure how much of a niche it has over other Baton Passers, even with Regenerator, due to its average bulk and inability to abuse these boosting moves itself.
The main thing holding Mienfoo back is that its BST is lower than Dugtrio's

After experimenting with some different spreads, I found that an EV spread of 236 Atk / 196 Def / 36 SDef / 40 Spe alongside an Adamant nature works very well when using Mienfoo. This accomplishes a few things: It is able to outspeed specific defensive threats such as Jellicent and Alomomola, which allows it to remove their items or pivot on them before before taking a hit. It still remains slow enough to utilize its U-turn on faster offensive threats, allowing it to bring in a frail but powerful teammate such as Sharpedo, Yanmega, etc. With the given defense investment and Eviolite, it is able to tank some surprisingly strong hits from prevalent threats such as Sharpedo
252+ Atk Life Orb Sharpedo Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 196 Def Eviolite Mienfoo: 152-179 (65.8 - 77.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and 1 layer of Spikes
....and promptly KO back
236+ Atk Mienfoo Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Sharpedo: 408-480 (144.6 - 170.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
With regenerator, Mienfoo can switch out after the encounter unscathed. I agree with you that Mienfoo has plenty of shortcomings, but it does have a unique niche that no other mon in RU can perfectly fill.

 

[Imanalt]

After experimenting with some different spreads, I found that an EV spread of 236 Atk / 196 Def / 36 SDef / 40 Spe alongside an Adamant nature works very well when using Mienfoo. This accomplishes a few things: It is able to outspeed specific defensive threats such as Jellicent and Alomomola, which allows it to remove their items or pivot on them before before taking a hit. It still remains slow enough to utilize its U-turn on faster offensive threats, allowing it to bring in a frail but powerful teammate such as Sharpedo, Yanmega, etc. With the given defense investment and Eviolite, it is able to tank some surprisingly strong hits from prevalent threats such as Sharpedo
252+ Atk Life Orb Sharpedo Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 196 Def Eviolite Mienfoo: 152-179 (65.8 - 77.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and 1 layer of Spikes
....and promptly KO back
236+ Atk Mienfoo Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Sharpedo: 408-480 (144.6 - 170.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
With regenerator, Mienfoo can switch out after the encounter unscathed. I agree with you that Mienfoo has plenty of shortcomings, but it does have a unique niche that no other mon in RU can perfectly fill.

vulnerability of mien put aside for a minute, if nothing else its going to be much more effective to use hp evs.... you also are using lc evs still for no apparently reason... If you are going to use it you want to use max hp and max defense, (sharpedo is only thing youre actually doing any damage to, and you still ohko it so...)

That said, i really question its usefulness, as there are plenty of other good answers to shark...