Psychology vs psychiatry

Altmer

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I already know the technical difference between the two; but what I want to ask about, for anyone who has gone to either, what is the difference in treatment? Do you find either to be more effective than the other? Would you rather talk to a psychologist than drug yourself out on meds?

Reason I ask is because I have to see a psychologist soon (lovely fear, anxiety, depressive issues that make me one happy boy)
 

Chill Murray

get well soon jacoby..
As someone interested in the field (and one who has participated in it on your end as well) I'd recommend seeing a psychologist first instead of a full blown shrink. I don't know if it's the same in Europe, but in the U.S. it seems as though psychiatrists are more likely to use medication as a first line of defense against mental illness. I myself had one encounter where a doctor who had never met with me before (and I presume had no data about me other than the file my school had on me) managed to figure out that I needed to be put on an antidepressant, all within two hours of conversation. I've heard similar stories from other people.

I have had much more success with my current psychologist, but it has also been a very gradual thing. I started seeing him in December and while I've made a lot of progress I'm still not quite where I want to be.

Keep in mind this is all anecdotal, and that your experience might be different than mine (being in a different country for one thing and perhaps having a different view on using drugs to help yourself), so explore each of your options.
 
Psychology is generally the better answer. Unless you suffer from some sort of mental illness such as schitzofrenia or paranoia, psychology helps without use of drugs. Drugs are the better answer in the case of a physiological abnormality or disease, but psychology can solve most problems without the use of drugs. I have found that the answer one may be looking for can be found through the psyche instead of covering up an issue with medication.
 
Heavily recommend psychology. I have zilch experience with either, but psychiatrists tend to overdiagnose and give iffy medication with, often, brutal side effects that often do not work; it is not abnormal for you to switch medication if your current one is ineffective. and plus, we're all familiar with the FDA's legendary standards on pharmaceutical drugs.

Not to say drugs will never work, because they can, but you'll be stuck on 'em for the rest of your life (or continue with your mental "illness") and never grow beyond it. then again, if you're schizo it's definitely a different story (but i doubt that you are).
 
I have zilch experience with either, but psychiatrists tend to overdiagnose and give iffy medication with, often, brutal side effects that often do not work
Well I was planning to avoid posting in this thread since, even though I have actually been seeing a psychologist recently and I've had the occasion to see a psychiatrist some time ago, I thought that I wasn't qualified enough to provide a pertinent answer... I wonder why I'm refraining.
 
I think everyone is getting slightly mixed up. There are clinical Psychologists, which are what you're thinking of when you're saying Psychiatrists. They have medical degrees, and because of that, are physicians that can prescribe medicine. It is true that some people give Medication as a fix all to common problems, which is not something you should submit yourself to.

However, there are other fields of Psycholody, like Humanistic, Behavioral, and Cognitive, which all have separate ways to deal with patients. I'm a Psychology major, and know a little bit of information about getting Psychological treatment. If you can let me know what you're experiencing, maybe through a PM, if you're uncomfortable, I can suggest a path you might want to take to get the best treatment. One great form of help that is kind of recent is called Client Centered Therapy. You should look into it if you want to avoid getting medically treated. It can help a lot.
 

Chill Murray

get well soon jacoby..
I think everyone is getting slightly mixed up. There are clinical Psychologists, which are what you're thinking of when you're saying Psychiatrists.
Actually, clinical psychologists are not the same as psychiatrists. Psychiatrists are medical doctors that can prescribe medication, which is what differentiates them from clinical psychologists. Both work to relieve the symptoms of mental illness.

Like I said, I would explore each of your options, beginning with finding a competent clinical psychologist. A good clinical psychologist should be able to determine after a month or two whether or not you could be better served by seeing a psychiatrist and taking medication.
 
I've had experiences with both and my psychiatrist also prescribed unnecessary medication which really fucked up my life for a couple of weeks. The experience with him was no help at all. He didn't listen to me all that well.

My psychologists were hardly better though =/ I may as well have been paying to talk to a brick wall.
 
i see a physchologist, its for family counseling though.. and i love it.
i feel better understood talking to mine.
-and my mom sees a phychiatrist for mental issues and shes already fucked so ..
smh
 

Pirika

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I recommend you a psychologist or a psychanalyst, sometimes drugs precribed by psychiatry can make you worse once you stop to use them and they can even causa dependency.
 
I already know the technical difference between the two; but what I want to ask about, for anyone who has gone to either, what is the difference in treatment? Do you find either to be more effective than the other? Would you rather talk to a psychologist than drug yourself out on meds?

Reason I ask is because I have to see a psychologist soon (lovely fear, anxiety, depressive issues that make me one happy boy)

Do you have to choose? If you find talking therapies decent at all, then it's worth at least trying to see both. Most psychiatrists will however offer some form of therapy, too, so if you have to choose go with the psych. They're also better qualified and actual doctors, so I like them a lot more. Psychologists are often nicer but I find them pretty ineffectual.

edit: ignore Pirika, psychiatric drugs aren't 'addictive', there can be a discontinuation syndrome but that's avoidable, managable and to say psych drugs will leave you worse off than before is simple scare-tactics.

as to the other criticisms in the thread, I'm not entirely sure what's wrong with switching medication when one's not working - you'd do it for any other sort of med! yes, they can have fucking nasty side effects and I've experienced the worst they had to offer but I think, all things considered, if you're even just too shy for talking therapy then go for the meds, stabilise a bit, then try talking therapy with a psych.

if your depression/fear/anxiety has either a biological root or is severely imparing your day-to-day life then you really should think about meds. I don't buy all this 'BUT COPE ON YOUR OWN IF YOU CAN' shit, do whatever's easiest for you. It's hard to ignore all the internal 'but you're weak!' shit when you're picking up a prescription, but it's stupid that mental health issues are given some sort of status that physical issues (broken leg, for example) aren't, especially when so many mental health problems have a physical root.

edit: you WILL get bad doctors. I think (admittedly I am a fucking difficult patient) out of maybe 20 mental health professionals (psychologists and psychiatrists) that I've seen I liked maybe 4 (which is vital) and found 2 of any actual help. Good head doctors are like gold. GPs are about the same. I don't know how your system works over there, but here I need a referral from a GP (or hospital) and I have seen so many terribly shite GPs it is untrue. This does however make the fantastic ones really, really great
 
*anecdotal evidence alert* I've heard that certain pharmaceutical medication is as effectual as a sugar pill (i.e. placebo effect). Yeah, it was Colbert Report, I'll readily admit...

Well I was planning to avoid posting in this thread since, even though I have actually been seeing a psychologist recently and I've had the occasion to see a psychiatrist some time ago, I thought that I wasn't qualified enough to provide a pertinent answer... I wonder why I'm refraining.
I don't understand what I might have said that was so wrong. I thought that psychiatrists are authorized to prescribe medication, while psychologists are not, and employ other techniques to help their patients. I'm also pretty sure antidepressants can have some horrible side effects and there is a tendency amongst psychiatrists just to prescribe first and think later (akuchi can attest to the general difficult of finding a helpful doctor). there wasn't much detail of course and what i say should be taken with a grain of salt, but it's not like I said anything that was so completely off-base that it was inconceivable.
 

tape

i woke up in a new bugatti
I don't like how people are talking about psychiatrists here.

First off, I'll take off that side-effects thing. Most of the medication you take over a long period of time will make your body adapted to it and you won't suffer from side-effects (especially if you think less and less about it). I'm on 100 mg Zoloft daily, I used to get nausea and a quite uncomfortable stomach feeling, but it's gone already. Only thing I would be still suffering is a lost of appetite, and that can be easily fixed.

Now onto my real post;

I prefer psychiatrist over psychologists, by a FAR shot. The fact I don't really need to talk much, which I hate, makes it really easy. I have an incredibly hard time believing people and that makes it really hard in a psychotherapy.

I have been to about 2 psychologists due to something that happened to me that my parents thought it would be "traumatizing", and almost ever since then I've felt they are so useless. I didn't say a word or anything, didn't even try talking. But maybe it's just my way of being?

I have Depression and OCD, and I actually LOVE my psychiatrist. My first one (this is my second) was pretty uncomfortable and took a psychologist approach over a psychiatrist one, and it was... meh. The second one, I just had to tell him what I'm being prescribed and bam, he turns out to be a nice guy. I love the fact he's there for me in case I actually want to talk with him as if he was a psychologist, so I don't know if I should even be backing up psychiatrists.

But yeah, like akuchi said, you have to be pretty lucky to find a GOOD one. This is the first time that I have felt psychology-and-all-of-its-branches
helped me in any way.

Sorry for this terrible, little wall of text. Just had to let that out.

edit: I actually really love my psych. He gives off a I-know-what-I'm-talking-about and a I-actually-care feeling at the same time. He's so great :(
 
*anecdotal evidence alert* I've heard that certain pharmaceutical medication is as effectual as a sugar pill (i.e. placebo effect). Yeah, it was Colbert Report, I'll readily admit...



I don't understand what I might have said that was so wrong. I thought that psychiatrists are authorized to prescribe medication, while psychologists are not, and employ other techniques to help their patients. I'm also pretty sure antidepressants can have some horrible side effects and there is a tendency amongst psychiatrists just to prescribe first and think later (akuchi can attest to the general difficult of finding a helpful doctor). there wasn't much detail of course and what i say should be taken with a grain of salt, but it's not like I said anything that was so completely off-base that it was inconceivable.
I will happily agree. I think for that segment of the population - AND IT'S A FUCKING LARGE SEGMENT, IF THE POINT WAS NOT CLEAR - that isn't biologically depressed but thinks 'oh modern life is a bit empty cos my girlfriend dumped me so im so depressed :(' SSRI medication is pretty sugar-pill. In fact, a lot of meds are sugar-pill at that stage.
I'm REALLY SERIOUSLY ACTUALLY DEPRESSED (that was semi-ironic) and I feel better when I'm walking out with a prescription (though for me that prescription has to be for my favourite drug, or I'll not get this. but disregard. When I walk out with a scrip for a med that gives me hope - I've tried the rest, I'm left with mirtazapine - I smugface quite a lot. Because, you know, I always feel like things have been shit but I NOW HAVE SOMETHING TO LOOK UP TO. And I'm sure that segment of the population that is sooo totally down right now feels exactly the same, as do most other biologically or merely reactivelly depressed people. People are fucking tenacious. Once you've got hope, you fucking cling to hope.

Fuck side effects. If you're prescribed a med by someone you personally judge to be worth the time of day, take it. If the side effects are too heinous, stop taking it and they'll think about the sideeffects you got for a bit and give you another that's less likely to make you puke bats. Hopefully. Tell them about the way the last meds made you puke in searing, vivid detail. They're only human, they won't give them you again.

I spite of prevailing opinion in this thread - and may I be arrogant enough to point out that it's not prevailing opinon that has hated psychology AND psychiatry for six fucking years and been treated by both schools thewhole time - meds are worth it, even if they fuck up at first. I'm always on hand to tell you what meds to get - believe me, I'm more up on this shit than most pharmacists because I got 100% obsessive about it - and I agree meds can be bad. they can be AWFUL. they can leave you not eating for three weeks and puking anyway and having convulsions and just fucking up all over the place.
This is rare.

They can however leave you feeling when you wake up like you're awake, confident, and ready to face the fucking day - I dunno how muhc peoplle value this, but they shouls, because it is maybe the only thing that matters.
And meds can take away the bad things and replace them with okay things, until you're at a point that the okay things can start sorting you out.

Quite simply, noone would expect you to walk around on a broken leg to heal it. You'd get a cast, and painkillers, and understanding.
Mental health problems are seen differently. You're not supposed to be WEAK and GAY and PUSSY and UNABLE TO COPE. You're supposed to jump around on that fucking broken leg, and tell everyone how much better you're feeling! It's bullshit. Pills can fuck you up, mentally and physically. It's better than being cripplingly miserable or dead.
 

Altmer

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Oh I like my GP (and she told me to go to the psychologist, she figured I wasn't depressed but had enough issues that a psychologist would work). So I have an appointment. But I was wondering whether there was a real difference, and there is. So thanks for answering.

(actually my GP is really awesome. there's two of 'em; it's a married couple; but I remember when I fell ill with colitis the guy called me out of work hours to tell me YOU NEED A SPECIALIST YOUR BLOOD IS FANTASTICALLY SHITTY). he called me at like 8pm or something what the fuck that is one dedicated doctor. so i do trust my GP's opinion quite a bit
 
Ahh, excellent - definitely stick with the psychologist then, as it sounds like you can always go back and explain to your GP if the psychologist isn't working out for you.
 

X-Act

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My wife is a pharmacist, and she tells me that, in most cases, consult a psychologist before consulting a psychiatrist. Which is strange as psychiatrists will obviously earn pharmacists much more money than psychologists. :)
 

Caelum

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Depends on your concerns. The only real reason to try a psychologist over a psychiatrist is if you are worried about the negative side effects of medication (or no medication exists for your concerns, I suppose). There are some mental disorders, schizophrenia comes to mind, that a psychologist can't do anything for (even though many pretend they can) - in which case you'd head straight to the psychiatrist.

If it's something like depression or anxiety, it matters what prompted it really. If there is no evident reason for you to be depressed or excessively anxious, you'd be best to try a psychiatrist first. If it's mostly prompted by something like loss of a loved one or something, a psychologist may be the best first step - if only to avoid the negative side effects of some medications.

You do have to watch mental health professionals though. Quite a few of them overstep their boundaries and make claims and come up with therapies that are unscientific and untested (or sometimes outright false ...). It doesn't particularly help that the causes for many disorders that have medications available (e.g. ADHD, depression) aren't fully understood and it's even worse when a psychologist attempts to treat an issue through therapy when we don't even understand what causes it. It's like trying to build a building, but you are missing the blueprint for it. I'm not suggesting that none of them are responsible and scientific, but many of them do overstep the boundaries of what they know and what they can treat; this tends to be more common with psychologists though. Just make sure you have a responsible one!
 

Chill Murray

get well soon jacoby..
Depends on your concerns. The only real reason to try a psychologist over a psychiatrist is if you are worried about the negative side effects of medication (or no medication exists for your concerns, I suppose). There are some mental disorders, schizophrenia comes to mind, that a psychologist can't do anything for (even though many pretend they can) - in which case you'd head straight to the psychiatrist.
I would not agree with this statement. Yes, for serious psychological disorders one would be better off seeing a psychiatrist, but a psychologist should be very well equipped to handle a variety of mental illnesses, even those illnesses for which one can obtain medication (depression is an excellent example of this). To me, it sounds as though you're saying it would be beneficial to go to a hospital emergency room for all your physical health needs rather than a family doctor, since the hospital is much better equipped to handle it.

If it's something like depression or anxiety, it matters what prompted it really. If there is no evident reason for you to be depressed or excessively anxious, you'd be best to try a psychiatrist first. If it's mostly prompted by something like loss of a loved one or something, a psychologist may be the best first step - if only to avoid the negative side effects of some medications.
Depression is a chronic disorder that may or may not be prompted by stressful events in life. A loved one dying will not cause depression, but it is possible that someone close to the loved one who is predisposed to depression will exhibit signs as a result. What you are talking about is not clinical depression, but rather grief, which is temporary, and under no circumstances requires any alterations in your brain chemistry.

You do have to watch mental health professionals though. Quite a few of them overstep their boundaries and make claims and come up with therapies that are unscientific and untested (or sometimes outright false ...). It doesn't particularly help that the causes for many disorders that have medications available (e.g. ADHD, depression) aren't fully understood and it's even worse when a psychologist attempts to treat an issue through therapy when we don't even understand what causes it. It's like trying to build a building, but you are missing the blueprint for it. I'm not suggesting that none of them are responsible and scientific, but many of them do overstep the boundaries of what they know and what they can treat; this tends to be more common with psychologists though. Just make sure you have a responsible one!
A better analogy would be taking in a stray cat while trying to find a home for it. You may not know what exactly would be the best thing to feed it in the meantime, but you know that you can't go wrong with several things, such as a saucer of milk. Likewise, the "not completely understood" disorders you listed have several effective methods of treatment that have been shown to work in the past, and new ones are being found every year.

Could you elaborate on "overstepping the boundaries of what they know" for me? I'm having a hard time understanding what you mean by that.
 

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