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[mtr]

Every sun team should have Palkia. Some players have suggested using Ho-oh or Heatran as a Kyogre lure.

 

[tripe]

Every sun team should have Palkia. Some players have suggested using Ho-oh or Heatran as a Kyogre lure.

Although Ho-oh can deliver the swift ohko with brave bird with sr and 2 layers of spikes iirc.

 

[Dan Dan]

I've been using Sub/Explosion as a Kyogre lure with a lot of success recently, sub/fire blast/dragon pulse/explosion. I just took the set from theorymon's Heatran topic and ran a few more attack EVs with a quiet nature, something like 244 HP / 12 Atk / 252 SAtk I think. You can also blow up on Blissey, Ho-oh, Lugia.. anything that's threatening really they all take a fuckload from Explosion.

 

[Garganator]

SpecsQuaza is nothing, but a gimmick. I'd sr again.

I agree, but what would you run with Timid Nature ? This is my only idea for this. And I used it in the past making top50. It's great lure to some physical walls like Groudon or Lugia, but Rapid Spin is a must. Although I still agree it's a gimmick. But quite strong at this, so really, if you face it, don't underestimate completely as 150 special attack is not a joke.

So, what is the best way to lure out kyogre to kill it?

Or is it impossible?

I love sunny day in uu and nu, and abusing groudon and ho-oh sounds fun... but with kyogre everywhere and really the best or second best uber... how do sunny day teams deal with it?

may be to hard of a question for this type of thread but I thought I would at least ask.

thanks... trying to get into this tier a little over wifi... may have to use shoddy though due to lack of opponents. Need something a little different ot keep me intrested...

If you want to lure Kyogre, I suggest few things:

a) Specs Heatran is good at this, as it easily 2OHKO max hp Kyogre with HP Electric/HP Grass. If you don't want to risk, just explode and finish Kyogre like this.
b) Life Orb Brave Bird from Ho-Oh OHKOes 4 HP Kyogre with SR up. BUt more experienced players knows this, so it won't work all of the time. However Choice Band is nice surprise (but yeah, Rapid Spin is an absolute must here) as it eliminates even the most defensive Kyogre. If it's physically defensive, you 2OHKo it. If not, it goes down in one hit.
c) Shiftry is also nice idea. Life Orb Grass Knot 2OHKO Max HP Kyogre and you outspeed it, so you win. And if it's less bulky, Grass Knot deals heavy enough damage to cripple it for the rest of the match (and some Kyogres switches on Shiftry to cancel sun, so as a lure it works). Situations is similar with other chlorophyll users like Exeggcutor, Tangrowth or Victreebel. However Shiftry is the most effective in Ubers.

I hope that helps ;).

 

[dbcb]

Is giratina the only real ghost type used in ubers therefore the only spin blocker?

or is rapid spin such a "set up" on move and too dangerous to use in ubers?

thanks again

 

[Revolution.Z]

Is giratina the only real ghost type used in ubers therefore the only spin blocker?

or is rapid spin such a "set up" on move and too dangerous to use in ubers?

thanks again

Yes in general Giratina is the only ghost type used in ubers and yes it does make the most viable spinner but not many people carry Rapid Spin unless carrying pokemon such as Lugia, Rayquaza and Ho-Oh as it's too risky a move in ubers as that 1 move could wreck your whole game with a KO or a Switch to a pokemon that counters your spinner and can set up.

So, what is the best way to lure out kyogre to kill it?

Or is it impossible?

I love sunny day in uu and nu, and abusing groudon and ho-oh sounds fun... but with kyogre everywhere and really the best or second best uber... how do sunny day teams deal with it?

may be to hard of a question for this type of thread but I thought I would at least ask.

thanks... trying to get into this tier a little over wifi... may have to use shoddy though due to lack of opponents. Need something a little different ot keep me intrested...

I wouldn't say so much the way to take Kyogre out the game is luring I think it's more countering, now a great example of this is Lati@s. While carrying soul dew Lati@s is probably one of the best Kyogre counters as it resists Kyogre's STAB Water and also can come in on Electric attacks ie Thunder. This provides an oppertunity to scare Kyogre off or potentially KO'ing with your Thunder. Soul Dew shows how great it is here as it gives Lati@s the boost it needs to take powerful moves from Kyogre while also giving the boost of a Choice Specs to Lati@s without locking it into a move.

Another great counter to Kyogre is Palkia. Try to come in on Water Spout/Surf obviously due to the 4x resistance it poses.

Hope it helps

 

[DarkestSamus]

@tripe:

Earlier you and I were discussing a Groudon to compliment my Subroosting Ho-oh (who I wanted to be the center of my team). We agreed on this:

Impish Groudon 252 HP/196 Def/60 SpD

My team is an in-game non-hacked WiFi team, so IVs are an issue (not all 31). I've been SRing Groudon for a while I got this:

Impish
HP: 28 - 29
Att: 28 - 29
Def: 20 - 21
SpA: 8
SpD: 29
Speed: 31

Would this Groudon satisfy my requirements? I know the Defense is low, but he needs so many stats and overall, this is fairly grounded (pun).

Note that I have NOT saved my game, so this Groudon is still SRable if needed.

Also, if this is an acceptable Groudon, I'll ask about tweaking around his EVs to make up for any discrepancies. But it's irrelevant for now unless you confirm that I can use this Groudon (or if I should reset it).

 

[shrang]

So, what is the best way to lure out kyogre to kill it?

Or is it impossible?

I love sunny day in uu and nu, and abusing groudon and ho-oh sounds fun... but with kyogre everywhere and really the best or second best uber... how do sunny day teams deal with it?

may be to hard of a question for this type of thread but I thought I would at least ask.

thanks... trying to get into this tier a little over wifi... may have to use shoddy though due to lack of opponents. Need something a little different ot keep me intrested...

I'm only really theorymoning here, but Rock Polish/SD Groudon is a great lure for Kyogre. Start off by Rock Polishing, and if Kyogre comes in, it's obviously a bulky Kyogre. If it doesn't, you can just sweep through it later, if it is bulky, get Groudon out of there and bring it back in again later. This time, instead of Rock Polishing, go for Swords Dance and OHKO that Kyogre after it comes in.

 

[tripe]

@tripe:

Earlier you and I were discussing a Groudon to compliment my Subroosting Ho-oh (who I wanted to be the center of my team). We agreed on this:

Impish Groudon 252 HP/196 Def/60 SpD

My team is an in-game non-hacked WiFi team, so IVs are an issue (not all 31). I've been SRing Groudon for a while I got this:

Impish
HP: 28 - 29
Att: 28 - 29
Def: 20 - 21
SpA: 8
SpD: 29
Speed: 31

Would this Groudon satisfy my requirements? I know the Defense is low, but he needs so many stats and overall, this is fairly grounded (pun).

Note that I have NOT saved my game, so this Groudon is still SRable if needed.

Also, if this is an acceptable Groudon, I'll ask about tweaking around his EVs to make up for any discrepancies. But it's irrelevant for now unless you confirm that I can use this Groudon (or if I should reset it).

I'd aim for max defense, and max attack.

 

[DarkestSamus]

I'd aim for max defense, and max attack.

Advice taken. Groudon reset.

Thanks tripe!

 

[ginganinja]

I was wondering about Tyranitar and metagross in Ubers and weighing up the usefullness of Earthquake on these pokemon and whether Ice Punch outclass's it in the Uber metagame, basically is Earthquake a usefull move for Metagross and Tyranitar or are their options better suited for it?

Note
I am thinking about Earthquake on choiced Tyranitar and Metagross sets if that affects the answer in any way

 

[ZetoTarken]

I was wondering about Tyranitar and metagross in Ubers and weighing up the usefullness of Earthquake on these pokemon and whether Ice Punch outclass's it in the Uber metagame, basically is Earthquake a usefull move for Metagross and Tyranitar or are their options better suited for it?

Note
I am thinking about Earthquake on choiced Tyranitar and Metagross sets if that affects the answer in any way

STAB Crunch hits harder than EQ on pokes the don't resist it and Low Kick hits all of the pokes that resist Crunch harder than EQ sans Heatran and random Fighting pokes.

As for Metagross, EQ will out damage Ice Punch on basically everything it hits sans Garchomp, Giratina, and Groudon.

Ice Punch does slightly more damage than Meteor Mash on pokes weak to Ice and doesn't miss.

Mewtwo, Mew, Darkrai, Deoxys formes, and Wobbuffet are the only pokes in ubers that take more from Meteor Mash than EQ or Ice Punch. The rest either resist Steel or are weak to Ice.

 

[locoghoul]

So, what do you guys think of the new legends? Fire/Dragon and Electric/Dragon. Both resist Scizor's BP but both are weak to EQ and and one of them is weak to SR as well. Opinions?

 

[Hugendugen]

So, what do you guys think of the new legends? Fire/Dragon and Electric/Dragon. Both resist Scizor's BP but both are weak to EQ and and one of them is weak to SR as well. Opinions?

Electric Dragon resists both of Ho-oh's stab moves and has stab Thunder to kill it. I guess we would see many more Ho-oh's carrying the third move EQ just in case.

It also means some trouble for Kyogre. I'm sure it wouldn't like to take a stab electirc move. Stab electric may also be big trouble for Lugia.

Groudon seems obvious to increase in usage although stab fire may be powerful enough to OHKO it.

 

[ZetoTarken]

So, what do you guys think of the new legends? Fire/Dragon and Electric/Dragon. Both resist Scizor's BP but both are weak to EQ and and one of them is weak to SR as well. Opinions?

They seem to pair up with really well with Groudon and Kyogre respectively and their abilities imply that they'll boost the power of Fire and Electric respectively(Turbo Blaze and Tera Voltage) so they should make really good lures for the opposing weather to weaken the Fire STAB and halve the accuracy of Thunder(assuming it gets a Dragon signature move and is Specially based).

 

[shrang]

Electric/Dragon and Fire/Dragon are both near perfect coverage STABs. Hopefully, both have recovery moves so the Fire/Dragon doesn't get whittled down by SR amazingly quick.

 

[locoghoul]

I'm curious about seeing new moves (maybe even signature moves) and specially the stats of these two new legendaries. I'd expect the Electric/Dragon having above average speed, but he looks more sluggish than speedy, maybe he is a physical attacker. The Fire/Dragon looks more like a special attacker. I can see HP Ground on this for perfect coverage. There is a rumor on the third legend being a giant snake, but don't we have Ray already?? Maybe a ground/dragon or poison/dragon

 

[Uberrules1039]

Hm, I've been thinking. With tyranitar running around 'outspeeding' my groudon+kyogre combination do you think an iron ball would be viable? Trick room, i'm talking about- i know i sound 'inexperienced', which i am to a certain extent, but could someone suggest a better idea than 'you're inexperienced- go play more ubers. Iron balls are terrible.'? Okay if you don't know my strategy(which is also crazy and 'inexperienced(in some peoples' terms)') which i'm testing out this is it:

Groudon@lefties/iron ball
Brave
HP252/Atk252
Stone edge/???
Rock slide
Earthquake
Dragon claw
Yes, i know. There's something wrong and it's just a test after all. What would be a better ev spread?

Kyogre@specs/iron ball
Quiet
HP252/SpA252/SDef4
Ice beam
Water spout
surf
thunder

And, here's where you throw rotten tomatoes at my tactics:
Kyogre uses water spout
Groudon uses Rock slide
Kyogre uses water spout
Groudon uses Rock slide
Kyogre uses water spout
Groudon uses Rock slide
etc...
Oh No! trick room ran out!
or
Oh no! it's tyranitar!

So is this tactic viable or completely useless? If it's useless, just explain calmly why it's useless. If viable, How about the iron balls?
Okay, i might have lost my mind, but will marowak do the rock slide better?

 

[MegaKick]

So, what do you guys think of the new legends? Fire/Dragon and Electric/Dragon. Both resist Scizor's BP but both are weak to EQ and and one of them is weak to SR as well. Opinions?

Definatly see an increase in heatran since it's the only thing to take fire + dragon

So, what is the best way to lure out kyogre to kill it?

I've been using sub-explosion heatran, it doesn't KO but it will shave off quite a bit, should put it into KO range with rocks if you add some attack EVs

 

[calze6]

What is the best uber EV spread for sub wave jirachi?

 

[Dan Dan]

I've got an uber team that I'm not quite ready to make a RMT for (I still feel it needs more testing - can't have enough testing). I'm sitting around 1300 on the ladder at the moment, but I can't seem to get much higher. I seem to have most trouble wth Specs Kyogre, Wobbuffet + setup Dragon (Ray/Garchomp) and NP Darkrai. This is the team:

TTar - Crunch/Superpower/Fire Blast/Stone Edge @Lum
Forretress - SR/RS/Payback/Toxic @Lefties
Dialga - DM/Dragon Pulse/Flamethrower/Earth Power @Expert Belt
Lugia - Reflect/Ice Beam/Roost/WW @Lefties
Rayquaza - SD/EQ/Dragon Claw/X-speed @Life Orb
Palkia - DM/Surf/Thunder/Fire Blast @Haban Berry

Any ideas on how to deal with these problem pokes?

 

[ginganinja]

I've got an uber team that I'm not quite ready to make a RMT for (I still feel it needs more testing - can't have enough testing). I'm sitting around 1300 on the ladder at the moment, but I can't seem to get much higher. I seem to have most trouble wth Specs Kyogre, Wobbuffet + setup Dragon (Ray/Garchomp) and NP Darkrai. This is the team:

TTar - Crunch/Superpower/Fire Blast/Stone Edge @Lum
Forretress - SR/RS/Payback/Toxic @Lefties
Dialga - DM/Dragon Pulse/Flamethrower/Earth Power @Expert Belt
Lugia - Reflect/Ice Beam/Roost/WW @Lefties
Rayquaza - SD/EQ/Dragon Claw/X-speed @Life Orb
Palkia - DM/Surf/Thunder/Fire Blast @Haban Berry

Any ideas on how to deal with these problem pokes?

I think that scarfing either Palkia or Tyranitar are good optiion to beat a few of the pokemom you have trouble with. Scarf T-ar beats NP Darkrai due too it outspeading and KOing with Superpower.

Scarf Palkia as stated can beat Darkrai authough T-tar should handle Lead NP Versions anyway due to Lum. Wobbuffet has no counter really so its a a bit difficult to help you there. I guess that Scarfing Palkia is your best option.

In summery

T-tar should handle lead darkrai pretty well but scarf Palkia can also check it if it comes out late game.

SD Rayquaza is checked my Lugia since the SD set does not often run Stone Edge

DD Rayquaza is checked by Palkia.

Specs Kyogre is outspead and gets KO'ed by Palkias Thunder. Watch out though as Kyogre will 2KO Palkia with Stealth Rock with Ice Beam.

So in conclusion Scarf Palkia is a quick fix to some of your porblems

Have a Nice Day!

EDIT: Yep sorry. Shrang is correct.
Scarf T-tar does not outspeed Darkrai

It was a miss type. I got mixed up between Scarf Palkia and Lum Tyranitar.

LUM Tyrantar can handle lead Darkrai though since it will survive a Dark Void and KO with SUperpower

 

[shrang]

Scarf T-ar beats NP Darkrai due too it outspeading and KOing with Superpower.

ScarfTar does not outspeed Darkrai.

 

[Toasta]

Hi, I was wondering if it was possible for a shiny legendary able to have flawless IV's if it was RNG'd, and still be considered legit. The reason I ask is my friend went to a local tournament today and was disqualified because the palkia he had was shiny and flawless IV's and his Kyogre had a couple 31's. He won his first match against this guy and then they had his IV's and stats checked and said that shiny legendary pokemon can't have any IV's of 31. He knew what IV's were, but didn't know that his palkia couldn't have perfect IV's. Also he in no way hacked them he recieved them from someone else.

 

[COKTAL]

Yes, it's compeltly possible with RNG Abuse (you could reset for them, but I'd take a while and some luck). Just check out the discuss my pokemon thread in wifi for proof.