My name is AA, and I've been Hail-free for 2 weeks

[Team Amon Amarth]

...and so far it sucks :(

At the suggestion of multiple people, I tried to construct a team that is *not* Hail. It looked pretty good on paper, but in practice... yeah didn't work so well. Partially due to the fact that I have no idea what I'm doing with this kind of team, and partially 'cos it has a few Pokemon that particularly bug... well just about any team I make.

The inspiration for this team came from the Creative Movesets thread. I stumbled upon a very unique Salamence set that I wanted to try out. Salamence is an underrated boss anyway. And so, I present to you...

THE GUARDIANS OF ASGAARD

TEAM BUILDING PROCESS
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The instant I decided upon Salamence I remembered how powerful the synergy between Jirachi and Salamence is. There was also a special Jirachi set close to the Salamence one, and I just love surprises. That, and the standard Jirachi set is just a troll.

Both of the sets I had in mind were specially-based, so I wanted a strong Physical attacker. In the past, the two biggest Special-threats to my teams were Lati@s and Volcarona. And Rain teams. Tyranitar covered those weaknesses, but I personally think the standard Tyranitar set is kinda pathetic, so I went with a more traditional CBTar.

At this point, I realized my team was weak to strong Fighting Pokemon, and the best counter to those I could think of was... Gliscor.

I added Rotom-W simply to complete Solum's core and because I had no clue what else to go with. It seemed to fit, to cover the teams weakness to Bulky waters.

Lastly I realized that Thundurus was problematic... and well Electric types in general. Tyranitar could do ok, but it was at risk from Focus Blast or Hammer Arm. I also realized that I was able to have two resists to every type on my team, so I added.... no I'm not even gonna dignify it with a name.

Shortly after adding it, I looked at my team and was appalled at how much of a Sandstorm team it had become... so I ditched it for Ferrothorn, who I've always liked. It also provided some much-appreciated support, and the same resistances I was looking for.

THE GUARDIANS
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@Leftovers
Intimidate/Modest
232 HP/84 Def/176 SpA/16 Spe
~Draco Meteor
~Hydro Pump
~Flamethrower
~Roost

The whole reason I made this team. It's main strength is it's surprise value. Salamence is a very rare Pokemon to come across this Gen, thanks to Lati@s, a buffed Dragonite, and Haxorus. Salamence's main niche is as a wallbreaker, so it's usually seen as a Mixed Set, or a Dragon Dance set. When the opponent sends in their Physical wall, it gets a Draco Meteor to the face. Flamethrower provides nice coverage with Draco Meteor, and allows Salamence to roast Steels, especially Scizor, Forry, and Ferrothorn. Hydro Pump is neat little move that most people forget Salamence can learn... but it still provides a nice way to hit *Most* Steels in rain conditions, Ferrothorn is still a troll in Rain conditions. Roost is for healing, when they *think* they've weakened Salamence enough. Actually, Salamence has passable bulk, which, combined with Intimidate, Roost, Leftovers, and the investment in bulk, makes Salamence rather sturdy. This isn't a very fast Salamence, 'cos there wasn't really much to outspeed, and no DD numbers to hit. It seemed like most of the threats I'd be running into were either always going to outspeed me or be outsped, except like... Haxorus. Speaking of which....

Considered Changes
-Changing to a different Dragon, such as CB Haxorus, or my custom DD Mix Latios... not Dragonite or Latias though.
-Adding Outrage over Hydro Pump and switching a little bulk investment to Attack.
-If the above occurs, switching Roost to Earthquake.
-Invest in Speed to beat Haxorus, and I guess Hydreigon while I'm at it.

Synergy
- Ice: Jirachi, Rotom-W
- Rock: Jirachi, Ferrothorn
- Dragon: Jirachi, Ferrothorn

@Leftovers
Serene Grace/Modest
252 HP/252 SpA/6 Spe
~Doom Desire
~U-Turn
~Wish
~Protect

Another little experiment. Jirachi complements Salamence quite nicely, by even further adding to it's longevity with Wish... in fact the whole team greatly appreciates the Wish support- they're all bulky, but lacking reliable recovery. Doom Desire is a very, very powerful attack that nothing resists (it's type-neutral). The idea is to cast the Doom Desire- then U-Turn into a heavy hitter. With the proper prediction, most Pokemon can't take TWO hard hits in a turn. Protect + Wish acts as a Pseudo-Recovery, and as a general scout. It's also fun to use when the opponent has like 6% left, so that the Sandstorm kills them XD As fun as this set is, it's just not doing as well as I'd like.

Considered Changes
-Replacing everything but Wish
-Adding things like, Thunder Wave, Stealth Rock, Healing Wish
-Adding it an actual attack, probably Flash Cannon
-Running a bulkier EV spread, or a faster one

Synergy
-Fire: Salamence, Tyranitar, Rotom-W
-Ground: Salamence, Gliscor, Rotom-W

@Choice Band
Sand Stream/Adamant
252 HP/36 Atk/216 SpD/6 Spe
~Stone Edge
~Earthquake
~Crunch
~Pursuit

CB Tar is the REAL Tyranitar, not the ridiculous Sassy thing everyone uses. I've got plenty of special firepower on this team anyway, and the ability to royally screw over Volcarona, Jellicent, Espeon and especially Lati@s is very, very welcome. Well, maybe not so much Jellicent, burn is a problem... XD
Anyways, I originally planned on using a more classic EV spread of 252 HP/252 Atk/4 Spe, but the given one is more suitable for taking Scald, Bug Buzz, Draco Meteor, etc... which Tyranitar will have to do. Still, I can't help but wonder if it'd be better to put more attack power into it.
Stone Edge and Crunch are strong STAB attacks that hit the key threats SE, Earthquake provides coverage and allows Tyranitar to take on Heatran, and Pursuit is to guarantee that Lati@s doesn't get a free trip home.
Tyranitar also serves to troll Rain and Sun teams, although it makes facing Sand teams that much harder...

Considered Changes
-252 HP/252 Atk/6 Spe EV Spread
-Aqua Tail over Crunch
-Unnerve over Sand Stream?

Synergy (a.k.a, Why Tyranitar has way too many weaknesses)
-Water: Salamence, Rotom-W, Ferrothorn
-Grass: Salamence, Jirachi, Ferrothorn
-Fighting: Salamence, Gliscor
-Ground: Salamence, Gliscor, Rotom-W
-Bug: Salamence, Gliscor
-Steel: Jirachi, Rotom-W, Ferrothorn

@Toxic Orb
Poison Heal/Impish
252 HP/184 Def/76 Spe
~Earthquake
~Knock Off
~Toxic
~Protect

I'll say it up front, I hate Poison Heal Gliscor. In Gen IV, I loved using Gliscor. For whatever reason, I just can't use this one properly. Basically I needed a Gliscor, and this was just about the only set I knew off that reliably worked... I replaced Ice Fang/Facade for Knock Off because I've never had to use them before, and Knock Off is an insanely helpful attack. There's not much else to say, I'm really not happy with this set.

Considered Changes (a.k.a, the differences between Gen IV and Gen V Gliscor)
- Replacing Toxic and Protect with Roost and Stealth Rock
- Replacing Poison Heal with Sand Veil and Toxic Orb with Leftovers
- Investing those Speed EVs elsewhere, unless someone can explain what they are used for

Synergy
-Water: Salamence, Rotom-W, Ferrothorn
-Ice: Jirachi, Rotom-W

@Leftovers
Levitate/Modest
112 HP/252 SpA/144 Spe
~Hydro Pump
~Thunder
~Will-o-Wisp
~Pain Split

Yeah, standard Rotom-W. This is one of the few standard sets that I like. I replaced Thunderbolt with Thunder because I really hate Rain teams, it does net some surprise KOs, and I like the extra Paralysis chance. Rotom-W carries a lot of key resistances and pretty much holds the team together. I'm pretty content with this set, and don't see much need to change it.

Considered Changes
- Volt Switch or Thunderbolt over Thunder
- Hidden Power Fire over Will-o-Wisp

Synergy
-Grass: Salamence, Jirachi, Ferrothorn

@Leftovers
Iron Barbs/Impish
252 HP/48 Def/208 SpD
~Power Whip
~Leech Seed
~Thunder Wave
~Stealth Rock

Rain Counter #2. Ferrothorn provides some key resists, Rocks, and is generally a solid Pokemon, and it's never let me down. Along with Rotom-W, I'm quite content with it. It's always fun to neuter things with a T-Wave on the switch. *coughlatioscough*
Considered Changes
-Stealth Rock to Spikes if Jirachi learns Rocks

Synergy
-Fire: Salamence, Tyranitar, Rotom-W
-Fighting: Salamence, Gliscor

Analysis

Pros
+2 Resists for every type
+No more than two weaknesses to any given type
+Stealth Rock and Wish support
+Burn, Toxic, and Paralysis support
+Knock Off
+All members are reasonably bulky and possess at least one strong attack
+Great synergy
+5 of 6 members are immune to Toxic Spikes and 3 immune to regular Spikes
+Only 1 Stealth Rocks weak

Cons
-Really, really slow
-Epically weak to DD Nite with Fire attacks
-No Rapid Spin :(
-I suck at using balanced teams
-No Hail :(

Rate, comment, and sub... er wrong place.
You know the drill XD
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[Team Amon Amarth]

THE EVIL GIANTS OF THE SOUTH (Threat List)

Aerodactyl
Blissey
Breloom
Bronzong
Celebi
Chansey
Conkeldurr
Darmanitan
Deoxys-D
Deoxys-S
Dragonite
Dusclops
Empoleon
Espeon
Excadrill
Ferrothorn
Forretress
Gengar
Gliscor
Gyarados
Haxorus
Heatran
Heracross
Hippowdon
Hydreigon
Infernape
Jellicent
Jirachi
Jolteon
Kingdra
Kyurem
Landorus
Latias
Latios
Lilligant
Lucario
Machamp
Magnezone
Mamoswine
Metagross
Mienshao
Murkrow
Ninetales
Politoed
Porygon2
Reuniclus
Roserade
Rotom-W
Salamence
Sawsbuck
Scizor
Scrafty
Shaymin
Sigilyph
Skarmory
Smeargle
Snorlax
Starmie
Suicune
Swampert
Tentacruel
Terrakion
Thundurus
Tornadus
Tyranitar
Vaporeon
Venusaur
Victini
Volcarona
Weavile
Whimsicott
Xatu
Zapdos
Zoroark

 

[AB2]

Hey, Excadrill would work very well on this team, as much as you don't like to use it. Thundurus is a huge problem for this team since it can set up easily and ohko this entire team with its boosted moves. I'd replace Gliscor for Excadrill since it has the ability to both revenge kill Thundurus and provide rapid spin support for Salamence. A set with swords dance | earthquake | rock slide | rapid spin would work extremely well with a jolly nature and a balloon. Maxmizing speed an attack is also your only option for an ev spread. Also, with Excadrill's support, there will be no rocks down on the field, and your opponent will have an extremely hard time ridding of Salamence. Speaking of Salamence, it would work much better as a mixed set. Between Salamence blowing holes in this team and Excadrill both cleaning up later in the game and rapid spinning, you keep the offensive pressure on very well. A set with draco meteor | fire blast | brick break | roost with a naive nature and life orb would work well. A good ev spread on classic mixmence would also be 116 Atk | 216 SpA | 176 Spe.

With all of these changes, you seem to be a bit weak to some sandstorm sweepers such as Landorus and Excadrill to an extent. This is why Slowbro would work excellently on this team over Rotom-W as it can help you tank hits from these threats. A set with scald | fire blast | psychic | slack off with 252 HP | 252 Def | 4 SpA with leftovers and a bold nature would work really well since it can also help you beat fighting types, such as Conkeldurr and Terrakion. Jirachi would work much better as a specially defensive set. This will allow you to repeatedly tank draco meteors from Latios and provide wish support to your team. A set with wish | body slam | iron head | protect with a careful nature leftovers and a spread of 252 HP | 216 SpD | 40 Spe would work very well. Finally, I would consider running a scarf Tyranitar over your your current version. Between scarf Tyrnaitar and Ferrothorn, you have a good check to most generic drizzle teams which will really help you out a lot. A set with crunch | pursuit | superpower | stone edge would work really well with a jolly nature and maximizing speed and attack.

After all of those changes, this team is really looking solid. Good Luck.

 

[Jirachee]

Hey there,

If you wanna deal with the DDnite problem you stated, I'd swap Toxic for Ice Fang on Gliscor. It has the bulk to take a couple of hits and can strike back very hard with a x4 effective move. Knock Off is a very neat move, props to you for using it.

Now I strongly suggest you to change your Jirachi's moveset. While being original has a surprise value that may win games and is very nice, sometimes you have to use the standard. I suggest you use SpD Jirachi for a pretty good reason : Thundurus. Right now your only team member that is able to at least check it is Rotom-W, who can't exactly take multiple Thunders. Tyranitar is nice to have to change the weather, but most of them carry Focus Blast, which is pretty much an instant death for the mighty T-Rex. SpD Jirachi checks Thundurus very well (close from being a counter, though Thunder hurts a lot) and is able to paralyze it with Body Slam. Here's the set in case you don't know it :

SpD Rachi

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Careful
Serene Grace
EVs : 252 HP / 216 SpD / 40 Spe
-Iron Head
-Body Slam
-Wish
-Protect

SpD Jirachi also counters Trick Room Reuniclus, who otherwise can give your problems. Good luck.

 

[mrbiggstuff444]

need ice move somewhere. Ice fang on gliscor? Maybe replace toxic with ice fang? if you need toxic to destroy something you could replace protect with swords dance.

My gliscor in my sand team is coupled with blissey to wake up from rest but here he is:

Gliscor @ toxic orb
poison heal
252 Def 4 atk 252 def
Impish nature

rest
earthquake
ice fang
swords dance

mine has fainted one time by being hit by hp ice out of the 10 or so battles ive used him. After rest if you need to get out of there you can switch to another wall and predict a toxic to come back in... long shot i know but your setup is good as it is but no large healing move for the physical wall. overall great team that will cause most teams trouble.. good luck

 

[Team Amon Amarth]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone :)
When I get the time I'll be testing these changes ~

Tyarnitar --> Scarf Variant
Ferrothorn --> Slowbro (Ice Beam over Fire Blast for D-Nite)
Jirachi --> SpD Variant
Gliscor --> Excadrill
Salamence --> MixMence variant (DM/Outrage/EQ/Flamethrower)

 

[Zephyr]

Hi. Looks like you have a good team in production at the moment. Since I see you're still trying a lot of different variants in your team right now, if you find your uncomfortable with some of the Salamence sets you are using I recommend you try this variant; It will drastically ease your time against stall and defensive-based teams. Blissey and Skarmory among other cores will crumble much easier, especially since you lack a reliable wall breaker and this set will help a lot with that, and let you beat Blissey without getting stuck into Outrage. Not only that but with the addition of Roost (and if you end up sticking with Rapid Spin Excadrill) you'll have a lot more opportunities to get Salamence in and wreak havoc without worrying about him dieing off too quickly. Here it is:

Salamence @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 116 Atk / 216 SpA / 176 Spe
Rash / Naive
- Draco Meteor
- Roost
- Fire Blast
- Brick Break

Good luck!

 

[-Tsunami-]

Hey there. Cool team.

I agree with what Zeph suggested about the Salamence, as stall will be a pain otherwise.

On Tyranitar, take 40 evs out from HP / Special Defense and put them in speed. This will let you outspeed standard Jellicent, and hit it, assuming it doesnt switch of course, before it can burn you with Will-O-Wisp.

Definitely run Volt Switch over Thunder on Rotom-W. It's just so helpful, and since you have sand, it would definitely be better than Thunder. With Volt Switch, you can bring in an appropriate counter for common switch-ins such as Celebi and Blissey, which makes it much harder to play against Rotom-W. I would also change Rotom-W to a Scarf Set, as having a scarf pokemon is always important.

Rotom-W@Choice Scarf
Levitate/Timid
4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Speed
~Hydro Pump
~Volt Switch
~Hidden Power Fire
~Trick

Since you already have Gliscor as a defensive wall, changing Rotom-W to a scarf set shouldn't hurt you defensively too much. Scarfing Rotom means you can revenge kill dangerous threats such as Thundurus that you would not be able to do before. Trick cripples pokemon such as Blissey, and Hidden Power Fire can get rid of Scizor and Ferrothorn.

The speed on Gliscor is important because it lets you outspeed all variants of Magnezone, Nasty Plot Celebi, all versions of Tyranitar, and Special Wall Jirachi. Also, you have 512 evs on Gliscor, so take out 4 evs in either HP or Defense.

I would definitely run the standard Jirachi instead of the variant that you have now, as that will help with your Thundurus problem immensely.

Jirachi@Leftovers
Serene Grace/Calm
252 HP/224 SDef/24 Speed
~Iron Head
~Body Slam
~Wish
~Protect

This Jirachi, with a bit of prediction, can beat most versions of Thundurus except the Lum Berry version. Iron Head + Body Slam causes sheer annoyance for the opponent, and Wish + Protect means it can heal itself and your teammates.

 

[Team Amon Amarth]

Alright, after some testing last night,

Tyranitar- I think I want to stick with the CB Set

Slowbro- About as handy as Ferrothorn, only now I'm not running into any Psychics- what about CM over Psychic?

Jirachi- Doing it's job much better now, but I'm looking for something to run over Iron Head, probably Zen Headbutt, which would get more useful coverage and help Rachi deal with Fighters if Slowbro runs a CM set. (You weren't kidding about the Thundurus, I out stalled a Magnezone long enough for the guy to just switch out of frustration XD)

Excadrill- This thing really is NOT my style, I can't use it right at all... I know it fits the team, but.. XD if there is another option or if there is some "proper" way to use it...

Salamance- As much as I love the DM/Outrage/EQ/Flamethrower set... I'm going to go with the one suggestion just for survivability. Having my team walled by an Eviolite Clefairy is just sad. (Finally took it out with a DM + Outrage, only to have a Scizor come in and bye-bye Salamence)

I'm going to test Haxorus over Salamence as well.

I'll have to try out the Rotom-W set :)

Also, what about running a Scizor over Excadrill? I'm thinking a CB U-Turn/BP/Quick Attack/Pursuit would be helpful, depending on how much Quick Attack does to Thundurus... that might be a bit redundant with T-Tar though...