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Dream World Tier Discussion
- Thread starter lostaurora
- Start date
You really can't call DW a fairytale metagame when people are more than happy to play the "real OU"....the real "OU" where you magically can't use evasion moves, can't put a second pokemon to sleep, OHKO moves always fail, etc. etc.
Messing with the programming of the game itself and then calling something that's actually present in the game's data unreal is mad.
Messing with the programming of the game itself and then calling something that's actually present in the game's data unreal is mad.
Well, technically, in OU, at least for Wifi, you CAN do all those things.
You just lose when you do.
The "messing with the programming" is just something that assumes you don't want to commit suicide game-wise, and thus prevents you from doing so.
Dream World is a lot more fun than wi-fi for me.
So many more options, and things I wanted to try out when I first saw DW abilites like 8 months ago.
So many more options, and things I wanted to try out when I first saw DW abilites like 8 months ago.
Updated the OP with info about the unreleased pinch berries, incorporated Hawkstar's post into a new section (I thought this was a perfect response to people claiming that the DW tier suffers from illegitimacy) and added a short section summing up why I think Dream World can be more enjoyable than OU. If anyone has other contributions regarding why people should play in DW, I'd be happy to listen to your points and possibly incorporate them into that section, because that's something I believe a lot of people want to know.
Every tier that isn't BW OU or UU and Ubers to an extent is near impossible to get a match in. There's only a few hundred people on the server at it's busiest, so it's no surprise.
PO DW > Smogon DW imo.
PO has much more people, and many good players. Smogon just has the latter.
PO has much more people, and many good players. Smogon just has the latter.
That's why I enjoy playing on Smogon. Playing on DW, I walk all over people with 1200+ ratings, while the guys here with 1200+ ratings actually make me work for wins.
It's very true that it's hard to find a match sometimes in Smogon DW, I'm stuck at #2 right now because it's impossible to actually find someone to play.
However, in my experience the quality of competition on the Smogon server is higher, still.
Good point, I forgot those were illegal in OU, I'll add that in.
Yeah, that's true. I keep decaying in all my alts and I can't stop it because no one can play against me besides blah23 or you or MCramez or Jargonite or Dezza or other people whose names escape me.
On an unrelated note, for those who are using Rain, do you generally prefer SpDef Thunderachi or Ferrothorn as a defensive 'mon? I've been using both and can't really decide which I like more, because it depends on the other team.
I like Ferrothorn better. You lose out on wish support, but it can still paralyze stuff and hit Ground-types immune to Thunder Wave with a STAB Power Whip. It also takes the Water- and Electric-type moves found on all the rain teams running around the tier a lot better.
The OP really doesn't mention Ditto???
Because Dream World is seen as a PO metagame in the same way Clear Skies is, despite the fact that it's more popular than Ubers, UU and LC combined. Rising_Dusk, the smogonite who runs the server, despises it and therefore it's cool for OU players to thumb their noses at DW. You'll notice a lot of badged OU players saying things like "DW is just a fantasy game", "it's not even pokemon" and other generally ignorant statements without being challenged because of how difficult it is to challenge the opinions of the guy running the server. Never mind the fact that it's the second most popular metagame, it's way more diverse than OU and requires more careful planning due to the nature of common threats like Chandelure and Ditto requiring patience. You'd think that Smogon would be all over this metagame.
DW >>>>>>>>>> OU. There are actually threats in the tier that don't require weather to set up so it provides for a nice variation of stale OU weather wars. In OU, if you lose your weather mon you've lost the match. In DW, you can still come back. In OU there might be 50 pokemon that qualify, but there are only like 5 types of team possible. Sand, Rain, Hail, Sun, No weather (but you have to have things capable of dealing with weather mons anyways), with no real variation. For example: every Sand team has ttar/gliscor/excadrill/ferrothorn/filler.
I personally enjoy the fact that DW isn't an official metagame. It keeps annoying suspect tests away from the game. The DW metagame would be destroyed if we let OU players get their grubby paws on it. Although it would be interesting to test things like Rough Skin Garchomp and pokemon like Manaphy since Lati@s has their soul dew.
Because Dream World is seen as a PO metagame in the same way Clear Skies is, despite the fact that it's more popular than Ubers, UU and LC combined. Rising_Dusk, the smogonite who runs the server, despises it and therefore it's cool for OU players to thumb their noses at DW. You'll notice a lot of badged OU players saying things like "DW is just a fantasy game", "it's not even pokemon" and other generally ignorant statements without being challenged because of how difficult it is to challenge the opinions of the guy running the server. Never mind the fact that it's the second most popular metagame, it's way more diverse than OU and requires more careful planning due to the nature of common threats like Chandelure and Ditto requiring patience. You'd think that Smogon would be all over this metagame.
DW >>>>>>>>>> OU. There are actually threats in the tier that don't require weather to set up so it provides for a nice variation of stale OU weather wars. In OU, if you lose your weather mon you've lost the match. In DW, you can still come back. In OU there might be 50 pokemon that qualify, but there are only like 5 types of team possible. Sand, Rain, Hail, Sun, No weather (but you have to have things capable of dealing with weather mons anyways), with no real variation. For example: every Sand team has ttar/gliscor/excadrill/ferrothorn/filler.
I personally enjoy the fact that DW isn't an official metagame. It keeps annoying suspect tests away from the game. The DW metagame would be destroyed if we let OU players get their grubby paws on it. Although it would be interesting to test things like Rough Skin Garchomp and pokemon like Manaphy since Lati@s has their soul dew.
This.
I haven't played DW since the beginning of BW although I am beginning to find OU increasingly dull and repetitive. On the other hand, I am not relishing having to get accustomed to a whole new metagame. So how easy is it to get into, and would it be worth it?
I really like the dreamworld tier but ever since people realised latios/latias get soul dew the tier becomes centralised over the extremely overpowered latios/latias and his best counter scarf genosect.
I also find that rain tends to dominate dreamworld due to genesect and Keldeo the 2 big reasons to play dw both get a boost in the rain, boosting a stab and dulling a crippling weakness whilst also halving one of the stabs of the horrific shadow tag chandelure.
Finally i would like to say that I think the po server is in fact a tougher server due to the sheer number of players on it and there being loads of people with high rated accounts rather than just the same 5 or 6 people on different alts
I also find that rain tends to dominate dreamworld due to genesect and Keldeo the 2 big reasons to play dw both get a boost in the rain, boosting a stab and dulling a crippling weakness whilst also halving one of the stabs of the horrific shadow tag chandelure.
Finally i would like to say that I think the po server is in fact a tougher server due to the sheer number of players on it and there being loads of people with high rated accounts rather than just the same 5 or 6 people on different alts
I had alot of fun on the DW, outside lead Genosect maybe. I tried OU and was turned off by every fucking team being Sand, Stall, or Sand Stall. It was then I realised the OU's management is just bad and being manufactured in favour of one playstyle, and that there is balance and variety in a game with less meddling going on.
I seriously don't know why people say OU is all weather. I've played a lot non weather matches on OU, in fact, I run a SmashPass team on OU and I ALWAYS beat weather teams. I can say for sure that the people who don't run weather teams scare me the most because it shows they must know what they are doing.
I tried DW out for a bit and got board of it quickly. People here are saying you can use it as a way to test mons with their unreleased ability's and see how they do, but if you actually play the DW it's hell trying to use a team that isn't Politoad, Lati@s, Genisect, Keldo, filler, filler.
It's certainly not a friendly testing zone. Also...
This makes no sense to me considering that the top ten teams in DW are weather teams.... Show me a DW rain team that doesn't use Ferrow, Genisect, Lati@s, or Thunderachi.
Hell at least in OU all weathers have a chance to do well (yes, even Hail if used right). In DW it seems like Rain is the top tier threat with all the other weathers trying to match it. In fact, it seems like the only reason Sand is used is because it's the best weather to use Chand in.
I tried DW out for a bit and got board of it quickly. People here are saying you can use it as a way to test mons with their unreleased ability's and see how they do, but if you actually play the DW it's hell trying to use a team that isn't Politoad, Lati@s, Genisect, Keldo, filler, filler.
It's certainly not a friendly testing zone. Also...
This makes no sense to me considering that the top ten teams in DW are weather teams.... Show me a DW rain team that doesn't use Ferrow, Genisect, Lati@s, or Thunderachi.
Hell at least in OU all weathers have a chance to do well (yes, even Hail if used right). In DW it seems like Rain is the top tier threat with all the other weathers trying to match it. In fact, it seems like the only reason Sand is used is because it's the best weather to use Chand in.
To be honest, I actually really like Dream World UU on the Beta server. The tiering is kind of fucked (somehow shit like Terrakion and Lucario is UU) but other than that, it's pretty cool to test unreleased abilities. I've been using a Sandstorm team based around Stoutland and Sand Rush Sandslash, and let me just say, this thing is Excadrill-lite. It even has the exact same moveset (Swords Dance, Earthquake, Rock Slide, X-Scissor/Rapid Spin). Once Sand Rush Sandslash is released, I seriously think it might get banned from UU. Picture Excadrill that can actually take a hit, and doesn't cry at the first sight of Mach Punch. Yeah. >_>
tl;dr - DW OU is kind of boring since everyone uses the same team, but DW UU is a lot of fun with variety to it. Try it today. ;D
tl;dr - DW OU is kind of boring since everyone uses the same team, but DW UU is a lot of fun with variety to it. Try it today. ;D
I don't understand why some people are so anti-DW. Calling it a "fantasy" game? Uh...you do realize we're playing Pokemon, right? Even beyond that, we're playing a Pokemon game with rules such as Sleep and Evasion clause, which are non-existent in the actual game. Face it, we're already in a fantasy land.
Anyway, it's not like we're pulling things out of our ass in DW like Spore Tyranitar or some shit. Sure, there might be a couple of ability/move compatibility issues if certain Pokemon never get released as Females from the DW, but on the whole that's rather minuscule. That's the game we'll all eventually be playing, so don't try to make it seem like DW is a ridiculous idea. Keldeo/Genesect/Meloetta will eventually be released, and nobody truly believes that they programmed all those DW abilities on 5th generation Pokemon with no intention of ever releasing them. That's completely irrational.
If you despise everything DW stands for then I suggest you just quit competitive Pokemon now since you're freely admitting to despising the definite future of the metagame. It's not a matter of if, but when.
Anyway, it's not like we're pulling things out of our ass in DW like Spore Tyranitar or some shit. Sure, there might be a couple of ability/move compatibility issues if certain Pokemon never get released as Females from the DW, but on the whole that's rather minuscule. That's the game we'll all eventually be playing, so don't try to make it seem like DW is a ridiculous idea. Keldeo/Genesect/Meloetta will eventually be released, and nobody truly believes that they programmed all those DW abilities on 5th generation Pokemon with no intention of ever releasing them. That's completely irrational.
If you despise everything DW stands for then I suggest you just quit competitive Pokemon now since you're freely admitting to despising the definite future of the metagame. It's not a matter of if, but when.
So I tried playing some OU, and I've now decided that I just can't do it.
Maybe the playing style doesn't suit me, but I just hate the standard in regular OU. Tyranitar + bulky Grass + bulky Water + Lati@s + Excadrill + Steel of your choice.
To reiterate, Dream World is much faster paced and defensive style like OU (laying down hazards and slowly killing off the opponent) just doesn't work. Because I hate any form of stall, DW is the kind of metagame I like. It's not that hard to get into @ above poster, I think it's easier to learn how to adapt to DW than it is to OU.
Maybe the playing style doesn't suit me, but I just hate the standard in regular OU. Tyranitar + bulky Grass + bulky Water + Lati@s + Excadrill + Steel of your choice.
To reiterate, Dream World is much faster paced and defensive style like OU (laying down hazards and slowly killing off the opponent) just doesn't work. Because I hate any form of stall, DW is the kind of metagame I like. It's not that hard to get into @ above poster, I think it's easier to learn how to adapt to DW than it is to OU.
People say it's a "fantasy" game because DW is all just "hoping" that this stuff gets released.
Most of the DW tier can't be played legitimately on the cartridge yet and therefore it IS a "fantasy" tier.
It's also a broken tier where everyone uses Rain.
Lets face it, there isn't much variety. Even Sand fails here thanks to Keldeo raping everything, allowing Rain to...reign supreme.
Now you got Latios spamming +1 Attacks all over the place and then comes Genesect to counter him, but then comes Chandelure to trap him.
Everything revolves around Latios, Genesect, Politoed, Chandelure, Keldeo, and Ferrothorn.